Originally posted by Vagrant_Zero

 

---

Originally posted by Haiken
Yeah, I m not a big Western fan either, I prefer Eastern stuff, for example, I've always prefer Anime stuff like DBZ, Samurai X and Saint Seiya, instead of western Cartoons, like X-men, Underdog, although I watch those too, I still prefer the Anime ones, it relates to the topic because is the same issue, I prefer Asians Games instead of western, I like to play Metal Gear Solid, Devil May Cry, Street Fighter, Zelda, Mario more than Grand Theft Auto, Halo or other western games.
Lets be honest, in the Game subject Asians are 1 step ahead than Westerns, although not by much because we have seen some great games by western companys such as Counter-Strike, Half- Life, Quake, Doom, but Asian still have some classics such as Zelda, Mario and Metal Gear Solid.
I know none of those games are MMOs but if you are smart you will relate it with the thread.

---

 

It amazes me that people still view the world in such an irrational manner.

All the games you mentioned are made by the Japanese. They have a name for their race you know, and just because a KOREAN company makes a game there's no reason to believe they're going to have "The Japanese Mojo" rub off on them.

Hell if anything, most of the single player Koreans RPGs I've played were absolute garbage compared to their japanese counterparts. Korea is pretty much the poor man's Japan.

So ?, Japanesse are not Asians ?, you need a fucking map  before saying anything, is like USA alcohol and Mexico Alcohol they Both western, someone failed at geography class.

I haven't seen anything that hasn't been done before. To me it feels no different than logging into Silkroad online or something like that. I'm not out to knock the game, but the game companies are going to have to do better than this to give WoW a serious challenge. Not that it's a bad game. It just feels and plays like one of the hundreds of F2P games out there to me.

Originally posted by cfurlin

Originally posted by porovaara

 I don't see any real innovation here with regards to the player's level of interactivity. Where are the games like Spellborn and Hellgate that allow a player's actual skill to have some value.

 

Aion is a good game, but it's not a great game (yet). It's not innovatative enough to be considered groundbreaking. It will probably do well and have a good customer base through its lifetime. The proof will be in what they do with it once it goes live (retail) for everyone.

For people looking for something completely different, Aion isn't going to cut it. But, if you are looking for another MMO with familar gameplay like you would find in most popular MMOs. then that's what you'll get and you'll be happy with it.

Agreed

Originally posted by Haiken

Originally posted by Vagrant_Zero

 

---

Originally posted by Haiken
Yeah, I m not a big Western fan either, I prefer Eastern stuff, for example, I've always prefer Anime stuff like DBZ, Samurai X and Saint Seiya, instead of western Cartoons, like X-men, Underdog, although I watch those too, I still prefer the Anime ones, it relates to the topic because is the same issue, I prefer Asians Games instead of western, I like to play Metal Gear Solid, Devil May Cry, Street Fighter, Zelda, Mario more than Grand Theft Auto, Halo or other western games.
Lets be honest, in the Game subject Asians are 1 step ahead than Westerns, although not by much because we have seen some great games by western companys such as Counter-Strike, Half- Life, Quake, Doom, but Asian still have some classics such as Zelda, Mario and Metal Gear Solid.
I know none of those games are MMOs but if you are smart you will relate it with the thread.

---

 

It amazes me that people still view the world in such an irrational manner.

All the games you mentioned are made by the Japanese. They have a name for their race you know, and just because a KOREAN company makes a game there's no reason to believe they're going to have "The Japanese Mojo" rub off on them.

Hell if anything, most of the single player Koreans RPGs I've played were absolute garbage compared to their japanese counterparts. Korea is pretty much the poor man's Japan.

So ?, Japanesse are not Asians ?, you need a fucking map  before saying anything, is like USA alcohol and Mexico Alcohol they Both western, someone failed at geography class.

Come on now don't be a smart ass, you know darn well what he meant. DO NOT credit Koreans with something an entirely different culture produced. Or I guess Iraq, Russia and India are also better at making games than the "west".

When talking about MMOs KOREANS are still far behind what we do here. I prefer Auction Houses instead of Player cluttering stalls for selling. I prefer WASD over point clicking. I prefer worn-down looking armor over mirror shiny stuff. I prefer grittier looking mobs to kill rather than cutesy ones.

None of these things keep me from trying out Korean MMOs, but nothing beats having people in your own backyard making stuff catered to local players when the newness factor wears off.

Originally posted by Ramonski7

When talking about MMOs KOREANS are still far behind what we do here. I prefer Auction Houses instead of Player cluttering stalls for selling.

I'm glad you said this because it reminded me of how much I hate personal shops. For those of you playing Aion that don't think it's going to be a big deal, download a copy of Lineage II, buy a month of game time, and walk into any large city. Trust me, it gets annoying real fast.

People set up shops in doorways, entrances, any place that you HAVE to walk through to get somewhere. Right now it doesn't look too bad, but wait until there are hundreds of people doing it in one area.

Originally posted by cfurlin

Originally posted by Ramonski7

When talking about MMOs KOREANS are still far behind what we do here. I prefer Auction Houses instead of Player cluttering stalls for selling.

 

I'm glad you said this because it reminded me of how much I hate personal shops. For those of you playing Aion that don't think it's going to be a big deal, download a copy of Lineage II, buy a month of game time, and walk into any large city. Trust me, it gets annoying real fast.

People set up shops in doorways, entrances, any place that you HAVE to walk through to get somewhere. Right now it doesn't look too bad, but wait until there are hundreds of people doing it in one area.

Is this what Aion has instead of an auction house?  Too bad as the thing about GW's that hurts the game for me is lack of an auction system.
 

Originally posted by MavisP

Originally posted by cfurlin

Originally posted by Ramonski7

When talking about MMOs KOREANS are still far behind what we do here. I prefer Auction Houses instead of Player cluttering stalls for selling.

 

I'm glad you said this because it reminded me of how much I hate personal shops. For those of you playing Aion that don't think it's going to be a big deal, download a copy of Lineage II, buy a month of game time, and walk into any large city. Trust me, it gets annoying real fast.

People set up shops in doorways, entrances, any place that you HAVE to walk through to get somewhere. Right now it doesn't look too bad, but wait until there are hundreds of people doing it in one area.

Is this what Aion has instead of an auction house?  Too bad as the thing about GW's that hurts the game for me is lack of an auction system.
 

It has both.

EDIT: However, you have to pay to post on the AH, you do not for personal shops.

Originally posted by Haiken

Originally posted by cfurlin

Originally posted by porovaara

 I don't see any real innovation here with regards to the player's level of interactivity. Where are the games like Spellborn and Hellgate that allow a player's actual skill to have some value.

 

Aion is a good game, but it's not a great game (yet). It's not innovatative enough to be considered groundbreaking. It will probably do well and have a good customer base through its lifetime. The proof will be in what they do with it once it goes live (retail) for everyone.

For people looking for something completely different, Aion isn't going to cut it. But, if you are looking for another MMO with familar gameplay like you would find in most popular MMOs. then that's what you'll get and you'll be happy with it.

Agreed

I agree also. I don't think there is anything ground breaking or new here, and, personally, I'm not a big fan of the anime style art (no matter how mean and scarred you make your toon...they seem to always be at least a little effeminate. Of course, maybe that says more about me than the style, but whatever). All that said, I am having fun so far. I hope it is not just the "new mmo smell" that is getting me. I guess I'll play it for a while and see.

Originally posted by DrSpanky

Originally posted by Haiken

Originally posted by cfurlin

Originally posted by porovaara

 I don't see any real innovation here with regards to the player's level of interactivity. Where are the games like Spellborn and Hellgate that allow a player's actual skill to have some value.

 

Aion is a good game, but it's not a great game (yet). It's not innovatative enough to be considered groundbreaking. It will probably do well and have a good customer base through its lifetime. The proof will be in what they do with it once it goes live (retail) for everyone.

For people looking for something completely different, Aion isn't going to cut it. But, if you are looking for another MMO with familar gameplay like you would find in most popular MMOs. then that's what you'll get and you'll be happy with it.

Agreed

I agree also. I don't think there is anything ground breaking or new here, and, personally, I'm not a big fan of the anime style art (no matter how mean and scarred you make your toon...they seem to always be at least a little effeminate. Of course, maybe that says more about me than the style, but whatever). All that said, I am having fun so far. I hope it is not just the "new mmo smell" that is getting me. I guess I'll play it for a while and see.

Yeah, I've always thought that your character should look a little more "battleworn" in a game that has combat as a primary function. Even games like WAR and Darkfall have characters that look rough, but in a "clean" sort of way (I hope that makes sense -- it does to me).

Originally posted by cfurlin

Originally posted by MavisP

Originally posted by cfurlin

Originally posted by Ramonski7

When talking about MMOs KOREANS are still far behind what we do here. I prefer Auction Houses instead of Player cluttering stalls for selling.

 

I'm glad you said this because it reminded me of how much I hate personal shops. For those of you playing Aion that don't think it's going to be a big deal, download a copy of Lineage II, buy a month of game time, and walk into any large city. Trust me, it gets annoying real fast.

People set up shops in doorways, entrances, any place that you HAVE to walk through to get somewhere. Right now it doesn't look too bad, but wait until there are hundreds of people doing it in one area.

Is this what Aion has instead of an auction house?  Too bad as the thing about GW's that hurts the game for me is lack of an auction system.
 

It has both.

EDIT: However, you have to pay to post on the AH, you do not for personal shops.

Ok good, i know its just a little thing but its the little things that make an MMO enjoyable for me.  Ive not played it in beta but am looking forward to it.
 

I got to level 10, and the people touting how this game "adds" to anything are delusional.

Fancy combos that require you to stand still, but are very pretty to look at are what I found waiting for me at the end of the painfully PAINFULLY generic newbie zone. If I wanted that, I'd go play 2Moons. Flying isn't as bad I had initially thought, but the fact of the matter is that the game is just one big kill quest grind to 50, where at that point; you may or may not be entertained by the siege warfare. Hell, in the newbie zone the only quest that looked like it might have been interesting turned out to be nothing but a stupid fedex quest. 

(The quest I refer to is in the asmodian zone, you're to secretly raid the camp ewoks. You go to the next quest NPC with a certain code word, only to find out "LAWL I HAVE NO INCENDIARYS. RAIDS OFF!". At which point you return to the original quest NPC for a meager exp reward... Wtf?)

Are you people so desperate for a new MMO that you're ignoring the obvious?

Originally posted by LogothX

I got to level 10, and the people touting how this game "adds" to anything are delusional.

Fancy combos that require you to stand still, but are very pretty to look at are what I found waiting for me at the end of the painfully PAINFULLY generic newbie zone. If I wanted that, I'd go play 2Moons. Flying isn't as bad I had initially thought, but the fact of the matter is that the game is just one big kill quest grind to 50, where at that point; you may or may not be entertained by the siege warfare. Hell, in the newbie zone the only quest that looked like it might have been interesting turned out to be nothing but a stupid fedex quest. 

 

(The quest I refer to is in the asmodian zone, you're to secretly raid the camp ewoks. You go to the next quest NPC with a certain code word, only to find out "LAWL I HAVE NO INCENDIARYS. RAIDS OFF!". At which point you return to the original quest NPC for a meager exp reward... Wtf?)

Are you people so desperate for a new MMO that you're ignoring the obvious?

I agree that this game doesn't add anything new, but I remeber moving while doing combos.  I mean I wasn't circling around mobs because I was only doing PvE.  Maybe I'm wrong, but I think I would have noticed my attacks not going off if I moved.

Originally posted by Ramonski7

When talking about MMOs KOREANS are still far behind what we do here. I prefer Auction Houses instead of Player cluttering stalls for selling. I prefer WASD over point clicking. I prefer worn-down looking armor over mirror shiny stuff. I prefer grittier looking mobs to kill rather than cutesy ones.

LMAO, Aion has all of this.

Nice shooting yourself in the foot.

Giving more choices to everyone has always been better than forcing people to play the way you want in my book.

And koreans are still far behind? Lineage 2 and GW have always been on the level of what we do here.

As for Aion, tell me what other game has a 3rd AI controlled race, the Balaur. They will come on their own to attack your faction and your fortresses (Aoc promised to do this, but still fails to deliver after 1 year). They will also help balance the pvp as they will sometimes come to help defend your fortress against the enemy and sometimes they will help the enemy crush you. All of the other faction games like WAR have always been missing such a feature. Look at the rvr balancing problems WAR has.

And what do we have here?

- slow and boring combat (only 1 western game has fast paced and fun combat: Aoc).

- lacking world polish. Aion has footprints on relevant surfaces (only game that was able to achieve this was Wow), many different kinds of birds in the skies (only game that achieved to do this is Aoc, but it only has 1 kind of birds), many different kinds of butterflies, etc... And yes all this is HUGE considering how people have been asking for this kind of polish and world engine features in other games' forums for years, they all failed to bring us this level of world immersion (lotro and aoc did quite well, aion does better).

- etc...

Aion takes the best from all of the other games and improves it. I agree with the OP, Aion, while not groundbreaking, is several points above most of the other mmos.

Aion is the best of what we have today (... lotro probably does better with story telling though, aion is not really a story based mmo, its a pvpve game). That said, if you dont like the art direction or the world, thats another subjective issue.

Hahahaha, no.

And koreans are still far behind? Lineage 2 and GW have always been on the level of what we do here.

...What do you consider "on the level of what we have here"(In regards to L2, GW isn't an MMORPG)? The prohibitely long grind, the unfriendly penalties, the stiff and unintuitive combat, or the botting epidemic that continues in spite of highly ineffectual and boreline harmful anti cheating software "Game Guard".

The phrase "Asian Grinder" came from somewhere, and I garantee you that it wasn't a phrase coined because of how wonderfully designed these games are.

As for Aion, tell me what other game has a 3rd AI controlled race, the Balaur. They will come on their own to attack your faction and your fortresses (Aoc promised to do this, but still fails to deliver after 1 year). They will also help balance the pvp as they will sometimes come to help defend your fortress against the enemy and sometimes they will help the enemy crush you. All of the other faction games like WAR have always been missing such a feature. Look at the rvr balancing problems WAR has.

The Baluar is a single good idea. That's true enough. How well it works remains to be seen, however I don't remember AoC ever promsing something like this... Oh well, it's irrelevant, and AoC is widely regarded as a failed effort, just like Warhammer. The say that all western MMOs can be defined by these two failure titles is short sighted to say the least.

- slow and boring combat (only 1 western game has fast paced and fun combat: Aoc).

WoW does not have Slow and boring combat, WoW has fairly fast paced combat. Whether or not you enjoy it is up to you. Oh, Warhammer had fast combat too... It's awful combat, but it's fast! Oh let's see... What else... DDO online has fast combat, infact it has real time action combat. There's more and more out there, but I think you get the picture.

- lacking world polish. Aion has footprints on relevant surfaces (only game that was able to achieve this was Wow), many different kinds of birds in the skies (only game that achieved to do this is Aoc, but it only has 1 kind of birds), many different kinds of butterflies, etc... And yes all this is HUGE considering how people have been asking for this kind of polish and world engine features in other games' forums for years, they all failed to bring us this level of world immersion (lotro and aoc did quite well, aion does better).

If this were the WoW forums, insert a giant macro image of the picard face palm here.

Nobody denies how nice the game looks, but looks are just that. Looks.

FOOTPRINTs, and good draw distance are not a subsitute for coherent lore, variety, and depth.

Aion takes the best from all of the other games and improves it. I agree with the OP, Aion, while not groundbreaking, is several points above the other mmos.

WoW took what's best from all other MMOs and improved on it. Aion just melded Lineage 2 with WoW and got this.

Aion is the best of what we have today (... lotro probably does better with story telling though, aion is not really a story based mmo, its a pvpve game). That said, if you dont like the art direction or the world, thats another subjective issue.

It's the best... Why? Because you said so? A subjective issue? You're either a fan of Irony, or you don't know what the world subjective means. Here's some facts for you.

EVERY single quest has been Kill, Fedex, or collection quests. Aion's 1-10 can easily be compared to WoW's 1-20 in time spent.

Aion 1-10 you're stuck running random, sometimes absurd errands for a random group of compeltely unlikeable and faceless NPCs.

In WoW 1-20 you're running some of the same errands, but with some variety. Whether you're burning something down, escorting an NPC, or finding a small group to fight an elite. Not highly innovative but it's fast and it learns to mix things up.

Aion 1-10 the newbie quest line culiminates with a quest that has you go to three NPCs... That's it. Ok, perhaps that's an unfair comparison. The last action oriented quest in the newbie area has you CLICK ON THREE PILLARs. No boss fight, no dungeon, you click on three pillars and you're done. Maybe you fight a few bird people inbetween. Wow.

WoW 1-20, the newbie area finishes off with you raiding a bandit gang's lair. You face off against a variety of strange bosses until you finally meet with Van Cleef, who's surprisingly aboard a pirate ship.

Gee, which of these games is the "next step" again? The one that feels the need to hide it's "real game" behind an giant block of grind, or the one that entertains you throughout? Which of these games has a number of classes, each with a unique mechanic? Oh well it must be Aion since you said it was the next step... OH WAIT, that's WoW.

I don't even play WoW anymore, but to say that this game is even a half a step above WoW is ridiculous. This is a side step, AT BEST. A game that forgot the lessons learned by all of the other titles released, and chose to only advance from the tired Lineage 2 design model.

Saying this follows closely in L2's footsteps just means you haven't played L2 nearly enough.  Combat dynamics, quest (and especially the rewards) are nothing alike, and your own side isn't about to run around and stab you in the back.
Also, has WoW really been sped up to the point that 1-20 is only five hours?  I know it was fast and easy leveling, but that's a little much.

---

Originally posted by LogothX

Aion 1-10 the newbie quest line culiminates with a quest that has you go to three NPCs... That's it. Ok, perhaps that's an unfair comparison. The last action oriented quest in the newbie area has you CLICK ON THREE PILLARs. No boss fight, no dungeon, you click on three pillars and you're done. Maybe you fight a few bird people inbetween. Wow.

---

For this, you're suffering from the preview weekend.  Just clicking on the three pillars is really easy when there's more players than mobs in that cave, but its a lot different if you try it on any of the older servers and have to go in alone.  There is a boss in there too, although he's not significantly tougher than the other mobs.  If you're playing a mage, the cave is not a cakewalk and you'd be glad to get an extra in for back up.

Its not that hard though since it has to be soloable.  Its a tutorial section cut off from the real game world; after launch its going to be hard to find anyone there to party with.  After all, the only people that will be there are you and anyone else that just happened to create an account in the last five hours.

Saying this follows closely in L2's footsteps just means you haven't played L2 nearly enough. Combat dynamics, quest (and especially the rewards) are nothing alike, and your own side isn't about to run around and stab you in the back.

Irrelevant details. The game looks similar, it also feels similar. As difficult as it is to believe I don't play games I dont like extensively, but I was compelled to give Aion a chance because of all the mindless yammering that goes on in these forums.

Also, has WoW really been sped up to the point that 1-20 is only five hours? I know it was fast and easy leveling, but that's a little much.

Wow leveling has been sped up, even back in the day it also didn't take too long to get from 1-20.

For this, you're suffering from the preview weekend. Just clicking on the three pillars is really easy when there's more players than mobs in that cave, but its a lot different if you try it on any of the older servers and have to go in alone. There is a boss in there too, although he's not significantly tougher than the other mobs. If you're playing a mage, the cave is not a cakewalk and you'd be glad to get an extra in for back up.

Well ok, perhaps the quest is slightly more difficult than I had experience. The point still stands that for the end of a giant chain, it's anti climactic and boring. Fighting an elite that you might not even need another person for?

Its not that hard though since it has to be soloable. Its a tutorial section cut off from the real game world; after launch its going to be hard to find anyone there to party with. After all, the only people that will be there are you and anyone else that just happened to create an account in the last five hours.

A tutorial does not need to last 5 hours. A tutorial is a small part of the game that tells you the basics. During my time trudging through levels 1-10, I saw maybe one or two quests that actually informed me of the games mechanics. I'm afraid I don't understand how this qualifies as a tutorial.

Looking at my future mission logs, I can see nothing but "Rebels - kill them. Go - collect this and Talk to him". The game starts at 10? I'm seeing a lot of the same garbage I saw on the newbie island only this time time; I have a bigger weapon and few fun abilities... and wings.

Originally posted by BigMango

Originally posted by Ramonski7

When talking about MMOs KOREANS are still far behind what we do here. I prefer Auction Houses instead of Player cluttering stalls for selling. I prefer WASD over point clicking. I prefer worn-down looking armor over mirror shiny stuff. I prefer grittier looking mobs to kill rather than cutesy ones.

 Lineage 2 and GW have always been on the level of what we do here.

Do where ? NcSoft headquaters  ?

As for Aion, tell me what other game has a 3rd AI controlled race ,,,,,,

Tabula Rasa "did" but since Rg refused to contribute his ideas of  into Aion they fired him and stuck the idea in Aion anyway

- slow and boring combat (only 1 western game has fast paced and fun combat: Aoc).

- lacking world polish. Aion has footprints on relevant surfaces (only game that was able to achieve this was Wow), many different kinds of birds in the skies (only game that achieved to do this is Aoc, but it only has 1 kind of birds), many different kinds of butterflies, etc... And yes all this is HUGE considering how people have been asking for this kind of polish and world engine features in other games' forums for years, they all failed to bring us this level of world immersion (lotro and aoc did quite well, aion does better).

Vanugard has bird, Pegesus and ect in the Sky

LotRO has flocks of Craban searching for froto and the fellowshop. LoTRO Deer, Squirrels , Fish, rabbits, foxes frogs ect ...

Foot prints in the samd, really ? woah, let us grab the most innovative waste of memory award, BTW footsteps in sand and snow where done by Dark and Light, and we saw how well that game did..

 

- etc...

Aion takes the best from all of the other games and improves it. I agree with the OP, Aion, while not groundbreaking, is several points above most of the other mmos.

Aion takes the best of all mmos that NcSoft owns and liquidfied into sonmething that resemble nothing a mmo player would remotely consider interesting.

Aion is the best of what we have today (... lotro probably does better with story telling though, aion is not really a story based mmo, its a pvpve game). That said, if you dont like the art direction or the world, thats another subjective issue.

You stop with the fake LotrO pandering now, Aion is what is it, a Korean grinder game, that for lack on content, made pvp the focus.  Anyone who is going to try and spin the game into this big wonderous new thing that does nothing different but everyon should play anyway, really doesn't have a strong case here at mmorpg.com, the home of true mmo players. People wil call it as it is here, if you can't take the heat of people seeing straight through the hype and "mmo fever" then maybe you need to try and hype vNboards.

 

 

---

Originally posted by LogothX

 

And koreans are still far behind? Lineage 2 and GW have always been on the level of what we do here.

 
...What do you consider "on the level of what we have here"(In regards to L2, GW isn't an MMORPG)? The prohibitely long grind, the unfriendly penalties, the stiff and unintuitive combat, or the botting epidemic that continues in spite of highly ineffectual and boreline harmful anti cheating software "Game Guard".
The phrase "Asian Grinder" came from somewhere, and I garantee you that it wasn't a phrase coined because of how wonderfully designed these games are.
 

---

Sorry, but you are missing the point.

You are talking about subjective opinions. Some people prefer wow, and some others prefer the L2 type of gameplay. Some people prefer to grind quests, some people hate quests.

Furthermore, both games are completely different. Wow is a pve game and it sucks at pvp, L2 is a pvp game.

Agreed on the bots though. But still, this is not much of a point again as:

1. RMT is in every game. When Aoc came out whole guilds purchased gold to build cities, equip their members with horses and everything. Same goes for WAR, wow, etc...

2. Why do you care about the bots so much? Do you play for the bots or for yourself? Just ignore them and play with your friends, the world is big enough.
 

---

Originally posted by LogothX
- slow and boring combat (only 1 western game has fast paced and fun combat: Aoc).

 

WoW does not have Slow and boring combat, WoW has fairly fast paced combat. Whether or not you enjoy it is up to you. Oh, Warhammer had fast combat too... It's awful combat, but it's fast! Oh let's see... What else... DDO online has fast combat, infact it has real time action combat. There's more and more out there, but I think you get the picture.

---

Agreed, I forgot about DDO and its neat combat.

Still the point stands, most western mmos fail to make combat fun.
 

---

Originally posted by LogothX
- lacking world polish. Aion has footprints on relevant surfaces (only game that was able to achieve this was Wow), many different kinds of birds in the skies (only game that achieved to do this is Aoc, but it only has 1 kind of birds), many different kinds of butterflies, etc... And yes all this is HUGE considering how people have been asking for this kind of polish and world engine features in other games' forums for years, they all failed to bring us this level of world immersion (lotro and aoc did quite well, aion does better).

 

If this were the WoW forums, insert a giant macro image of the picard face palm here.
 
Nobody denies how nice the game looks, but looks are just that. Looks.
FOOTPRINTs, and good draw distance are not a subsitute for coherent lore, variety, and depth.

---

Sure, wow had a great world. But today its an old engine. However, this further points out how much most of the western games that came out after wow failed in this area.

As for coherent lore, variety, depth. Aion has all of this.

---

Originally posted by LogothX
Aion takes the best from all of the other games and improves it. I agree with the OP, Aion, while not groundbreaking, is several points above the other mmos.

 

WoW took what's best from all other MMOs and improved on it. Aion just melded Lineage 2 with WoW and got this.
 

Aion is the best of what we have today (... lotro probably does better with story telling though, aion is not really a story based mmo, its a pvpve game). That said, if you dont like the art direction or the world, thats another subjective issue.

 
It's the best... Why? Because you said so? A subjective issue? You're either a fan of Irony, or you don't know what the world subjective means. Here's some facts for you.
 
EVERY single quest has been Kill, Fedex, or collection quests. Aion's 1-10 can easily be compared to WoW's 1-20 in time spent.
 
Aion 1-10 you're stuck running random, sometimes absurd errands for a random group of compeltely unlikeable and faceless NPCs.
In WoW 1-20 you're running some of the same errands, but with some variety. Whether you're burning something down, escorting an NPC, or finding a small group to fight an elite. Not highly innovative but it's fast and it learns to mix things up.
Aion 1-10 the newbie quest line culiminates with a quest that has you go to three NPCs... That's it. Ok, perhaps that's an unfair comparison. The last action oriented quest in the newbie area has you CLICK ON THREE PILLARs. No boss fight, no dungeon, you click on three pillars and you're done. Maybe you fight a few bird people inbetween. Wow.
WoW 1-20, the newbie area finishes off with you raiding a bandit gang's lair. You face off against a variety of strange bosses until you finally meet with Van Cleef, who's surprisingly aboard a pirate ship.
 
Gee, which of these games is the "next step" again? The one that feels the need to hide it's "real game" behind an giant block of grind, or the one that entertains you throughout? Which of these games has a number of classes, each with a unique mechanic? Oh well it must be Aion since you said it was the next step... OH WAIT, that's WoW.
I don't even play WoW anymore, but to say that this game is even a half a step above WoW is ridiculous. This is a side step, AT BEST. A game that forgot the lessons learned by all of the other titles released, and chose to only advance from the tired Lineage 2 design model.

---

1. Where did I say its the next step? I said, while not groundbreaking, it's several points above -> it takes the best of all and puts it together (minus the deep lotro story telling, but this is not the point of this game).

2. You are talking about the starter areas, level 1-20. You are judging a game you have barely played for what? 2 days?. Play the game, and then come back and we can talk.

And again, you seem to be looking for a pure pve game. So I suggest you go play wow or DDO, or if you are looking for some deep story telling, head over to lotro.

But if you are looking for RvR and pvpve (and also a little of everything), Aion is where it stands (unless you don't like the art direction, but as I said this is subjective again).

---

Originally posted by solareus
Vanugard has bird, Pegesus and ect in the Sky

---

Vanguad has mobs. That's it. Outside of the mobs its a lifeless world with dead cities. Aion has world life with many different kinds of birds, butterflies, many different kinds of fish in the water, etc...etc...

---

Originally posted by solareus
LotRO has flocks of Craban searching for froto and the fellowshop. LoTRO Deer, Squirrels , Fish, rabbits, foxes frogs ect ...

---

I said lotro did quite well, didn't you read?

---

Originally posted by solareus
You stop with the fake LotrO pandering now, Aion is what is it, a Korean grinder game, that for lack on content, made pvp the focus.  Anyone who is going to try and spin the game into this big wonderous new thing that does nothing different but everyon should play anyway, really doesn't have a strong case here at mmorpg.com, the home of true mmo players. People wil call it as it is here, if you can't take the heat of people seeing straight through the hype and "mmo fever" then maybe you need to try and hype vNboards.

---

1. Fake lotro pandering? I said lotro did great in its department. Man, you can stop trolling what I said right now, will you?

2. Korean grind.. lack of content? Lol. In all of the threads you have posted you have already proved time and again that you have barely played the game, but of course you know it all, kudos to you

3. Hype? FYI the western world has 1 game: WOW and its 11M players. All of the other western games with their 10k to 300k players are irrelevant. LOL, even the western players don't play them. So, your opinion about games nobody plays doesn't have much weight in this world.

Aion so far has 3.5+M players in 2 countries, and growing. Japan is in beta as much as we are.

Sorry, but you are missing the point.

You are talking about subjective opinions. Some people prefer wow, and some others prefer the L2 type of gameplay. Some people prefer to grind quests, some people hate quests.

Believe it or not, I'm using all of my restraint to resist calling you people stupid. Having a set of quests with a cohesive design and goal is not subjective. This is fact, It is fact that the quests in aion lack any type of focus and variety. FACT, FACT AS IN THIS IS ACTUALLY TRUE, AND NOT OPINION. Whether or not you like it is up to you; but to suggest the game is a step ahead, or whatever phrase you guys used is just nonsense.

1. RMT is in every game. When Aoc came out whole guilds purchased gold to build cities, equip their members with horses and everything. Same goes for WAR, wow, etc...

So... what? This applies for all MMORPGs. You dont see a horde of bots and cheaters in every MMO. That's something restricted to crappy games that use game guard.

2. Why do you care about the bots so much? Do you play for the bots or for yourself? Just ignore them and play with your friends, the world is big enough.

It's difficult to ignore bots in such large numbers. Not only that, but it effects other areas of the game. You know, trivial things like the game economy and all that. But hey, who cares; right?

Still the point stands, most western mmos fail to make combat fun.

WoW's mechanics are more intricate and varied and the game is YEARS older than Aion. Let's take this slow, okay? Let's just IGNORE opinion for a second and take a look at the facts.

Most every class in WoW has their own energy mechanic.

Every class in Aion uses the same.

Every class in WoW has a different gimmick to them. Whether it's rage, combo points, pets, transforms, etc.

Every class in Aion uses COMBOS or spells. That's it. The only difference between a Assassin and a Gladiator are the abilities they have and their armor class. This was cute back in the EQ days, but things change over time. It's called standards.

Furthermore, Aion's combat is NEARLY IDENTICAL to wow's, with Aions being slightly more stiff, so explain to me...

HOW IS THIS GAME's COMBAT better than WOW's, or any other of the cookie cutter WoW copies that have been released?

You're going on about the game's supiority when it is fact that the game's base combat is nearly identical to WoW's, only with shallower classes and stiffer casting. Do you NOT like having control of your character?

Sure, wow had a great world. But today its an old engine. However, this further points out how much most of the western games that came out after wow failed in this area.

...Ugh, seriously. For every single bad western MMO we have (there are plenty!) there are about a dozen released in asia that are far worse. Don't use the east vs. west angle in this. Just don't. It really, really REALLY does not favor you.

As for coherent lore, variety, depth. Aion has all of this.

After playing for 5 hours, I didn't see it. All I know is that somehow, EVERYONE in the game has the exact same amnesia backstory, and that EVERYONE in the game faught a Dragon Ball Z style flying battle with their rival faction's icon. But yeah, that's coherent. I hate to steal words from other people, but MMORPGs are supposed to be about solidarity, team work, being a part of something bigger than yourself. WE ALL can't be the "CHOSEN ONE", but the game's lore would have us think otherwise.

1. Where did I say its the next step? I said it's several points above -> it takes the best of all and puts it together (minus the deep lotro story telling, but this is not the point of this game).

Except for the fact that it DOESNT take the best of everything else. It doesn't have the varied classes of WoW, it doesnt have AoC's combat, it doesn't have immersion, it doesn't have the instant cheap thrill of WAR, what the hell does it have? A bunch of borrowed ideas from Lineage 2 and WoW's movement system.

2. You are talking about the starter areas, level 1-20. You are judging a game you have barely played for what? 2 days?. Play the game, and then come back and we can talk.

After playing 4-5 hours, I'm not allowed to judge the game? At what point am I allowed to say I not like it? Seriously people, THINK.

And again, you seem to be looking for a pure pve game. So I suggest you go play wow, or if you are looking for some deep story telling, head over to lotro.

I'm looking for a PVP game but all I've found was lineage III (Or Lineage ]I[ ! lawl).A game so insecure about itself that it has to hide the "real game" behind a giant block of grind. Wait, let me guess. This is another "great" feature taken from other MMOs and refined.

But if you are looking for RvR and pvpve (and also a little of everything), Aion is where it stands (unless you don't like the art direction, but as I said this is subjective again).

Aion doesnt have interesting classes, it doesnt have good lore, and lastly it doesnt have good questing. So all that's left would be the game's end game PVP, which looks similar to WARHAMMER's pvp... and we all know how well that turned out. Hoh boy, I just love killing doors.

 Dude, dont fight against solareus, dont lose your time, this dude has been trolling Aion for a while, but he will find a way to tell you is not trollings is just his opinion, for some reason he developped a great hate towards the game dont ask me why tho.

---

Originally posted by LogothX
Believe it or not, I'm using all of my restraint to resist calling you people stupid. Having a set of quests with a cohesive design and goal is not subjective. This is fact, It is fact that the quests in aion lack any type of focus and variety. FACT, FACT AS IN THIS IS ACTUALLY TRUE, AND NOT OPINION. Whether or not you like it is up to you

---

Yes, Aion has this. But you only played 4-5 hours, as you say, and you know better.

If you look at Aion's quest tab, you will see that there are 2 kinds of quests.

Aion has quests with a "cohesive design and goal", to use your words. They are called "Campaign quests". These are the quests that your story and your character is built on.

And then it also has "Standard quests", these are the normal "local" quests.

But I agree, the quests are pretty standard pve quests. Nothing different that what we have in the old games.

---

Originally posted by LogothX
Let's take this slow, okay? Let's just IGNORE opinion for a second and take a look at the facts.
Most every class in WoW has their own energy mechanic.
Every class in Aion uses the same.

---

As I said, Aion takes the best from the other games and puts it together.

---

Originally posted by LogothX
Every class in WoW has a different gimmick to them. Whether it's rage, combo points, pets, transforms, etc.

---

- Pets are coming, haven't you see the tamed pets next to the NPCs in every city?

- There are transforms in Aion. You can even already transform into different kinds of animals (depending on the classes) by purchasing transform items from the npcs.

See, you have only played 4-5 hours and even within this time frame you haven't seen what was there.

---

Originally posted by LogothX
Every class in Aion uses COMBOS or spells. That's it. The only difference between a Assassin and a Gladiator are the abilities they have and their armor class. This was cute back in the EQ days, but things change over time. It's called standards.

 

Furthermore, Aion's combat is NEARLY IDENTICAL to wow's, with Aions being slightly more stiff, so explain to me...
HOW IS THIS GAME's COMBAT better than WOW's, or any other of the cookie cutter WoW copies that have been released?

---

 
No, again you have only played 4-5 hours and you are comparing the game with a game you have played at high level for years. >Pointless<

I.ex: Aion has the Stigma system. You have 5 stigmas (and with patch 1.3 there are 8 + 2 new stigmas for each class, etc...) which allows you to take special attributes form your class + attributes from other classes -> this is also one of the unique features of Aion.

The result of the stigmas (and also the gear & crafting system) is that at the higher levels it will be difficult, if not almost impossible to have 2 same characters.

Anyway, you have played 4-5 hours. There's not much point in going on with this discussion, especially if you don't even take the time to read and inform yourself about the game.

And regarding what I am calling fast, furious and fun combat (as opposed to what we have in 90% of the western mmos), here is a video to illustrate what I am talking about : http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D9BID71fqYQ&fmt=18

(and this is only with the current level 50 limit. How will it be when the game reaches level 70-80 )

Cheers.

I've played UO ( 3 years), Lineage2 (3 years), WoW, Lotro, AoC and Darkfall.I know that the first 10 levels of gameplay shouldnt be considered as the way to judge the endgame of a MMO.My Lotro subscription is a lifetime one but I hardly ever touch it as it bores me too quickly these days.

After I hit about level 7 in Aion I realised that it felt a lot like Lotro and I had the nasty realisation that it may well collect dust the way Lotro does. I found the levels 7-9 boring and I couldn't wait to finish them just to see what happened with becoming daeva.

So at 2am last night I got to Daeva and logged off with concerns.

I logged on this morning for 10 mins tops (busy with RL things but wanted to show someone what level 10 looks like) and I had received a duel challenge before the screen had loaded. Fought the duel and lost (the other guys toon hadn't loaded for half the fight lol) but I started getting more interested again.

To be fair, I havn't seen guilds yet as I just wanted to solo 1-10, but I'm not feeling the same motivation to level another class to 10 today that I felt to do the first one yesterday.

Levelled a mage first btw.

Unfortunately this isn't UO breadth yet (and neither is anything else).

I'm looking forward to taking a toon to 20 next week to see if my impression changes and may try levelling another class to 10, maybe.

My daughter loves the game though. 

Nice job of making a fool of yourself. Now we at least know what kind of person you are

Anyway, as I said, you play a game for 4-5 hours and then you bash away. Go play the game, and then come back if you want to talk. And if you don't like it, just go play whatever game you like, there are enough games.

 

First impressions matter. You're the fool for not realizing this. You still failed to answer my question : at what point are we allowed by you and your illustrious kind to have valid hatreds on something? 30 hours? 40? Oh, and you also ignored everything else, like how something nearly identical to the other is somehow "better".

I will go play what I like, I'll go play actual games. Have fun with your second job, and see you once you make your predictable transformation from "hopeful fan" into "disgruntled customer".

---

Originally posted by LogothX
First impressions matter.

---

Yes I agree, they do matter.

I think lotro is the only mmo that really has a real story that takes you from the start.

Aion's story is that you lost your memory, so you don't know what happens and where you are. And you regain your memory bits by bids as you progress in the game.

This made more than enough sense to me. It doesn't for you? Good. I like tomatoes, maybe you don't, no problem.

---

Originally posted by LogothX
You still failed to answer my question : at what point are we allowed by you and your illustrious kind to have valid hatreds on something? 30 hours? 40?

---

No problem if you don't like it. We all have different tastes. 11M players like Wow, I didn't like Wow, but loved Lineage 2, some of Aoc and Lotro and now I am enjoying my time in Aion.

---

Originally posted by LogothX
Oh, and you also ignored everything else, like how something nearly identical to the other is somehow "better".

---

Just as I told you above.

What makes it better is that it takes the best from all of the games (missing some of the deep lotro like story as I said), puts it all together and improves upon it as a whole with a rarely seen level of polish.

Nothing really groundbreaking but what is new is to have all of this together with this level of world life + pvpve with this kind of 3rd party AI living in the world next to us + stigma system giving access to cross class attributes.

All in all it feels like an all fresh and nice upgrade to me.

But you don't like the kind of tomatoes I like. No problem.

Cheers