Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by Ionselon

Originally posted by MMO_Doubter

Originally posted by Ionselon

A nice epeen article.  Congrats on accomplishing your goals against players who you admit had never played DFO before.  Sounds to me like high schoolers beating up on kindergarteners.

BTW, it was not a NA server launch but the opening of the NA server.  A game can have only one launch, and that was the EU server.  There is a difference.

From the description of what was happening in chat, it sounds like the NA server community is no better than the EU server community.  Not unexpected but worth noting.

Enjoy your wins against clueless players.

Ion

Sounds to me, like a smart group used planning and organization to make strong initial strides in a VERY competitive environment. Grats to them. I don't like the exploiting, but it only takes one guild to do it, to virtually force all the others to do the same.

 

As for wins against clueless players - that's PvP, that's war. Why go into a FFA PvP game if you aren't up to competition?

LOL
 

People have been rationalizing their behavior since time immortal.  I understand FFA PvP; I just don't understand bragging about winning against a much overmatched opponent.  Where is the challenge, the true accomplishment?  There is none.

Also, I didn't say anything against the planning and organization the guild demonstrated.  They are to be commended for that.  It's just that their planning and organizing was not really tested because of the uneven playing field that was stacked in their favor.  Again, there was no real accomplish gained through their planning and organizing.

Ion

Edit: grammar

It's a war, not a boxing match. Do you think wars like the Iraqi war or Vietnam wars were evenly matched?

That being said, cheating sucks. But I blame AV for not being able to fix these exploits ~6 months after release.

I don't deny that it's unevenly matched; I'm just saying that it's the height of epeeness to brag about beating an opponent who has no chance of beating you.
 

I'm no fan of AV, but why do you blame them for people cheating?  Sure, they should fix their game, but that does not excuse anyone from immoral behavior.  Just because I can do something doesn't make it right to do it.  Personal responsibility, which is in such short supply in our world today, should prevent anyone from taking advantage of a flaw in a game.  But the reality is that cheaters exist, and they always blame someone else for their behavior.  They can't win honestly, so they cheat their way to their goal.  Why brag about cheating?

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by Ionselon

Originally posted by korvass

Originally posted by junzo316

Are we actually promoting an article on MMORPG that condones a bannable offense?  Ummmm, just wow.....

 

Gotta agree with the dude above.. Kudos to Syndicate's 'uberness', organisational skills are hard to come by. If this is the kind of gaming that makes them happy, great. But why the heck is this an article? The only thing I read there as being positive was the work that goes into organising stuff.

C'mon, editors, doesn't this whole piece really scrape the borders of integrity? MMORPG.com, while remaining neutral in all things, should surely be working toward promoting MMO gaming from a positive angle? This whole article just smacks of all the things already described in earlier responses. AFK 'bloodwalls'?!?! Seriously.. even I know what one of those is, and I'm a bleedin' roleplayer fer fug's sake!

Or is the highlighting of bloodwalls (skilling up your character by hitting afk guildmembers) some sort of journalistic strategy to turn people away from Darkfall? Ooohh.. conspiracies! /sarcasm

It would be interesting to have someone from MMORPG.com comment on their decision to post this article.
 

Why should they not post it? Journalism just reports what other people do, it does not condone it. Censored journalism is no way to fight cheating, it just hides the fact that it exists.

The writer didn't report what other people did.  He reported what he and his guild did.  This is not journalism, so don't try to hide behind that excuse.  It's nothing more than self-aggrandizing article about what he and his guild did.  Nothing more.
 

Originally posted by Yamota

It's a war, not a boxing match. Do you think wars like the Iraqi war or Vietnam wars were evenly matched?

That being said, cheating sucks. But I blame AV for not being able to fix these exploits ~6 months after release.

It seems rather naive of them to allow skilling up by hitting friends. Did no one think of it when they designed the game?

Originally posted by Yamota

Originally posted by Ionselon

Originally posted by korvass

Originally posted by junzo316

Are we actually promoting an article on MMORPG that condones a bannable offense?  Ummmm, just wow.....

 

Gotta agree with the dude above.. Kudos to Syndicate's 'uberness', organisational skills are hard to come by. If this is the kind of gaming that makes them happy, great. But why the heck is this an article? The only thing I read there as being positive was the work that goes into organising stuff.

C'mon, editors, doesn't this whole piece really scrape the borders of integrity? MMORPG.com, while remaining neutral in all things, should surely be working toward promoting MMO gaming from a positive angle? This whole article just smacks of all the things already described in earlier responses. AFK 'bloodwalls'?!?! Seriously.. even I know what one of those is, and I'm a bleedin' roleplayer fer fug's sake!

Or is the highlighting of bloodwalls (skilling up your character by hitting afk guildmembers) some sort of journalistic strategy to turn people away from Darkfall? Ooohh.. conspiracies! /sarcasm

It would be interesting to have someone from MMORPG.com comment on their decision to post this article.
 

Why should they not post it? Journalism just reports what other people do, it does not condone it. Censored journalism is no way to fight cheating, it just hides the fact that it exists.

By posting it, it condones it.  I thought MMORPG was against cheating and exploiting, by publishing this article, it seems otherwise.

Originally posted by MMO_Doubter

Originally posted by Yamota

It's a war, not a boxing match. Do you think wars like the Iraqi war or Vietnam wars were evenly matched?

That being said, cheating sucks. But I blame AV for not being able to fix these exploits ~6 months after release.

It seems rather naive of them to allow skilling up by hitting friends. Did no one think of it when they designed the game?

Blaming the designers for errors or omissions in their game design is fine. Darkfall doesn't sound like a game I would want to play. But as someone else said, taking responsibility for one's own actions is in real short supply these days. Simply just blaming the devs for loopholes, and doing things, 'just because you can' is one reason why RP-PVP servers don't work for crap. Most of the pvp has zero story involved, just people attacking others because they can.

As Chris Rock said, "You can drive a car with your feet; that don't make it a good f*ckin' idea!" - Same goes for 'bloodwalls'.

Originally posted by Ionselon

They are probably the same people who beat up kids on the first day of school for their lunch money.  All the kids started at zero; there were just some who were better organized and better bullies.  LOL, sad.
 

 

They had a choice whether to go to that school, and knew lunch money would be at risk when they made their choice.

Sour grapes make the best whine.

Originally posted by Ionselon

It would be interesting to have someone from MMORPG.com comment on their decision to post this article.
 

Ok,, I'm here.

Not personally being  familiar with the ins and outs of Darkfall's rules, I honestly missed the fact that there was a possibility that the contents of this article described behavior that was not sanctioned by the developers. As you can imagine, it is difficult to be instantly aware of the specific rules in every game on our list.

Of course we don't want to promote cheating in games. Such things are a serious problem within the industry and can completely ruin the integrity and competitive spirit of these games.

As a result of the controversey surrounding the article, and wanting to be fair to both the article's author and to Aventurine and its players, I have emailed Tasos to simply ask the question of whether or not the activities described in the article are against the game's RoC.

If the aforementioned issues turn out to actually be against the rules we will, of course, remove the article from publication, take appropriate internal action and issue an apology and a correction.

Again, it is never our intent to promote activities thata re against a game's rulset. As you can imagine though, with a game as controversial as Darkfall as been, it is difficult to know what is and is not considered acceptable behavior b the game's developers.

Sorry for the confusion.

Jon Wood

Originally posted by MMO_Doubter

Originally posted by Ionselon

They are probably the same people who beat up kids on the first day of school for their lunch money.  All the kids started at zero; there were just some who were better organized and better bullies.  LOL, sad.
 

 

They had a choice whether to go to that school, and knew lunch money would be at risk when they made their choice.

Sour grapes make the best whine.

 

ROFL!!!
 

Dude, that is pathetic.

Thanks Jon.  I know the correct decision will be made.

Originally posted by Stradden

Originally posted by Ionselon

It would be interesting to have someone from MMORPG.com comment on their decision to post this article.
 

Ok,, I'm here.

Not personally being  familiar with the ins and outs of Darkfall's rules, I honestly missed the fact that there was a possibility that the contents of this article described behavior that was not sanctioned by the developers. As you can imagine, it is difficult to be instantly aware of the specific rules in every game on our list.

Of course we don't want to promote cheating in games. Such things are a serious problem within the industry and can completely ruin the integrity and competitive spirit of these games.

As a result of the controversey surrounding the article, and wanting to be fair to both the article's author and to Aventuring and its players, I have emailed Tasos to simply ask the question of whether or not the activities described in the article are against the game's RoC.

If the aforementioned issues turn out to actually be against the rules we will, of course, remove the article from publication, take appropriate internal action and issue an apology and a correction.

Again, it is never our intent to promote activities thata re against a game's rulset. As you can imagine though, with a game as controversial as Darkfall as been, it is difficult to know what is and is not considered acceptable behavior b the game's developers.

Sorry for the confusion.

Jon Wood

 

Good to hear  =)

Originally posted by korvass

Blaming the designers for errors or omissions in their game design is fine. Darkfall doesn't sound like a game I would want to play. But as someone else said, taking responsibility for one's own actions is in real short supply these days. Simply just blaming the devs for loopholes, and doing things, 'just because you can' is one reason why RP-PVP servers don't work for crap. Most of the pvp has zero story involved, just people attacking others because they can.

As Chris Rock said, "You can drive a car with your feet; that don't make it a good f*ckin' idea!" - Same goes for 'bloodwalls'.

What - exactly - are "bloodwalls"?

PvP doesn't have a story, because characters in stories don't have free will. They do what the writer decides they do.

War is hell. Don't expect fair play in a war.

Im not sure which this article says more about,MMORPG.coms role as advertiser rather than consumer advocate, or the type of player in darkfall.

I do know this is a prime example of why games like this should exist.Remember without this game, these players would probably be playing in other games right now, Possibly with you.So,think of DF as the reform school of mmos....

L

O

L

!

My macro > your macro. LOL reading this makes me SO SO happy I quit DF- the only exciting part was waking up hoping they were too busy dealing with hackers to deal with the droves of macro'rs.

I'll admit I macro'd ALOT to keep up with everyone... and it seemed that that was everyone elses reason too... I wonder who the FIRST one was... hah or was there never a first... go go Stand Alone Complex =D. Sucking our own fun out of the game is pure win. But what's the alternative? Get crapped on by all the people who did... cause lets face it, to play DF you gotta be hardcore or a masochist. Apparently I wasn't enough of both to make it in the long haul! Hah

Another $50 saved and a smile on ma face!

Originally posted by Stradden

Aventuring

Really Stradden?

I guess this proves it isnt a paid for article. Atleast there's no D

Originally posted by warty

Originally posted by Stradden

Aventuring

 

Really Stradden?

I guess this proves it isnt a paid for article. Atleast there's no D

lol, ok, it was a pre-coffee typo. I'll fix that.

;)

Sorry just got off work and am being a pedant. BTW as a player, what the article suggests is not macroing (unless I missed it) but bloodwalling which is just not logging out. Its somewhat of a hard distinction as most wallers DO macro, but to bloodwall is not to macro in of itself. Nor is bloodwalling against any ToS or mechanics, wish as i do it did not happen!

Originally posted by tkobo

Im not sure which this article says more about,MMORPG.coms role as advertiser rather than consumer advocate, or the type of player in darkfall.

I do know this is a prime example of why games like this should exist.Remember without this game, these players would probably be playing in other games right now, Possibly with you.So,think of DF as the reform school of mmos....

I'm sure they would prefer to think of it as Salusia Secundous (sp?).

Originally posted by tkobo

I do know this is a prime example of why games like this should exist.Remember without this game, these players would probably be playing in other games right now, Possibly with you.So,think of DF as the reform school of mmos....

Exactly so.

This is the perfect kind of review for Darkfall because 10-15% of players wil go "this sounds like the best game ever" and 85-90% will go "this sounds like the worst game ever".

MMORPGs need two successful "clanbox" type games, one fantasy and one sci fi.

 "As a result of the controversey surrounding the article, and wanting to be fair to both the article's author and to Aventurine and its players, I have emailed Tasos to simply ask the question of whether or not the activities described in the article are against the game's RoC."

That made me chuckle, it will be interesting to see what the reply (if any is). Thier stance on this seemsto have changed somewhat over time  though there is a sort of tacit acceptance by the devs. A kind of OK if you don't get caught situation. Dont want to scare off the 'hardcore' macroing guilds but don't want to alienate those that want a level playing field.

Originally posted by warty

;)

 

Sorry just got off work and am being a pedant. BTW as a player, what the article suggests is not macroing (unless I missed it) but bloodwalling which is just not logging out. Its somewhat of a hard distinction as most wallers DO macro, but to bloodwall is not to macro in of itself. Nor is bloodwalling against any ToS or mechanics, wish as i do it did not happen!

The quotes below would seem to disagree with your assessment.

"Unattended macroing could get you kicked anywhere in the world depending on the situation. You engage in it at your own risk."
 

forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php

"Any macroing or disruptive skilling up within the protective radius of the towers is strictly forbidden. Offenders will be kicked. Repeat offenders will be banned.

Unattended macroing anywhere is forbidden. Offenders will be kicked. Repeat offenders will be banned."
 

forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php

"Macroing: We are working to address it at its source, but until then we need to enforce our policies. Before we do that we will appeal to players not actually playing the game to log off rather than leaving their character in-game. This will allow more people to be able to enjoy Darkfall instead of unmanned characters taking up server space. If you’re skilling up by not playing the game as it was intended, you will be kicked and repeated offenses will result in a ban. "
 

forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php

Not really sure how else you could interpret those quotes.  To say what the OP said they were doing in the article as anything other than "skilling up while not playing the game"... is dishonest at best. 

If the game is fun to play... play it.  Otherwise, you're just another bot program.