There is only one real PvE MMO, that's Final Fantasy XI.  All others are just single player rpgs that you play along side other players, nothing multiplayer about them.  That's why FFXI is my favorite MMO for PvE.  DAoC is best PvP MMO, since you really had to group up to do very well in PvP (yay massive 100man+ raids). Other than the weekly raid in WoW, you never have to group in any other "MMO".

calling games like WoW and LotRO massively MULTIPLAYER is like calling a Ford Escape a SPORT utility vehicle.  They're not multiplayer, just like there are no SUVs, except the Hummer H1

Dark Age of Camelot was the absolute best solo and small group AND raid PvE ever until Trials of Atlantis expansion ruined it for me.

World of Warcraft's PvE was a very good experience except for raid but WoW's PvE, although fun and is the best MMORPG ever imo, still feels kind of like it isn't better than DAoC's (before the 2nd expansion). It could be because it's so easy though. WoW is so awesome and easy that people eventually got good at it and now people just fly through the PvE content. Back when WoW was new with no mods and stuff it was a smidgen harder. That just means people need to enter dungeons at lower levels than what is recommended though.

Guild Wars had a unique feeling for PvE for the MMORPG RTS genre because you always had people with you even if they were just bots and the PvE was story driven AND sandbox (you could go anywhere if you wished) so it was fun.

Everquest PvE will not be denied the fact that it is a classic but imo daoc was better.

Everquest 2 PvE scared me away from it multiple times as I would try to give it second and third chances.

City of Heroes PvE just felt like pushing all buttons 1+2+3+...+n lol then wait for their cooldowns to do it again. Even healing was just spamming the group heal mostly but I never got past level 30 in that game.

Warhammer's PvE was boring, grindy, and buggy.

Lord of the Rings Online's PvE scared me because I couldn't get myself to like their classes or combat to begin with. This is similar to why Warhammer was bad in PvE because you need a combat system that makes people say "Ooo! Aaa!" for a game to not feel boring and grindy.

DDO's PvE didn't work for me because the combat animations seemed poorly done and it felt awkward and laggy.

Lineage 2 beta was where I tried this game and never again. The PvE took longer than any MMORPG ever to level. Nothing about it interested me.

Star Wars Galaxies never interested me and when I finally tried it I still didn't like it. Shooting lasers at stuff is boring. The melee felt too much like EQ2.

Age of Conan PvE got boring pushing direction keys over and over... I lost interest and began PvPing everyone in the towns and getting killed by guards & other players for more fun and then quit.

Ultima Online PvE was okay until I had tried it all. The only thing left to do was get involved with the online community. I wasn't interested. However, I can see why it was a classic back in the day.

Aion's PvE failed to interest me in their character classes. The mage classes were okay but the melee classes were all the same and were even given all the same sound effects for hitting with their weapon. The PvE seemed okay but I couldn't stand the game itself.

Anarchy Online's PvE was something I can't remember too well but it wasn't for me. I can see why ppl say it's a sci-fi classic.

Shadowbane's PvE lol It was okay but not that great. Aside from annoying lag, the character classes were refreshing and original and the PvE's gameplay was engaging but overall lacking especially in end game since it was mostly a pvp game (you have to PvE to level in order to PvP!).

FFXI is the only game on the list I have not tried.

These are just the MMORPGs I feel are major enough that had PvE to give my opinion for. All P2P also (except Guild Wars). After all the MMORPGs I've played I feel that DAoC, Guild Wars, and WoW had the best PvE experiences because those three kept me playing the longest and I could not stop. DAoC 2-3 years from launchday and then off and on some more. WoW 4 non-stop years from launchday. Guild Wars 1 year from launchday.

   Right now I would have to say WoW still has the best PVE out. Aion, Conan & Warhammer are a few of the newer ones that focus on PVP. I hate PVP my self and really don't understand why people buy MMO's and grind their way to top level to just PVP, I don't get it. Just go play Halo or something. There are people out there like me who enjoy PVE MMO's. It's a shame that most developers are all leaning towards PVP now. I'm waiting for FF XIV to come out, they say it is mainly focused on PVE. So I'm sure I'll be picking that up. I just hope SWTOR isn going to have plenty of PVE.

   Most of the early MMO's like EQ and pre CU SWG were awesome and didn't even think much about PVP when they were developed. Yes PVP was there, but not like it is put in to MMO's now. PVP is the reason I'm not playing any MMO right now. In fact I just pre-ordered Fallout 3 GOTY edition for my PS3. I consider Games like Fallout 3, Elder Scrolls & Fable II to be single player MMO's. It's just like playing WoW when you grind your way up to top level on your own.

Originally posted by Gravarg

There is only one real PvE MMO, that's Final Fantasy XI.  All others are just single player rpgs that you play along side other players, nothing multiplayer about them.  That's why FFXI is my favorite MMO for PvE.  DAoC is best PvP MMO, since you really had to group up to do very well in PvP (yay massive 100man+ raids). Other than the weekly raid in WoW, you never have to group in any other "MMO".

 

calling games like WoW and LotRO massively MULTIPLAYER is like calling a Ford Escape a SPORT utility vehicle.  They're not multiplayer, just like there are no SUVs, except the Hummer H1

Actually MMORPGs are also a persistent online world that exists when players log off. So the definition of an MMORPG isn't just a large group of players all doing something together though they definitely have that feature in most MMORPGs. This allows for single player, small coop, small pvp, or large coop and pvp all at the same time.

In my opinion a game that limits gameplay only to raid content and that alone, that leaves less things to do. Which is also somewhat true if you just think about it. Less things to do = less things are available to you to experience.

Still, I agree MMORPGs like WoW and others need to encourage grouping more. As WoW stands now there's no reason to group since it divides group player's EXP in half per person and speeds questing up thereby leaving people with no more quests to do for their level making them grind to open up more quests.

Ahh I remember the vanilla DAoC days when it took forever to level up and everyone grouped for nearly everything and it came with group bonus EXP.

The problem is divided EXP discourages leveling *Edit: grouping*. People should get bonuses for grouping other than the fact you probably won't die grouped with a friend. In WoW most people do not fear death enough to group unless they entered a zone that's too high for them and then they're more like a crutch to the people that are high enough.

Hmm i have played alot of these games but by far the best PvE was ffxi... next would be WoW simply because well Raiding is fun!

It's all opinion anyways.  Raiding easily goes to WoW though, or at least it did before Lich King came out.  I can't really comment on solo pve as I really couldn't careless about it.  Small group pve...hmmm well the only games that have done it really well I can think of aren't MMORPG's.

Originally posted by Gravarg

There is only one real PvE MMO, that's Final Fantasy XI.  All others are just single player rpgs that you play along side other players, nothing multiplayer about them.  That's why FFXI is my favorite MMO for PvE.  DAoC is best PvP MMO, since you really had to group up to do very well in PvP (yay massive 100man+ raids). Other than the weekly raid in WoW, you never have to group in any other "MMO".

 

calling games like WoW and LotRO massively MULTIPLAYER is like calling a Ford Escape a SPORT utility vehicle.  They're not multiplayer, just like there are no SUVs, except the Hummer H1

Did you play EQ1 back in the original through Planes of Power days?

Also, your definition of multiplayer is skewed.  It's your opinion, but not one backed by any definition other than your own.

Originally posted by daeandor

Originally posted by Gravarg

There is only one real PvE MMO, that's Final Fantasy XI.  All others are just single player rpgs that you play along side other players, nothing multiplayer about them.  That's why FFXI is my favorite MMO for PvE.  DAoC is best PvP MMO, since you really had to group up to do very well in PvP (yay massive 100man+ raids). Other than the weekly raid in WoW, you never have to group in any other "MMO".

 

calling games like WoW and LotRO massively MULTIPLAYER is like calling a Ford Escape a SPORT utility vehicle.  They're not multiplayer, just like there are no SUVs, except the Hummer H1

 

Did you play EQ1 back in the original through Planes of Power days?

 

Also, your definition of multiplayer is skewed.  It's your opinion, but not one backed by any definition other than your own.

EQ 1 was a very good game for its time. I actually forgot to mention Phantasy star online. Yes its not really an mmorpg, but still had a loyal fan base at  that EQ 1999-2002 time frame. 

Those who voted Darkfall are doing something wrong imo :D

Its FFXI without a doubt.

EQ lost its way along the way, all this pre this pre that is irrelevent. You gotta take what the expansions did to the game. No expansion ruined FFXI.

FFXI's first expansion gear is just as viable as its last expansions gear, unlike other games, I dont consider that good PvE mechanics. Yes I am looking at you WoW. 

I cant really comment on lotr because i dont know anything about that game.

So IMO FFXI has the best PvE.

Everquest but I'm not going to give my vote to EQ2 so I didn't vote.

It has to be World of Warcraft and EQ2

Originally posted by Gravarg

There is only one real PvE MMO, that's Final Fantasy XI.  All others are just single player rpgs that you play along side other players, nothing multiplayer about them.  That's why FFXI is my favorite MMO for PvE.  DAoC is best PvP MMO, since you really had to group up to do very well in PvP (yay massive 100man+ raids). Other than the weekly raid in WoW, you never have to group in any other "MMO".

 

calling games like WoW and LotRO massively MULTIPLAYER is like calling a Ford Escape a SPORT utility vehicle.  They're not multiplayer, just like there are no SUVs, except the Hummer H1

Sorry, but if you want to achieve something in WoW, you have to group. Be it for arena or raids, you wont get a frostwyrm or Mirmiron's head by not grouping with extremely skilled people. Hell, even in BGs you have to group unless you enjoy enduring the retardness of your average BG pug.
On topic, I'd go with FFXI, because raiding isn't the only aspect of PvE.

If you're talking strictly quests, Runescape's (harder) quests took a lot of preparation, time, and patience. There were no floaty question marks, there was no quest text to blow through and ignore (well, a little journal-type log, but that only had short phrases like "I need to find a way through the Underground Pass"), and they were solo (though you could do them with friends) so you felt awesome if you completed them. Funny, huh? Quests and variety of skills are all RS has going for it.

If you're talking strictly quests in a more traditional sense, I'd have to go with LotRO. Beautiful, immersive world with well written text and quests that make sense. WoW certainly does have alot of quests, but they aren't that great until Northrend, honestly. All of Azeroth pales in comparison (which is why they're breaking it and starting over with Cataclysm). Honestly, ever been to Azshara as Alliance? Probably two, three quests in an entire zone. That's lame.

As far as group challenges, or raiding, yeah... WoW takes the cake here. Even "easy" raids can be screwed up if people don't work together well. And, of course, progression is a bitch. It takes alot of patience (unless you're Ensidia) and dedication. Blizzard does a pretty good job of balancing bosses (though there's always that first little hotfix, isn't there?) and the challenge is fun even if you do it for a while.

Both EQ1 and EQ2, early on in those games, had great PVE.  Mainly, you felt the game was not holding your hand and that the mobs were trying as hard to survive and win a fight as the players.

Out of all the games I've played, I have to say that my favourite PVE experience would have to be Guild Wars, even though Guild Wars is supposed to be PVP-concentrated. Even though the storyline in Guild Wars was more... well... storyline-based than lore based, I loved the storyline to bits. I loved the fact that it made me feel as if I was the hero of the story, and that I actually mattered to the storyine as a whole. The characters were extremely enjoyable as well, especially that Koss.

And, it had cutscenes! That was an instant winnar for me.

I'm about to try LOTRO soon though, as long as I can find the game that is... but if I can, I'm definitely going to suscribe to it. I've always been a huge fan of Lord of the Rings, and I would definitely want to experience Middle Earth if possible.

My favorite PVE experiences were pre cu SWG and Everquest 2. I have to admit World of Warcraft was fun and something new in 2004 and I enjoyed my trip to level 60 at that time with my Hunter and Rogue. Since then though I am looking more for the non linear game since after that initial rush of something new with WoW, I rather have the older type MMO experience again with some questing, some grinding, and I used to love grinding with groups..I miss the social aspect of the older MMO's.

My favorite was Asheron's Call 2, as it felt like an MMO, as did EQ and SWG.. however many of these games are just about doing "instanced" dungeons with a few people and it loses that MMO-feel I had.

Final Fantasy XI imo, it is the Only PVE heavy game that i loved..

 Going to have to go with FFXI on this one.

Too bad not many NA people have played it though... FF doesn't seem as popular here as it is in Europe and Japan.