I buy in-game gold so I can give it away to in-game homeless people.....Charity is good for the soul....not sure about Ganking though.

Originally posted by SgtFrog

Originally posted by Goatgod76

Originally posted by SgtFrog

When I started out in EVE my friend sent me 100 million isk....is that still considered cheating ? , I don’t think it is any different than  someone bought it from gold seller (as long as they did not bot it ) but most do so idk .

 

Depends. Did he earn his money legitimately through his deeds in-game? Or did HE buy from a gold seller and then give you some? If it's the first, there is nothing wrong with that, if it's the latter, then yes, it's cheating all the same, and you contributed to it by accepting it.

Na he made it himself.
But if the gold farmer made the money in a legit way is that not the same thing?

Because your friend is not ruining the game by using bots, spamming in-game advertisements, or causing the long-term economic destruction that gold-sellers do.  Your friend is merely one person helping another for personal reasons, not a large organization dedicated to making a profit IRL. 

I have indeed.

Haven't done it in a long time but I bought & sold before.  It made the games more fun for me, and made many many others happy.  I never minded these things, but I was always strongly against spam, or gaming companies coming out to try to do the same thing.

It's one thing if a player who has camped and spent hours of his time to get an item, then decides to sell his time & item to someone else.  It's quite another when a gaming company who can spawn these darn things try to sell them.

 I would never buy gold but I don't mind selling the gold I have :)  and I did sell gold before.

Never bought gold or any other in-game items, I dont play F2P's with item shops (one of the reasons I refuse to go back to EQ2 now) Anyone arguing that gold buyers / sellers dont effect the in-game economy is living in dream land. Basic economic's dictates how adding extra currency to any market pans out ... and its not good for the masses.

I usually end up in guilds that have pretty strict rules on gold buying etc and all the guilds I've ever run have a no RMT policy. The poster saying WoW raiding guilds buy gold is way off base. Some do I'll agree, but its not as wide spread as he/she implys. My WoW guild did not buy gold (as a guild) and we were the only guild on the server raiding Nax (Pre-BC) Now I'm not silly enough to say that no-one in that guild "ever" bought gold as I dont know for sure ... what I do know is that the vast majority of us did our own farming for raids and earned our cash in-game the right way. RMT was / is not a pre-requirement to raiding and IMO raiding is simply no excuse for RMT. Earn your way into the raid or go home.

All that said ... I dont buy / sell items or gold in game for the simple reason that it upsets the games economy. On the other hand .. I have been known to sell whole accounts back in the day. I dont see this as having an impact on the economy except the E-bayers I sold too prob had to fork out a fortune in repair bills as they learned to play my old accounts !!

So in short ... selling virtual items I dont agree with. Selling a whole account .. I really have no issues with assuming the account owner is decent enough to warn his guild / friends and remove themselves (something I always did)

Originally posted by SgtFrog

Originally posted by Goatgod76

Originally posted by SgtFrog

When I started out in EVE my friend sent me 100 million isk....is that still considered cheating ? , I don’t think it is any different than  someone bought it from gold seller (as long as they did not bot it ) but most do so idk .

 

Depends. Did he earn his money legitimately through his deeds in-game? Or did HE buy from a gold seller and then give you some? If it's the first, there is nothing wrong with that, if it's the latter, then yes, it's cheating all the same, and you contributed to it by accepting it.

Na he made it himself.
But if the gold farmer made the money in a legit way is that not the same thing?

Same means to get it, but for different goals. Your friend was doing it through legal in-game means to advance his character. The gold farmer is gathering it in a legitimate way yes, but his intent for it is to sell it for real cash and break the games rules, as well as ruin the economy of the game for their own personal gain outside of the game. There is no justifying it.

I've purchased in-game currency in Lineage 2, DAOC, WOW and EVE.

Oh yeah, and Runes of Magic :)    

I was trying to go legit.

Originally posted by heremypet

There is no excuse, cheaters ruin everything.  So many games have been completely destroyed by cheaters.  I hope whatever small gain you get is worth it.

Way to be hyper-dramatic about it.  You play your own game, you kill your leet mobs, and you participate in the "global" economy (which is really not as different with gold selling as people like to think - I mean the twinks are still gonna prevent you from leet low level gear whether there's gold selling or not).  Even if you're not a solo based person, most everything you do in the game is insignificant to the whole and primarily focused on yourself.  Gold buying and selling doesn't really affect you.  It only affects you because you want it to.  You've latched onto some perceived injustice and try to vilify it in front of everyone, even though it has little to no effect on you.  

It's ok, though.  Most people are like this.  They try to find some sort of cause to feel like they're doing some good for the world, and then take it to the extreme.  Only difference is here you can spam forums with your propaganda.  But hey, I'm the same way, just on the opposite side of the fence as you on this issue.  So I guess we're both extremists in a way.

(Note - my retort is about mmos, not other games such as fps games that are so focused on one specific aspect that they are indeed ruined by cheats)

Originally posted by zaxxon23

Originally posted by heremypet

There is no excuse, cheaters ruin everything.  So many games have been completely destroyed by cheaters.  I hope whatever small gain you get is worth it.

 

Way to be hyper-dramatic about it.  You play your own game, you kill your leet mobs, and you participate in the "global" economy (which is really not as different with gold selling as people like to think - I mean the twinks are still gonna prevent you from leet low level gear whether there's gold selling or not).  Even if you're not a solo based person, most everything you do in the game is insignificant to the whole and primarily focused on yourself.  Gold buying and selling doesn't really affect you.  It only affects you because you want it to.  You've latched onto some perceived injustice and try to vilify it in front of everyone, even though it has little to no effect on you.  

 

It's ok, though.  Most people are like this.  They try to find some sort of cause to feel like they're doing some good for the world, and then take it to the extreme.  Only difference is here you can spam forums with your propaganda.  But hey, I'm the same way, just on the opposite side of the fence as you on this issue.  So I guess we're both extremists in a way.

 

(Note - my retort is about mmos, not other games such as fps games that are so focused on one specific aspect that they are indeed ruined by cheats)

 

yeah your right., with all the crap you just puked up to justify it, i think you deserve all the gold your CC can hold.

Originally posted by Trollstar

I've purchased in-game currency in Lineage 2, DAOC, WOW and EVE.

Oh yeah, and Runes of Magic :)    

I was trying to go legit.

I've paid for gold on Runescape years ago, but never in any of the mainstream mmos such as Aion, FFXI, EverQuest, and SWG

Originally posted by Caleveira

It is cheating, no two ways about it. As a PvPer it specially bothers me because it gives people without use of experience or skill a chance to be on par with someone who got things done the hard way. Now, i really don't mean to come off as holier than thou about it (i stole booze and cigarrettes from convenience stores more than a few times when i was in high school) but there's no discussion about it being wrong. It seems it's now become much more of an issue with gold farmers exploiting cheap labor in the third world. This people don't get even their country's minimum wage, have no job security and are certainly exposed to human traficking or worse. By providing resources to criminal organizations people buying gold may be getting their own hands bloody. I know it may seem exagerated but really adults should have no part in this, nor allow others to be involved.

Having MMOs asociated with crime will hurt us all, already keyloggers and other types of scammers have made navigating gaming sites difficult at best. I appreciate the OP's candor in discussing this issue, as well as that of other posters, i understand it may seem like a harmless thing to do and not a big deal. But there are grave consequences to this behaviour.

And all other things aside, the internet's anonimity is no excuse for dishonesty.

Actually, the real problem right now has moved beyond cheap Chinese labor and progressed to bots, which don't require wages, sleep, or time off.  Just 24 hr a day bot runs for gold or leet gear to sell.  You ain't seen nothing yet.  Even me, a firm support of rmt in mmos, despises bots and what they represent to the mmo genre.

On another note, supply meets demand.  You can take your moral high road all you want, but I and many other people frankly disagree with the eula claiming that digital items are the property of the owner, and I simply blatantly ignore it.  If anyone is being dishonest, I feel it is the developers claiming right to something they have no right to claim.  You can talk about them owning the servers, and the data, but you know just as well as I do that's a bunch of bull.  The digital age is here, and previous precedent on ownership of virtual data and intangible objects no longer applies the way that it used to.  The claim of a player on virtual property is a very real issue, and not something you can sweep under the rug by declaring it dishonest.

Originally posted by grandpagamer

Originally posted by zaxxon23

Originally posted by heremypet

There is no excuse, cheaters ruin everything.  So many games have been completely destroyed by cheaters.  I hope whatever small gain you get is worth it.

 

Way to be hyper-dramatic about it.  You play your own game, you kill your leet mobs, and you participate in the "global" economy (which is really not as different with gold selling as people like to think - I mean the twinks are still gonna prevent you from leet low level gear whether there's gold selling or not).  Even if you're not a solo based person, most everything you do in the game is insignificant to the whole and primarily focused on yourself.  Gold buying and selling doesn't really affect you.  It only affects you because you want it to.  You've latched onto some perceived injustice and try to vilify it in front of everyone, even though it has little to no effect on you.  

 

It's ok, though.  Most people are like this.  They try to find some sort of cause to feel like they're doing some good for the world, and then take it to the extreme.  Only difference is here you can spam forums with your propaganda.  But hey, I'm the same way, just on the opposite side of the fence as you on this issue.  So I guess we're both extremists in a way.

 

(Note - my retort is about mmos, not other games such as fps games that are so focused on one specific aspect that they are indeed ruined by cheats)

 

yeah your right., with all the crap you just puked up to justify it, i think you deserve all the gold your CC can hold.

Well, I actually don't buy virtual items, I just sell them.  

Sorta makes your retort seem like a bit of ignorant drivel, eh?

Originally posted by zaxxon23

Originally posted by Caleveira

It is cheating, no two ways about it. As a PvPer it specially bothers me because it gives people without use of experience or skill a chance to be on par with someone who got things done the hard way. Now, i really don't mean to come off as holier than thou about it (i stole booze and cigarrettes from convenience stores more than a few times when i was in high school) but there's no discussion about it being wrong. It seems it's now become much more of an issue with gold farmers exploiting cheap labor in the third world. This people don't get even their country's minimum wage, have no job security and are certainly exposed to human traficking or worse. By providing resources to criminal organizations people buying gold may be getting their own hands bloody. I know it may seem exagerated but really adults should have no part in this, nor allow others to be involved.

Having MMOs asociated with crime will hurt us all, already keyloggers and other types of scammers have made navigating gaming sites difficult at best. I appreciate the OP's candor in discussing this issue, as well as that of other posters, i understand it may seem like a harmless thing to do and not a big deal. But there are grave consequences to this behaviour.

And all other things aside, the internet's anonimity is no excuse for dishonesty.

 

Actually, the real problem right now has moved beyond cheap Chinese labor and progressed to bots, which don't require wages, sleep, or time off.  Just 24 hr a day bot runs for gold or leet gear to sell.  You ain't seen nothing yet.  Even me, a firm support of rmt in mmos, despises bots and what they represent to the mmo genre.

 

On another note, supply meets demand.  You can take your moral high road all you want, but I and many other people frankly disagree with the eula claiming that digital items are the property of the owner, and I simply blatantly ignore it.  If anyone is being dishonest, I feel it is the developers claiming right to something they have no right to claim.  You can talk about them owning the servers, and the data, but you know just as well as I do that's a bunch of bull.  The digital age is here, and previous precedent on ownership of virtual data and intangible objects no longer applies the way that it used to.  The claim of a player on virtual property is a very real issue, and not something you can sweep under the rug by declaring it dishonest.

If your ok with cheating in a video game, good for you. You dont have to justify  it with anyone except yourself. So now your leading a revolution against game companies for their DRM? Please, go buy some gold to get your epic gear and stop with all the excuses for doing so.

Originally posted by zaxxon23

Originally posted by grandpagamer

Originally posted by zaxxon23

Originally posted by heremypet

There is no excuse, cheaters ruin everything.  So many games have been completely destroyed by cheaters.  I hope whatever small gain you get is worth it.

 

Way to be hyper-dramatic about it.  You play your own game, you kill your leet mobs, and you participate in the "global" economy (which is really not as different with gold selling as people like to think - I mean the twinks are still gonna prevent you from leet low level gear whether there's gold selling or not).  Even if you're not a solo based person, most everything you do in the game is insignificant to the whole and primarily focused on yourself.  Gold buying and selling doesn't really affect you.  It only affects you because you want it to.  You've latched onto some perceived injustice and try to vilify it in front of everyone, even though it has little to no effect on you.  

 

It's ok, though.  Most people are like this.  They try to find some sort of cause to feel like they're doing some good for the world, and then take it to the extreme.  Only difference is here you can spam forums with your propaganda.  But hey, I'm the same way, just on the opposite side of the fence as you on this issue.  So I guess we're both extremists in a way.

 

(Note - my retort is about mmos, not other games such as fps games that are so focused on one specific aspect that they are indeed ruined by cheats)

 

yeah your right., with all the crap you just puked up to justify it, i think you deserve all the gold your CC can hold.

 

Well, I actually don't buy virtual items, I just sell them.  

 

Sorta makes your retort seem like a bit of ignorant drivel, eh?

The only one sounding ignorant here is you trying to justify the fact that you have to cheat in a video game. A video game, lmao.

Originally posted by grandpagamer

Originally posted by zaxxon23

Originally posted by grandpagamer

Originally posted by zaxxon23

Originally posted by heremypet

There is no excuse, cheaters ruin everything.  So many games have been completely destroyed by cheaters.  I hope whatever small gain you get is worth it.

 

Way to be hyper-dramatic about it.  You play your own game, you kill your leet mobs, and you participate in the "global" economy (which is really not as different with gold selling as people like to think - I mean the twinks are still gonna prevent you from leet low level gear whether there's gold selling or not).  Even if you're not a solo based person, most everything you do in the game is insignificant to the whole and primarily focused on yourself.  Gold buying and selling doesn't really affect you.  It only affects you because you want it to.  You've latched onto some perceived injustice and try to vilify it in front of everyone, even though it has little to no effect on you.  

 

It's ok, though.  Most people are like this.  They try to find some sort of cause to feel like they're doing some good for the world, and then take it to the extreme.  Only difference is here you can spam forums with your propaganda.  But hey, I'm the same way, just on the opposite side of the fence as you on this issue.  So I guess we're both extremists in a way.

 

(Note - my retort is about mmos, not other games such as fps games that are so focused on one specific aspect that they are indeed ruined by cheats)

 

yeah your right., with all the crap you just puked up to justify it, i think you deserve all the gold your CC can hold.

 

Well, I actually don't buy virtual items, I just sell them.  

 

Sorta makes your retort seem like a bit of ignorant drivel, eh?

The only one sounding ignorant here is you trying to justify the fact that you have to cheat in a video game. A video game, lmao.

2 billion + per year industry says that a whole bunch of people disagree with you and don't give a darn what you say.  If anything is ignorant, it is expecting people to agree with your misguided morals.

Now that we've filled up a page with flames, let's stop.  Take another shot at me if you'd like, but I'm done.

I bought 1k gold in WoW 2 or 3 times while I was playing it.

Used it to buy mounts and other other items that IMO did not alter my character much. My gear I earned just like everyone else.

From my point of view buying gold to get a mount cost me less than 1/2 hour of work at my job, where at the time in WoW the same amount was hours and hours of grinding, gathering or whatever. Granted this was years ago when gold was actually harder to come bye.

So for myself, who works full time, has wife and kids its a no brainer for stuff like that.

And honestly who gives a shit, if you get bent because someone bought a virtual item in some MMO then perhaps its you who should find a new game, and a life while your at it.

Its just a game after all, people act like you kicked their dog or something if you mess with " their " game ......

Originally posted by zaxxon23

Originally posted by grandpagamer

Originally posted by zaxxon23

Originally posted by grandpagamer

Originally posted by zaxxon23

Originally posted by heremypet

There is no excuse, cheaters ruin everything.  So many games have been completely destroyed by cheaters.  I hope whatever small gain you get is worth it.

 

Way to be hyper-dramatic about it.  You play your own game, you kill your leet mobs, and you participate in the "global" economy (which is really not as different with gold selling as people like to think - I mean the twinks are still gonna prevent you from leet low level gear whether there's gold selling or not).  Even if you're not a solo based person, most everything you do in the game is insignificant to the whole and primarily focused on yourself.  Gold buying and selling doesn't really affect you.  It only affects you because you want it to.  You've latched onto some perceived injustice and try to vilify it in front of everyone, even though it has little to no effect on you.  

 

It's ok, though.  Most people are like this.  They try to find some sort of cause to feel like they're doing some good for the world, and then take it to the extreme.  Only difference is here you can spam forums with your propaganda.  But hey, I'm the same way, just on the opposite side of the fence as you on this issue.  So I guess we're both extremists in a way.

 

(Note - my retort is about mmos, not other games such as fps games that are so focused on one specific aspect that they are indeed ruined by cheats)

 

yeah your right., with all the crap you just puked up to justify it, i think you deserve all the gold your CC can hold.

 

Well, I actually don't buy virtual items, I just sell them.  

 

Sorta makes your retort seem like a bit of ignorant drivel, eh?

The only one sounding ignorant here is you trying to justify the fact that you have to cheat in a video game. A video game, lmao.

 

2 billion + per year industry says that a whole bunch of people disagree with you and don't give a darn what you say.  If anything is ignorant, it is expecting people to agree with your misguided morals.

It shows the mentality of the buyers more than many, yourself included, would ever admit. If you cheat in a game you will cheat in other things. Again, the entitlement mentality rears its ugly head. You deserve it goddamit and your gonna get it now matter what it takes.

I have bought gold on several occasions in the past...

The way I see it is this: I have a job and other real world responsibilities that take up the vast majority of my time. I have only a small amount of time each day to play my game of choice. I unfortunately cannot afford to play for 8 hours straight each day like many people do. Still, I want to be competitive... so when I have finally reached the end game and I see a piece of gear I can purchase and immediately enhance my character, I have occasionally done so with purchased gold.

I don't see anything wrong with this because advancement in MMORPGs comes down to little more than time spent in game. I have less time to spend in game, but I have more money because I work constantly. If I spent less time working and more time playing MMOs, I would make less money, but my character would be stronger. Buying a little gold occasionally just balances things out ;P

Time = money = advancement.

I have never, and will never buy gold. The earning of gold on my own is a bit of a achievement and goal for me. When someone asks me how i got enough money I can honestly say I worked for it farming and working the AH. I didn't just go and enter my credit card number.

Never. Not from the publisher. Not from gold sellers. If a game sucks so bad that I need to pay someone to play it for me I need to be playing something else or nothing at all.

Yup.   Rather than waste the time grinding for gold, I chose to use my limited play time to actually play and have fun.

Originally posted by Sober_Sean

I never bought gold, but I did sell my account for real life cash.

I've done this. I always find that playing an MMO from scratch the 2nd or 3rd time around is quite fun.

Look at all the cockroaches coming out of the woodwork!  Each with their own little excuses, how cute.

Uh, does Second Life count? Ha ha.

Man, you can waste a lot of real life money in that game...

EDIT: To be more straightforward, do games that have real life money stores count?