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Vanguard: Saga of Heroes

Vanguard: Saga of Heroes 

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73 posts found
  Umbral

Novice Member

Joined: 5/29/08
Posts: 1080

7/17/09 4:55:50 PM#41
Originally posted by boojiboy


 

Completely untrue. 

 

Can you please tell-me how Vanguard expand and open more at high levels and not the opposite?

Of course, comparing with other games.

In the end, Xeonsoldier is right .Today the seamless world of Vanguard is nothing more than eye candy, when we talk about gameplay (functional) choices/content/endgame (remember choices= freedom) there are better options among newer, older, zoned, instanced and seamless games.

I agree and I can confirm from level 1 to level 18 Vanguard has a lot of options, freedom and choices everywhere, unfortunately, we can't say the same about mid/end game... character progression, locations, creatures  etc...

  Umbral

Novice Member

Joined: 5/29/08
Posts: 1080

7/17/09 5:00:47 PM#42
Originally posted by boojiboy


 

In fact, part of the problem is that people don't have the patience to let this game develop during the higher levels across all the spheres.


 

You are wrong Boojiboy, this kind of criticism comes from people who explored the game at higher levels including all those spheres ( 3 only, well, 2 as Diplomacy is unfinished and undeveloped).

I don't thing you understood, it is not a matter or patience, the higher level progression of Vanguard is limited, very limited comparing to other games... well, I already said that...

Anyway, it is a nice game and can offer some good moments and immersion while you are leveling.

  TormDK

Novice Member

Joined: 2/22/06
Posts: 98

7/17/09 5:02:15 PM#43

 Vanguards largest problem seems to be that there is only four people working on it.

Which is a shame as the game itself has huge potential that likely never will be realised.

  Daffid011

Old School

Joined: 1/03/04
Posts: 7652

7/17/09 5:23:30 PM#44
Originally posted by boojiboy

Completely untrue.   In fact, part of the problem is that people don't have the patience to let this game develop during the higher levels across all the spheres.

 

Just how many YEARS does vanguard need to develop?  Honestly the excuses are getting out of hand and blaming the players is so far off base it is ridiculous.

 

Vanguard had its shot.  It had a very rare second chance when soe bought it, but soe from minute one showed they were more interested in their stable of other games. 

 

Almost everyone predicted this would happen when soe bought the game and many others said the same thing the second soe partnered with sigil.  This is the reality come true.  Vanguard doesn't need time, it needed a developer that cared about its progress.

 

  Xeonsoldier

Novice Member

Joined: 10/07/08
Posts: 192

7/17/09 5:35:46 PM#45
Originally posted by TormDK

 Vanguards largest problem seems to be that there is only four people working on it.

Which is a shame as the game itself has huge potential that likely never will be realised.


 

This is a part of the problem but its something the game has to live with. As for me, I am 55 in both adventuring and crafting, 50 in diplo, got every piece of gear, mount, you name it. My reasoning for speaking that the game is limited is because I compared my times in EQ/EQ2 even half-assed I felt way more limited in VG then I did in the other two games. Yeah the world is seemless, open and all that jazz but the world doesn't keep you occupied, I don't go around hugging trees for entertainment.

The potential for VG has died years back. ALL games have potential to be something huge not just VG. If L2 got rid of the bots and asian grind feel it could be massive. If WoW stopped being so gd easy, and change the graphics, it would be even more superior. Potential is dead across the board. Its either you produce, or you face the consequences of dealing with a mediocre or failed project.

But lets put it in perspective, yes EQ has been out for 10 years, yes WoW/EQ2 have been out for 5 years. But apparently, businesses will invest their time in those games because why? Their potential has been realized and they just continue with what works. VG had a decent formula going in the low end of the game but failed to do so in the upper end and it is costing them dearly. Loyal subscribers and a reputation. They don't need to be an mmo smash blockbuster 20 million sub game but they need to be on the level of decency and its not even that. Sporting sub 10k numbers is nothing to joke about. Whatever the game has presented, it isn't enough to attract players to get it back on its feet. Its the sad reality.

I can say this because I have done the little viral marketting gig, but the players I've drawn in, have all quit around the same mid point to high end of the game. Simply put, the seamless eye candy is all great, but you need much much more than that to survive in this mmo industry. VG succeeded in putting pictures on a game box, but failed in actually producing the game itself. It is just something we as mmo players have to accept. Granted SOE is working on some new flagship mmo that has been unnannounced, I am willing to bet all I have that they will take everything that VG had that worked and polish the living nonsense out of it.

Oh and crafting game, its cute but about 1 in 20 gamers actually choose a game because of a crafting system. It just doesn't sell like adventuring.

  boojiboy

Novice Member

Joined: 10/28/06
Posts: 1543

7/18/09 2:43:51 PM#46
Originally posted by Umbral
Originally posted by boojiboy


 

In fact, part of the problem is that people don't have the patience to let this game develop during the higher levels across all the spheres.


 

You are wrong Boojiboy, this kind of criticism comes from people who explored the game at higher levels including all those spheres ( 3 only, well, 2 as Diplomacy is unfinished and undeveloped).

I don't thing you understood, it is not a matter or patience, the higher level progression of Vanguard is limited, very limited comparing to other games... well, I already said that...

Anyway, it is a nice game and can offer some good moments and immersion while you are leveling.


 

What I am disputing is the assertion that one has seen it all by the time they hit their 30s.  That's a very misleading thing to tell a new player.  If one likes to raid, then there is a huge amount of content 50+ that will keep a normal player busy indefinitely.  That said, I know there are those that play hard core, and in hard core guilds and they are fiddling their fingers wanting more content.  But that would be true for ANY game for those that play 16-20 hours a day.  Personally, I can't even imagine that kind of play style. 

For someone that plays 15-20 hours a week (which is a lot), there is more to do at the higher levels than there is time for.  I'm still leveling crafting, still working on House and PotA quests for diplomacy.  I'm level 53 and I'm working on trials, we raid APW a couple times a week even though we've killed Kota.  Moving onto Guar and Fengrot soon. 

As for other MMOs... /shrug.  I've played most of them, but haven't have finished the end game in many.  What I do know is that a group of friends left Vanguard prior to PotA, went to WoW, maxed out, got all the top gear, beat all the raid mobs within 3 months and returned to VG for PotA and the level cap.  Also, our guild crosses both EQ2 and VG and the EQ2 players always swing back to VG once they've completed an expansion. 

Seems to me there is plenty to do in the VG end-game.  And if you play hard core, well, then you'll finish the content in just about any MMO you've played, especially if you've been playing for 2.5 years.

  Xeonsoldier

Novice Member

Joined: 10/07/08
Posts: 192

7/18/09 4:16:44 PM#47
Originally posted by boojiboy
Originally posted by Umbral
Originally posted by boojiboy


 

In fact, part of the problem is that people don't have the patience to let this game develop during the higher levels across all the spheres.


 

You are wrong Boojiboy, this kind of criticism comes from people who explored the game at higher levels including all those spheres ( 3 only, well, 2 as Diplomacy is unfinished and undeveloped).

I don't thing you understood, it is not a matter or patience, the higher level progression of Vanguard is limited, very limited comparing to other games... well, I already said that...

Anyway, it is a nice game and can offer some good moments and immersion while you are leveling.


 

What I am disputing is the assertion that one has seen it all by the time they hit their 30s.  That's a very misleading thing to tell a new player.  If one likes to raid, then there is a huge amount of content 50+ that will keep a normal player busy indefinitely.  That said, I know there are those that play hard core, and in hard core guilds and they are fiddling their fingers wanting more content.  But that would be true for ANY game for those that play 16-20 hours a day.  Personally, I can't even imagine that kind of play style. 

For someone that plays 15-20 hours a week (which is a lot), there is more to do at the higher levels than there is time for.  I'm still leveling crafting, still working on House and PotA quests for diplomacy.  I'm level 53 and I'm working on trials, we raid APW a couple times a week even though we've killed Kota.  Moving onto Guar and Fengrot soon. 

As for other MMOs... /shrug.  I've played most of them, but haven't have finished the end game in many.  What I do know is that a group of friends left Vanguard prior to PotA, went to WoW, maxed out, got all the top gear, beat all the raid mobs within 3 months and returned to VG for PotA and the level cap.  Also, our guild crosses both EQ2 and VG and the EQ2 players always swing back to VG once they've completed an expansion. 

Seems to me there is plenty to do in the VG end-game.  And if you play hard core, well, then you'll finish the content in just about any MMO you've played, especially if you've been playing for 2.5 years.


 

I have to disagree with you here. My guild was considered hardcore but we rarely played hardcore. We played 3-4 nights a week 3-4 hours each of those nights. The casual efficient player can get through this game in no time.

  Daffid011

Old School

Joined: 1/03/04
Posts: 7652

7/18/09 4:34:21 PM#48
Originally posted by boojiboy

What I am disputing is the assertion that one has seen it all by the time they hit their 30s.  That's a very misleading thing to tell a new player.  If one likes to raid, then there is a huge amount of content 50+ that will keep a normal player busy indefinitely.


You keep saying this, but somehow I don't think it is true.  You said it when vanguard has just 1 raid zone.  Now vanguard has a second, but the way they implemented it trivializes the first, so it essentially has one raid dungeon again and I doubt it is going to be enough to occupy people for another 1.5 years let alone indefinitely.

I don't know many people who would look at one raid dungeon and say "yep, that will keep me occupied indefinitely.".  Even with the absurb grind time put into the recent patch it doesn't make up for content.

You are the only person I have ever heard talk about all this end game conent and how only hardcore players could possibly do it all.  I mean it honestly took your guild 1.5 years to work your way through 1 dungeon?  Everything you write about your experiences says the content lasted as long as it did because of your guilds skill level and not the amount of content the game offers.   Sorry, but that is just how it reads.  

  Trueth

Novice Member

Joined: 8/21/08
Posts: 308

7/18/09 4:41:27 PM#49

Some people just say whatever they think will get others to subscribe.

 

Vanguard is dead. 4 developers, 1 raid zone and all post 50 content is total crap. Every patch screws up the game more. Even the VG forums are dead. At this point, even if they fired Silius (the man responsible of Vanguards death) it wouldn't matter, the game and population are just too far gone.

 

/next mmorpg please

  boojiboy

Novice Member

Joined: 10/28/06
Posts: 1543

7/18/09 4:44:52 PM#50
Originally posted by Daffid011
Originally posted by boojiboy

What I am disputing is the assertion that one has seen it all by the time they hit their 30s.  That's a very misleading thing to tell a new player.  If one likes to raid, then there is a huge amount of content 50+ that will keep a normal player busy indefinitely.


You keep saying this, but somehow I don't think it is true.  You said it when vanguard has just 1 raid zone.  Now vanguard has a second, but the way they implemented it trivializes the first, so it essentially has one raid dungeon again and I doubt it is going to be enough to occupy people for another 1.5 years let alone indefinitely.

I don't know many people who would look at one raid dungeon and say "yep, that will keep me occupied indefinitely.".  Even with the absurb grind time put into the recent patch it doesn't make up for content.

You are the only person I have ever heard talk about all this end game conent and how only hardcore players could possibly do it all.  I mean it honestly took your guild 1.5 years to work your way through 1 dungeon?  Everything you write about your experiences says the content lasted as long as it did because of your guilds skill level and not the amount of content the game offers.   Sorry, but that is just how it reads.  


 

Heh, nice.  So anyone that hasn't got through all the content is unskilled.  And anyone who has is simply a casual player.  That is BS and you know it.  You are past the point of absurity.  Haven't we been through this before?  Check out the progression thread.  How many have finished APW, all the overland mobs, Bridge of Destiny, Isle of Garzumut and finished all 12 trials?  If it was so damn easy for the casual player just to cruise through all that, then why is it such a small list of guilds?

Once again, sure, hard-core, no life, no job, no kids, play every day, burn up the content as fast as possible sure.  Average player, no way. 

  Cyborg99

Novice Member

Joined: 6/03/08
Posts: 608

All your base are belong to us....

7/18/09 4:54:43 PM#51

OP ignore the haters. It sounds like your having fun and thats all that matters.

Trolls = Hardcore
Fanbois = Carebears


The only posts I read in threads are my own.

  Daffid011

Old School

Joined: 1/03/04
Posts: 7652

7/18/09 4:54:47 PM#52
Originally posted by boojiboy
Originally posted by Daffid011
Originally posted by boojiboy

What I am disputing is the assertion that one has seen it all by the time they hit their 30s.  That's a very misleading thing to tell a new player.  If one likes to raid, then there is a huge amount of content 50+ that will keep a normal player busy indefinitely.


You keep saying this, but somehow I don't think it is true.  You said it when vanguard has just 1 raid zone.  Now vanguard has a second, but the way they implemented it trivializes the first, so it essentially has one raid dungeon again and I doubt it is going to be enough to occupy people for another 1.5 years let alone indefinitely.

I don't know many people who would look at one raid dungeon and say "yep, that will keep me occupied indefinitely.".  Even with the absurb grind time put into the recent patch it doesn't make up for content.

You are the only person I have ever heard talk about all this end game conent and how only hardcore players could possibly do it all.  I mean it honestly took your guild 1.5 years to work your way through 1 dungeon?  Everything you write about your experiences says the content lasted as long as it did because of your guilds skill level and not the amount of content the game offers.   Sorry, but that is just how it reads.  


 

Heh, nice.  So anyone that hasn't got through all the content is unskilled.  And anyone who has is simply a casual player.  That is BS and you know it.  You are past the point of absurity.  Haven't we been through this before?  Check out the progression thread.  How many have finished APW, all the overland mobs, Bridge of Destiny, Isle of Garzumut and finished all 12 trials?  If it was so damn easy for the casual player just to cruise through all that, then why is it such a small list of guilds?

Once again, sure, hard-core, no life, no job, no kids, play every day, burn up the content as fast as possible sure.  Average player, no way. 

The point I was trying to make is that you qualify anyone beyond your guilds skill level to be some hardcore no life player and that you are somehow the baseline average player.  From what you post about your guild I don't think that is the case and I think you are taking a very narrow view of things.  For example there was a thread where you were boasting about how many new healers your guild brings frequently as if to show how many new players there are at max level.  That just tells me how much turnover there is and lack of experienced players really hold a raid back.  *shrug*

 

I can tell you that no matter what, after 18 months of the said raid zone I would be bored to tears.  It doesn't matter how much grind the devs introduce to slow down my progress through the zone, it would get old long before the 18 month mark even rolled around.  Spin it however you want, cast shadow on those who could do the content in a decent time frame it is what it is.  Not a lot of content for a game that is slowly creeping up on its 3rd year. 

 

Can you name me any other game that only has 1 raid zone for 2.5 years and everyone thinks that is enough content to keep them occupied for that time, let alone keep them occupied forever as you put it?

 

  boojiboy

Novice Member

Joined: 10/28/06
Posts: 1543

7/18/09 5:08:10 PM#53

All I am saying is that the average player is not going to catch up and finish content.  Secondly, APW is massive, so if a guild started it when it first came out and spend a year in there, that's not at all unusual.  Hell, APW probably defeated more guilds than guilds that defeated it.  Any new guilds or new players joining at some point after launch or as recently as the past couple of months have a ton of stuff to do when they get to 50 and above.

That said, if someone is a soloer, they can get to 55 but they are not going to find a lot of new stuff to solo or quest.  If someone is just a group-type person, then they've got Shores of Darkness and PotA, Bridge of Destiny and not a whole lot more.  They definitely need more group type content for 50+ and hopefully some of these dungeon revamps fit the bill once they finish PotA-B raid.  And I, as much as anyone, want another APW type of raid zone more than any other planned content.

  Xeonsoldier

Novice Member

Joined: 10/07/08
Posts: 192

7/18/09 5:11:10 PM#54
Originally posted by boojiboy
Originally posted by Daffid011
Originally posted by boojiboy

What I am disputing is the assertion that one has seen it all by the time they hit their 30s.  That's a very misleading thing to tell a new player.  If one likes to raid, then there is a huge amount of content 50+ that will keep a normal player busy indefinitely.


You keep saying this, but somehow I don't think it is true.  You said it when vanguard has just 1 raid zone.  Now vanguard has a second, but the way they implemented it trivializes the first, so it essentially has one raid dungeon again and I doubt it is going to be enough to occupy people for another 1.5 years let alone indefinitely.

I don't know many people who would look at one raid dungeon and say "yep, that will keep me occupied indefinitely.".  Even with the absurb grind time put into the recent patch it doesn't make up for content.

You are the only person I have ever heard talk about all this end game conent and how only hardcore players could possibly do it all.  I mean it honestly took your guild 1.5 years to work your way through 1 dungeon?  Everything you write about your experiences says the content lasted as long as it did because of your guilds skill level and not the amount of content the game offers.   Sorry, but that is just how it reads.  


 

Heh, nice.  So anyone that hasn't got through all the content is unskilled.  And anyone who has is simply a casual player.  That is BS and you know it.  You are past the point of absurity.  Haven't we been through this before?  Check out the progression thread.  How many have finished APW, all the overland mobs, Bridge of Destiny, Isle of Garzumut and finished all 12 trials?  If it was so damn easy for the casual player just to cruise through all that, then why is it such a small list of guilds?

Once again, sure, hard-core, no life, no job, no kids, play every day, burn up the content as fast as possible sure.  Average player, no way. 


 

So I'm a hard-core, no life, no job, no kids person? Lol how about a more efficient player who likes to get things done?I have a life, job, female, but no kids and go to school. Explain my position please sir since I obviously couldn't gotten through so much content.

  boojiboy

Novice Member

Joined: 10/28/06
Posts: 1543

7/18/09 5:14:03 PM#55
Originally posted by Cyborg99

OP ignore the haters. It sounds like your having fun and thats all that matters.


 

/sigh.  Very true.  It's amazing how any positive post with someone stating that they enjoy the game gets met with the same few haters.  Then I get sucked into the argument too!  :)

  Xeonsoldier

Novice Member

Joined: 10/07/08
Posts: 192

7/18/09 5:29:13 PM#56
Originally posted by boojiboy
Originally posted by Cyborg99

OP ignore the haters. It sounds like your having fun and thats all that matters.


 

/sigh.  Very true.  It's amazing how any positive post with someone stating that they enjoy the game gets met with the same few haters.  Then I get sucked into the argument too!  :)


 

If anyone enjoys the game then great. But please don't spread lies and rumors. That's what gets me into these arguements.

  shakermaker0

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/25/09
Posts: 198

7/18/09 6:16:08 PM#57

Vanguard is a great game, its a shame that trolls seems to monitorr any posts about it. If anyone wants an independent and honest opinion/review of Vanguard go to http://thatmmoguy.blogspot.com

  Trueth

Novice Member

Joined: 8/21/08
Posts: 308

7/18/09 6:23:24 PM#58

WTF?? You post a link to your own blog and say that YOUR opinion is the only true and honest opinion -- And -- anyone who has a negative opinion of Vanguard is troll?

Grow-up, little man.

Vanguard is on the brink of extinction. It's not worth the effort to DL and install and certainly not woth $14.99 per month.

  shakermaker0

Apprentice Member

Joined: 5/25/09
Posts: 198

7/18/09 6:27:50 PM#59

I said independent, not true, If you cared to read my blog you would find I praised but criticised the game, you know, sort of like a review. Ironically you proved my original comment that trolls monitor these forums, as soon as I say its a great game someeone with no interest in Vanguard tells me I am an idiot and that Vanguard in fact sucks

Im a little man, your a twat

  Xeonsoldier

Novice Member

Joined: 10/07/08
Posts: 192

7/18/09 6:29:21 PM#60
Originally posted by shakermaker0

Vanguard is a great game, its a shame that trolls seems to monitorr any posts about it. If anyone wants an independent and honest opinion/review of Vanguard go to http://thatmmoguy.blogspot.com


 

Shame, VG's biggest supporters are considered as trolls now? How about real honest players with opinions. Sounds like a much better word.

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