I've just noticed that Mortal Online opens store for their boxed version the 29, and not the 6 as I said previously. The 6 is only for the digital download. Both versions contain access to the beta too.

By the time the DFO NA server is released, most will be happily playing MO, which is a way superior game, and the two DFO servers, both NA and EU, will be dead no man's lands with a handful of hardcore fanbois trying to find each other for hours in order to do some little PvP.

Originally posted by krieblood

Yup i was one of them when NGE came out i left and never looked back and i mean SWG pre-cu was my game i loved it to death.

if NGE didnt happen id still be playing it.

NGE? Where are your principles!?! Some of us left when the CU went live :P

All kidding aside though, SWG is a great case study in people leaving a game they love due to principles. Hell many of those fans are actually recreating the game they loved.

Hehe according to all those trolls DF must have been dead already for... not less than 3 months. But it still isn't. And AV has enough money now to open NA sever. I don't think they robbed some bank so I assume they got money from customers. And don't say they robbed them because as far as I know subscribers pay voluntarily...

Originally posted by krieblood

Yup i was one of them when NGE came out i left and never looked back and i mean SWG pre-cu was my game i loved it to death.

if NGE didnt happen id still be playing it.

So we are saying that there are enough gamers to completely distroy games by turning them into nothing more that customer service and promise vechicles.

Great, well that is unfortunate for sure. might explain why the gaming market is already so bad.

Originally posted by SEANMCAD

Originally posted by krieblood

Yup i was one of them when NGE came out i left and never looked back and i mean SWG pre-cu was my game i loved it to death.

if NGE didnt happen id still be playing it.

 

So we are saying that there are enough gamers to completely distroy games by turning them into nothing more that customer service and promise vechicles.

 

Great, well that is unfortunate for sure. might explain why the gaming market is already so bad.

How do you interpret that as gamer's destroying the game? In the NGE case: The devs forced a change that significantly affected the gameplay of every customer. So how can you blame the consumer for reacting to change that was forced on them? Once again, although to a lesser degree for sure, we see a company changing it's tune on statements they made and people are reacting and saying that is unacceptable. How is that unfortunate? Especially given the fact there are a number of promising alternatives releasing in (what appears to be) the near future.

Originally posted by krieblood

Is a complete and utter moron. I would never pay 50 dollars again for that Crap game and its Crap guard towers mybe if they told me.

With this copy of Darkfall we will have Anti hack software, No Safe Zones (all towers even guild citys removed), Locational Banks, Armor drops from mobs that are worth a damn, All starter weapons do 0.05 DMG to other players,  Fixed NPC UI, Added pets, Added NPC hired Mercs, ect the list gos on but those are the lies that made me turn away after 4 months of play so. Basically AV can fist there o rings to the point of permanint damage

 

.

you sound like an idiot, try thinking before posting, then someone might respond to you in the way you so obivously need. or go outside for a while. sun is healthy.

Originally posted by mklinic

 

How do you interpret that as gamer's destroying the game? In the NGE case: The devs forced a change that significantly affected the gameplay of every customer. So how can you blame the consumer for reacting to change that was forced on them? Once again, although to a lesser degree for sure, we see a company changing it's tune on statements they made and people are reacting and saying that is unacceptable. How is that unfortunate? Especially given the fact there are a number of promising alternatives releasing in (what appears to be) the near future.

I have had gamers literally tell me and this is nearly and exact quote "yes its a fun game but they broke a promise so I will not play".

Do I really need to explain that?

If its unclear I will try to explain it.

I think that Mortal Online should offer a discount to Darkfall Online customers. Basically let them buy your Darkfall Online account and cancel it. In return, they'll give you 2 free months of their game.

This is a moment for Mortal Online to take advantage of the bad practices by Aventurine.

Originally posted by SEANMCAD

I have had gamers literally tell me and this is nearly and exact quote "yes its a fun game but they broke a promise so I will not play".

Do I really need to explain that?

If its unclear I will try to explain it.

Given the stir this particular event has created, there are numerous people who are saying, essentially "they broke a promis so I will no play". Sure there are variations that go on to complain about greed and other vices, but ultimately it boiled down to people felt they were promised on thing and it was switched. So again, as consumers, these people react with their wallets and, as consumers will do, speak their minds about the change.

Nowhere in this whole mess did the consumer initiate the change. Since the action is being taken against the consumer, once again, how is it the consumers fault? Your logic is unclear to me, so please explain if you feel so inclined.

Originally posted by mklinic

 

Given the stir this particular event has created, there are numerous people who are saying, essentially "they broke a promis so I will no play". Sure there are variations that go on to complain about greed and other vices, but ultimately it boiled down to people felt they were promised on thing and it was switched. So again, as consumers, these people react with their wallets and, as consumers will do, speak their minds about the change.

Nowhere in this whole mess did the consumer initiate the change. Since the action is being taken against the consumer, once again, how is it the consumers fault? Your logic is unclear to me, so please explain if you feel so inclined.

I understand and acknowledge what you are saying and I am stating (given my reasons in the quote) that this approach will ruin gaming because a great game can be destroyed not because of bad code but because of some comment a developer makes to the community.

I play games to play games. I don’t play games to read and watch develop statements. I would hate for a good game to be shut down because some develop made a promise that turned out to be not possible OR change because the new option is better.

Now given that I understand what you are saying, do you understand what I am saying?
 

There is no reason to re-explain your position becuase I do understand it. I just dont agree with it.

Originally posted by SEANMCAD

I understand and acknowledge what you are saying and I am stating (given my reasons in the quote) that this approach will ruin gaming because a great game can be destroyed not because of bad code but because of some comment a developer makes to the community.

I play games to play games. I don’t play games to read and watch develop statements. I would hate for a good game to be shut down because some develop made a promise that turned out to be not possible OR change because the new option is better.

Now given that I understand what you are saying, do you understand what I am saying?
 

There is no reason to re-explain your position becuase I do understand it. I just dont agree with it.

Given the supposed subscription base of DF, the whole "great game" part is certainly debatable. One person's trash is another's treasure as it were. So, what you are really saying is that it would be a shame if people ruined your game becuase they don't like what is taking place.

You've already posted in another thread that you have no principles so, I can understand that you don't agree, but that does not mean that those people who cite principles as their reason for not tolerating the current situation, are destroying the game/undustry. It means they are casting their vote on a siginificant, to them, development.

For many people, they are paying for customer service, a game, and the whole package and their decision is based on this. Great that you are happy, but that does not mean others are wrong for casting their vote.

Originally posted by krieblood

Originally posted by daarco

Originally posted by krieblood

LoL i love how only 2 people tried to defend this crap.

yeah in 3 months the NA server will be over run by hackfesters and 3 months of afk sparing later lol.

AV couldnt even pay me not to go to Mortal.

But yeah when NA is out you 2 have a great fucken time and say hello to the Towers for me there so No safe zone's.

Yeah they still advertise Darkfall with Lies i love all the Lies!!!!

"http://www.darkfallonline.com/faq/world.html"

"Will Darkfall have safe zones?
There are no safe zones in Darkfall unless the players themselves create them or seek them out. There is no area where a player cannot be attacked by another player. In the starting locations, guard towers will attack aggressors, providing some measure of safety for new players."

So a Tower thats a NPC object that zaps you even through mountains by Player citys Those arnt safe zones???

Needless to say its Range of shooting you is longer then its range of seeing you..

Fun fun welp have fun in your hardcore dangrous Hackzor world of Fagon..

 

It sounds as you just dont like Darkfall at all, not because they will open up another server.

And what about the "safe zone"? If you belive some guardtower makes a location safe..then you have not played darkfall at all. The tower cant defend anyone. Think that was explained many months ago : )

Yeah ok i was in Dusk alliance in Vindicators for your info iv played. Need more info Toons name was Ikisis Frost.

And yeah ok it dosnt stop you from killing people in citys huh.

So when was the last time Alfar could enter the Dwarf city and kill people without being killed by the towers before they even get close to entering. yeah can u answer that

No you cant because you know damn well that you cant and that is  safe zone and your just a fan boy.

So when you have something true to say post back because know Guard towers in NPC main citys is SAFEZONE alfar cant enter any city without a tower killing them.

and the towers in guild citys yeah they jsut vie off ur location thats cool.

PvP games are ment to be PvP not PvPTower.

So go play darkfail since its so Awesome and sandbox.

I see where you are coming from.  You are butthurt because you can't kill people unawares everywhere you like.

Your's has to be the first DF post I've ever read where someone complained there wasn't enough player killing going on.

Safezones are good for the game, and I think you have to be the only person in recent months to really complain about it.

Originally posted by SEANMCAD

Originally posted by mklinic

 

How do you interpret that as gamer's destroying the game? In the NGE case: The devs forced a change that significantly affected the gameplay of every customer. So how can you blame the consumer for reacting to change that was forced on them? Once again, although to a lesser degree for sure, we see a company changing it's tune on statements they made and people are reacting and saying that is unacceptable. How is that unfortunate? Especially given the fact there are a number of promising alternatives releasing in (what appears to be) the near future.

I have had gamers literally tell me and this is nearly and exact quote "yes its a fun game but they broke a promise so I will not play".

Broke a promise?  This isn't grade-school.  The Aventurine team, lead by Tasos, baited North American players to purchase an account, which is akin to buying a key or a client for @ $50, and mentioned that they would accommodate NA players to transfer to their character to the new server if they chose to, the NA server, when it is on-line. 

And now, 2-weeks, not months, not last year when they were still baiting, did AV provide the clarity about having to pay-out/fund AV for another account/key/client (its all semantics)  AV informs their NA player-base that they do in fact have to pay another client/account/key fee of @50 to play on the NA server.

Just as a snake-oil salesman doesn't make promised, neither did Aventurine, they just mislead and deceived the North American market to gain income to fund their experiement.  Wait for the 'transfer' fee 3months down the road, if you dont enter the NA server in a week and a half, to be as much as the account fee.

Originally posted by mklinic

 

Given the supposed subscription base of DF, the whole "great game" part is certainly debatable. One person's trash is another's treasure as it were. So, what you are really saying is that it would be a shame if people ruined your game becuase they don't like what is taking place.

You've already posted in another thread that you have no principles so, I can understand that you don't agree, but that does not mean that those people who cite principles as their reason for not tolerating the current situation, are destroying the game/undustry. It means they are casting their vote on a siginificant, to them, development.

For many people, they are paying for customer service, a game, and the whole package and their decision is based on this. Great that you are happy, but that does not mean others are wrong for casting their vote.

There are two very seperate situations here and I think you are fliping back and forth a bit.

1. quiting a game you LIKE because of a promise broken

2. quitting a game you DONT like becuase you dont like it.

I understand not playing a game becuase its not fun. I dont agree with not playing a game becuase a developer uses slave labor or lies becuase I think there are much more importnat things in the world than worrying about a developer liying

PLUS (and this is important)

If have an idea and then later I have a BETTER idea but it would involve me breaking my orginal promise, which is better?

Originally posted by Conq

Broke a promise?  This isn't grade-school.  The Aventurine team, lead by Tasos, baited North American players to purchase an account, which is akin to buying a key or a client for @ $50, and mentioned that they would accommodate NA players to transfer to their character to the new server if they chose to, the NA server, when it is on-line. 

 

And now, 2-weeks, not months, not last year when they were still baiting, did AV provide the clarity about having to pay-out/fund AV for another account/key/client (its all semantics)  AV informs their NA player-base that they do in fact have to pay another client/account/key fee of @50 to play on the NA server.

 

Just as a snake-oil salesman doesn't make promised, neither did Aventurine, they just mislead and deceived the North American market to gain income to fund their experiement.  Wait for the 'transfer' fee 3months down the road, if you dont enter the NA server in a week and a half, to be as much as the account fee.

So you want to play the game still is what you are saying?

think about this....

Originally posted by SEANMCAD

So you want to play the game still is what you are saying?

 

think about this....

And what will all those people from North America who got screwed do, in your opinion?

Give more money to Aventurine, who lied to them, July 7.?

Or buy MO June 29.?

Or even if they don't buy MO then, many people who did will have been in the game and able to make reviews. Some of them will be ex-DFO players who will be able to compare both games. The potential NA DFO buyers will read all those reviews and comparisons...

This about this when you log into your empty DFO server soon.

Originally posted by SEANMCAD

Originally posted by Conq

Broke a promise?  This isn't grade-school.  The Aventurine team, lead by Tasos, baited North American players to purchase an account, which is akin to buying a key or a client for @ $50, and mentioned that they would accommodate NA players to transfer to their character to the new server if they chose to, the NA server, when it is on-line. 

 

And now, 2-weeks, not months, not last year when they were still baiting, did AV provide the clarity about having to pay-out/fund AV for another account/key/client (its all semantics)  AV informs their NA player-base that they do in fact have to pay another client/account/key fee of @50 to play on the NA server.

 

Just as a snake-oil salesman doesn't make promised, neither did Aventurine, they just mislead and deceived the North American market to gain income to fund their experiement.  Wait for the 'transfer' fee 3months down the road, if you dont enter the NA server in a week and a half, to be as much as the account fee.

 

So you want to play the game still is what you are saying?

 

think about this....

. . .let me finish your thought. . .anyone that gets scammed and deceived by the likes of Aventurine and Tasos over the course of a long period of time, and pays twice, should look into a lobotomy.

Originally posted by The_Korrigan

 

And what will all those people from North America who got screwed do, in your opinion?

Give more money to Aventurine, who lied to them, July 7.?

Or buy MO June 29.?

Or even if they don't buy MO then, many people who did will have been in the game and able to make reviews. Some of them will be ex-DFO players who will be able to compare both games. The potential NA DFO buyers will read all those reviews and comparisons...

This about this when you log into your empty DFO server soon.

THINK!

the only people getting "Screwed over" are people who ACTUALLY LIKE THE GAME AND WANT TO PLAY.

the people who DO NOT like the game are not going to try to get on the NA server in the first place!

So this subject alone admits that people want to play the game

Originally posted by WOWthatsucks

 

please sit back down captain clueless.

dfo has been out for soemtime, and people dont like it, and with mmo's you are buying a service aswell.  Not just the game.

and i dont like dfo or the other ones....

funny you thought u were the only one watching american idol..........lol @ u

the problem here is is that the game, the actual game itself. I find fun. I find it more fun than most other MMOs.

THAT is the core problem here.

ALSO: you guys that harp on the valid point of being charged twice are admiting that there are still players that in fact want to play the game.

Originally posted by SEANMCAD

Originally posted by WOWthatsucks

 

please sit back down captain clueless.

dfo has been out for soemtime, and people dont like it, and with mmo's you are buying a service aswell.  Not just the game.

and i dont like dfo or the other ones....

funny you thought u were the only one watching american idol..........lol @ u

 

the problem here is is that the game, the actual game itself. I find fun. I find it more fun than most other MMOs.

THAT is the core problem here.

 

ALSO: you guys that harp on the valid point of being charged twice are admiting that there are still players that in fact want to play the game.

You are also forgetting a change in the MMO landscape this time around though.
 

At the time people purchased and continued to play DarkFall (because they were having fun presumably) there wasn't a newer MMO alternative that gave them the same gameplay.

That will not be the case this go around with the NA DarkFall server launch.

MO will be available for players to buy before then.

So, given that even though there may be some NA players of DarkFall who had some fun playing... there are very few that are happy over the prospects of paying again to play on the NA server.

These DarkFall players (the ones that had fun) are going to have to make a choice.  Spend money on getting the newest MMO on the block, or spend money on getting another copy of DarkFall.

Obviously the DarkFall players that did NOT have fun will not be purchasing the NA DarkFall version.

With this move by Aventurine they have now made it a really tough choice for their NA players that DID have fun.

Still think it was a smart move by Aventurine?

I agree with one of the posters above.  If I was part of the MO marketing team I'd offer an extra free month, or some other "allowance" for any existing DarkFall player. 

Originally posted by xzyax

You are also forgetting a change in the MMO landscape this time around though.
 

 

At the time people purchased and continued to play DarkFall (because they were having fun presumably) there wasn't a newer MMO alternative that gave them the same gameplay.

 

That will not be the case this go around with the NA DarkFall server launch.

MO will be available for players to buy before then.

 

So, given that even though there may be some NA players of DarkFall who had some fun playing... there are very few that are happy over the prospects of paying again to play on the NA server.

These DarkFall players (the ones that had fun) are going to have to make a choice.  Spend money on getting the newest MMO on the block, or spend money on getting another copy of DarkFall.

 

Obviously the DarkFall players that did NOT have fun will not be purchasing the NA DarkFall version.

With this move by Aventurine they have now made it a really tough choice for their NA players that DID have fun.

Still think it was a smart move by Aventurine?

 

I agree with one of the posters above.  If I was part of the MO marketing team I'd offer an extra free month, or some other "allowance" for any existing DarkFall player. 

well you might be 100% correct in that and I might even be an MO player then.

But I do not speculate on games before they come out so for the most part I dont really care about what might happen.

have fun until then!

Originally posted by SEANMCAD

Originally posted by xzyax

You are also forgetting a change in the MMO landscape this time around though.
 

 

At the time people purchased and continued to play DarkFall (because they were having fun presumably) there wasn't a newer MMO alternative that gave them the same gameplay.

 

That will not be the case this go around with the NA DarkFall server launch.

MO will be available for players to buy before then.

 

So, given that even though there may be some NA players of DarkFall who had some fun playing... there are very few that are happy over the prospects of paying again to play on the NA server.

These DarkFall players (the ones that had fun) are going to have to make a choice.  Spend money on getting the newest MMO on the block, or spend money on getting another copy of DarkFall.

 

Obviously the DarkFall players that did NOT have fun will not be purchasing the NA DarkFall version.

With this move by Aventurine they have now made it a really tough choice for their NA players that DID have fun.

Still think it was a smart move by Aventurine?

 

I agree with one of the posters above.  If I was part of the MO marketing team I'd offer an extra free month, or some other "allowance" for any existing DarkFall player. 

 

well you might be 100% correct in that and I might even be an MO player then.

But I do not speculate on games before they come out so for the most part I dont really care about what might happen.

have fun until then!

Yup, I am.
 

Part of that fun for me is posting on discussion boards while at work.   Doing server maintenance sometimes gets really boring. 

Originally posted by SEANMCAD
 

There are two very seperate situations here and I think you are fliping back and forth a bit.

1. quiting a game you LIKE because of a promise broken

2. quitting a game you DONT like becuase you dont like it.

I understand not playing a game becuase its not fun. I dont agree with not playing a game becuase a developer uses slave labor or lies becuase I think there are much more importnat things in the world than worrying about a developer liying

PLUS (and this is important)

If have an idea and then later I have a BETTER idea but it would involve me breaking my orginal promise, which is better?

You phrased your point as a "great game" being destroyed. My point was that no game is universally great and is not flipping back and forth. It was merely addressing a point you stated.

That said, let's look at the alternative you present: I like a game and, as a result, I should bury my head in the sand and say "thank you, can I have another?" anytime the devs decide they want to implement a poorly thought out change or demand more money.

Having been through such a chance with SWG, I can assure you the end result of this behavior does not lead to a great game.

Now as to your "PLUS" statement, are you implying that deciding to charge an extra $50 so someone can keep playing the game, but with possibly lower latency, amounts to a "better idea"? That's pretty rediculous from where I am standing, but in the end, it comes down to what you are willing to accept I suppose.

Ultimately, I stand by my point that players do not destroy games which was the original comment that prompted me to reply. A player does not decide what changes are made in a game, what new charges are made, or any of this. A player just decides whether it is acceptable and worth their dollar/pound/euro/whatever. Ultimately, it is the publisher/developer who destroy a game as it is their job to entice and retain more players then they alienate.

Originally posted by mklinic

 

You phrased your point as a "great game" being destroyed. My point was that no game is universally great and is not flipping back and forth. It was merely addressing a point you stated.

That said, let's look at the alternative you present: I like a game and, as a result, I should bury my head in the sand and say "thank you, can I have another?" anytime the devs decide they want to implement a poorly thought out change or demand more money.

Having been through such a chance with SWG, I can assure you the end result of this behavior does not lead to a great game.

Now as to your "PLUS" statement, are you implying that deciding to charge an extra $50 so someone can keep playing the game, but with possibly lower latency, amounts to a "better idea"? That's pretty rediculous from where I am standing, but in the end, it comes down to what you are willing to accept I suppose.

Ultimately, I stand by my point that players do not destroy games which was the original comment that prompted me to reply. A player does not decide what changes are made in a game, what new charges are made, or any of this. A player just decides whether it is acceptable and worth their dollar/pound/euro/whatever. Ultimately, it is the publisher/developer who destroy a game as it is their job to entice and retain more players then they alienate.

despite your great efforts the best I can tell the gaming industry as a whole is infamous for making promises all the time that they never fullfil. So it seems despite how much power people have the problem has only grown.

pleas read

Additionally, sometimes broken promises are actually a good thing!...oh wait do tell you ask?.....

Well, if I promise to take you to the ball game on sunday and one sunday we find out that the road to the ball game is crammed with traffic making it impossible to get there but there was a carnaval very close by that you would like at least as much which would be the better option?

1. get out of the car and spend the day walking to the ballpark in 100degree weather becuase I promised it

2. drive to the carnval and have good fun

Originally posted by SEANMCAD

Originally posted by mklinic

 

You phrased your point as a "great game" being destroyed. My point was that no game is universally great and is not flipping back and forth. It was merely addressing a point you stated.

That said, let's look at the alternative you present: I like a game and, as a result, I should bury my head in the sand and say "thank you, can I have another?" anytime the devs decide they want to implement a poorly thought out change or demand more money.

Having been through such a chance with SWG, I can assure you the end result of this behavior does not lead to a great game.

Now as to your "PLUS" statement, are you implying that deciding to charge an extra $50 so someone can keep playing the game, but with possibly lower latency, amounts to a "better idea"? That's pretty rediculous from where I am standing, but in the end, it comes down to what you are willing to accept I suppose.

Ultimately, I stand by my point that players do not destroy games which was the original comment that prompted me to reply. A player does not decide what changes are made in a game, what new charges are made, or any of this. A player just decides whether it is acceptable and worth their dollar/pound/euro/whatever. Ultimately, it is the publisher/developer who destroy a game as it is their job to entice and retain more players then they alienate.

 

despite your great efforts the best I can tell the gaming industry as a whole is infamous for making promises all the time that they never fullfil. So it seems despite how much power people have the problem has only grown.

pleas read

Additionally, sometimes broken promises are actually a good thing!...oh wait do tell you ask?.....

Well, if I promise to take you to the ball game on sunday and one sunday we find out that the road to the ball game is crammed with traffic making it impossible to get there but there was a carnaval very close by that you would like at least as much which would be the better option?

1. get out of the car and spend the day walking to the ballpark in 100degree weather becuase I promised it

2. drive to the carnval and have good fun

As I said, it all comes down to what a person is willing to accept. Most people were unwilling to accept the NGE. We see many people unwilling to accept the recent news from AV. However, when WoW decided to allow transfers from PvE to PvP servers (despite promises at one point that they would not), we heard some complaints, but overall, people were willing to accept it. This is an example of a company who had a good idea of what there playerbase wanted and would tolerate and made a move based on the fact they could likely retain and attract more then they lost. So there are three examples that hopefully provide some anecdotal perspective.

That said, I'm not really sure how your example has any bearing on the conversation. What was the better alternative AV offered? A player can either spend money or wait and spend money with undisclosed limitations (aside from the whole no gear transfer) if their desire is to play on NA1. Wow, with all those options, one has to be the clear winner right?

Back to my original point which you went out of your way to not address; players don't kill games. I have to assume we agree on that since you did not choose to address that point and that what my main point of contention to your previous posts.