Originally posted by rr2real

Originally posted by Methos12

People these days... it's very simple actually: you'll START caring about the story or this MMO isn't for you. Simple as that.

 

if your life is so boring that you need to care about story in an MMO you need to shut off the computer and go out more

Who the heck are you?  Ann Landers? 

p.s., your computer is still on....

Originally posted by rr2real

Originally posted by Methos12

People these days... it's very simple actually: you'll START caring about the story or this MMO isn't for you. Simple as that.

 

if your life is so boring that you need to care about story in an MMO you need to shut off the computer and go out more

if your life is so exciting you never need to read or watch any other stories... no news, no tv at all, no movies, no magazines, no books, no friends telling you about their day.......   then you need to be writing a book about your life.

wtf are you doing on the internet, your life is far to exciting for sucha mundane task.

Originally posted by steamtank

Originally posted by rr2real

Originally posted by Methos12

People these days... it's very simple actually: you'll START caring about the story or this MMO isn't for you. Simple as that.

 

if your life is so boring that you need to care about story in an MMO you need to shut off the computer and go out more

 

if your life is so exciting you never need to read or watch any other stories... no news, no tv at all, no movies, no magazines, no books, no friends telling you about their day.......   then you need to be writing a book about your life.

 

wtf are you doing on the internet, your life is far to exciting for sucha mundane task.

pretty much i'm so great i don't need to do any of that

I love storylines, always have done it gives a sense of atmosphere and progression.  I also love well balanced classes with huge room for customization... So it seems futile to say they are out of touch when thats clearly not everyones oppinion...

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Originally posted by rr2real

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Originally posted by steamtank

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Originally posted by rr2real

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Originally posted by Methos12

People these days... it's very simple actually: you'll START caring about the story or this MMO isn't for you. Simple as that.

---

 
if your life is so boring that you need to care about story in an MMO you need to shut off the computer and go out more

---

 
if your life is so exciting you never need to read or watch any other stories... no news, no tv at all, no movies, no magazines, no books, no friends telling you about their day.......   then you need to be writing a book about your life.
 
wtf are you doing on the internet, your life is far to exciting for sucha mundane task.

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pretty much i'm so great i don't need to do any of that

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Proper punctuation is a casualty of your greatness it seems.

TSDR: DIAF.

Originally posted by Nicrox

I'd rather have a sandbox mmo where its player driven and NOT a linear storyline that would make a sane person insane with boredom.

Hear hear!

I would add that the addition of story lines, story arcs, things that tie in to different paths of your characters destiny (say you are a bounty hunter and there were like five different story paths to follow) simultaneously with your own creation of a story, then that is fine.

But story can only really exist in a meaningful way if the majority of it is played out under freedom of choice. Great crafting and ressource system is a component of that, as well as world pvp, player housing and player cities - preferably with some forms of city government system. Covert ops could play a part too. Player driven economy is the absolute cornerstone of meaningful story creation.

I am sick and tired of Bioware taking the mmo genre and dumb it down so much and claim that the players don't want freedom of choice in their stories. That all we went is to be guided by hand. I strongly believe many players who are now excited about TOR will rebel the minute they understand just how singular this gaming experience will be after all..

Originally posted by Draccan

Originally posted by Nicrox

I'd rather have a sandbox mmo where its player driven and NOT a linear storyline that would make a sane person insane with boredom.

 

Hear hear!

I would add that the addition of story lines, story arcs, things that tie in to different paths of your characters destiny (say you are a bounty hunter and there were like five different story paths to follow) simultaneously with your own creation of a story, then that is fine.

But story can only really exist in a meaningful way if the majority of it is played out under freedom of choice. Great crafting and ressource system is a component of that, as well as world pvp, player housing and player cities - preferably with some forms of city government system. Covert ops could play a part too. Player driven economy is the absolute cornerstone of meaningful story creation.

I am sick and tired of Bioware taking the mmo genre and dumb it down so much and claim that the players don't want freedom of choice in their stories. That all we went is to be guided by hand. I strongly believe many players who are now excited about TOR will rebel the minute they understand just how singular this gaming experience will be after all..

 

guildwars was pretty good for a few weeks gameplay, and then it got boring. but it was good because at least it was free to play online, after you bought the initial game, i can see this one turning into a game, that you play when you need a break from your main online game, i dont see it as having the potential to be a 'main' game at all, though that will depend on whatever subscription model they use. imo i dont see any longevity in this game at all, despite all the shouting by the 'vocal minority'

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Originally posted by Draccan

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Originally posted by Nicrox

 

I'd rather have a sandbox mmo where its player driven and NOT a linear storyline that would make a sane person insane with boredom.

---

 
Hear hear!
I would add that the addition of story lines, story arcs, things that tie in to different paths of your characters destiny (say you are a bounty hunter and there were like five different story paths to follow) simultaneously with your own creation of a story, then that is fine.
But story can only really exist in a meaningful way if the majority of it is played out under freedom of choice. Great crafting and ressource system is a component of that, as well as world pvp, player housing and player cities - preferably with some forms of city government system. Covert ops could play a part too. Player driven economy is the absolute cornerstone of meaningful story creation.
I am sick and tired of Bioware taking the mmo genre and dumb it down so much and claim that the players don't want freedom of choice in their stories. That all we went is to be guided by hand. I strongly believe many players who are now excited about TOR will rebel the minute they understand just how singular this gaming experience will be after all..
 

---

None of us has actually played the game, so this speculation goes a bit to far IMO. You have no idea how much "sandbox" time there will be in between story-arc missions. There could be quite enough to get your self-made story "written".

I was intrigued by the part where you mentioned "freedom of choice...great crafting [is a] component of [story]." and "Player driven economy is the absolute cornerstone of meaningful story creation."

If I wrote stories about my crafting experiences in SWG for example you would be bored to death.

"My gas harvesters on Dantooine caught fire because I neglected them while hunting Ewoks on Endor with my Empire character" is a really shitty story. It's also about as thrilling a tale as "Man, the recession was so apparent at the banking terminals after the new game engine was introduced. I remember when SWG's economy was BOOMING... before the dark times... before the NGE."

Save those "stories" for OOC chat with your guild buddies. If I'm playing STAR WARS I want a friggin' engaging story. A good story; well written and presented. I want something to happen in a cutscene that is so damn cool I want to chat about it OOC in the cantina with other players. Stuff like "have you done the mish with the cave in the jungle on Tython? Man, I shouldn't even tell you what comes at the end of that mission... but I want to show you the items you get soooo bad... look, just go do it, it's so fucking cool!" Especially if I'm paying for it. My imagination is free, I don't want to pay them a monthly fee to "use my imagination". I want the product to actually suspend my disbelief for a few hours.

EDIT: or ignore what I've said and watch the new video. I refuse to believe you don't want this aspect in a SW MMO. Did you even play Kotor?
 

So I understand this thread a bit better, You want to log into a MMO where there is no story just simply grab a weapon head out on quests you have done 3 or 4 times before knowing what will happen.  Go kill 6 bears and bring me thier fangs and after that I will have you go back to that area 5 or 6 times to time sink your day?

So we want more EQ clones where all we do is quest and go into huge group instances with a crappy loot system relying on a 12 year old to play thier class right, Log into vent where they scream and hurt my ears cause thier Testicles have not dropped yet So now I have a headache, I feel like it is more work then fun and Story....this game has a story?.... Then after we fail and get Frusterated at the group content I decide for the rest of the day I am going to go farm mats for 5 hours to see 653524 other people are there doing the same fricken thing.  So now not only Did I have a bad day have a headache and thinking of having surgery so I dont have any kids like the ones I had to deal with ealier, Did not get my loot or complete my quest. Nor did I get my mats so guess all there is left to do is stand around a popular area and try and make idle chit chat with this really hot elf named Bellitrix but in the back of my head know she in real life is either a guy or looks alot like jabba the hut....

No thanks I think I rather have a story driven MMO where I Feel emerged in content and having fun....

Originally posted by Netzoko

It blows my mind how out of touch developers are with the MMO base. With literally the biggest IP in the world, their focus is NOT what gamers have hated about mmos for years. No no, they will contiune to shovel the bullshit, but will now have STORY!

Are you kidding me? The level of absurdity is making my brain swell. People hate classes, they hate levels, they hate watered-down gameplay and grind. Does BioWare plan on address these -universal- complaints? Fuck no, to them the problem with MMOs is story? My mind is utterly blown. From forum to forum across the internet, followers are asking the same basic questions. Whats pvp like? Whats pve like? How are the classes? What is the item system like? Yet over and over, every single dev blog and release is about story. I just can't wrap my head around the unsurpassable amount of ignorance by the dev teams. You would think that seeing the failings of supposed "blockbuster" MMOs like Aoc and WAR would send a message, but no. Alas we continue to be insulted by developers who ignore the -KEY- issues people have with the genre, and instead focus on something utterly worthless.

Newsflash jackasses, your customers arn't upset with lack of story, they are upset with the cookie cutter MMO template that money grubing bandwagoners like you continue to reiterate and expect to sell.

Newsflash Jackass, You have no clue what you are talking about and should never speak for the gameing Community.

Story is one of the biggest and best part of MMO's. you don't want story? go back to your FPS and deal with mindless combat.

 I think we've exhausted this topic. They are focusing on story whether you like it or not. I happen to like it.

Originally posted by Netzoko

It blows my mind how out of touch developers are with the MMO base. With literally the biggest IP in the world, their focus is NOT what gamers have hated about mmos for years. No no, they will contiune to shovel the bullshit, but will now have STORY!

Are you kidding me? The level of absurdity is making my brain swell. People hate classes, they hate levels, they hate watered-down gameplay and grind. Does BioWare plan on address these -universal- complaints? Fuck no, to them the problem with MMOs is story? My mind is utterly blown. From forum to forum across the internet, followers are asking the same basic questions. Whats pvp like? Whats pve like? How are the classes? What is the item system like? Yet over and over, every single dev blog and release is about story. I just can't wrap my head around the unsurpassable amount of ignorance by the dev teams. You would think that seeing the failings of supposed "blockbuster" MMOs like Aoc and WAR would send a message, but no. Alas we continue to be insulted by developers who ignore the -KEY- issues people have with the genre, and instead focus on something utterly worthless.

Newsflash jackasses, your customers arn't upset with lack of story, they are upset with the cookie cutter MMO template that money grubing bandwagoners like you continue to reiterate and expect to sell.

The problem is people have expectations for this game and those are formed by assuming this will be like your conventional MMORPG and I think thats where people are shooting them selves in the foot. Its not going to be your conventional MMORPG i.e. EQ, AOC, WoW, UO, AO  etc , but from my own assumptions from what I have read about the game it should just be refered to as a MMOG its just a massively multiplayer game thats why i'm not expecting any thing from this and will decide if I like it or not when I play it, but like some people have said its too early to say anything and as more information comes out my assumptions might change.

Originally posted by zazz

Originally posted by Ilvaldyr

Originally posted by hubertgrove

Originally posted by zazz

I dont think story is the problem or what is being meant here , its being governed by a story making the game linear that is a big problem.

Agreed - and it's a story that the player cannot change. The player must proceed through it, otherwise there's no game.

How is that different than every other MMOs on the market?

There's always a progressive element in this genre; it's what defines a game as an MMORPG.

If Bioware are going to replace "grind 10000 mobs" or "do 1000 quests to kill 10 x boars" with "complete a long-winded questline" are the end-game oriented players really going to care?

They'll rush through it just as fast as they typically rush through the grinding/questing to get to max level and begin their raiding/PvP. Bioware have already said the game would have these things.

Perhaps a few will whine because it's not bottable, or can't be done semi-afk in large groups .. but I doubt many people (or the developers) will be sympathetic to their viewpoint.

And for the rest of us; the ones who enjoy the journey more than the destination .. it's a HUGE improvement over current MMO mechanics. If they also add in player housing and support for roleplaying, it'll be my dream game.

 

Thats the point mate its not your journey its theres be design, carefully masked by linear options, yes it will be fun but will it having last appeal i doubt it.

 

See people are mistaken by Story Driven, Story Arcs, Story and last which i think your mistaken by is LORE.

 

Regardless i think people want to fall in love with there characters and become someone in that world. not to have to keep roilling different toons and classes every few weeks cause they ran out of content.

 

 

this is my chief complaint as well.

seems like Bioware is selling this story feature as a means to make the game enjoyable to replay it. Umm thats a feature that belongs in single player games.

This is an mmo where your ideally suposed to stick to 1 maybe 2 toons and develop them for years and years.

I suspect we can look to and blame WoW for this warped way of thinking of mmo's. Because games like wow are linear theme parks, people run out of content. So what do they do, why they re-roll another toon. In WoW it was boring to repeat quests in goldshire, westfall, etc. So Bioware comes up with a storyline that gives you different options hence replayability is more entertaining.

The problem though is its still linear, its still forced on the player to progress, and its concept is based entirely on beating the game and starting over. These concepts are more akin to KOTOR 1 but not an MMO.

I dont want a game where the best feature is to finish the theme park linear quests and then reroll a new toon.  This is a huuuuge flaw in TOR and might be its downfall. Yes it will prolly be a blast that first month or two but it doesnt sound like the next MMO I will play for years

Originally posted by admriker4

Originally posted by zazz

Originally posted by Ilvaldyr

Originally posted by hubertgrove

Originally posted by zazz

I dont think story is the problem or what is being meant here , its being governed by a story making the game linear that is a big problem.

Agreed - and it's a story that the player cannot change. The player must proceed through it, otherwise there's no game.

How is that different than every other MMOs on the market?

There's always a progressive element in this genre; it's what defines a game as an MMORPG.

If Bioware are going to replace "grind 10000 mobs" or "do 1000 quests to kill 10 x boars" with "complete a long-winded questline" are the end-game oriented players really going to care?

They'll rush through it just as fast as they typically rush through the grinding/questing to get to max level and begin their raiding/PvP. Bioware have already said the game would have these things.

Perhaps a few will whine because it's not bottable, or can't be done semi-afk in large groups .. but I doubt many people (or the developers) will be sympathetic to their viewpoint.

And for the rest of us; the ones who enjoy the journey more than the destination .. it's a HUGE improvement over current MMO mechanics. If they also add in player housing and support for roleplaying, it'll be my dream game.

 

Thats the point mate its not your journey its theres be design, carefully masked by linear options, yes it will be fun but will it having last appeal i doubt it.

 

See people are mistaken by Story Driven, Story Arcs, Story and last which i think your mistaken by is LORE.

 

Regardless i think people want to fall in love with there characters and become someone in that world. not to have to keep roilling different toons and classes every few weeks cause they ran out of content.

 

 

 

this is my chief complaint as well.

seems like Bioware is selling this story feature as a means to make the game enjoyable to replay it. Umm thats a feature that belongs in single player games.

This is an mmo where your ideally suposed to stick to 1 maybe 2 toons and develop them for years and years.

I suspect we can look to and blame WoW for this warped way of thinking of mmo's. Because games like wow are linear theme parks, people run out of content. So what do they do, why they re-roll another toon. In WoW it was boring to repeat quests in goldshire, westfall, etc. So Bioware comes up with a storyline that gives you different options hence replayability is more entertaining.

The problem though is its still linear, its still forced on the player to progress, and its concept is based entirely on beating the game and starting over. These concepts are more akin to KOTOR 1 but not an MMO.

I dont want a game where the best feature is to finish the theme park linear quests and then reroll a new toon.  This is a huuuuge flaw in TOR and might be its downfall. Yes it will prolly be a blast that first month or two but it doesnt sound like the next MMO I will play for years

Don't know about you but haven't seen an mmo yet (apart from SWG before they took the feature away from the players) where you actually were encouraged not to play alts.  Games like Warhammer, EQ, EQ2, WOW, etc have such a quick curve to get you to the end game with such a small amount of content that you either create alts or quit the game.

I think it might be a downfall for you, but knowing full well that apart from faction differences having completely different quest lines for the classes will make the game far more appealing to people that enjoy rpgs.  Your complaint about linearity is flawed.  There is no MMO that is not linear.  Sure, like eve, they can throw up smoke and mirrors but the end goal of every mmo is to reach the endgame get the expensive and/or rare gear and walk around talking about how you are more elite than the person next to you.

We have 0 inkling of what the endgame in The Old Republic will entail but if it keeps the mouth breathing shooter crowd out of the game then it is that much better.

 M M O R P G

Massively Multiplayer Online ROLE PLAYING GAME

Perhaps its just me, but Role Playing needs an interesting story line. I do not enjoy role playing paint drying.

I don't mind stories, I liked the KOTOR series, and Mass Effect, ME was a nice improvement and you run into people on the way to your destination and do side jobs for them, that's the kind of thing I hope for in TOR.

Never been a fan of classes and levels though, I hope the system is similar to KOTOR where you pick up abilities of your choice and add points to them for improvements. Or a similar system where you either go dark or light depending on your actions and you're given abilities depending (lightning or choke for dark, cure or regenerate for light).

I don't think game will be 100% locked on a linear storyline, I'm sure you can take a break in between and do other stuff or visit other contacts on the way.

Originally posted by severius 

We have 0 inkling of what the endgame in The Old Republic will entail but if it keeps the mouth breathing shooter crowd out of the game then it is that much better.

We do have an inkling:

General:

* Only being released for PC, no consoles
* Seems that the Game has PvE Mode and a PvP Mode - SifiWire
* Graphics are great and smooth - Mentioned in Multiple Reviews
* The interface seems standardised. Hot keys on a UI Bar. - 1UP
* The Majority of the Game can be done without Any help from anyone else - StarWarsMMO Demo
* Space Experience will be in game, its still being worked on - Machinima
* Subtitles for alien speech. - EuroGamer
* BioWare is currently indicating that it will be unwilling to let players skip or read dialogue scenes- EuroGamer
* The UI Can be customised!- StarWarsMMO
* Naming Filters include not being able to have numbers, special characters or Star Wars names - StarWarsMMO Demo
* Full Voice overs for all NPC, Companions and some extent our characters (There is a mention in one of the reviews about some text, maybe just during the selection, it was not too clear.)
* Some voice overs being done by cast members of Battlestar Galatica - Kokaku
* The voiceovers seem to be done by good actors not Fred the Cleaner (If anyone has played Culling of Strath in WoW 3rd boss, you will know what I mean)
* There is mention of a Player Driven Economy in the review from Joystiq.
* No grinding - Destructoid review.
* 8 Classes confirmed (During Gamespot Interview)
* They are looking into seperate servers for PvP, RP etc as an option. - StarWarsMMO
* They are trying to make TOR available to People with a mix of PC quality Old and New- StarWarsMMO
* PvP, Auction House, Raiding and an Economy all confirmed on video by a Dev: ZAM
* The Game is fully operational now Gophn.com
* Localised instancing - When getting/handing in a quest you are the only one at NPC - MMOGAMER

Characters:

* Characters maybe planet locked for a period based on gameplay mechanics (BH needs to get a Hutts help to get off the planet, Smuggler has no ship (Its been stolen)
* Still no mention of non-human playable races.
* Bounty Hunters start on Hutta - Mentioned in Multiple Reviews
* Bounty Hunters Story Arc is called 'The Great Hunt' - SifiWire
* Bounty Hunters as well as ranged can do hand to hand combat plus dirty tricks - SifiWire
* Smuggler starts on Ord Mantell - Mentioned in Multiple Reviews
* Characters can Jump!- StarwarsMMO
* Multiple Voices for Player Characters so that when we respond they do not all sound the same - StarwarsMMO Demo
* Full Body and Facial expressions while speaking - StarWarsMMO Demo
* Information on races other than Human coming soon - StarWarsMMO
* Character customization
* Other classes will get the Cover ability, but maybe not as effective.
* Player Characters have some intresting moves.. Smuggler (knee NPC in nuts and shoot them in the head)
* Mixed Party Quests, If a Smuggler and Jedi group to go do the Smuggler quest line there will be quests for the Jedi to do while helping Smuggler - MMOGAmer
* Dialog selection via a Mass Effect Style Dialog wheel - GameSutra
* There is an END to each classes Story with new content to extend each story- MMOGamer
* The more Dark/Light Side you go you gain access to more abilities that lean towards that calling that going the other way denies you. - GameSutra

Combat:

* No Auto Attack - Mentioned in Multiple Reviews
* Combat is fast paced (Almost Console Speed) - TenTonHammer
* Enemies fall fast and come quick, and the pace of action is consistent.- EuroGamer
* Cooldowns on the skills were very short, and the skills themselves were swift, immediate- EuroGamer
* TOR is NOT going for normal MMO Combat but Star Wars Combat (2.43 on vid)- Gamespot 17th June
* Special moves seem to require points similar to Rogue in WoW. (If you are not sure what I mean read further in this post, its explained)
* Players seem to be able to take on 1 to 4 NPCs at the same time. - Destructoid StarWarsMMO
* Combat seems to be more fluid and dynamic (not too sure what they were refering to by maybe queuing moves?)
* Duel use of Lightsabers shown. - Mentioned in Multiple Reviews
* There is mention of the Sith soaking up damage and causing agro. Possible hint to a Tanking class?
* While seeing the Combat in the Flaspoint its seemed very like Battlefront with 10 vs 2 combat - StarWarsMMO Demo
* When engaging NPCs the NPC switched from Ranged to Melee as the Players got closer - StarWarsMMO Demo
* Combat was more fluid not stiff like KOTRO - StarWarsMMO Demo
* The Sith was Auto deflecting Blaster Bolts during the Flaspoint - StarWarsMMO Demo

Flashpoints/Loot:

* Loot seems to be based on Light/Darkside as well as class.
* End Game Content like Raiding is available if players do not want to re roll- MMOGamer
* Looting is the standard Loot types in other MMOs - StarWarsMMO
* Choices in Flashpoints can change the course of the instance. Kill a NPC and 'A' happens.. do not kill and 'B' happens. - Mentioned in Multiple Reviews
* Flashpoints can be done solo or grouped.
* Group decisions in Flashpoints (Its mentioned that BW are still working on how to apply LS/DS points depending on outcome).
* PvP loot mentioned as loot in the gamespot Smuggler interview.
* Loot sets also seem to be in game, possible mutliple PvP sets mentioned - Gamespot Smuggler
* The Group decisions seem to work like the LOTRO Combo Combat function, you get little time to decide what you want to do. A selection of outcomes appear and you have to decide fast.
* Multiple different outfits per class- TenTonHammer (watch vid)

http://swtormmo.blogspot.com/2009/06/star-wars-old-republic-ingame-gameplay.html

:Enter game:

:Story pop up:

*Skip, skip, skip*

:Level, level, level:

:Max level:

:Done:

:At the forum asking for more:

 Hahaha.. nice try.

They've already stated you can't skip the story. It will most likely be like KotOR where you can skip the audio, but you still have to read the dialogue (if you are smart and hopefully literate) and make a choice.

I still don't get why people are complaining about this.

Who seriously doesn't want a DIFFERENT online experience?

Ask me why I've never even played WoW sometime. If I want cookies, my girlfriend can bake 'em. I want a multi-layered cake, covered with icing and a surprise filling, not some duplicate snack that I have to pay for.

Yeah your right no one gave a shit about the STORY in World of Warcraft......er..wait a minute...DOH! 

Originally posted by Ghostworks

 Hahaha.. nice try.

They've already stated you can't skip the story. It will most likely be like KotOR where you can skip the audio, but you still have to read the dialogue (if you are smart and hopefully literate) and make a choice. 

I think they also have to assume that a number of players are illiterate. Now, an illiterate person can easily hack'n'slash through Diablo, but will have very limited experience in games like Planetscape: Torment or even Baldur's Gate.

Do not have EU numbers, but around 7 million Americans are illiterate, 27 million are unable to read well enough to complete a job application and 30 million can't read a simple sentence (source: http://abcnews.go.com/WN/LegalCenter/story?id=4336421&page=1). And these numbers are growing rapidly.

Originally posted by Ghostworks

 Hahaha.. nice try.

They've already stated you can't skip the story. It will most likely be like KotOR where you can skip the audio, but you still have to read the dialogue (if you are smart and hopefully literate) and make a choice. 

 

 

I remember Kotor ... it was 1 1 1 1 1 2 ... right ? :P

Btw ... i've asked Pete, he does give a crap.

Originally posted by Netzoko

It blows my mind how out of touch developers are with the MMO base. With literally the biggest IP in the world, their focus is NOT what gamers have hated about mmos for years. No no, they will contiune to shovel the bullshit, but will now have STORY!

Are you kidding me? The level of absurdity is making my brain swell. People hate classes, they hate levels, they hate watered-down gameplay and grind. Does BioWare plan on address these -universal- complaints? Fuck no, to them the problem with MMOs is story? My mind is utterly blown. From forum to forum across the internet, followers are asking the same basic questions. Whats pvp like? Whats pve like? How are the classes? What is the item system like? Yet over and over, every single dev blog and release is about story. I just can't wrap my head around the unsurpassable amount of ignorance by the dev teams. You would think that seeing the failings of supposed "blockbuster" MMOs like Aoc and WAR would send a message, but no. Alas we continue to be insulted by developers who ignore the -KEY- issues people have with the genre, and instead focus on something utterly worthless.

Newsflash jackasses, your customers arn't upset with lack of story, they are upset with the cookie cutter MMO template that money grubing bandwagoners like you continue to reiterate and expect to sell.

Tell that to the 20 million people playing WoW, Lineage, Lineage 2, EQ, EQ2, LoTRO, etc.

In case you forgot, an MMO with no classes, no levels and no story based on this same IP was released 6 years ago, and it was a festering piece of garbage that failed miserably and just kept getting worse as time crept on.  AoC and WAR failed because they weren't different enough from WoW to bother with, and for the most part, were buggy pieces of crap.

Who said they are going after the idiots playing MMOs today?  That's no way to make a successful game.  WoW succeeded by attracting non-MMO players.

Originally posted by rikilii

Originally posted by Netzoko

It blows my mind how out of touch developers are with the MMO base. With literally the biggest IP in the world, their focus is NOT what gamers have hated about mmos for years. No no, they will contiune to shovel the bullshit, but will now have STORY!

Are you kidding me? The level of absurdity is making my brain swell. People hate classes, they hate levels, they hate watered-down gameplay and grind. Does BioWare plan on address these -universal- complaints? Fuck no, to them the problem with MMOs is story? My mind is utterly blown. From forum to forum across the internet, followers are asking the same basic questions. Whats pvp like? Whats pve like? How are the classes? What is the item system like? Yet over and over, every single dev blog and release is about story. I just can't wrap my head around the unsurpassable amount of ignorance by the dev teams. You would think that seeing the failings of supposed "blockbuster" MMOs like Aoc and WAR would send a message, but no. Alas we continue to be insulted by developers who ignore the -KEY- issues people have with the genre, and instead focus on something utterly worthless.

Newsflash jackasses, your customers arn't upset with lack of story, they are upset with the cookie cutter MMO template that money grubing bandwagoners like you continue to reiterate and expect to sell.

Tell that to the 20 million people playing WoW, Lineage, Lineage 2, EQ, EQ2, LoTRO, etc.

In case you forgot, an MMO with no classes, no levels and no story based on this same IP was released 6 years ago, and it was a festering piece of garbage that failed miserably and just kept getting worse as time crept on.  AoC and WAR failed because they weren't different enough from WoW to bother with, and for the most part, were buggy pieces of crap.

Who said they are going after the idiots playing MMOs today?  That's no way to make a successful game.  WoW succeeded by attracting non-MMO players.

Truer words have never been spoken. I always get a kick out of the small percent who think that SWG, a game that had a horrible launch and bleeded subs on a monthly basis, is what EVERYONE wants. Newsflash jackass, that game is dead and no developer will bring it back. Get over it.

Speak for yourself, OP. The fact that there's going to be story is the reason I'm buying this game after leaving the MMO genre. While the things you mentioned are important, for me, this is a Bioware game and I'm expecting story. GOOD story. I'll pay $15 a month for an evolving story.