As I said in another post, I am still playin Chinese verison of Aion, I believe it's still 1.1 or 1.0.  1.2 will be out on 7/19 for China.

So far I enjoy this game very much for PvE part, still have not had a chance to try PvP yet, I am a level 28 Cleric.  The problem I think would be a major turn off for Western players are "Death Penalty" and "Need money to cure for XP".  At lower level, it was not a big problem for me since I didn't die too often.  As I level up higher and I needed to group for group quests, I found that I die easily.  Sometimes I die 6 or 7 times in an hour which equal to about 100k to cure all lost xp and pretty much would wipe out 2 or 3 hours solo questing or grinding.  Personally, I have no problem, it's a way to weed out weaker players.  

If Aion wants to capture more players, they might need to remove that or reduce the penalty.  At current level, I think majority of people would quit around 30 because Ice Claw area is a major pain and Key of Abyss mission is very tough if people are trying to do it at level 27.If you die to a player, you do not loss XP, only apply to PvE or death taxi players. :P

I wonder if they would change that for NA version or maybe in 1.5 patch would change to lower the cost.  Again, I have no idea what's in 1.5.  I have only read some in4 from other websites about new dungeons and gears.

rather than seeing this as bad thing, I see it as an incentive for the community not to suck. $0.02

I definitely don't have a problem with this.  I'm sure anybody who has played a MMO before WoW was released will be used to it.  At least you can buy your exp back. 

Originally posted by Ryonox

rather than seeing this as bad thing, I see it as an incentive for the community not to suck. $0.02

I agree completely.

Originally posted by Ryonox

rather than seeing this as bad thing, I see it as an incentive for the community not to suck. $0.02

I agree completely. I play Vanguard and don't have a problem with lossing xp when I die. Sadly though, this game is targeted towards the new age of MMO players like the people who started out with WoW. These people whose first MMO was WoW are going to hate having any sort of death penalty, even though this one doesn't sound severe at all.

You should change the subject to "... turn casual WOW players away."  For people who want challenge this is good.  I don't think it's enough though, losing all of your EQ except what your wearing would be nice.  Full loot would be crazy (since it's not a skill based game) but I'd be good with a random drop. 

Alot of people are coming to this game because of the raised difficulty.  One of the problems with WAR is that when you died you lost nothing but the inconvenience of a trip back.  Death actually means something.

I'd actually like to see a game like Darkfall or Mortal Online using this engine as opposed to it's FPS view.  Reason I can't play those games is I will probably get motion sickness, I seem to get that in a melee FPS view (not shooters though).

If they start dumbing down this game I would quit immediately, I'm sure alot of people will agree.

Originally posted by teco221

As I said in another post, I am still playin Chinese verison of Aion, I believe it's still 1.1 or 1.0.  1.2 will be out on 7/19 for China.

 

So far I enjoy this game very much for PvE part, still have not had a chance to try PvP yet, I am a level 28 Cleric.  The problem I think would be a major turn off for Western players are "Death Penalty" and "Need money to cure for XP".  At lower level, it was not a big problem for me since I didn't die too often.  As I level up higher and I needed to group for group quests, I found that I die easily.  Sometimes I die 6 or 7 times in an hour which equal to about 100k to cure all lost xp and pretty much would wipe out 2 or 3 hours solo questing or grinding.  Personally, I have no problem, it's a way to weed out weaker players.  

 

If Aion wants to capture more players, they might need to remove that or reduce the penalty.  At current level, I think majority of people would quit around 30 because Ice Claw area is a major pain and Key of Abyss mission is very tough if people are trying to do it at level 27.If you die to a player, you do not loss XP, only apply to PvE or death taxi players. :P

I wonder if they would change that for NA version or maybe in 1.5 patch would change to lower the cost.  Again, I have no idea what's in 1.5.  I have only read some in4 from other websites about new dungeons and gears.

 

I think you are correct. Average players might not like the idea of an xp death penalty. And of course being able to pay for the removal of the penalty is one of many money sinks that average players will not like.

 I have been playing MMO's Since EQ and AO launch and I agree 100%,  if you die it should mean somthing, even piss you off a bit.  This is what drives a real gamer to try harder or learn new ways to attack a problem.  Think of a great console game you love and remember that part in the game where you died over and over because it was hard.  I love that part because when you finally beat it you feel like you have accually accomplished somthing.  I am going to be trying the beta this upcoming weekend and I can not wait.  See you there.

I don't have a problem as I am a lvl 35 Assasin and hold many other characters. It sucks to die from a mob and lose some exp with the ability to return some back with cash, but who says u have to do it right after you die? Also I think the price scales nicley according to your level. Like a pervious poster said, it's kinda there so you don't suck at living. I'm happy that PVP you don't lose EXP though. I don't think it's nothing to complain about because players will learn early on before level 10 about dying and what happens.

The fact is there and you are now at 28 should mean you should have already adjusted to the method of dying. Not only that, at that level you should have at least 4 sources of income (Broker (drops, gathering, etc.), Misc. Items, quest, crafting, etc.). My level 21 made alone far over 200k just my hustling with the Broker as there is still a high demand for lower level items.

EDIT

Also this is an rpg, if one is not comfortable with this method (even if they came from WoW) then they should stop the mmo scene or maybe even the RPG scene. Dying don't mean a smile on your face and going about your way. I can think of many harsher games than Aion when it comes to dying.

Originally posted by Ezzerial

 I have been playing MMO's Since EQ and AO launch and I agree 100%,  if you die it should mean somthing, even piss you off a bit.  This is what drives a real gamer to try harder or learn new ways to attack a problem.  Think of a great console game you love and remember that part in the game where you died over and over because it was hard.  I love that part because when you finally beat it you feel like you have accually accomplished somthing.  I am going to be trying the beta this upcoming weekend and I can not wait.  See you there.

 

 

But that's what he is saying. The average person who plays games will not like this.

Besides, "meaning" is so subjective. I don't mind exp loss. I hate running back to get a corpse. Therefore, for me, WoW has one of the most annoying death penalties[AoC for that matter] which is a bit funny since it is one of the easier games short of the raiding.

I have never played a MMO before with such death penalties.I have been looking forward to Aion for ages, and i did not now about the death penalty until now...

Im HAPPY such a thing exists in Aion! In WoW i used to die all the time because i knew it wouldnt effect me. I used to AFK in the middle of enemy camps not giving a crap if i die due to no death penalty. I used to intentionally die just to get somewhere faster. I used to die for heaps of things that players shouldnt be dying for in an MMO. 

Im glad im on the Aion bandwagon. This stuff that Aion is introducing may not be new to the MMO scene, but it is new to me. Im really looking forward to playing this!

I honestly don't think the minor exp penalty upon death will stop anyone from playing Aion. Also as another poster said there is no rule that  says you have to pay to get the xp back immediately anyway. I actually think most MMO players who try Aion will find it refreshing to actually have some incentive to not die, even these so called "weak" WoW players everyone seems to think so little of lol.

Originally posted by Lazarus71

I honestly don't think the minor exp penalty upon death will stop anyone from playing Aion. Also as another poster said there is no rule that  says you have to pay to get the xp back immediately anyway. I actually think most MMO players who try Aion will find it refreshing to actually have some incentive to not die, even these so called "weak" WoW players everyone seems to think so little of lol.

Oh, you would be surprised. I've seen many posts about how the death penatly is bad. My assumption is that they were from WoW players not used to Deat Penalties and who would prefer to keep it that way.

Though not to say that ALL WoW players feel that way, as the gentleman above can attest to.

Sorry to burst your bubble but death penalty is something common in MMOs, WoW is simply an exception (with it being just the hassle of walking back from a graveyard and a 10% durability damage).

And this is one of the weakest death penalties I have seen.

And to remove it because average players may not like it is like saying we should enable all-world flying with no timers and no regio restrictions simply because people want to. It is part of the game, it's either a like it, not care about it, or ragequit because of it feature.

Personally I like it, because it is a way of disencouraging proposital deaths. About to die in PvP? Suicide to mobs. Too hard to level? Kill a few mobs, die, res on a nearby kisk, repeat. Also I like that this, along with DP, make up a system to reward not dying like some retard but instead trying to learn how to survive.

Originally posted by Ezzerial

 I have been playing MMO's Since EQ and AO launch and I agree 100%,  if you die it should mean somthing, even piss you off a bit.  This is what drives a real gamer to try harder or learn new ways to attack a problem.  Think of a great console game you love and remember that part in the game where you died over and over because it was hard.  I love that part because when you finally beat it you feel like you have accually accomplished somthing.  I am going to be trying the beta this upcoming weekend and I can not wait.  See you there.

Yes, exactly.  It's quite rewarding to meet a challenging boss and realize that your own strategy, use of a skill set/chain, etc. was what allowed you to continue.

I've had a good friend, but not much of a gamer, quit Xenogears over a boss battle that he couldn't figure out (the answer was kinda obvious, but not totally).

You see, in this fight, the boss has two *really* worthless skills.  Well, "worthless" to a player because they are annoying and defy your normal expectations for a boss fight.  One skill halves the entire party's HP (and the boss'....), the other cures the boss for a ton of HP a turn or two after it has taken damage from the player.

Essentially, the "normal" -whittle away with your specials and normal attacks, healing when needed, would never work (because as you attack and waste your time/energy to do minimal damage, the boss was maxing HP just as quickly).  It made it futile and frustrating because fighting in a conventional fashion was clearly a dead end

So, what you had to do instead was sit back and just take the pain.  Turn after turn, you just heal and do your best to minimize damage, all the while the boss is weakening itself.  You do not attack.  Ever (it triggers the boss' HP spell, if I remember correctly).

At a certain point (which you have probably established after dying multiple times before), you will reach that spot where your characters can take down the boss based on your total dmg after a way or two of attacks vs. the boss' now depleted HP.

Using every special/etc. you have, you unleash everything you've got.  It feels great to take the jerk down, even if you caught on quickly because you've fought the same kind of boss/battle.  This is why makers CANNOT remove the challenge, or are making a mistake if they do.

My friend was stuck and quit, but after I explained, he went back, and later beat the game... He also confessed it was one of the crazier boss battles he's fought, and that he felt awesome when he finally cleared that level.

Originally posted by teco221

As I said in another post, I am still playin Chinese verison of Aion, I believe it's still 1.1 or 1.0.  1.2 will be out on 7/19 for China.

 

So far I enjoy this game very much for PvE part, still have not had a chance to try PvP yet, I am a level 28 Cleric.  The problem I think would be a major turn off for Western players are "Death Penalty" and "Need money to cure for XP".  At lower level, it was not a big problem for me since I didn't die too often.  As I level up higher and I needed to group for group quests, I found that I die easily.  Sometimes I die 6 or 7 times in an hour which equal to about 100k to cure all lost xp and pretty much would wipe out 2 or 3 hours solo questing or grinding.  Personally, I have no problem, it's a way to weed out weaker players.  

 

If Aion wants to capture more players, they might need to remove that or reduce the penalty.  At current level, I think majority of people would quit around 30 because Ice Claw area is a major pain and Key of Abyss mission is very tough if people are trying to do it at level 27.If you die to a player, you do not loss XP, only apply to PvE or death taxi players. :P

I wonder if they would change that for NA version or maybe in 1.5 patch would change to lower the cost.  Again, I have no idea what's in 1.5.  I have only read some in4 from other websites about new dungeons and gears.

It is intentional Kinah sink. Same as repair cost in WoW. However, I think repair is better as it exists after you reach the level cap.

Well, Aion also has powerstones.

A REAL death penalty that makes people more cautious about their characters?

Man, they can't release this game fast enough for me.

I don't have a problem with the current death penalty costs. I am more concerned about the obelisk waypoint, which you need to fork over 1-2k just to bind location. It might not be a big problem when your financially established, but at the lower levels, you loose out on alot of income needed elsewhere.

so what happens when you reach level cap and die?

Coming from FFXI to WoW, I found WoW's death penalty was a nice little change.  After playing WAR, where dying basically means nothing more than quick transportation to the nearest hub, Aion's death penalty will be good. 

I believe once you reach a level, you won't lose the level. 

 I read all the posts and I thank for all the replys.  I saw a very good point is "Money".  Auction house will only work if there is a demand, Popluation is very important factor in the game and players' levels.  Another nice feature is once you level pass the certain level of mobs, you would not get any loots. This way they prevent higher level players farming lower level mobs or bosses.

I want to talk about money.  Ways to spend so much money without even noticing:

1. Binding to a location

2. Using flight system to another location or zone

3. All the potions and items

4. back bag and bank expansion

5. Upgrading gears if a players would not have the luck for the loot or skill to make their own

Again, I have no porblem with all these because I am from MMO like FFXI.  Farming is normal to me, unlike AOC or Warhammer, money system is a joke.  This will create a problem........ that is huge number of gold farmers will be in the game.  Eeveryday on chinese server with all those non-stop spaming message, it drives me crazy.  They spawn faster then I can put them in my blacklist.  I have to say I was tempted because it's like 41,000,000 for like 30 US dollars (not 100% sure), that would make me just go out to level crafting and just go for all the grouping and buy all the "Gold" gears I want. 

Gold farmers are in almost all MMO, they will not go away because there is money to be made and someone has to do it.  I can only hope people who play Aion has the willpower NOT TO BUY from gold farmers.

Again, I want to emphsize "Average Players or Caucal Players", usually they do not like this kind of idea.  I know lot of people they couldn't handle FFXI, and they have never reached top level.  Luckily, I got to level 75 (2 jobs only), and I found some people to constantly farming.  

My view of the MMO that I have played

1. FFXI: best group and PvE game (2003-2004)

2. EQ2: It was average game.

3. WoW: it's very easy and huge community

4. Matrix Online, Tabula Rasa and lot of F2P MMO:  pretty much all trash to me.

5. AOC: very nice graphic just too many bugs at release, even it is better now.  Too late for me.

6. Warhammer:  at current stage the whole game is a joke.  I didn't like it at beta which I should know it's a sign to tell me not to play but I got the game anyway and I found a very wonderful guild (only thing good out of this game).  My last day will be on 7/15/09 for Warhammer.  Even if they make changes to it, it's too late for me.  (I have full DP and almost full set of  Warlord gears, so I did my share of zerging and PvE, so don't defend Warhammer)

Originally posted by teco221

As I said in another post, I am still playin Chinese verison of Aion, I believe it's still 1.1 or 1.0.  1.2 will be out on 7/19 for China.

 

So far I enjoy this game very much for PvE part, still have not had a chance to try PvP yet, I am a level 28 Cleric.  The problem I think would be a major turn off for Western players are "Death Penalty" and "Need money to cure for XP".  At lower level, it was not a big problem for me since I didn't die too often.  As I level up higher and I needed to group for group quests, I found that I die easily.  Sometimes I die 6 or 7 times in an hour which equal to about 100k to cure all lost xp and pretty much would wipe out 2 or 3 hours solo questing or grinding.  Personally, I have no problem, it's a way to weed out weaker players.  

 

If Aion wants to capture more players, they might need to remove that or reduce the penalty.  At current level, I think majority of people would quit around 30 because Ice Claw area is a major pain and Key of Abyss mission is very tough if people are trying to do it at level 27.If you die to a player, you do not loss XP, only apply to PvE or death taxi players. :P

I wonder if they would change that for NA version or maybe in 1.5 patch would change to lower the cost.  Again, I have no idea what's in 1.5.  I have only read some in4 from other websites about new dungeons and gears.

 

Please don't dumb down these game anymore.  L2P maybe?

Originally posted by teco221

As I said in another post, I am still playin Chinese verison of Aion, I believe it's still 1.1 or 1.0.  1.2 will be out on 7/19 for China.

 

So far I enjoy this game very much for PvE part, still have not had a chance to try PvP yet, I am a level 28 Cleric.  The problem I think would be a major turn off for Western players are "Death Penalty" and "Need money to cure for XP".  At lower level, it was not a big problem for me since I didn't die too often.  As I level up higher and I needed to group for group quests, I found that I die easily.  Sometimes I die 6 or 7 times in an hour which equal to about 100k to cure all lost xp and pretty much would wipe out 2 or 3 hours solo questing or grinding.  Personally, I have no problem, it's a way to weed out weaker players.  

 

If Aion wants to capture more players, they might need to remove that or reduce the penalty.  At current level, I think majority of people would quit around 30 because Ice Claw area is a major pain and Key of Abyss mission is very tough if people are trying to do it at level 27.If you die to a player, you do not loss XP, only apply to PvE or death taxi players. :P

I wonder if they would change that for NA version or maybe in 1.5 patch would change to lower the cost.  Again, I have no idea what's in 1.5.  I have only read some in4 from other websites about new dungeons and gears.

 

Tho I find myself becoming more and more of an Aion fanoboi with each passing day I have to agree with this criticism.

Face it people, death penalties are sooo 90's. Imo Aion should get rid of them, especially the PvP AP loss for the higher ranked PvP characters. In PvP each "kill" corresponds to one "death". If you make dying too unpalatable you're demotivating players from PvP... and no matter how uber you are you will die in PvP. A lot. And besides death penalties are pushing people to play "safe" which in PvP terms means ganking and zerging.

I like it. 1) There is a cost to death and franky the worse the better... granted i might get frustrated but I should get frustrated if I did. 2) There is no way to get around it which is a good thing. In WoW you can just get rid of all your gear when you run somewhere and if you die nothing happens. So this will alwasy make sense to me.

This actually reminds quite a bit the death penalty there was in WoW back in beta if it indeed does not punish those who have reached the highest attainable level. This be the case, the entire system is meaningless because most of the playing (time-wise) will happen at max level. It was likely also the reason why WoW got rid of it during beta and replaced it later on with a durability damage to gear as that actually does punish highest level players way more than others, as it should be. A system that punishes new players but leaves experienced players untouched doesn't encourage playing better by. Instead of creating a money sink it is a mere annoyance. (All this under assumption that you cannot lose a level).