When US guild Exodus received the achievement Alone in the Darkness for their killing of Yogg-Saron without keepers, they apparently used an exploit. While there had already been accusations of this, I take anything within the WOW community lightly until I see otherwise. There will always be some jealous punk somewhere crying foul when you do something that they can't. There's a new thread in our realm forums every day about the account I hacked last week, or the person who was removed from our guild without reason (of course in their eyes), or our progress. This time, in the case of Exodus, it just so happens that it was true.

What is an exploit can be debated until the cows come home. This goes back to standing behind the fence on Mandy, and I am sure farther. But that's the first time I can remember an entire guild being suspended or banned. My thought on this is that they were clever and used a game mechanic against the boss. Certainly it wasn't the way it was intended, but this being the case, it was in Blizzard's job to fix the programming error. While I don't believe in cheating within the game, there is a gray area between when it's a programming error or all out cheating. This IS a game mechanic, whether intended or not, and I find it ridiculous that Blizzard would punish a guild for THEIR mistake. Kobyashi Maru anyone? That being said, I don't think the kill should count, especially by any record keeping standard.

While I have never condoned exploits, I will say that Blizzard has been changing directions lately. They are now focusing on a new MMO, and less and less resources are being given to World of Warcraft. Most average players might argue this, but it is completely evident in the lack of armor, design, and content in general. A good example is the new armor which is faction based, however, it all looks the same. Why? Because what's the first thing you need on a new MMO... designers.

I have to say that I do believe that Blizzard stacks the cards in their favor, and probably do make bosses impossible until they decide otherwise. This has been suspected for years, but it's really starting to show lately. With all of the MMORPGs coming out, and with resources at Blizzard being diverted to the new MMO, it wouldn't surprise me if Exodus and Ensidia's accusations are true. Blizzard has already admitted that they released Black Temple too early, and what would keep them from not allowing people to complete content until they felt like they could put out another raid instance with rehashed mobs dawning new color schemes.

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There is no debate at all on this one, they found a bug and exploited it to kill the boss, plain and simple. They knew all too well what they were doing, they knew it was against the rules and they have to face the consequences for those actions!

Maybe if they had notified Blizzard straight away that there was an issue they may have avoided a suspension, but instead they bragged that they had defeated the boss and also brag about how they did it!

 Your post isn't coherent and doesn't make a lot of sense. Exploits have always been in the game and aren't related to the colours of armor. Exodus clearly knew they where cheating because they didn't fraps the event, or so they claimed, because obviously they didn't want the world to see they cheated. What they should have done, is basically what Ensidia did in similar circomestances, which is to report the exploit to Blizzard, and not take claim for the kill. By not reporting the exploit and even taking claim for it as a legal kill, they made a joke out of themselves and where rightfully banned.

Exploits will always be present in online games and of course they should be fixed but in the meantime perpetrators who take advantage of them like Exodus did, should be banned. There will never be an exploit free MMO, but that being said WoW has very, very few exploits compared to some of its competitors. 

The fact that armor looks a lot alike in WoTLK is another issue, it has nothing to do with a lack of designers, its actually something that is demanded by the gaming community. The problem with The Burning Crusade that a lot of people had was that until you got a full set of tiered gear, you basically looked like a clown, as armors mismatched. So players had more choice in armor but since a player rarely has a full set, one would walk around with a green chestpiece, yellow gloves and red shoulders. Blizzard fixed this in WOTLK by making all armor of certain classes similar, so while people actually all do wear a variety of different armors, they look alike because the color and styles are similar. 

The advantage of this is, that even during levelling your character looks consistant and stylish, the whole clownslook is gone and as you reach 80 and collect gear at no point does your armorset look ugly as even the tiered gear is styled similar to the green and blue quest gear you picked up during levelling. 

The disadvantage of this is, that obviously because of this system, players look a lot alike.

Personally I like the gear in WOTLK better then the gear before that, I really hated to look like a clown and my characters look a lot cooler now. That being said, I think they should allow players to colour their armor pieces, that way you'd still have some variety in gear.

Tbh it's Blizzards fault so how can you suspend someone for finding a bug and taking advantage of it? Pisses me off when developers cry over this though it's their own lack of testing.

And i was like WHATEVA...

Originally posted by John.A.Zoid

Tbh it's Blizzards fault so how can you suspend someone for finding a bug and taking advantage of it? Pisses me off when developers cry over this though it's their own lack of testing.

To give a comparison, let's say you walk past an ATM machine and it appears to be broke and money is flying out of it. Now you can do 2 things, either report the issue at the bank, or take the money and be silent about it. Now if the police catch you, it won't be enough to say "hey they should have the machine fixed". You took money that wasn't yours so your guilty. 

Now back to this US guild, they knew they where exploiting, exploiting game mechanics is illegal by the Terms of Service you have to sign onto when you log into the game. So if you don't agree with the idea that abusing exploits can get you banned, you shouldn't have hit the "I Agree" button on the ToS and thus never have even started playing the game. Too bad you won't find any MMO out there that doesn't have "exploiting game mechanics" as a bannable offense in their ToS though. 

Regardless, what makes this exploiting worste is that unlike other guilds who have immediatly been forthcoming about the bugs and exploits they used, these Americans kept their mouth shut and claimed the actual world first as being legit. Had they been forthcoming and honest about this, they would not have been banned, but they decided to lie to everyone just to have their 15 minutes of fame and now they are being properly banned and shamed for it. 

Originally posted by Shana77

Originally posted by John.A.Zoid

Tbh it's Blizzards fault so how can you suspend someone for finding a bug and taking advantage of it? Pisses me off when developers cry over this though it's their own lack of testing.

 

To give a comparison, let's say you walk past an ATM machine and it appears to be broke and money is flying out of it. Now you can do 2 things, either report the issue at the bank, or take the money and be silent about it. Now if the police catch you, it won't be enough to say "hey they should have the machine fixed". You took money that wasn't yours so your guilty. 

Now back to this US guild, they knew they where exploiting, exploiting game mechanics is illegal by the Terms of Service you have to sign onto when you log into the game. So if you don't agree with the idea that abusing exploits can get you banned, you shouldn't have hit the "I Agree" button on the ToS and thus never have even started playing the game. Too bad you won't find any MMO out there that doesn't have "exploiting game mechanics" as a bannable offense in their ToS though. 

Regardless, what makes this exploiting worste is that unlike other guilds who have immediatly been forthcoming about the bugs and exploits they used, these Americans kept their mouth shut and claimed the actual world first as being legit. Had they been forthcoming and honest about this, they would not have been banned, but they decided to lie to everyone just to have their 15 minutes of fame and now they are being properly banned and shamed for it. 

PERFECT.. I couldn't have done any better.. except that American part.. lol I'm from the US and I would hate to be lumped into the "American" part..  I'm honorable and play for fun..  It's a shame that people in general reguardless of nationality, need to cheat to win.. :(    Why even play then?

 Wasn't specifically a dig at Americans, obviously there are cheaters on every continent. 

 72 hours aint too bad of a punishment is it?

Maybe if they report the bug next time, they might get free game time.

(oh boy here goes)

"To give a comparison, let's say you walk past an ATM machine and it appears to be broke and money is flying out of it. Now you can do 2 things, either report the issue at the bank, or take the money and be silent about it. Now if the police catch you, it won't be enough to say "hey they should have the machine fixed". You took money that wasn't yours so your guilty. "

Fairly recently here in UK a cash machine had a problem in that it was giving twice the money you asked for. The publics response was to phone their friends and with 2 hours the machine was empty.  The police did sweet FA.

In life and wow  many times things don't work as they should sometimes thats good for you and sometimes it isn't. If you have ever contacted a GM about something that is broke in game and has negatively effected you then they probably won't have fixed it to your satisfaction or re-imbursed you. So to mass suspend like this seems a bit heavy.

The basic truth is they did this because they can and they wanted to make an example of the guild so others think careful about clever tactics to speed through content. Its a delaying measure nothing more.

---

Originally posted by xerax
Fairly recently here in UK a cash machine had a problem in that it was giving twice the money you asked for. The publics response was to phone their friends and with 2 hours the machine was empty.  The police did sweet FA.

The basic truth is they did this because they can and they wanted to make an example of the guild so others think careful about clever tactics to speed through content. Its a delaying measure nothing more.

---

On your first point, we don't know how each bank dealt with those customers as yet (there would have been more than one bank involved in this), but you can be damned sure that the bank won't be out of pocket. A few went on about how they were sticking it to the banks, but all they were actually doing was taking out money they didn't have to spare that the banks would most likely charge back to their accounts anyway at some point in the future. Worst case scenario is that they will charge back any losses to the contractor that made the mistake in the first place, probably putting them or at least some of their workers out of business/jobs.

On your second, they agreed not to exploit any bugs found in the game before they started playing, they are an experienced raiding guild too, so which ever way you want to colour it they knew they were in the wrong and were punished accordingly.

if this was a guild event...how did someone on the outside find out about it ...to report it.  Maybe if the guild had not bragged about it...then maybe you would still be playing.  Learn to keep your mouth shut ...lessons learned....better yet...dont cheat.

I don't think they posted the video until after. The fact is that Blizzard made the fight impossible because they don't have the resources to create the raids that existed in BC, therefore they are making some things damn near impossible. The red flag was that it was beat, because Blizzard knew it couldn't be. I also am willing to bet that they check into every single world first.

---

Originally posted by chaosngn
I don't think they posted the video until after. The fact is that Blizzard made the fight impossible because they don't have the resources to create the raids that existed in BC, therefore they are making some things damn near impossible. The red flag was that it was beat, because Blizzard knew it couldn't be. I also am willing to bet that they check into every single world first.

---

This talk of impossible bosses is being banded around far too much now and it makes me laugh so much. For ages now hardcore guilds have been pissing and moaning about how easy the content was getting and they would like something challenging, well WTF, maybe you should have been a little more careful about what you wished for!!!!

You can't have it both ways, kick and scream like kids that it is all too casual and getting too easy and then cry foul when you are given a real challenge to overcome???

Where the hell does this no resources thing come from?? This huge lack of resources isn't stopping them creating another 5/10/25 encounter in the next patch is it?

Originally posted by Rydeson

Originally posted by Shana77

Originally posted by John.A.Zoid

Tbh it's Blizzards fault so how can you suspend someone for finding a bug and taking advantage of it? Pisses me off when developers cry over this though it's their own lack of testing.

 

To give a comparison, let's say you walk past an ATM machine and it appears to be broke and money is flying out of it. Now you can do 2 things, either report the issue at the bank, or take the money and be silent about it. Now if the police catch you, it won't be enough to say "hey they should have the machine fixed". You took money that wasn't yours so your guilty. 

Now back to this US guild, they knew they where exploiting, exploiting game mechanics is illegal by the Terms of Service you have to sign onto when you log into the game. So if you don't agree with the idea that abusing exploits can get you banned, you shouldn't have hit the "I Agree" button on the ToS and thus never have even started playing the game. Too bad you won't find any MMO out there that doesn't have "exploiting game mechanics" as a bannable offense in their ToS though. 

Regardless, what makes this exploiting worste is that unlike other guilds who have immediatly been forthcoming about the bugs and exploits they used, these Americans kept their mouth shut and claimed the actual world first as being legit. Had they been forthcoming and honest about this, they would not have been banned, but they decided to lie to everyone just to have their 15 minutes of fame and now they are being properly banned and shamed for it. 

 

PERFECT.. I couldn't have done any better.. except that American part.. lol I'm from the US and I would hate to be lumped into the "American" part..  I'm honorable and play for fun..  It's a shame that people in general reguardless of nationality, need to cheat to win.. :(    Why even play then?

Firstly thats not the same and even if it was you'd take th emoney and it would be your right cause it's the stupid banks fault. Secondly it ain't cheating, it's in the game so it's legal.

Originally posted by John.A.Zoid

Originally posted by Rydeson

Originally posted by Shana77

Originally posted by John.A.Zoid

Tbh it's Blizzards fault so how can you suspend someone for finding a bug and taking advantage of it? Pisses me off when developers cry over this though it's their own lack of testing.

 

To give a comparison, let's say you walk past an ATM machine and it appears to be broke and money is flying out of it. Now you can do 2 things, either report the issue at the bank, or take the money and be silent about it. Now if the police catch you, it won't be enough to say "hey they should have the machine fixed". You took money that wasn't yours so your guilty. 

Now back to this US guild, they knew they where exploiting, exploiting game mechanics is illegal by the Terms of Service you have to sign onto when you log into the game. So if you don't agree with the idea that abusing exploits can get you banned, you shouldn't have hit the "I Agree" button on the ToS and thus never have even started playing the game. Too bad you won't find any MMO out there that doesn't have "exploiting game mechanics" as a bannable offense in their ToS though. 

Regardless, what makes this exploiting worste is that unlike other guilds who have immediatly been forthcoming about the bugs and exploits they used, these Americans kept their mouth shut and claimed the actual world first as being legit. Had they been forthcoming and honest about this, they would not have been banned, but they decided to lie to everyone just to have their 15 minutes of fame and now they are being properly banned and shamed for it. 

 

PERFECT.. I couldn't have done any better.. except that American part.. lol I'm from the US and I would hate to be lumped into the "American" part..  I'm honorable and play for fun..  It's a shame that people in general reguardless of nationality, need to cheat to win.. :(    Why even play then?

 

Firstly thats not the same and even if it was you'd take th emoney and it would be your right cause it's the stupid banks fault. Secondly it ain't cheating, it's in the game so it's legal.

No it wouldn't

Originally posted by John.A.Zoid

Originally posted by Rydeson

Originally posted by Shana77

Originally posted by John.A.Zoid

Tbh it's Blizzards fault so how can you suspend someone for finding a bug and taking advantage of it? Pisses me off when developers cry over this though it's their own lack of testing.

 

To give a comparison, let's say you walk past an ATM machine and it appears to be broke and money is flying out of it. Now you can do 2 things, either report the issue at the bank, or take the money and be silent about it. Now if the police catch you, it won't be enough to say "hey they should have the machine fixed". You took money that wasn't yours so your guilty. 

Now back to this US guild, they knew they where exploiting, exploiting game mechanics is illegal by the Terms of Service you have to sign onto when you log into the game. So if you don't agree with the idea that abusing exploits can get you banned, you shouldn't have hit the "I Agree" button on the ToS and thus never have even started playing the game. Too bad you won't find any MMO out there that doesn't have "exploiting game mechanics" as a bannable offense in their ToS though. 

Regardless, what makes this exploiting worste is that unlike other guilds who have immediatly been forthcoming about the bugs and exploits they used, these Americans kept their mouth shut and claimed the actual world first as being legit. Had they been forthcoming and honest about this, they would not have been banned, but they decided to lie to everyone just to have their 15 minutes of fame and now they are being properly banned and shamed for it. 

 

PERFECT.. I couldn't have done any better.. except that American part.. lol I'm from the US and I would hate to be lumped into the "American" part..  I'm honorable and play for fun..  It's a shame that people in general reguardless of nationality, need to cheat to win.. :(    Why even play then?

 

Firstly thats not the same and even if it was you'd take th emoney and it would be your right cause it's the stupid banks fault. Secondly it ain't cheating, it's in the game so it's legal.

Ok, first of all, even if you want to claim it's the banks fault, it's still not yours, and it's still illegal as it is theft.  Even if the bank accidentally puts money in your account, if you don't give it back, it is theft.

As far as cheating in WoW is concerned, the EULA clearly warns about exploits.  They did it.  They knew it was wrong.  Now they have to pay the consequences.

They exploited a bug.  The bug caused adds during the fight to aggro a healer who wasn't actually attackable by said adds.  This caused the adds to evade and allowed the dps to focus on the boss which made the phase easy rather than difficult. 

Here is where I have a problem with the guild.  They wiped on one attempt, but also found the bug.  They realized how that bug could be exploited and downed the boss on the next attempt.  The guild then took pictures and promoted themselves as having completed a world first.

This was their mistake.  They put the spotlight on themselves.  They deserved to be banned.  If you know you are exploiting and then flaunt it, expect a ban.

As for the ATM analogy, it is perfect.  Just because something is exploitable, doesn't mean exploiting it places blame on the thing being exploited.  That just means you are a dishonest person and need to rationalize your behavior so you don't feel guilty.

Originally posted by chaosngn

 But that's the first time I can remember an entire guild being suspended or banned.

This has happened once before I believe. Way back in pre-bc there was a guild on my old server who pulled the Ironforge leader into old ironforge. If I recall correctly they were all banned for a few days, but don't quote me on that.

Originally posted by retrospectic

They exploited a bug.  The bug caused adds during the fight to aggro a healer who wasn't actually attackable by said adds.  This caused the adds to evade and allowed the dps to focus on the boss which made the phase easy rather than difficult. 

 

Here is where I have a problem with the guild.  They wiped on one attempt, but also found the bug.  They realized how that bug could be exploited and downed the boss on the next attempt.  The guild then took pictures and promoted themselves as having completed a world first.

This was their mistake.  They put the spotlight on themselves.  They deserved to be banned.  If you know you are exploiting and then flaunt it, expect a ban.

As for the ATM analogy, it is perfect.  Just because something is exploitable, doesn't mean exploiting it places blame on the thing being exploited.  That just means you are a dishonest person and need to rationalize your behavior so you don't feel guilty.

This is perfect.

All the people who say "its blizzards fault, it wasnt my fault cause it was there..." are saying it cause it was to their advantage. If a level 5 rogue came up behind your geared level 80 and one shotted him and stole all your armor cause the rogue found some bug that allowed him to, it would no longer be fair, it would no longer be fine cause it was blizzards fault for allowing it, it would be "HE CHEATED, BAN HIM NOW!"

Perception is key.

Originally posted by chaosngn

 

When US guild Exodus received the achievement Alone in the Darkness for their killing of Yogg-Saron without keepers, they apparently used an exploit. While there had already been accusations of this, I take anything within the WOW community lightly until I see otherwise. There will always be some jealous punk somewhere crying foul when you do something that they can't. There's a new thread in our realm forums every day about the account I hacked last week, or the person who was removed from our guild without reason (of course in their eyes), or our progress. This time, in the case of Exodus, it just so happens that it was true.

This paragraph is really confusing.  You go from saying that Exodus might be innocent, and that it could have just been someone whining about their progress, to saying that it is truth.  Also, you hack game accounts?  That's pretty shady business.  At least, that's what the sentence seems to state.  I understand it might be the worse perspective, but it is confusing regardless.

What is an exploit can be debated until the cows come home.

I don't agree with this.  The idea of a game exploit is abusing a game mechanic to achieve something unintentional that either negatively effects others or unfairly benefits you.  Now, sure, some people might debate how legit an exploit is, but usually it is more of a rationalization to avoid guilt than a real debate.  In short, you know when you or someone else is exploiting.

This goes back to standing behind the fence on Mandy, and I am sure farther. But that's the first time I can remember an entire guild being suspended or banned. My thought on this is that they were clever and used a game mechanic against the boss. Certainly it wasn't the way it was intended, but this being the case, it was in Blizzard's job to fix the programming error.

Here is where I really begin to disagree with you.  First, there are only so many ways for the game to undergo testing.  You have the PTR testing, beta testing, and in-house testing.  Even though that's a large group of people, they will never find every bug.  So, some will remain during launch.  That means that someone will find a bug they can benefit from, and some will choose to exploit it.

Second, the idea of not banning people or guilds who do this is just purely ridiculous.  Sure, after a bug is found it is the company's obligation to fix it.  That being said, if Blizzard did not ban players who benefited from exploiting than people would be justified in trying to find more bugs.  Instead of reporting them and getting them fixed, people would abuse them.  I think, although Blizzard needs to actively fix bugs, they are in the right when it comes to banning guilds or players for exploiting bugs they discover.

While I don't believe in cheating within the game, there is a gray area between when it's a programming error or all out cheating. This IS a game mechanic, whether intended or not, and I find it ridiculous that Blizzard would punish a guild for THEIR mistake. Kobyashi Maru anyone? That being said, I don't think the kill should count, especially by any record keeping standard.

The guild is being punished the same way a player is punished for exploiting a bug.  Here's an example:  A pre-made battleground team discovers a spot in Warsong Gultch they can hide the flag.   This spot not only puts the player out of line-of-sight, but also requires other players to make a specific amount of jumps and wall climbing hops.  Now, this is part of game.  If you can climb the terrain because jumping is a mechanic and the messed up wall area is a bug the developers missed.

Now, get real.  Against this team everyone would head straight for the report button.  The team will win the match because they are exploiting.  Are you saying that Blizzard should allow the team to continue breaking the rules just because they happened to miss a bit of awkward terrain?  Seems kind of bad business to me.

While I have never condoned exploits, I will say that Blizzard has been changing directions lately. They are now focusing on a new MMO, and less and less resources are being given to World of Warcraft. Most average players might argue this, but it is completely evident in the lack of armor, design, and content in general. A good example is the new armor which is faction based, however, it all looks the same. Why? Because what's the first thing you need on a new MMO... designers.

This statement is completely off-base.  The idea that a billion dollar company would take resources away from their cash cow and not just hire new employees is ridiculous.  The average player would disagree with these statements because they are obviously just biased conjecture.  

Lack of armor design, are you kidding me?  I'm not sure what faction armor you are talking about, but the latest content patch put in a ton of new armor and weapon graphics.  Are you speaking about the argent tournament armor graphics?  The quartermasters you unlock all have the same rewards expect pets, tabards, and mounts.  This is to limit the amount of epic gear you can simply grind dailies for.  

Or are you talking about the gear you get from tabard factions?  This armor all appears the same due to complaints from the prior expansion, and for good reason.  I'd rather have all my gear match than look like someone who dresses in the dark.

To think Blizzard has any lack of developers or employees in general is just insane.  I'd love to see proof that they are spending less time on World of Warcraft in favor of their next gen mmo. 

I have to say that I do believe that Blizzard stacks the cards in their favor, and probably do make bosses impossible until they decide otherwise.

If you think the bosses in World of Warcraft are impossible you really haven't played many other MMORPGs.  The bosses in Ulduar are fairly simple and their hardmodes are refreshing when compared to the epicfest which is Naxxramas.  Give me a break.

This has been suspected for years, but it's really starting to show lately.

I'd like proof of this.  Just because a guild has to exploit to kill a boss in a hardmode doesn't mean that the boss is normally impossible.  The fact is that guilds have to gear up in order to tackle hardmode bosses.  Surprised?  Perhaps in a world where epics drop like gumdrops in la la land people are surprised when the purples they were given don't help them in hardmode.

With all of the MMORPGs coming out, and with resources at Blizzard being diverted to the new MMO, it wouldn't surprise me if Exodus and Ensidia's accusations are true.

What accusations are these?  I'd like more reference if you are going to promote your blog via this website. 

Blizzard has already admitted that they released Black Temple too early, and what would keep them from not allowing people to complete content until they felt like they could put out another raid instance with rehashed mobs dawning new color schemes.

This is a ridiculous conspiracy theory.  Blizzard's statement that The Burning Crusade made the leap between raids to severe was not Blizzard's way of admitting they release impossible content on purpose.  The whole idea of Naxxramas, Obsidian Sanctum, and heroics in Wrath is that they are stepping stones into raid progression.  The first raids released were easy and allowed more players than ever to experience raiding.  

To say that Ulduar is impossible is laughable, and to say that hardmodes or any boss in the current game is impossible is just silly.  Also, to make a jab at them for rehashed art design and color schemes just further proves you have a biased against Blizzard. Again, give me a break.

 

There was an issue on Asheron's Call a little while ago where a bunch of people who got banned for a week for using an exploit and told that future bans would be longer.

They too sat there and tried to say it was Turbine's fault for not preventing the exploit (the difference between AC and WoW is that AC has monthly content updates which does make bugs more likely, Blizzard has a lot more time to catch bugs at least). And how they shouldn't have been banned for exploiting and it wasn't their fault.

As with this thread people jumped on them and tried to get it through their thick skulls that using a bug to your advantage is YOUR fault, not the company that let the bug through. It is always unfortunate when a bug makes it into a game but it's bound to happen, there are too many variables to make sure there isn't a single bug left over.

It is sad that people try to dodge all responsibility for their actions, and always want to blame others for them doing the wrong thing. I think Blizzard's ban was far too short, I felt Turbine's ban was far too short and it was a week. People who exploit need to be shown that the consequences make it not worth even considering, a month ban for the first offense and worse from there, if there are multiple offenses then a full out ip/cc ban for all of that companies products should be enacted.

Originally posted by chaosngn

Blizzard has already admitted that they released Black Temple too early,

You are correct, they did admit to releasing Black Temple too early. But not because of why you say so. Way to take something WAY out of context to try and prove your own point.

The reason they commented about the Black Temple being released too early is that Illidan was supposed to be the final BOSS of The Burning Crusade. The entire expansion dealt with him and the content for it should have ended with him. However, since they released it too early (in the development cycle), they had to scramble and find another boss to be more epic than Illidan so they introduced Kiljedan (sp?) in Magister's terrace.

The reason they made this comment is to let the players know that Arthas will be the FINAL boss of WOTLK; this is why the raids are preparing us for that confrontation and why recent decisions (badges for example) will make sure people are on the same playing field..

So it has nothing to do with the difficulty of the raid or the details of color schemes or however you want to spin it, Blizzard just wants to be sure that the chief badass is the final boss for that expansion.

Originally posted by John.A.Zoid

Originally posted by Rydeson

Originally posted by Shana77

Originally posted by John.A.Zoid

Tbh it's Blizzards fault so how can you suspend someone for finding a bug and taking advantage of it? Pisses me off when developers cry over this though it's their own lack of testing.

 

To give a comparison, let's say you walk past an ATM machine and it appears to be broke and money is flying out of it. Now you can do 2 things, either report the issue at the bank, or take the money and be silent about it. Now if the police catch you, it won't be enough to say "hey they should have the machine fixed". You took money that wasn't yours so your guilty. 

Now back to this US guild, they knew they where exploiting, exploiting game mechanics is illegal by the Terms of Service you have to sign onto when you log into the game. So if you don't agree with the idea that abusing exploits can get you banned, you shouldn't have hit the "I Agree" button on the ToS and thus never have even started playing the game. Too bad you won't find any MMO out there that doesn't have "exploiting game mechanics" as a bannable offense in their ToS though. 

Regardless, what makes this exploiting worste is that unlike other guilds who have immediatly been forthcoming about the bugs and exploits they used, these Americans kept their mouth shut and claimed the actual world first as being legit. Had they been forthcoming and honest about this, they would not have been banned, but they decided to lie to everyone just to have their 15 minutes of fame and now they are being properly banned and shamed for it. 

 

PERFECT.. I couldn't have done any better.. except that American part.. lol I'm from the US and I would hate to be lumped into the "American" part..  I'm honorable and play for fun..  It's a shame that people in general reguardless of nationality, need to cheat to win.. :(    Why even play then?

 

Firstly thats not the same and even if it was you'd take th emoney and it would be your right cause it's the stupid banks fault. Secondly it ain't cheating, it's in the game so it's legal.

Ah no....just try and keep money that you receive from a bank that isn't yours, even if its their mistake.  They'll hunt you down, prosecute you and worst of all, blacklist you from the banking system, which will prevent you from ever having a bank account.  (I've known people who had this happen, results were not pretty)

Cheating is cheating.  Just because something is overlooked, doesn't mean you don't know what the right thing to do is.

These folks got what they deserved.

 Whoa!  Wait a damn minute.  You mean hardcore WoW raiders exploit bugs and cheats to clear content?

Wow, I never new!!11!!1!

I guess you can toss the term "hardcore" out in their case.

/sarcasm