Originally posted by green13

Originally posted by Cik_Asalin

I agree that what would compel many to continue would be non-instanced player housing;but then again, there isnt an mmo that offers it.

I know it's a bit of an embarassment in the mmo world, but Istaria has had non-instanced player housing for many years now.

What should be the purpose of player houses in Darkfall ? Please describe a bit of how they should function in the existing game.

"Often heard but really experienced ? be honest, on how many occasions you really had to report a hacker ? You personally, not how many times you heard about hacking."

For me, I reported nine in a fairly short time period then gave up when I saw that nothing happened to them.

When I left the game last week, those nine were still cheating away, plus I could find another 20 doing the same thing within a short travel time.

Those are my *firsthand*, personal observations.

I really love df's pve btw.

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

Originally posted by JTBanker

Been lurking for a while and have a question that maybe one of the more reasonable people can answer.

Are Darth and Javac paid employees of AV that actually are Mods here on MMORPG which is why they don't get banned? There has to be someone in bed with someone else on MMORPG staff to get away with what those 2 do.

I have over the last 4 months seen people get banned for using words that Mods don't understand all the while Javac and Darth flame people constantly and troll their little hearts out and seem to get away with it?

So does anyone know the answer? Are they actually Mods that are also paid AV shills?

 

No i defend the game becuase i love it i am not paid by aventurine or have any position but i started playing some weeks after launch and i am a satisfied customer since.  No problems with account, the gameplay is exciting particullary i hadn't any more fun  in PvP in ANY mmorpg until now with DarkFall also i hadnt any more fun in any MMORPG until now with a GROUP of people.

Interesting fact is that you single few persons out (in fact 2)  including me that bothers you.

On the other hand you dont question opinions from people who NOT play but

state opinions as facts,  taking excessive negative perspectives without knowledge, bully people who admitelly like the game.

(take these thread for example  and how haters started to bully fans of the game by  recurring to personal attacks)

Interesting.

 

 

You people are the only ones who put out personal attacks. This is undisputable.

Originally posted by oddjobs74

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

Originally posted by JTBanker

Been lurking for a while and have a question that maybe one of the more reasonable people can answer.

Are Darth and Javac paid employees of AV that actually are Mods here on MMORPG which is why they don't get banned? There has to be someone in bed with someone else on MMORPG staff to get away with what those 2 do.

I have over the last 4 months seen people get banned for using words that Mods don't understand all the while Javac and Darth flame people constantly and troll their little hearts out and seem to get away with it?

So does anyone know the answer? Are they actually Mods that are also paid AV shills?

 

No i defend the game becuase i love it i am not paid by aventurine or have any position but i started playing some weeks after launch and i am a satisfied customer since.  No problems with account, the gameplay is exciting particullary i hadn't any more fun  in PvP in ANY mmorpg until now with DarkFall also i hadnt any more fun in any MMORPG until now with a GROUP of people.

Interesting fact is that you single few persons out (in fact 2)  including me that bothers you.

On the other hand you dont question opinions from people who NOT play but

state opinions as facts,  taking excessive negative perspectives without knowledge, bully people who admitelly like the game.

(take these thread for example  and how haters started to bully fans of the game by  recurring to personal attacks)

Interesting.

 

 

You people are the only ones who put out personal attacks. This is undisputable.

Absoutley correct. Also they are the kings of spin and denial.

Darth and Javac, give it a rest, you are becomming a laughing stock on several boards and if you like DF so much why are you here and not playing all your waking time?

I guess you both must be AFK macroing to level up in the game that has no levels (ROFLMAO, yeah right).

Oh and before you start the "you don't play so you don't know" crap, I have probably followed and played longer then most here.

I first joined the forum membership back when Razorwax owned the game. Back when we had level headed people that saw a future for what Razorwax was planning. Not a bunch of screaming kids that act emo everytime someone says anything against their wittle itty bitty game that is probably their first mmo they have ever played.

Originally posted by green13

Originally posted by Cik_Asalin

I agree that what would compel many to continue would be non-instanced player housing;but then again, there isnt an mmo that offers it.

I know it's a bit of an embarassment in the mmo world, but Istaria has had non-instanced player housing for many years now.

It's funny, but now that you've made me think of it, DFO is basically the "Horizons of Istaria" of the PvP world.

A comparison that is both valid and embarrassing.

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

What should be the purpose of player houses in Darkfall ? Please describe a bit of how they should function in the existing game.

but...but...but...it's a sandbox! you're supposed to use your imagination! That's what I've been hearing so I am not sure why you would expect someone to detail the purpose of housing in a game.

That said, they could function in much the same way they have in SWG as storage, vendor hireling locations, or simply a place where someone can carve out their life in the game and have some impact on the game world. Certainly, I wouldn't expect the purpose to be limited to this short list.

So, while that may provide the begining of answer to your question, the previous response was based on a comment that no game had non-instanced player housing and not whether or not DF should have it. I imagine there are plenty of other things on the DF devs' plate.

Originally posted by Cik_Asalin

Originally posted by rhinok

Originally posted by javac

out of curiosity, what were you expecting? WOW with full loot? did you research the game at all before buying? What game did you come from and what game are you going back to?

 

DF is a sandbox MMO with an emphasis on PVP and conquest, and that's exactly what it delivers. IMO.

• Can I build a house? No
• Can I set up a farmstead or mine? No
• Can I have my own store, either brick-and-mortar or online? No - I can only spam the trade channel.
• Do I have to be in a group in order to kill most mobs?  Yes
• Can I rob an unprotected bank? No
• Do I have to be in a clan in order to  particpate in most activies (sieging, building, etc...)? Yes 
• Can my clan build their hamlet or city anywhere they want?  No
• Can my clan build their hamlet or city any way they want? No

I'm starting to think Aventurine's definition of sandbox is "game that's not finished yet"

~Ripper

 

I'll be another to say that DF is not a true sandbox.  But it is the most compelling and freedom of tethered coded static environment available, where players influence the game-play environment and take on the roll of a mob which are hard-coded into most games for combat and gain.

 

This is not a solo game, never has been designed that way, or thought about changing their core dynamic in that direction for years.  DF is a purely social team-oriented, guild-centric game where you play the politics and diplomacy against the backdrop of small bands of players with the freedom to influence your game-play.

 

I agree that what would compel many to continue would be non-instanced player housing;but then again, there isnt an mmo that offers it.  But to think that there should be some safety of having a farmstead without being influenced by the player-driven ecosystem is outrageous, though you can have a farm within a hamelt.

 

So, while DF offers the greatest dynamic mmorpg to date within a player-centric ecosystem, you touch on a few things that no mmorpg has such as...

 

>player housing. (UO, EQ2, SWG) Just to name 3

>brick and mortel store. (SWG has actual player built stores. Almost ANY korean mmo has player stores as well.)

>robbing a bank. (Not yet seen any mmo do that, would like to though!)

>building a hamlet in any conceivable location. (SWG did it, build anywhere and anything.)

 

. . . .and claim that those are the reasons why you wont leave your pve-centric, themepark game?  Alrighty then.

Would just like to point that out.

Originally posted by Axllow18

Originally posted by Cik_Asalin

Originally posted by rhinok

Originally posted by javac

out of curiosity, what were you expecting? WOW with full loot? did you research the game at all before buying? What game did you come from and what game are you going back to?

 

DF is a sandbox MMO with an emphasis on PVP and conquest, and that's exactly what it delivers. IMO.

• Can I build a house? No
• Can I set up a farmstead or mine? No
• Can I have my own store, either brick-and-mortar or online? No - I can only spam the trade channel.
• Do I have to be in a group in order to kill most mobs?  Yes
• Can I rob an unprotected bank? No
• Do I have to be in a clan in order to  particpate in most activies (sieging, building, etc...)? Yes 
• Can my clan build their hamlet or city anywhere they want?  No
• Can my clan build their hamlet or city any way they want? No

I'm starting to think Aventurine's definition of sandbox is "game that's not finished yet"

~Ripper

 

I'll be another to say that DF is not a true sandbox.  But it is the most compelling and freedom of tethered coded static environment available, where players influence the game-play environment and take on the roll of a mob which are hard-coded into most games for combat and gain.

 

This is not a solo game, never has been designed that way, or thought about changing their core dynamic in that direction for years.  DF is a purely social team-oriented, guild-centric game where you play the politics and diplomacy against the backdrop of small bands of players with the freedom to influence your game-play.

 

I agree that what would compel many to continue would be non-instanced player housing;but then again, there isnt an mmo that offers it.  But to think that there should be some safety of having a farmstead without being influenced by the player-driven ecosystem is outrageous, though you can have a farm within a hamelt.

 

So, while DF offers the greatest dynamic mmorpg to date within a player-centric ecosystem, you touch on a few things that no mmorpg has such as...

 

>player housing. (UO, EQ2, SWG) Just to name 3

>brick and mortel store. (SWG has actual player built stores. Almost ANY korean mmo has player stores as well.)

>robbing a bank. (Not yet seen any mmo do that, would like to though!)

>building a hamlet in any conceivable location. (SWG did it, build anywhere and anything.)

 

. . . .and claim that those are the reasons why you wont leave your pve-centric, themepark game?  Alrighty then.

 

Would just like to point that out.

Kind of makes you think they never played an MMO before.

You could break into someones non instanced house and steal there stuff 10 years ago in UO.

Originally posted by mklinic

Originally posted by Cik_Asalin

I agree that what would compel many to continue would be non-instanced player housing;but then again, there isnt an mmo that offers it.

 

On this point in particular, and I will admit it has been a while, but last time I played, SWG was non-instance player housing. Additionally, you could place vendors in your house, decorate it however you wanted using any object (armor, weapons, furniture, resources, etc), and set access permissions. Placement was fairly liberal with terrain determining whether you could place your house and you could set your flora farmers working just steps from your front door if the resources in the area were right.

Now, to add to the sandbox argument, you could do all this without picking up a weapon of any sort and, if you chose, without a player association/guild, though being in a PA didn't hurt your gaming options.

 

Indeed, SWG at launch is miles ahead than almost everygame now in the industry, as far as sandbox goes.  The community is varied, everyone plays in his own ways.  Merchants! never before in any game and never since, you have merchants that really is a gameplay, and not just an off-activity before log out, and not just AH camping.  Crafters, they are unique.

DF is completely left in the shade when you look at SWG.  What shame it is for a game released in 2009 to pale in totality comparing to a game years before.  With the new processing power from computers, we expect ease and fluid implementation of SWG-like game, and room for much more improvement to be tried out.  Sad to us, DF simply deliver an empty map with broken skill system, hacker-heaven ... endless list of issues.

DF is a PVP game with ffa loot, that is it.  Sandbox?  Well if we do not bring up the successful stories of sandbox games, maybe we can pretend DF to be one.

It's a debate that will rage on throughout the gaming community about what is defined as sandbox and what isn't.

First of all DF does have full loot but so what. There really isn't any fear of death. I lose armor or a mount or anything I can easily replace it. Granted some items are a tad harder to get a hold of but honestly who the hell goes out fighting with stuff that they can't afford to lose?

DF has no fear of death so who the hell cares if you killed me or not?

I died many times but I still grow stronger because I didn't lose skill.

I admit DF does sometimes create some fun, but there is no purpose to the game.

I decided to not renew my accounts for the simple fact that I want to use my time for something more entertaining. I didn't think that DFO would turn into such a boring concept.

Fact is that the devs do deserve some credit for having the balls to bring back full loot but seriously they needed to bring something more to the table.

Remember the saying fool me once.......

Players need to realize that this game is what it is. It's not UO,SWG,EQ,EVE,...ect

The bottomline I am bored with the game.

This game seems more and more bland by the moment.

Originally posted by oddjobs74

Originally posted by shukes33

Originally posted by oddjobs74

Originally posted by shukes33

Originally posted by oddjobs74

Originally posted by shukes33

Originally posted by oddjobs74

Darkfail fans  Just consitently confuse sand box with litter box, which is what AV created.

Case in point! these are the comments we need to stop! what is the point of it other than getting post count up? it adds nothing to any disscusion and just gives other sites a chance to smile at us! surely you have more to offer than that friend.
 

Why is Darkfall a litter box? tell potential buyers why they shouldnt buy the game or why you think they shouldnt.

 

seriously?

I guess the same reason you should not play games of 3 card monty on street corners.

The entire thing is a scam. Look at the development history and everything out of Tasos' mouth has been a lie.. there is no reason to list reasons that have been listed in every other thread.  If the situation warrants it I do have more to offer but in this case it is not warranted.

My last comment is nothing short of fact, and this is undisputable.

 

of course i am serious friend.
 

Fact you say? undisputably you are wrong. it is simply a game. that is fact and something you can't argue about! it's ok to argue about tasos mouth etc, but why continue about that when i have already agreed with you? doesn't make sense! but for the sake of players who want to know about the game...why can't people like you offer them help? why can't you give your opinion about your playing experience in the game? why can't you offer what you thought was bad about the core pf the game, or the technical side of the game? thats what people are looking for not just useless comments!

I am just asking you to offer something worthwhile that's all. please dont get upset about it :)

 

I am in no way shape or form wrong. But you know what man? you win. I yeild. I cant go back and forth with you ultra lib reward bad behavior types. The fact is I and everyone else who have commonsense regarding Darkfall has stated real factual issues with this game. Im simply not going to in every thread. So what I said is just a short and sweet version of what I have said before. Sorry If I have offended you Mr. Rogers. It is just simply not a beautiful day in my neighborhood today.

 

Haha dont worry mate you didn't offend me. i'm just having a bit of fun with you :)

But again you can't just label what you say as fact and think you are right! fact is it is just your opinion friend. like or not that is all it is :) so please dont use the word if you can't understand it's true meaning :) also i think i actually have a meagre bit of common sense, and i still play it. Haha i'm guessing you havent actually played the game have you? go on...you can say it...we already know the answer :) .....so cute!

Am i really a ultra lib bad behaviour type lol? thats something to take home to the missus haha!

Oh ye back on topic. I give credit to AV for listening to current players and at least attempting to put things right! but i also have to say " sort that damned site out AV" it has started so many threads, and rightly so. dont mislead potential customers.

 

First of all I know what fact means.

No I do not and have not played Darkfall. As i have said, I have common sense.  I would not by a car with 2 wheels and no transmission, or play 3 card monty on the street, which is what a person who plays Darkfall has in essence done.

What gives you the Idea that AV is attempting to put things right?

err patches every week improving the game? patches that actually include things that players have asked for? thise are the things that give me the idea Av are trying tp put things right
 

You didnt need to answer the question on whether you had played it or not btw, it was plainly obvious by your complete lack of anything to say :) a car with 2 wheels wouldnt work! darkfall works....come on your better than this, tell you what mate, sleep on it for a bit..have a think then come back with something. your'e just not saying anything really other than that you think the game is broken and crap! and how do you come up with this i ask...you got it! by listening to others who dont like it! you say you have common sense but you come onto a darkfall forum to have your say when you couldnt even make up your own mind....you make me glad i have no common sense.

Originally posted by beaverz

You dont need to try something to know that its a peice of crap.

This whole you didnt try it so stfugtfogmfban attitude shows how great the df community is.

The worst thing about df isnt that there is only one feature to this game: full loot. The main problem is its community, hell even the goons seem like jolly good fellows compared to you guys.

you misunderstand friend. i am not saying you need to play it to know about it. but one thing is certain that i am sure you can agree with....when you state things as fact! you need to know it is a fact. how can you state for a fact that you dont like something when you have never even tried it? how can you state something is a litterbox as fact when it simply is a game? this is nothing to do with the DF community friend this is just common sense.

But it's always a simple way to add your side by slating everything that someone says as the old" DF community" thing. But again that adds nothing.what is the difference to me adding something to an argument and you saying"df community"? does that really make you better?

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

Originally posted by green13

• To be forced to hit afk'ers on bloodwalls for a couple of months before I could walk out of town wearing armour I didn't want to lose. *yawn*
• An alignment system so badly screwed up, that players will be griefed more by members of their own "friendly" faction than by enemy ones.
• Rampant hacking/macro'ing/botting.
• Aventurine to not enforce their ToS - which they don't on nearly all counts. Because if they did, they'd be taking disciplinary action again the majority of their already tiny playerbase.

 

So let break your points down one by one.

To be forced to hit afk'ers on bloodwalls for a couple of months before I could walk out of town wearing armour I didn't want to lose. *yawn*

You dont like loose items.  - its a full loot PvP game. You choose to attend bloodwals having YOU fear of loosing armor  force you. 

There have could been other options you didnt choose. One of which is  ..get used to loosing stuff in a full loot game the most important and foremost.  Then dont wear the most expensive armor running around use the armor fitting your skill.

Its YOU wanting to wear full plate with lets say  Lesser Magic 40 as highest skill (just an example) . AYou want to have it all handed to you. You want no risk while wearing the best armor and to minimize it the fast possible way you put yourself on Bloodwalls. 

An alignment system so badly screwed up, that players will be griefed more by members of their own "friendly" faction than by enemy ones.

These could have been an issue prior the alignment received a patch. I haven't been killed by a blue player since. Be honest and count me how often you got killed by blue friendly players ?

Rampant hacking/macro'ing/botting.

Often heard but really experienced ? be honest, on how many occasions you really had to report a hacker ?  You personally, not how many times you heard about hacking.

 Aventurine to not enforce their ToS - which they don't on nearly all counts. Because if they did, they'd be taking disciplinary action again the majority of their already tiny playerbase.

What makes you believe that ?  A general statement without any proof ?

1) Items are just stuff. I've no attachment to them.

But players need to pay for skills with gold and they need reagents to level magic. It's difficult to accumulate either if you're killed every 15 minutes. That means it's difficult to advance, unless you opt for bloodwalls.

Nice attempt at an insult with the example of crappy skill and full plate mail - but I've never worn anything other than mob loot out of town, because I'm almost guaranteed to lose it. And there's no way I could afford even 1 suit of full plate mail. All I have is one set of banded armour which I wear on those few occasions I've taken a mount out of town - mainly to give the false impression that I'm not an easy target and not worth chasing down.

And, with a server that's had a paid beta with no wipe - anyone entering the game now is at a serious disadvantage. It's also not helped by the stupid alignment system. Listen on race alliance chat. Any time anyone asks about the easiest way to get your alignment up it's "kill afk'ers on bloodwalls", "kill harvesters in newbie areas" or "kill naked newbies in newbie areas".

Which is ironic, given this game is supposedly for hard-core pvp'ers....

Of course all of this is only a problem if Aventurine ever want to increase their subscriptions.

2) Read my post - I hate to let facts get in the way of a good argument, but I said "griefed" not " "killed". To answer your question, though, yes I've been killed about as often by blues as I have by reds.

My first death was to blues. I got invited to a party. Ten seconds later I was dead. No alignment penalty so that was safe for them - not that there was anything about this in their woefully inadequate help files or ten second tutorial.

I prefer magic to melee - not a good choice for Darkfall, even with their supposedly sandbox design - so that means aoe splash. Blues jump into splash twice in a short period and bam - they're free to kill and loot me. It's happened to me repeatedly. And it's trickier, but they can do the same with melee or arrows.

Worse, since there's no on-screen indicator of your "Rogue" status, if you miss that message, you can run towards a tower mistakenly thinking it will protect you only to be killed by it. I've seen that happen a lot outside of Copperdale.

This hasn't happened to me, but I've heard people complain about it - guild war declarations. See another blue you want to kill and they're in a guild - just declare war on the guild, and you're free to kill them.

Oh, that was probably more honesty than you were after....

3) I wouldn't bother. When players boast openly about these things in chat, it's already too far gone.

4) I read their ToS. It prohibits a range of things which anyone who reads a chat channel for more than five minutes will see repeated examples of.

Theoretically, there are restrictions on player names and guild names - though read chat and you'll see plenty of examples that violate both - some spectacularly. You'll also see plenty of examples of topics and behaviour in chat that are also theoretically prohibited.

Botting is also theoretically illegal, and yet ridiculously commonplace.

Players swim afk in all sorts of places - I particularly like the under-ferry-trick.

I saw two afk players in Charybdis (for non-DF'ers, that is the Elven capital city) - one jumping, the other crouch-walking behind them. Beside the bank - they didn't even bother to pick somewhere discreet. They aimed poorly though - I had fun watching them fall off the nearby cliff and end up in the water!

Technically, the all too common bloodwall has to be counted as botting - since you're afk and still skilling up. I've even seen special macros discussed in chat and posted publicly on guild websites that let you practice shield blocking, while afk.

Again, probably more honesty than you're comfortable with....

Originally posted by green13

I wouldn't recommend this game to anyone in its current state and having purchased it, I feel ripped off.

I think it's perfectly fair to trash the game - especially in these forums which inform potential customers of the real nature of the product.

I think Aventurine have made several critical errors which may doom the game.

But I also think they deserve a little credit.

There have been a number of mmos in the past decade that have made bold claims re revolutionary gameplay. Many never made it to release (eg. Wish, Dragon Empires). Some made it to release but minus any of the promised "revolutionary" features (eg. Vanguard). Most, like Darkfall, were released in an appalling unfinished state with the questionable expectation that consumers would be happy to pay for them.

Darkfall has undoubtedly missed the mark - no bullseye, and I'm not sure they've even grazed the target - but they took the shot. Even though the current product isn't exactly what they promised, I think the attempt is something that will ultimately benefit the industry.

Hi Green13,
Minus the argument, I concur with you regarding the credit deserved, I just wanted to mention that in many of the threads I have checked out in the last couple of years following DF that they have received said credit. Don’t let some of the haters fool you, they wanted DF to succeed as much as anyone yet they were really let down by the problems that persist. Your point is well taken by me and I just wanted to add that many continue to give said credit, including me, to such an attempt.

 

Originally posted by Hammertime1

Originally posted by green13

Originally posted by Cik_Asalin

I agree that what would compel many to continue would be non-instanced player housing;but then again, there isnt an mmo that offers it.

I know it's a bit of an embarassment in the mmo world, but Istaria has had non-instanced player housing for many years now.

It's funny, but now that you've made me think of it, DFO is basically the "Horizons of Istaria" of the PvP world.

A comparison that is both valid and embarrassing.

Oh that's just plain nasty!

Horizons was much crappier at release and continued to be craptastic and even grow more craptastic for years afterwards. It's only in the past 18 months, with the new owners, that there's been any improvement at all.

Horizons also failed to deliver on most of the big promises they made in development. Darkfall has managed to deliver nearly all of the major game elements they promised. A lot of them suck, for various reasons - but generally in ways that are potentially fixable.

Most of Darkfall's existing problems are ones of imbalance. These are things that really should have been resolved in beta and the nature of the mmo market is such that having released it in the state they have, many who might have enjoyed the game that it might one day become, will never bother to try it.

Originally posted by green13

Originally posted by Hammertime1

Originally posted by green13

Originally posted by Cik_Asalin

I agree that what would compel many to continue would be non-instanced player housing;but then again, there isnt an mmo that offers it.

I know it's a bit of an embarassment in the mmo world, but Istaria has had non-instanced player housing for many years now.

It's funny, but now that you've made me think of it, DFO is basically the "Horizons of Istaria" of the PvP world.

A comparison that is both valid and embarrassing.

Oh that's just plain nasty!

Horizons was much crappier at release and continued to be craptastic and even grow more craptastic for years afterwards. It's only in the past 18 months, with the new owners, that there's been any improvement at all.

Horizons also failed to deliver on most of the big promises they made in development. Darkfall has managed to deliver nearly all of the major game elements they promised. A lot of them suck, for various reasons - but generally in ways that are potentially fixable.

Most of Darkfall's existing problems are ones of imbalance. These are things that really should have been resolved in beta and the nature of the mmo market is such that having released it in the state they have, many who might have enjoyed the game that it might one day become, will never bother to try it.

The game it might one day become?  Who can tell what it will be, and when the one day will be?

DF after 8 years and 10million Euros, is really a mess.  That is consensus.  Different people see different problems, that is worse, it means there are really a lot of issues, not just a few.  It is just plain hard to explain and convince the majority that AV can turn the table around with good chance.

Horizon is bad, that is why it does not prosper.  DF is bad, that is why it is sinking.  The majority of the gamers are not stupid, they go for what entertains them.  Hot air won't float, as people log in to play, not to enjoy the hot air.  Saying that DF managed to deliver nearly all of the major game elements they promised, is just empty talk.  What matters most is, does DF provide the right form of enjoyment for enough people to stick around.

Evidence seems to suggest otherwise.  From 300k chasing them to releasing the product, to under 1k or 2k loggin on.  That about sums it all.

Originally posted by Orthedos

Horizon is bad, that is why it does not prosper.  DF is bad, that is why it is sinking. 

I have no qualms slagging off at Darkfall - read some of my other posts - but this is an unfair comparison, for all the reasons I outlined.