World of Darkness is the game I'm waiting on.

Originally posted by Zorndorf

It is clear this list and this post is surprising for most.

3 lessons learned.

"Potential" is the worst what happened in mmorpg's these last 4 years. "Potential" means nothing, it is hype of a hot air balloon filled with ...  air.
The moment you enter the stage of "publishing" a game, ...  you enter the transition of a "potential" hot air balloon to actually  flying the thing.

I just wonder HOW long players will keep accepting the "potential" and pre launch gaming hype.

I really thought that 4 years and at least a dozen "duds" would have pushed some to the edge of "no more day dreaming and "potential" for me .... , just lets wait, see and PLAY.

--------

Secondly, I was very very surprised in the past with the choices of J. Wood when talking about games he likes.

I mean ... being the chief editor of mmorpg.com, and NOT seeing the extremely visible faults of games like WAR or AoC.

I would have thought guys running a website like this would have MUCH more insight in what make games thick these days.

Apparently I am wrong. These guys are not better or worse than the average kid around the block. Perhaps it's because I have a few years on all of you guys, but I think most could recognize the many faults with War and AoC from ... day one, if not (because of excitement) by day 3...

---

Third: what does a 6 year old game do in the list of 9 other "hot air balloons". I mean putting out a list with a game that most likely will not even be put out before 2011... with EVE. ???

I'll let J Wood in on a "secret"; You know potentially the only game that will rake in 1 billion dollars on a yearly basis is not included in that list....

The game that is talked about in the streets and gets the prime time News with every expansion is NOT on the list of "potential" for the coming years and at the same time "potential" is being used for games which are being developped at 1% of the current development costs of that market leader....

Or is perhaps ... the turnover of 1.2 billion dollars on a yearly basis from just one game.. not a "potential" for the complete mmorpg field ... filled with ... hot air balloons.

:))) Chances are J. Wood would not even be an editor of this site without the 800 lb gorilla in the field.

Now that's another kind of potential. The hard succesful dollar wise potential.

 

Our cruisers can't repel douchebaggery of that magnitude!

Seriously though, if you're going to bitch about every little detail like a little girl who just watched her pony be eaten alive by vultures...what are you still doing here? God knows I don't agree with EVERYTHING John says but if I were to disagree on every single tiny indiscrimate little point I probably wouldn't want to subject myself to this site.

lots of aion hate at the start of the thread, even though I'm ready to admit much of it is generic (can't really say hyped, because just reading this thread and people saying it is over-hyped just proves that it isn't over-hyped... because lets face it, WAR was over-hyped because it was an actual bad game hence it didn't match the hype... but most MMORPG fans aren't getting into/hating aion and it has already been out for months in other areas of the world), "lol wow clone" seems bit too much of a judgment considering all the reports im hearing of its 'end-game' are calling it more in line with DAOC... it just seems to me that any players that do comment on a game like this have never really looked into it themselves. does it have a wow-style to it? of course, it isn't eve or darkfall... calling it a wow-clone where currently its endgame and many of its systems is completely different is moronic

you'd think people judging a game they have never played would actually have some reasons on them... instead they just spam invalid opinions about how this is the generic asian mmo (yes because asians can NEVER make good games, racist much?) no. #24

either way, ill agree, why no FF14? SWTOR is the least im excited about, using star wars in mmorpgs (or games in general) just seems unoriginal to me... do gaming companies just want to try EVERY method in which to use a lightsaber?

Originally posted by Shreddi

Fallen Earth does look like a great concept.   Check out comments made by beta testers and potential is not the word they would use now.  Its really too bad because it could have HAD potential but might be too late now.    I really hope the comments I have read about the game are wrong because it was something I was very interested in.   Who knows?  Anyone here want to say how great it is?   Thanks much.

I think the game they were originally planning to make of Fallen Earth would have deserved a spot on this list.

But in my opinion, they made that classic mistake of tailoring the game to the very specific desires of their hard-core fans, who represent the tiniest sliver of their potential customer base.

It still looks like a quality product, but it may draw only a small audience.

I think Earthrise has more potential by virtue of accommodating a broader range of tastes.

Originally posted by Zorndorf

It is clear this list and this post is surprising for most.

3 lessons learned.

"Potential" is the worst what happened in mmorpg's these last 4 years. "Potential" means nothing, it is hype of a hot air balloon filled with ...  air.
The moment you enter the stage of "publishing" a game, ...  you enter the transition of a "potential" hot air balloon to actually  flying the thing.

I just wonder HOW long players will keep accepting the "potential" and pre launch gaming hype.

I really thought that 4 years and at least a dozen "duds" would have pushed some to the edge of "no more day dreaming and "potential" for me .... , just lets wait, see and PLAY.

--------

I think you're absolutely right.

Champions Online throwing in microtransactions on top of a subscription at the last minute was the final straw for me.

And the descent probably started with the travesty that was Dark and Light - which promised.... well basically to do everything short of my taxes and delivered.... no I doubt there's language that would do it justice that wouldn't also see me permanently banned from these forums.

Wish and Dragon Empires looked like they were going to rock my world. Neither made it to release.

Vanguard.... Vanguard was to be the real-deal where Dark and Light failed, except it was released too early and didn't even come close to keeping even half of its promises.

Tabula Rasa.... There were some great ideas in this game. It was even a little bit fun to play at launch, but so unfinished. And though I watched it for a long time after release, it never showed signs of actually being a complete game.

Darkfall.... Despite all the negativity I gave it a go on the recommendation of some friends. And there are some very good elements to the game, but some of those elements interact very poorly with each other to produce a generally unpleasant experience.

The mmo industry is, on the whole, a HUGE disappointment - with a few exceptions like Blizzard who had the benefit of years of experience in the gaming industry before trying their hand at an mmo. Morale is low. We've all become cynical - or dare I say realistically pessimistic. That's probably exactly why this article was written.

But I have to agree with Zorn. With such a spectacular history of disappointing, "potential" really is fairly meaningless. I don't pre-order mmos now unless they've eg. already been released overseas and are receiving both critical and player acclaim. Yes, I bit the bullet and pre-ordered Aion. There's very little new or revolutionary there, but the game is actually finished and enjoyable. It's a totally vanilla mmo, but it's French vanilla, squeezed from the bean between the butt-cheeks of doe-eyed virgins.

Originally posted by Stradden

Originally posted by Zorndorf

It is clear this list and this post is surprising for most.

3 lessons learned.

"Potential" is the worst what happened in mmorpg's these last 4 years. "Potential" means nothing, it is hype of a hot air balloon filled with ...  air.
The moment you enter the stage of "publishing" a game, ...  you enter the transition of a "potential" hot air balloon to actually  flying the thing.

I just wonder HOW long players will keep accepting the "potential" and pre launch gaming hype.

I really thought that 4 years and at least a dozen "duds" would have pushed some to the edge of "no more day dreaming and "potential" for me .... , just lets wait, see and PLAY.

--------

Secondly, I was very very surprised in the past with the choices of J. Wood when talking about games he likes.

I mean ... being the chief editor of mmorpg.com, and NOT seeing the extremely visible faults of games like WAR or AoC.

I would have thought guys running a website like this would have MUCH more insight in what make games thick these days.

Apparently I am wrong. These guys are not better or worse than the average kid around the block. Perhaps it's because I have a few years on all of you guys, but I think most could recognize the many faults with War and AoC from ... day one, if not (because of excitement) by day 3...

---

Third: what does a 6 year old game do in the list of 9 other "hot air balloons". I mean putting out a list with a game that most likely will not even be put out before 2011... with EVE. ???

I'll let J Wood in on a "secret"; You know potentially the only game that will rake in 1 billion dollars on a yearly basis is not included in that list....

The game that is talked about in the streets and gets the prime time News with every expansion is NOT on the list of "potential" for the coming years and at the same time "potential" is being used for games which are being developped at 1% of the current development costs of that market leader....

Or is perhaps ... the turnover of 1.2 billion dollars on a yearly basis from just one game.. not a "potential" for the complete mmorpg field ... filled with ... hot air balloons.

:))) Chances are J. Wood would not even be an editor of this site without the 800 lb gorilla in the field.

Now that's another kind of potential. The hard succesful dollar wise potential.

 

On the first point: That's cool. If you choose not to look tot he future and only look at a game post-launch, that's your right. Me? I'll keep thinking about possibilities.

On the second point: How exactly have I not seen the faults of WAR or AoC? I've written about both and in critical writings, they've come up. What i don't do is harp on them every single time I mention the games.

Third: Did you read the section where I talk about EVE and the reason I chose it? It's pretty much self-explanatory. I was referencing the fact that there is a spoken of feature that will fundamentally change the way the game is played... which you'd know if you'd read the article.

Fourth: This list had nothing to do with money, or the amount of money a game brings in. While I recognize all that WoW has done in the past for this genre. I, personally, don't see what great potential for something new and exciting at this point.

And just to clear things up, the analogy you're looking for is lead balloon, which the saying goes, won't fly. By comparing the games to hot air balloons, you're implying they are going to fly to great heights. Just if you're going to insult someone and their career, it might be wise to get you analogies straight. I'd also suggest thoroughly reading the article you're trashing, but that's entirely optional.

 

Zorndorf continually harps on the best being the thing making the most money. Also you might notice that he starts by attempting to dismiss "potential" as a useful term, then uses it to explain why WoW is the best and has the most potential.  It's like Moebius reasoning.

Agreed with some choices, like SW: TOR and even AION because I recognize that it will be a big force in the global market, but I have to agree with some others who question some of the potential games. Jumpgate should be in the place of SG at LEAST, although I'd probably place it at #5. For everyone else saying FFXIV, we all know that it's going to be a solid game with great potential, but honestly what did you expect?

Only till recently when SE announced their 500k subscriber base and the arrival of a whole new FFXIV, did this site even start to get some good articles on FFXI. For the countless crap we had to read about how amazing these games were that would eventually fail, we maybe got treated to 1 or 2 articles on anything FFXI. Now that FFXIV is coming out and people are actually getting hyped on it, we're getting articles referring to these nifty things in XI like Maat's cap, which should have probably been compiled about 3 years ago =P

Nice article, good to see all of the upcoming games after this half-decade drought.

I originally intended to disagree with Eve as a contender, but actually, it does have a lot of potential. Unfortunately, it's never going to realize that potential as long as it tries to retain its current player base. Someone else mentioned "tailoring their game to their hard-core fans, which is the smallest niche of their potential audience".

QFT. Eve Online's main barrier to real success is designing for the hardcore players who will cash out for multiple accounts, thereby boosting their revenues to multiples of what it would be as a single-account game. When I played, I estimated that fully half of Eve's players had two accounts, and a significant number had three. 

The conditions hardcore players will endure (mainly for the sake of feeling like they're tough in my observation) is way past what any reasonable player will tolerate paying for. The extreme travel time, the ridiculous complexity, price and sheer time sink of the training system, the gatecamping, the abuse of war declarations that make formerly "safe" space into a random gank zone, and the extremely low character of many players (as seen in the vileness filling chat even in safe zones) combine to make Eve a very bad game to play for anyone but their current audience.

But changing those factors would require not only turning against their current players, but their own developer's goals. The game is the way it is because CCP likes it that way, and they freely admit it. So they are not inclined to make a space game that everyone can play, and even if they change their minds, they are still facing the need to subscribe 2 to 3 new players for every hardcore player they lose due to game changes.

Originally posted by wootin

Nice article, good to see all of the upcoming games after this half-decade drought.

I originally intended to disagree with Eve as a contender, but actually, it does have a lot of potential. Unfortunately, it's never going to realize that potential as long as it tries to retain its current player base. Someone else mentioned "tailoring their game to their hard-core fans, which is the smallest niche of their potential audience".

QFT. Eve Online's main barrier to real success is designing for the hardcore players who will cash out for multiple accounts, thereby boosting their revenues to multiples of what it would be as a single-account game. When I played, I estimated that fully half of Eve's players had two accounts, and a significant number had three. 

The conditions hardcore players will endure (mainly for the sake of feeling like they're tough in my observation) is way past what any reasonable player will tolerate paying for. The extreme travel time, the ridiculous complexity, price and sheer time sink of the training system, the gatecamping, the abuse of war declarations that make formerly "safe" space into a random gank zone, and the extremely low character of many players (as seen in the vileness filling chat even in safe zones) combine to make Eve a very bad game to play for anyone but their current audience.

But changing those factors would require not only turning against their current players, but their own developer's goals. The game is the way it is because CCP likes it that way, and they freely admit it. So they are not inclined to make a space game that everyone can play, and even if they change their minds, they are still facing the need to subscribe 2 to 3 new players for every hardcore player they lose due to game changes.

I'd argue that they are experiencing "real success". EvE is their only up and running game and it's making them enough money to pay their staff, pay the bills (and considering what happened to Iceland's economy a few months back and the turmoil that ensued, that's saying something) and begin work on a brand new MMO (World of Darkness Online).

If that isn't real success, then not a single MMO company has experienced "real success". People can nit pick CCP and EvE all they want, but at the end of the day, they are turning a profit and venturing on. *shrug* Which does prove, by the way, that a competent company can make a "niche game" (they're all niche games in my book, even the 800lb gorilla) or, more appropriately, a highly specialized game tailored to a audience and still do well.

I would say that top 3 from your list (and not only those 3 but let's stick with those for now) are going to letdowns as same as Matrix Online or AoC.

You are right about EVE, the game is bursting with potential. Despite CCPs stupid moves this game is the future of online gaming.

Just about STO:

The former idea of a ST MMOG had HUGE potential - the way Cryptic is doing it has very little.

No ship interiors?? That's all about tech, and tons of fans are turned on by the tech aspect from ST.

No crews made of players? Tons of fans would love to be THE Sciences Officer, THE Chief Engineer, THE Doctor, let alone THE Captain. Not to mention how many people, not just fans, would love to start as cadets, really work their way up on the chain of command (working hard, like in a sandbox game), studying in the Academy, then going to a Space Station, and then, if they WANTED, achieving a place at a starship, then becoming one of the bridge officers.

But no, we'll just have a watered down ST experience, modelled after WoW - and by this I also mean "raiding to get better items", when the Items will be your ...crew?

Just where, where is Final Fantasy 14? Le sigh!

Originally posted by jakojako

WUT ABOUT DARKFAL?

Ironically potential is about ALL that Darkfail had going for it. It didnt even make the list, how appropriate. I had myself a good belly laugh.

I really think a game like Darkfall should have been on the list.  Sure the game has it's rough edges at the moment but in time just imagine what could be done with such a game.  I have never played an MMO that brought me the fear factor Darkfall brings.  It's a hard game.  If Darkfall didn't make it I'm very surprised Mortal Online wasn't there.

I can live with all your choices other than #2.  To me as a trek fan the game they are making is a joke and a sad excuse at an attempt for a star-trek MMO.  I love trek, and for that reason will not play that game. 

In the end I would suggest focusing on games that are changing the MMO experience, not re-using the same ideas and features over again with maybe a better finish.  Support the MMO's that are taking a chance at being different.

Originally posted by Bainwalker

I really think a game like Darkfall should have been on the list.  Sure the game has it's rough edges at the moment but in time just imagine what could be done with such a game.  I have never played an MMO that brought me the fear factor Darkfall brings.  It's a hard game.  If Darkfall didn't make it I'm very surprised Mortal Online wasn't there.

 

I can live with all your choices other than #2.  To me as a trek fan the game they are making is a joke and a sad excuse at an attempt for a star-trek MMO.  I love trek, and for that reason will not play that game. 

 

In the end I would suggest focusing on games that are changing the MMO experience, not re-using the same ideas and features over again with maybe a better finish.  Support the MMO's that are taking a chance at being different.

All those games listed, except EvE, are still games with potential, as we have yet to see how the implementation is, and how the market receives them.  EvE has proven that it can weather the hard rocks and launch to the sea.

Darkfall has been launched and potentials as it may be percieved to have, are not realised at all.  The real problem facing Darkfall is debt, $12m plus interest.  It is unlikely that it can recover from there, unless, somewhat like a bankrupcy act, it went down and got sold cheap to someone else, who can then ditch the old debts and move on.  That is last hope, to be sold as scrap and hopefully someone good and rich will take it up and rebuild from scratch.  SoE might have the charity and room to take it, but seeing it ditched Matrix Online, they might not need another dead weight.  Who else would want to risk?  Oh and first and foremost, fire Tasos upon purchase, or the new owner will regret.

EVEr cripled

EVE will allways be crippled  as long as  it has  ruthless free for all PVP  that is anti-casual player

as a mater of fact  many players now waiting for star trek online  are EVE refugees tired of the PVP jerks that like to destroy unarmed haulers and miners  just to ruin  other players enjoyment  of the game

STO will offer  what EVE seems unable to   and will surpass EVEs population probably the first day.

I would really like to know EVEs population before and after STOs release  see how far it drops.

lol no love for Champions Online?

why is Fallen Earth on that list? the game is terrible

Originally posted by Zorvan

Jon, I think you're going to have to add a giant disclaimer of "THIS IS MY OWN PERSONAL LIST AND NOT REPRESENTATIVE OF ANYONE BUT ME" at the top, or the kids on the shortbus are never going to figure it out. Even then, they'll probably miss it.

It won't matter. Most of these people just skim the posts looking for key phrases that piss them off and then go in for the kill... 

Please, you don't "eek out" anything, you eke out an existence.

That one is early as bad as the utterly mad  "here, here".

Like your article but I think you missed an opportunity.  Potential of what exactly?    And I would only put my 2 cents in on Stargate that game has about as much a chance as releasing as I do in ever making an MMO :P

As to others it is an opinion piece everyone has one deal. 

If only shattered galaxy was on this list.  I used to love that game, but KRU absolutely killed it.  With a little work and a company who actually updates (nothing signficant in probably 3 years) that would be one of the most unique and greatest games today.  It's really sad that a company can mess up a game so much and just watch it die.

Great article!  I'm saving this list for my archive.  Jon and I actually agreed on something :-)

Ken

Originally posted by Greenie

 

Correction, they have experience making games not MMO's. Now they may make a very good game that doesn't mean that the mmo and world feel to the population will be well presented or entertaining. For all we know the game could feel exactly like an SRPG with a chat feature.

That being said, Bioware does have a very good reputation and the clips of their games SWTOR and even Dragon age look highly entertaining.

Well, if you remeber correctly Blizzard didn't have any experience in the MMO feild either, they just stole from other games. In fact, they were a RTS company  (ok diablo was an RPG, but their IP was a revolutionary RTS) until then. Bioware is the best RPG company of the past decade-you can throw Bethesda in there too-like Blizzard was with RTSs. Futhermore, Bioware has delivered the best story driven RPG's ever, the games that the story truely mattered and engrossed me. Bioware also has many MMO vets on their dev team, so saying they don't know what an MMO is underwhelms their experience. That being said, the game still has a lot of work to do and hasn't released 75% of the real information on the game. It has a lot of potential to be a hit, but as of now it could also fall into the gutter. 

As for the list:

10 SGW: I don't see it coming out really. Should be replaced with a plethora of games.

9 APB: it has an interesting concept, thing is most MMORPGers may not touch it, making the primary audience GTA players. Those people are probably not going to submit to an MMO because they think it is uncool. Still concept sounds kind of cool.

8 Secret World: The trailer looks cool, could be a fresh of breath air. Still, not much information at all.

7 Ev e: I agree with what 90% of the people here are saying.

6 WoD: I don't know anything about the franchise, which seems to be the main potential.

5 Fallen Earth: Could be a great niche game, and a good sandbox game at large. My main problem would be the perceived lack of content, mainly due to the fact this isn't a huge budget company. 

4 Global Agenda: Pretty much the same as above. Looks refreshing, just the thing that I love in MMO's is the huge amount of content. After 3 weeks I don't want to be at the end end-game content (PvP i guess for this game)

3 Aion: The first 5 minutes greatly disappointed me. It seems like another asian grinder with good graphics. Still, even though I won't be playing it, it could make a splash if it has a smooth launch (due to the fact you mentioned-it has been out in Asia for sometime)

2 Star Trek: Has potential, NPC crews and such look cool. I just don't see it being a deep game, and the ground combat looks boring. 

1 SW:TOR: Again, being cautiosly opptimistic, I think this game has the greatest potential. If they clean up the animations/character models and make ranged classes more fun, this game could be great. Bioware is a world class developer, despite their lack of experience in the MMO realm as a company (the team has lots of MMO experience), and I think they know that story alone will not make a great MMO by any stretch of the imagination. If they deliver on the core tenants of MMO: community, PvP, customization, end-game progression, and crafting this game could be great. There is also a possibilty we could see space combat and cantina games (gambling, cards, swoop racing, etc.) Point in case: Huge budget+Bioware+Star Wars set in the Old Republic=huge potential to succeed or fail.