I think apples taste like oranges

By Mark Jacobs

According to Jacobs, another way to measure success is to look at the number of servers a game has added in a six-month period. "The corollary to that is if you've seen a game consolidate servers, you know it's in deep, deep trouble -- that's not a healthy sign for an MMO," he said, citing Sony's January-released "Pirates of the Burning Sea" as a recent example. "It will be the same for 'Warhammer.' Look at us six months out. Look at us six weeks out. If we're not adding servers, we're not doing well."

there you go guys

Originally posted by Slovenc

By Mark Jacobs

According to Jacobs, another way to measure success is to look at the number of servers a game has added in a six-month period. "The corollary to that is if you've seen a game consolidate servers, you know it's in deep, deep trouble -- that's not a healthy sign for an MMO," he said, citing Sony's January-released "Pirates of the Burning Sea" as a recent example. "It will be the same for 'Warhammer.' Look at us six months out. Look at us six weeks out. If we're not adding servers, we're not doing well."

there you go guys

Yeah, I remember that.

Originally posted by narakuu

I think apples taste like oranges

The first true fact I have heard all day.  Apples really do taste like oranges. :D

Originally posted by Crosswire

Originally posted by narakuu

I think apples taste like oranges

 

The first true fact I have heard all day.  Apples really do taste like oranges. :D

True facts are SO much better than untrue ones.

Originally posted by mbd1968

Originally posted by Daffid011

It is a flop, because:

• EA-Mythic spent "just south of $100 million dollars" to create the game and will struggle to make that back.
• 1.2 million copies of the game sold in the first quarter of its release. 
• Nearly 70 servers have been merged/closed and the trend does not look like it has finished.
• Warhammer lost somewhere close to 500,000 players in 1 financial quarter.
• Mythic has undergone round after round of layoffs.
• The financial "break even" number for warhammer was 250,000 according to Mark Jacobs and it is doubtful that Warhammer has that many subscribers anymore.
• Warhammer online is the result of a popular IP, from an mmo company with perhaps the most PvP/RvR experience on the market and the financial backing of the largest (at the time) software publisher in the world. 

 

Now that doesn't mean things cannot turn around somehow.  Maybe a successful release in the eastern market?   Maybe some massive changes to improve the game?  Who knows.

I fully believe that Mythic is aware of the problems with the game and is trying to address them, but for whatever reason they have not managed to do that.  In some cases they have only made things worse. 

 

Just wondering if you knew how many months they needed this number for the break even?

There was no mention of how many months would be needed at 250,000 subscribers, but I do think they were talking years and not months. 

Close to $100 million dollars invested in development in addition to ongoing expenses to pay for the team supporting the live game and developing expansions would take more than a few months to pay back.

250,000 x $15/month x 12 months = $45 million dollars a year in subscription fees.  Combine that with whatever they make on box sales and odds are warhammer would take well over 1-2 years to pay the initial investment and ongoing expenses. 

That being said, I don't think EA was looking to bankroll a game this size just to start seeing a return on the investment in a few years. 

---

Originally posted by Slovenc

By Mark Jacobs
According to Jacobs, another way to measure success is to look at the number of servers a game has added in a six-month period. "The corollary to that is if you've seen a game consolidate servers, you know it's in deep, deep trouble -- that's not a healthy sign for an MMO," he said, citing Sony's January-released "Pirates of the Burning Sea" as a recent example. "It will be the same for 'Warhammer.' Look at us six months out. Look at us six weeks out. If we're not adding servers, we're not doing well."
there you go guys

---

Mark Jacobs calls the OP a liar.

Originally posted by Crosswire

Originally posted by Newhopes

WAR is a flop simple as that if the subs where stable then yes it'd make money but the way it's going it could even be in danger of been shut down in the next year.

 

Do you think Warhammer is a flop because......

A - It has less subscribers than WoW

B - Because you and 9 other people don't like it. :)

I don't think it's a total flop, but a flop non the less.  The game had an incredible amount of hype, yet so many people keep leaving.  My guild wasn't huge or anything, but people stopped logging on, or said they were going to quit.  Mythic had their chance to regain players, gain new ones, and make the people still playing happy (or happier).  They didn't listen to their player base asking for important issues to be fixed.  Instead they released new classes, a shitty "expansion", etc. 

The game had potential, and could have been 2nd to WoW.  They had great ideas, but couldn't implement them correctly.  IMO it's too late for WAR to get that much bigger than it already is. 

Originally posted by Crosswire

Originally posted by Newhopes

WAR is a flop simple as that if the subs where stable then yes it'd make money but the way it's going it could even be in danger of been shut down in the next year.

 

Do you think Warhammer is a flop because......

A - It has less subscribers than WoW

B - Because you and 9 other people don't like it. :)

No it's a flop because it continues to lose subs at a record place, financial experts who have looked at the EA report estimate WAR now has around 180-200k subs which means they's lost around another 100k subs which is slightly more than 9 people....

Ehhhh I don't care. My friends and I still play and thats all that matters. We look at it as a good time. PVP is fun and thats what we were looking for in a game. So imo it is a success.

For you its success, im sure, but, im not sure if its for them.

I red somewhere, to be out of red numbers monthly, they need to have 250 000+ subscribers.

I think, its less then 250k yet, and its falling...

Btw. if its success for you, how long youre playing? Ive started day before official launch, when Collectors Eddition stared, but at the end of 2008. Maybe youre still at that optimistic start. 

100 Million dollars cost of production, 1Million boxes sold....200k (give or take) subs after 7 months....

Success.....ok

Think EA is trying to see how far they can push us with a product

The game started as a success.  But after 4 months in it went downhill.  It was all due to the same problems that DAOC had.  Horrible decision making and patching.   I was real happy those first 4 months when the patches were near perfect.  

The seoncd big problem is that they used an age old engine to make a big budget game.  The only way this engine would work and keep players is if the content of the game was epic and gameplay was perfectly balanced.  Now anyone who played this game form 1 - 40 knows that once you enter tier 4 both content and balance go out the window.  Add in that old outdated gameplay engine and people just moved on, (including me). 

I am a big fanboy of this game, because it had everything I pretty much needed in gameplay, but its lack of lvl 40 content has forced me to move onto Champions.

WAR is a flop or flopped or floppy or still flopping simply b/c MJ got fired. 

Originally posted by Urrelles

The game started as a success.  But after 4 months in it went downhill.  It was all due to the same problems that DAOC had.  Horrible decision making and patching.   I was real happy those first 4 months when the patches were near perfect.  

The seoncd big problem is that they used an age old engine to make a big budget game.  The only way this engine would work and keep players is if the content of the game was epic and gameplay was perfectly balanced.  Now anyone who played this game form 1 - 40 knows that once you enter tier 4 both content and balance go out the window.  Add in that old outdated gameplay engine and people just moved on, (including me). 

I am a big fanboy of this game, because it had everything I pretty much needed in gameplay, but its lack of lvl 40 content has forced me to move onto Champions.

4 months in the game had already lost well over half it's population.

Wonder how low war must sink before the harcore fanbois realize that the game is a flop...

When it's down below 200k, they will say it's a success.

When it's down to approxemately 100k, they will still say it's a success.

When EA pulls the plug and the game is dead, they will say it was a success....

Jesus, fanbois!!  Wake up, the game failed.

Originally posted by Miklosan

Wonder how low war must sink before the harcore fanbois realize that the game is a flop...

 

When it's down below 200k, they will say it's a success.

When it's down to approxemately 100k, they will still say it's a success.

When EA pulls the plug and the game is dead, they will say it was a success....

 

Jesus, fanbois!!  Wake up, the game failed.

This is so true, I honestly think these people must be insane to think this game is an success, Honestly how many servers closed and loss of subs needed for these people to understand this.

I reckon the subs atm his below 100k, maybe even 50k. Now the players on the Euro side are asking GOA about combining the last remaining four servers into one, so if that was to happen there would only be one english speaking Euro server lol and lets be honest, more servers on the US side will be combined too.

Now that Mythic is part of this team with Bioware I honestly think SWTOR is the major focus now, so any massive chances we hope that could happen to change the tide, like revamp of the rvr zones, a 3rd faction implemented etc...I doubt they will have the manpower now as the SWTOR is will be in full flow and I think Mythic devs will be helping with that.  They have already said they have been in a shoestring budget.

In my own opinion I see two diffent scenarios playing out, 1. Mythic some how get the resources for a major revamp for WAR, based on elements the players want, ie DAOC.  or 2. WAR struggles on and after SWTOR is more or less completed DAOC 2 or some similar world  is announced.

I was a major  WAR fanboi, I'm not scared to admit it lol but even I had to come to terms that WAR fails on so many aspects. But I'm not slating anyone who is still playing, each to their own I say I was so hoping WAR would be my main game untill the likes of SWTOR came out. 

funny how people over hype SWTOR since is a large singleplayer game and all. Also yea I was big into WAR. Its very annoying when a game with so much potential goes down the drain because the designers refuse to admit they made mistakes and fix them.

I don't know how you can see this game as a failure to be quite honest, it has been roughly a year since launch and subscription figures are probably well above 200k. I play the game on and off so I am not a rabid fan boy. I cannot tolerate these people that hail the failure of a game because it doesn't have 11 million subs.

When the genre kicked off in it's early begingings with games like EverQuest and Ultima you do realise subscription numbers never reached about around 400k? We all go around now comparing MMORPG's to WoW's figures but that isn't a reliable yard stick, the majority of people that play WoW aren't in the market for this genre, they will only ever play WoW, therefore WaR isn't doing to bad on the scale of things, sure it could be better but take WoW out of the equation and it's one of the more succesful games on the market.

Being a fan of Warhammer miniatures game, novels, lore, and MMO's I was very very disappointed at the implentation of the Warhammer world. I left the game for many reasons that I dont need to get into again.

Originally posted by Krayzjoel

Being a fan of Warhammer miniatures game, novels, lore, and MMO's I was very very disappointed at the implentation of the Warhammer world. I left the game for many reasons that I dont need to get into again.

 

 

Not only was Warhammer a flop, but it was my first Mythic purchase and will certainly be my last.  From a PR standpoint, it wasn't a flop, it was an epic disaster.

Originally posted by scodavis 

Not only was Warhammer a flop, but it was my first Mythic purchase and will certainly be my last.  From a PR standpoint, it wasn't a flop, it was an epic disaster.

 

A Mythic disaster. I propose this as a new internet meme.

Originally posted by shakermaker0

I don't know how you can see this game as a failure to be quite honest, it has been roughly a year since launch and subscription figures are probably well above 200k. I play the game on and off so I am not a rabid fan boy. I cannot tolerate these people that hail the failure of a game because it doesn't have 11 million subs.

When the genre kicked off in it's early begingings with games like EverQuest and Ultima you do realise subscription numbers never reached about around 400k? We all go around now comparing MMORPG's to WoW's figures but that isn't a reliable yard stick, the majority of people that play WoW aren't in the market for this genre, they will only ever play WoW, therefore WaR isn't doing to bad on the scale of things, sure it could be better but take WoW out of the equation and it's one of the more succesful games on the market.

No, no, no and NO!! Nobody is saying that a mmo needs those WoW numbers as I guess you referring to with those 11 millions subs.

A new small, more or less unknown mmo, can actually be considered as a success if it reach 75-100k subscribers.

If Blizzard comes up with their new mmo and it only reach 200k it would be considered as a failure.

Now, Mythics Warhammer doesn't need to get 11 million+, absolutely not. But somewhere between 150-250k's???  NO, that's not to be considered a success, rather the opposite.

Successful? It started with 55 U.S. Servers and is now down to SIX...SIX! This PoS is in it's death throes,and I say good riddance.

Complete waste of my time and money.Paul Barnett should burn in hell.

from a business standpoint it's a success, I read a thread somewhere that crunched some numbers and came up with the conclusion that Mythic was just barely in the black. the numbers seemed accurate and unbiased, it was a few months ago, so I don't know if it still stands. from a consumer's standpoint however, the game is a colossal failure, and for many this will be the last product they buy from Mythic, including me. I have never been so disappointed with a game in my life, it had absolutely everything going for it, and it turned out to be bland trash. mythic failed to deliver a lot that they had promised (almost no CC? HAH!). their announcement that 60% of the planned content had been cut was basically them admitting they bit off way more than they could swallow, all the while Paul Barnett was off somewhere rubbing his nipples with $100 bills.