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I disagree with the original poster completely. Blizzard started out re-using gear graphics, and has greatly reduced it. In fact, the latest patch even seperates gear between the factions. The amount of content being added is a staggering pace compared to other games. Go to AOC, the most significant things the devs there have done in the past 6 months have been to merge servers and add free trials.. very little new content. WOW is about to get patch 3.2, which adds a ton of new content. And no, the 'majority' of the new raid is not old bosses, they are about 1/20 of the bosses. Players have been joking (and asking) for this for a long time... Hogger as a lvl 80 raid boss etc. It's a cool diversion in raiding to be challenged in an arena by some of your old nemesis's. Just look at the functionality of the UI that Blizzard has added to the base Ui in the past 6 months. Dual specs, Outfitter, new quest functions, new map functions. Just huge amounts of changes. Again, you can point out every little 'thing' you thing is sloppy and rehashed, but that is a very small minority of the new patches, and the amount of new content WOW gets is HUGE compared to games like AOC and Warhammer. |
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Originally posted by branko2307
There were two new masks added to the game files. Apparently they will be new masks for the halloween event. Some players got a look at the masks and assumed they were for the new player races. The races were a cat-like face and goblins. |
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GETTING lazy and sloppy? Look at Blizzards track record. They've been lazy and sloppy since day 1. Games take them seemingly forever to release, IF they release (Starcraft Ghost.) Patches to games take forever to release. Online play to their games are bug ridden for years before fixes and support is seemingly dropped. Getting lazy and sloppy...
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Originally posted by ZivaDomini
You couldn't be more wrong, but I wont argue the point (too much). Blizzard are one of the few devs who take their time and produce quality most of which you don't notice because they do it so well... such as different Day & Night ambient music in each WOTLK zone, very few even noticed it. And not releasing SC:Ghost? so... they could't be bother to finish it? spend all that money and though "ah I cant be asses".. is that what your suggesting? it didin't meet Blizzard sometimes overly high standards and it was cancelled... sign of a good developer not a lazy developer.
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FANBOI ALERT FANBOI ALERT |
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Originally posted by coffee
You couldn't be more wrong, but I wont argue the point (too much). Blizzard are one of the few devs who take their time and produce quality most of which you don't notice because they do it so well... such as different Day & Night ambient music in each WOTLK zone, very few even noticed it. And not releasing SC:Ghost? so... they could't be bother to finish it? spend all that money and though "ah I cant be asses".. is that what your suggesting? it didin't meet Blizzard sometimes overly high standards and it was cancelled... sign of a good developer not a lazy developer.
I never said their products weren't of high quality. Simply that their products take, for some reason, an excessive amount of time to release. On top of that, they still have quite a number of bugs to work out requiring multiple patches. So they take longer than other games to release, and still have bugs. Not only that, bug their online support for their multi-player is horrid. Bot ridden, hack ridden, ect ect. They take another seemingly excessive amount of time to release patches and they still don't fix their bugs. All that time, all that money and they drop it because they didn't develop it good enough to pass their own standards. To me that's not a good developer. That's a lazy developer. Have you played games by their developers when they leave Blizzard and join other companies? Horrible games. Hellgate: London, for instance. Boasting their Blizzard experience sure suckered me in. Yup, complete failure.
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in regards to blizzard re-using models of buildings, armour etc. Blizzard ofc have the money and resources to create 100% unique models and textures, but blizzard have to balance that with their users machines, every model added to the game will use memory on a clients machine, the min requirements for wrath is 1gig ran I believe. Original wow was 512mb I rememeber way back at the start of wow in 2004 I was running win98 with 512 ram, I would know if some horde were sneeking up on me as my HD would go crazy loading up the armour and textures these horde players were wearing, it also made my game play stutter. In 2004 I could click login and be in the game in under 5 seconds in wrath its a good 30seconds as it loads all the resources and I had a good rig with 4gig ram. Its the reason why blizzard and other devs re-use models and textures. The latest patch for TF2 which added new weapons, maps etc was delayed for xbox360 becuase the xbox360 did not have enough ram.
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been playing wow for 2and a half years before quiting my opinion is that no they arent lazy,we the gamers are stupid.before TBC every major patch brought a lot of good things,after the release of TBC and wow being the sole ming of the mountain,the devs did something very logical,thought that we have so many of them that if we feed them same old same old they will be happy.so we have a game that most people that raid dont do much and wait for the nerfs to finish the raids,pvpers who just wont to pvp and those pveers that do the hard core thing.so reusing something its okmthe pvpers wont care much atleast since their problem is with just the pvp balance,the majority of pvers if you nerf a boss and let them kill it they will be happy and the rest we dont care,if anyone says that blizzard cares about their customers then dont know what they are saying,having no competition make those companies think like that,they have 10mil subs if the give shit to players they will be happy.the problem with blizzard is that they are a very good company but why try when your players dont have anything else to play.especially a breed of players that your game created and want from a game what wow offers. |
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They got "lazy" from TBC onward , the original world of warcarft was really made with passion and every part of it was really creative, but since TBC they just copy models and nerf the game to attract to casual to get more epics which are the same models changed slightly. I have no idea why they are "lazy" I guess the developers who worked on the original were just ordered to not put much time into each thing and just release more and more stuff to please the zombie-masses. edit: I remember reading an interview saying that Blizzard didn't expect their game to be so successful so I guess that can be one difference between the original content and the content after success when they smelled the money. World of Warcraft is a proof that MMORPG quality should affect schedule/budget and not the other way around. |
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Originally posted by MrArchy
That article says a lot of things that might make sense using some speculation. Then he says this line "AC2 wasn’t a blockbuster hit, so it didn’t make sense to use the rock star designers on it. Better to let the B team step in."
Then I realize this person is talking about his time designing.... asherons call 2. Not what I would exactly call the role model of mmo teams or a group of people that actually turned out quality. Yet he addressed that. Many of his rock star team was pulled away to work on turbines next project which was.... dungeon and dragons online.
It is like listening to the greeter at wallmarts talk about how wall street should operate. Maybe it is true, but I just can't take him serious.
@OP Mounted combat, vehicles, destructable walls, phasing, multiple versions of every raid/dungeon created now, and everything else. Not exactly what I would classify as lazy or sloppy.
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I dont think they got lazy. Sure I dont like things in the game such as the huge reliance on gear (but the game is based on gear progression so I should complain), but I think Blizz is doing a good job.
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Originally posted by Kyleran
Why should they care or try harder? People will pay them no matter what level of quality they deliver, what's their incentive? Until people start leaving, they won't change their ways...and then it might be too late.
True. Plus if they make a radical departure from the status quo they could get SWG like results. Don't fix what which isn't broken. |
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Ramonski7
 Elite Member
Joined: 5/21/03
"A wise man has something to say, but a fool just has to say something." |
Originally posted by ZivaDomini
I never said their products weren't of high quality. Simply that their products take, for some reason, an excessive amount of time to release. On top of that, they still have quite a number of bugs to work out requiring multiple patches. So they take longer than other games to release, and still have bugs. Not only that, bug their online support for their multi-player is horrid. Bot ridden, hack ridden, ect ect. They take another seemingly excessive amount of time to release patches and they still don't fix their bugs. All that time, all that money and they drop it because they didn't develop it good enough to pass their own standards. To me that's not a good developer. That's a lazy developer. Have you played games by their developers when they leave Blizzard and join other companies? Horrible games. Hellgate: London, for instance. Boasting their Blizzard experience sure suckered me in. Yup, complete failure. Are you mad? It really sounds like it. Now I don't claim to know the inner workings of any MMO company, but for you to come in and claim that you know exactly what went wrong in any given AAA game they have and will release makes you sound quite frankly bonkers!
I love it how you say that you KNOW they release high quality products but point out how bug, hack and bot ridden they are... Ok now if you're talking about Diablo, which I think you are, then surely you know that trying to offer customers a FREE way to play online with their friends while not letting the cost of such a service go over budget maaaybe was a factor in it's design. And I'm sure you're aware that 2 of the 3 things you mentioned are player created and no and I mean NO game in the entire history of game making is hack proof and no MMO is bot proof.
These are both by their very nature corrective issues not preventive ones. You have to see what happened to fix it rather than know before hand what will happen. CAPA look it up.
Also to suggest that developers have anything to do with the final stamp of what gets approved and what doesn't is naive. If you have a standard that you as a company live by, why in the world would you deviate from that standard if you're unhappy with it? Sure most companies looking to make a quick buck would, but doing so would only diminish their own brand in the long run.
Finally it's your own fault for thinking that the best of the best developers of Blizzard games all left to form Flagship Studios. Kinda reminds me of the scene from Jerry Maguire where ol Tom asked, "Who's coming with me!" Sure a couple of people may have left to help form a new company. And they probably banked on clueless consumers to automatically flock to them once they saw the "Brought to you by former Blizzard developers of Diablo!"
Nope it sounds to me that Blizzard is still Blizzard and crankin out triple A's when they feel like they are ready to. I have no problem with it.  "Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas." |
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Nowhere, in any post does it read "This is why such n' such happened..." The closest argument would be my reply to another poster when he mentions that they felt the product wasn't of high enough quality. To which I simply used his argument against him. So, I've no idea where you were going with that. So by all means, show me where I said "I KNOW this is what happened." Quality product- Stable; capable of being played. Interesting storylines. Unique backgrounds/levels. These are what I'm going by a quality. Bugs are an unfortunate truth in every game. I've yet to play a game that didn't have them. However, I've yet to play a game that knew about a bug and took a significant amount of time to even attempt at a patch for it. For instance, Diablo 1. I beat it, played online, got bored, so I started using bots/hacks. I used the same program and items for so long I can't even remember. In fact, I quit playing D1 before they even released a patch for it. It is not about being hack/bug/cheat ect proof. It's about being able to keep up with players as they do these things. I should not be able to use a program, a simple little nothing special program, for well over a year and nothing happen. I also never once said anything about the developers choosing what is published. However, when I hire a team of developers to make a game, I ensure they are capable of meeting my standards. Otherwise what's the point? When I give them money, and years to developer this game and they hand me something that is not of my highest quality, that leads me to question whose fault it is. I gave them time and money. Yet they still didn't meet the standards.
Now about the Hellgate:London. You're right, it is my fault. My point was only that these ARE (were) Blizzard developers. Men/women who worked for Blizzard, on Blizzard products. Which at the time would have been early WoW, Diablo II, Starcraft II w/ expansion and of course Starcraft Ghost.
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I have to agree with you original forum poster. WoW got me addicted in 04. Then when I heard about TBC, I was happy until relese, then I was pissed for buying it. It had mostly no new content that was not the same, no new freash taste in my mouth. Then when WoTLK came out, I payed 40$ for Wintergrasp and a level 80 cap? That should have been a fucking patch (Sorry for the language). So here is what I did. I sold my 5 level 80s and bought my dignety back by waiting for a newer greater game to come out (Such as Mortal Online). So thats all I have to say. Quit WoW while u can, the more that leave, the more freash content blizz will relese to get you back. Just try it. I am. 
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Ramonski7
Elite Member
Joined: 5/21/03
"A wise man has something to say, but a fool just has to say something." |
Originally posted by ZivaDomini
I never said their products weren't of high quality. Simply that their products take, for some reason, an excessive amount of time to release. On top of that, they still have quite a number of bugs to work out requiring multiple patches. So they take longer than other games to release, and still have bugs. Not only that, bug their online support for their multi-player is horrid. Bot ridden, hack ridden, ect ect. They take another seemingly excessive amount of time to release patches and they still don't fix their bugs. All that time, all that money and they drop it because they didn't develop it good enough to pass their own standards. To me that's not a good developer. That's a lazy developer. Have you played games by their developers when they leave Blizzard and join other companies? Horrible games. Hellgate: London, for instance. Boasting their Blizzard experience sure suckered me in. Yup, complete failure. I highlighted in red what you seem to know that the rest of us do not. You're claiming things you have NO knowledge of and back it up with opinions of one game you've played of theirs: Diablo. And one game developed by ex-Blizzard employees. "Small minds talk about people, average minds talk about events, great minds talk about ideas." |
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I don't know why, but you're ignoring the part where I said "It was a reply to another poster." The poster I was replying to said that Blizzard spent "all that money..." It's in his second paragraph, I believe. I was using his own argument against him. Which I thought I said in the quote you posted. But I'll go this far with it. They spent time developing it, that's just a fact of life. They did. I followed the game for about a year before I forgot about it and moved on. That's time, and money, that they spent on it. Money on the dev team, the web designers, and all the other background people whose names we never learn. My opinions were not solely of Diablo, they were of all of their games. I simply named diablo because that's the only one I personally cheated in. The rest I played legit.
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