I do not have any proof of this.  It was told to me by a former EA producer. I know many people have wondered why Warhammer turned out the way it did: unfinished, boring, and generally not meeting the standards of an mmorpg released in 2008-2009. Was it Mythic's fault?  Was it EA?  Was it Mark Jacobs? 

When Mythic was making Warhammer, they ran out of money.  They were looking for somebody that would continue to finance their project.  They also were looking to expand their team of developers, producers, programmers, ect. in order to help undertake the massive project of creating WAR.

EA, wanting to find the success that Blizzard had reached with WoW, was also interested in acquiring mmorpg studios.  They acquired Mythic, years ago.  Mark Jacobs was given much leeway.  He begin to move personnel from games like Ultima Online and the Sims into Warhammer development.  Supposedly, this caused many EA employees to not think very highly of him, my friend included.  I guess MJ also has a deep hatred for Blizzard and tells coworkers and employees that Blizzard stole some of his ideas when Blizzard were looking to get into the MMORPG market.

So, Mythic now had a lot more funding and a lot bigger staff to work on WAR.  But, even though EA enabled Mythic to continue the WAR project, they became impatient, in typical EA fashion.  "EA doesn't care about making good games.  EA cares about making their stock holders happy" was the direct quote I heard.  "Thats why they will never be able to make a game like WoW, they dont have the patience.  Take Starcraft 2 for example.  That game probably could have been released a year ago.  But Blizzard hasn't released it yet.  Its because they want to make it the best they can".

So Warhammer took three years to make and it now is looking like three years of waste.  The game should probably still be in development.  It should still be under wraps, causing us former fanboys to still be drooling over any tidbit of news.  I hope st:tor doesn't end up like this.

Originally posted by TheHavok

I do not have any proof of this.  It was told to me by a former EA producer. I know many people have wondered why Warhammer turned out the way it did: unfinished, boring, and generally not meeting the standards of an mmorpg released in 2008-2009. Was it Mythic's fault?  Was it EA?  Was it Mark Jacobs? 

 

When Mythic was making Warhammer, they ran out of money.  They were looking for somebody that would continue to finance their project.  They also were looking to expand their team of developers, producers, programmers, ect. in order to help undertake the massive project of creating WAR.

 

EA, wanting to find the success that Blizzard had reached with WoW, was also interested in acquiring mmorpg studios.  They acquired Mythic, years ago.  Mark Jacobs was given much leeway.  He begin to move personnel from games like Ultima Online and the Sims into Warhammer development.  Supposedly, this caused many EA employees to not think very highly of him, my friend included.  I guess MJ also has a deep hatred for Blizzard and tells coworkers and employees that Blizzard stole some of his ideas when Blizzard were looking to get into the MMORPG market.

 

So, Mythic now had a lot more funding and a lot bigger staff to work on WAR.  But, even though EA enabled Mythic to continue the WAR project, they became impatient, in typical EA fashion.  "EA doesn't care about making good games.  EA cares about making their stock holders happy" was the direct quote I heard.  "Thats why they will never be able to make a game like WoW, they dont have the patience.  Take Starcraft 2 for example.  That game probably could have been released a year ago.  But Blizzard hasn't released it yet.  Its because they want to make it the best they can".

 

So Warhammer took three years to make and it now is looking like three years of waste.  The game should probably still be in development.  It should still be under wraps, causing us former fanboys to still be drooling over any tidbit of news.  I hope st:tor doesn't end up like this.

 

Couldn't agree more. :)

The game was well over a year past the original intended release date, on EA's money and they became "impatient" a la typical EA? 

No Waaaaaaayyyy!! 

Honestly, think about it. At some point it's the developers job to actually get the game out the door. Clearly they were in far over their heads, clearly, even after a year delay they were still nowhere near finished. Clearly EA didn't feel like wasting more time and money on developers that can't make their goals to begin with.

Hmm, I feel one of the big downers to WAR doesn't have much to do with time constraints; world design, that is.

Each area has a very superficial layout with dedicated zones for RVR and PVE. Most of the time the PVE area is snaking it's way around the RVR area making me feel like I am following a pretty lineair path of progress throughout each zone while leveling. Though I found some area's very beautiful, I disliked the way in which the world is made into a great puzzle where physical boundaries are more often used as restraints, rather than challenges.

I agree that rhe RVR area's could have been more diverse and interesting between zones if they would have had more time for development but all in all I think Mythic's big mistake was putting too much of their RVR stamp on the world; they used a very specific mold on every zone and ended up having to add restrictions to player behavior (lethality of warcamp guards, for instance).

Generally the world feels too superficial to me. And their choices of going for this 'molded' world design didn't have anything to do with time constraints I feel, but more with focussing too much on one theme; RVR. Which happens to end up feeling grindy and repetitive.

It is true that they could have added more appeal to the game by putting more time in alternative gameplay aspects like crafting, dueling, etc.

Originally posted by Pheace

The game was well over a year past the original intended release date, on EA's money and they became "impatient" a la typical EA? 

 

No Waaaaaaayyyy!! 

 

Honestly, think about it. At some point it's the developers job to actually get the game out the door. Clearly they were in far over their heads, clearly, even after a year delay they were still nowhere near finished. Clearly EA didn't feel like wasting more time and money on developers that can't make their goals to begin with.

 

 

Saying the game was delayed a year is a tad misleading.  The game was only in development for 2 years at that point, which is an impossible task itself. 

The only way I can think someone would even try to set that type of date is if they were trying to rework the imperator game and make it into warhammer.  Maybe the project was intended to go longer and EA pressured for an earlier release, I don't know.  It doesn't sound like a winning environment from the start though.

Didnt MJ lay out the plans, time line of War to EA when he was selling Myhic? Sy i need about 2 more years and roughly about how many millions before this game will be ready? A rough release date? Than EA would look at it : ok, fair enough and consider it a wise investment before throwing money into it?

We are talking about millions over here, so i believe EA would truly discuss over it and make sure they are really comfortable with it before they proceed...

Or isit MJ in all his eargerness to sell, left out something?

But like a few posters above me, the core game design is what i hate. The world, the class etc.... i think even give them enough time to finish i would still quit after a month...

the big mistake of the devs were leting people to play Scenarios from level 1 !! They should have make scenarios available later at higher levels. There was nothing to do in this game at launch other than playing solo because everybody was leveling in Scenarios aka PvP Battlegrounds.  I am not saying that open RvR was not existant, but this game was a let down from day 1. First impressions matters. Also, in my opinion, I didn't like how the whole map was set up, crafting was a joke, and the list goes on.

I think the op is a little on and a little off on some analogies.

For one thing Blizzard copied the entire WOW game from EQ,there was nothing to do with patience or anytrhing for that matter,they followed SOE so closely,they even rushed WOW out the doors when SOE released EQ2 a little sooner than stated.

As far as EA pleasing their stock holders,or whoever is in charge of the finaces,i would say that is a no brainer from EVERY developer.I would bet 99% of the games we see today have all been rushed out the door or content removed or unfinished because the stock holders want a release to start making money on their investments.

I was turned off from WAR as soon as i heard them talk about streamlining crafting,that told me right away they were getting rushed and did not want to spend any time on it.

As for Starcraft 2 ,blizzard is not taking their time ,it has nothing to do with polish or trying to make a better game.This is a fact because Blizzard actually CANCELLED SC2 twice already,because they are still afraid to be a leader and realize there old game engine rehashing is becoming tiresome amongst players.If Blizzard was so confident that all it took was spending the time and effort,they would have never cancelled it in the first place,they are a second rate developer IMO,they REALLY need to copy ideas or steal staff from REAL developers to actually succeed.

The other reason it took SC2 so long to formalize,is becuase they had no money to take risks.They finally got a ton of cash from WOW subs,it makes the risk feasable,however any half witted marketing firm knows that right now there is a VERY small market to draw players from.Spending more time on your project ,especially one as weak as the starcraft 2 game engine,you are not going to reap large rewards for your investment.A game like SC2 would actually serve the developer better to just whip it out,it is not a hi tech game that needs polish nor does it involve any game breaking ideas,it is just a so so game,very average old tech game.

Yes it was rushed, in usual EA fashion. People blame Mythic, but the true problem is EA. The game is not boring or a failure, what other game can you RvR in or do massive PQs caked with awesome-sauce from level 1? The game has the average quests like other MMOs but with Kill collectors, and XP from the Tome unlocks and everything else, it is not boring, nor a grind. The game is only as fun as you make it. Mix up your game play and play with a friend you will have a blast!

The main servers on WAR, are actually growing, not dying. So before you try and turn this into a "game is a failure" topic, let me clearly state it is not.

Originally posted by spyder2k5

Yes it was rushed, in usual EA fashion. People blame Mythic, but the true problem is EA. The game is not boring or a failure, what other game can you RvR in or do massive PQs caked with awesome-sauce from level 1? The game has the average quests like other MMOs but with Kill collectors, and XP from the Tome unlocks and everything else, it is not boring, nor a grind. The game is only as fun as you make it. Mix up your game play and play with a friend you will have a blast!

The main servers on WAR, are actually growing, not dying. So before you try and turn this into a "game is a failure" topic, let me clearly state it is not.

Source of this information, or is this just your observations?

True problem was Mythic.  They told EA they could get the job done with a given budget and timeframe, and they weren't able to.

No investor should be expected to fund the development of any software (not just games) indefinitely.

Sure, there can be some delays, but after the 1st year...its time to question the ability of the Devs to deliver what they promise.

Its great that you enjoy WAR, me, I think its absolutely wretched in its core design (big fan of DAOC here of course) and will never warm up to it. 

Nah, bullcrap. Too many design flaws the game has to believe in sad fairy-tale about good developers and bad stupid publisher... Mythic just don't understand what should be taken to make a big successful game. Period.

Originally posted by Kyleran

Originally posted by spyder2k5

Yes it was rushed, in usual EA fashion. People blame Mythic, but the true problem is EA. The game is not boring or a failure, what other game can you RvR in or do massive PQs caked with awesome-sauce from level 1? The game has the average quests like other MMOs but with Kill collectors, and XP from the Tome unlocks and everything else, it is not boring, nor a grind. The game is only as fun as you make it. Mix up your game play and play with a friend you will have a blast!

The main servers on WAR, are actually growing, not dying. So before you try and turn this into a "game is a failure" topic, let me clearly state it is not.

 

Source of this information, or is this just your observations?

True problem was Mythic.  They told EA they could get the job done with a given budget and timeframe, and they weren't able to.

No investor should be expected to fund the development of any software (not just games) indefinitely.

Sure, there can be some delays, but after the 1st year...its time to question the ability of the Devs to deliver what they promise.

Its great that you enjoy WAR, me, I think its absolutely wretched in its core design (big fan of DAOC here of course) and will never warm up to it. 

 

 

 

I watch population on both sides, it is in fact growing.

You keep saying the game is not boring and has the same features as others, but the one consistant message I have gotten from people who have left is that the game just wasn't fun.  It isn't the "same quests as other games" or PQs layered in awesome sauce as you put it.

Most of the game is shallow and lack luster.  Even the main selling point of the game is plagued with problems and only randomly is fun. 

I could not argue with anyone who said that game is boring, because I think they are right.  Fun can be had, but it isn't like other games where fun is everywhere. 

Originally posted by Daffid011

You keep saying the game is not boring and has the same features as others, but the one consistant message I have gotten from people who have left is that the game just wasn't fun.  It isn't the "same quests as other games" or PQs layered in awesome sauce as you put it.

Most of the game is shallow and lack luster.  Even the main selling point of the game is plagued with problems and only randomly is fun. 

 

I could not argue with anyone who said that game is boring, because I think they are right.  Fun can be had, but it isn't like other games where fun is everywhere. 

There are those that do not like it but they are few. The game is as fun as you make it and mix things up.

Originally posted by spyder2k5

Originally posted by Daffid011

You keep saying the game is not boring and has the same features as others, but the one consistant message I have gotten from people who have left is that the game just wasn't fun.  It isn't the "same quests as other games" or PQs layered in awesome sauce as you put it.

Most of the game is shallow and lack luster.  Even the main selling point of the game is plagued with problems and only randomly is fun. 

 

I could not argue with anyone who said that game is boring, because I think they are right.  Fun can be had, but it isn't like other games where fun is everywhere. 

 

There are those that do not like it but they are few. The game is as fun as you make it and mix things up.

What? You mean few "among those that are left" I assume? Well over half the people that tried it decided not to play anymore. Clearly there's "many" who do not like it.

That doesn't mean the game is not fun fo rthose who stay but to say there are "few" who do not like it is simply not true.

Originally posted by Pheace

Originally posted by spyder2k5

Originally posted by Daffid011

You keep saying the game is not boring and has the same features as others, but the one consistant message I have gotten from people who have left is that the game just wasn't fun.  It isn't the "same quests as other games" or PQs layered in awesome sauce as you put it.

Most of the game is shallow and lack luster.  Even the main selling point of the game is plagued with problems and only randomly is fun. 

 

I could not argue with anyone who said that game is boring, because I think they are right.  Fun can be had, but it isn't like other games where fun is everywhere. 

 

There are those that do not like it but they are few. The game is as fun as you make it and mix things up.

 

What? You mean few "among those that are left" I assume? Well over half the people that tried it decided not to play anymore. Clearly there's "many" who do not like it.

 

That doesn't mean the game is not fun fo rthose who stay but to say there are "few" who do not like it is simply not true.

For each person that leaves, 10 more try it and at least half stay. Move on troll.

Originally posted by Kyleran

Originally posted by spyder2k5

Yes it was rushed, in usual EA fashion. People blame Mythic, but the true problem is EA. The game is not boring or a failure, what other game can you RvR in or do massive PQs caked with awesome-sauce from level 1? The game has the average quests like other MMOs but with Kill collectors, and XP from the Tome unlocks and everything else, it is not boring, nor a grind. The game is only as fun as you make it. Mix up your game play and play with a friend you will have a blast!

The main servers on WAR, are actually growing, not dying. So before you try and turn this into a "game is a failure" topic, let me clearly state it is not.

 

Source of this information, or is this just your observations?

True problem was Mythic.  They told EA they could get the job done with a given budget and timeframe, and they weren't able to.

No investor should be expected to fund the development of any software (not just games) indefinitely.

Sure, there can be some delays, but after the 1st year...its time to question the ability of the Devs to deliver what they promise.

Its great that you enjoy WAR, me, I think its absolutely wretched in its core design (big fan of DAOC here of course) and will never warm up to it. 

 

 

 

You ask that in a thread about a guy who claims to have heard some stuff from some guy that used to work at EA?

Originally posted by spyder2k5

Originally posted by Pheace

Originally posted by spyder2k5

Originally posted by Daffid011

You keep saying the game is not boring and has the same features as others, but the one consistant message I have gotten from people who have left is that the game just wasn't fun.  It isn't the "same quests as other games" or PQs layered in awesome sauce as you put it.

Most of the game is shallow and lack luster.  Even the main selling point of the game is plagued with problems and only randomly is fun. 

 

I could not argue with anyone who said that game is boring, because I think they are right.  Fun can be had, but it isn't like other games where fun is everywhere. 

 

There are those that do not like it but they are few. The game is as fun as you make it and mix things up.

 

What? You mean few "among those that are left" I assume? Well over half the people that tried it decided not to play anymore. Clearly there's "many" who do not like it.

 

That doesn't mean the game is not fun fo rthose who stay but to say there are "few" who do not like it is simply not true.

 

For each person that leaves, 10 more try it and at least half stay. Move on troll.

Rofl, you're straight up lying and *i* am the troll... hahaha

Mythic should hire you.

"I know the population has gone down to 300k but honestly, since those 800k for every person that has left 10 more have tried it and half have stayed. Seriously!... What do you mean what was my grade in calculus?"

Originally posted by TheHavok

I do not have any proof of this.  It was told to me by a former EA producer.

 

hehe.

Great story and theroy though.

Originally posted by spyder2k5

Originally posted by Pheace

Originally posted by spyder2k5

Originally posted by Daffid011

You keep saying the game is not boring and has the same features as others, but the one consistant message I have gotten from people who have left is that the game just wasn't fun.  It isn't the "same quests as other games" or PQs layered in awesome sauce as you put it.

Most of the game is shallow and lack luster.  Even the main selling point of the game is plagued with problems and only randomly is fun. 

 

I could not argue with anyone who said that game is boring, because I think they are right.  Fun can be had, but it isn't like other games where fun is everywhere. 

 

There are those that do not like it but they are few. The game is as fun as you make it and mix things up.

 

What? You mean few "among those that are left" I assume? Well over half the people that tried it decided not to play anymore. Clearly there's "many" who do not like it.

 

That doesn't mean the game is not fun fo rthose who stay but to say there are "few" who do not like it is simply not true.

 

For each person that leaves, 10 more try it and at least half stay. Move on troll.

Dude, if you cant back it up with any official, of x-fire links, than you lost all credibility... you can spam as much numbers as you want, but players like us that have tried the trial knows you are wrong...

Do i want this game to be success? Definitely! but this game is now beyond hope, unless Bioware totally revamp it, it will only be a normal 100k sub games that  will be shut down by EA soon...

Originally posted by Kshahdoo

Nah, bullcrap. Too many design flaws the game has to believe in sad fairy-tale about good developers and bad stupid publisher... Mythic just don't understand what should be taken to make a big successful game. Period.

*agreed

---

Originally posted by TheHavok
and generally not meeting the standards of an mmorpg released in 2008-2009. Was it Mythic's fault? 
 

---

as a huge DAoC fan i couldn't really get into WAR. but also as a general mmorpg fan that has tried every other game released since WoW...what game DID meet the standards of an mmorpg ?
WAR isn't a bad game at all. I can't think of another game released in the past few years thats better. PotBS? Vanguard? AOC? Tabula Rasa? Spellborn? Darkfall? big no to all. Aion, Fallen Earth you think? played them both and bigger no to both.

it gets a bad rap for alot of things, some being valid, others just being that at this point in time, alot of mmorpg fans are jus disheartedned and bored at the entire genre. (which is why this whole aion fad has me so puzzled...the only draw it has is..its a new game to grind)

I never thought WAR was that horrible but apparently mmo companies need to start hiring accountants to learn how to budget themselves. Design flaws and bad character imbalances didn't help either.

Myself I like War. Liked Wow as well.

The end game on both get a bit time consuming so I have been playing different characters up to 40 and then PVPing

A game is what you make it. Trying to change it into something else doesnt work even for Devs most times (See SWG)

In the end with a few minor differences every MMO out there is the same. You level. You get gear. You maybe read the quests.

Perhaps with the advent of voice acting in quest givers and games like STO where you will collect and level up minions (bridge officers) instead of gear will add some new flavor.... we will see.

Originally posted by spyder2k5

Originally posted by Pheace

Originally posted by spyder2k5

Originally posted by Daffid011

You keep saying the game is not boring and has the same features as others, but the one consistant message I have gotten from people who have left is that the game just wasn't fun.  It isn't the "same quests as other games" or PQs layered in awesome sauce as you put it.

Most of the game is shallow and lack luster.  Even the main selling point of the game is plagued with problems and only randomly is fun. 

 

I could not argue with anyone who said that game is boring, because I think they are right.  Fun can be had, but it isn't like other games where fun is everywhere. 

 

There are those that do not like it but they are few. The game is as fun as you make it and mix things up.

 

What? You mean few "among those that are left" I assume? Well over half the people that tried it decided not to play anymore. Clearly there's "many" who do not like it.

 

That doesn't mean the game is not fun fo rthose who stay but to say there are "few" who do not like it is simply not true.

 

For each person that leaves, 10 more try it and at least half stay. Move on troll.

Well, thats a flat-out lie.

How many servers have closed since release?...not even a year yet and were on our 2nd forced move due to them closing our server twice with a 3rd move on the horizon thanks to the mass exodus caused by lotd.

How many new servers have opened to accommodate this massive and mythical influx of new players?....well, none.

Christ, if your going to lie at least try and make it sound plausible.