Originally posted by AllNewMMOSuk

Originally posted by Mathrym

I agree with OP. I really dislike seeing people flame a game that isn't out yet without giving it a chance. And not only that, they are flaming Bioware who has virtually flawless history of games.

A good storyline is essential to a RPG, may it be single player or MMO. So what that it is possible to solo the whole game, it's also possible to do it with groups. And they did say that the game will incorporate most elements of current MMORPGs(I'm thinking of PvP, achievements and hopefully RvR). I'm not the biggest Star Wars fan, but I can see that this game has lots of potential to be very successful and will most likely give it a try once it gets out.

 

I see the opposite of that. I hate people who fall in love with a game that no real details have been released on, and then they turn around and call the game (which has no details out on it, let alone even beta tested or played it) innovative and will change MMOs. You see these same people pop up everytime before a game is released, getting pissed and attacking everyone who has the sense to realize nothing will be innovative or different.

 

But then again everytime a game is released those people mysteriously disappear and don't post anymore because they now realize the game isn't innovative, and often times isn't even good. So they don't want to be around when everyone is pointing out how they got their panties all bunched up when other people tried to explain it all before hand.

 

The fanboys are the ones who do more flaming then anyone else on the boards, bring on the next flame at me for pointing this out now.

Have you read any of the contradictions you made? lol

Mathrym: I really dislike seeing people flame a game that isn't out yet without giving it a chance.

AllNewMMOSuk: I hate people who fall in love with a game that no real details have been released on.

Your whole entire argument pretty much fell apart when you said Fanboy. It showed that you'll always look for something to hate, no matter what it could be, when when there is so little information.
Which fits pretty much into what the OP said, You're a very naive individual.

Your name also points to why you said Fanboy, Irony!

well whenever ppl  start  (no matter on what topic here) using phrases like Fanboi; hater ;carebear or become all of a sudden gramma nazis ect. to defend/underline their arguments, they reached imo the point where they're incapable to have a discussion in a civil manner .Some Ppl only want a  Bash/Flame Festival.

That said i think this site is the best MMO on the market right now isnt it ? :)

YAWN!.. the game will never be good enough for some, others its spot on blah blah.  It will come out with something not finished people will still pay some will bitch others with say best MMO EVER! Just like AION.. people crying its crap, others say its going to steal millions from WOW LMAO.. ok. others call it a wow clone..

Just play it when it comes out.. if you like it PAY if not cancel.

I only have 2 fears with sw:tor, being them:

1- be overly instanced. I despise overly instanced games like AOC, Yet since  Blizzard introduced the "phasing" concept, might be possible for Bioware to use the same idea, and in the process, allowing players to have some sense of impact on the gameoworld. Yet only time will tell.

2-EA pulling a "micro transiction business model"  on the players. Can cope with it, but If i couold chose, would go against.

On the rest naysayers and supporters can be wrong or right. We have to wait and see.

Originally posted by Praxus1874

 And now this becomes a speculation war on both sides, like every other thread.  I really wish that Bioware would release something new on this game so that we could put some of these discussions to rest, or at least have something better to discuss while we wait for the game to come out.

Prax  

QFT

Originally posted by andmiller

The bottom line is you guys don't want something new, you just want a variation of whatever game you liked in MMO history.

For me something new if fine or a good variation of an old favorite, story or no story as long as it's diverse with options, not something simple and generic and limited to me vs PVE/AI most the time.

And as far as SWTOR which is what it looks like your real focus is then I love the SW story line, esp pre Vader-R2D2. So in that regards it's still to early to tell but it is starting to look like it may just be a game like the other Bioware games and wont hold an interest for longer than 6 months-year. I am neither angry or cranky about the current options but I do have an opinion that reflects being disappointed at the last few years of MMO productions.

The bottom line is, will the next game captivate for any length of time vs the time I invest into building a game class/career. Or after I reach max lvl and experience the end game will it bore me to no end and feel like my time was wasted for a limited experience

please bring back pre-cu SWG!!!! Please!!! I need it!!! I have to have it!!!! Please bring it back!!! I cant continue on with my life without it!!!! Please!!! For the love of Christ please!!!!

This is a semi response to the OP and to one person who said WoW and FFXI were both based on a central story.

Eh.  You really can't compare WoW's storyline to FFXI's.  Yes WoW has a storyline, but it comes in disjointed bits and chunks and it isn't really comparable to the storylines in FFXI.  Don't get me wrong, WoW has some nice quest sequences and the cut scenes they do have (I've only seen the one in northrend) was awesome.

Here is an explation that probably isn't going to do justice to FFXI, but I'll try to summarize it:

Take a generic asian grinder MMO.  Now add a FF-like single player story line with a multitude of boss and dungeon encounters where you need a group to complete.   You slowly progress through the story line and complete more sections as you level up higher.  During each section there are a variety of engaging characters that explain the past of Vanadiel along with gripping cutscenes.

For some expansion storylines, the more you complete the more areas are unlocked to you for you to explore.  Add all of this with one of the best communities I've ever seen, and you have FFXI. :)

If TOR pulls off a great storyline they will have me hooked to the game. :)

I see a lot of people talking about assumptions on bothe sides here.  Why not take what information we have been given about the game at face value, and quit speculating on how much it will suck/not-suck.  The hands on from E3 showed nothing about a story line that had to be followed, it seemed to be nothing more than a simple quest that much more involved than the quest lines we are used to seeing.  That, VO for characters, and a dedicated class quest story is all we really know.

Innovation is a very poor word to use when talking about MMO;

innovation  Show Spelled Pronunciation [in-uh-vey-shuhn] Show IPA
–noun 1. something new or different introduced: numerous innovations in the high-school curriculum.
           2. the act of innovating; introduction of new things or methods.

                                  -Dictionary.com

Very few MMO's do this, if any.  Refining or improving already existing mechanics is obviously not the same thing.  Wait and see, is probably he best approach to have until new information is released.

-Edit: stupidity

Originally posted by Praxus1874

 And now this becomes a speculation war on both sides, like every other thread.  I really wish that Bioware would release something new on this game so that we could put some of these discussions to rest, or at least have something better to discuss while we wait for the game to come out.

Prax  

I don't see that happening anytime soon.. Bioware is running the hype engines at 110%.. The more hype, the more guessing, the more people are hooked and willing to BUY the game as release..  It's a marketing strategy plain and simple..  Bioware has no intention to damage their lil 8.5 hype rating with accurate game footage and facts before the game goes live.. Which as far as we're all concern won't be until 2010 IF we're lucky..  What pisses me off.. I hate when people, mags or conventions like E3 nominate games for "game of the year" when they have no intention of being released that year.. and further on that is that no games should ever be nominated or publisized without providing public details..

When was the last time "(anything) of the year" was ever awarded BEFORE it's proven?   Quarterback of the year?  Albumn of the Year?  Driver of the year? Movie of the year?  etc etc.. the list just keeps on going.. However in the cyber gaming world all normal rules are tossed out the door.. LETS wait and demand more intel and wait till games actually go LIVE before giving them any awards..

Originally posted by andmiller

This is more of a response to a buch of threads I have been following rather than a completely new topic.

I think it is rather amusing that the bulk of us have been clamoring for something new and innovative for the last few years.  I could link a hundred threads where posters bemoan the current MMO's and how there is nothing innovative in them.  We finally have a developer trying something new, a story driven MMO.  An MMO where you actually care about what is happening to your character in terms of the back-story of the game, where your progression is not simply based on what level your character is or what level you have macro'd your sword skill to.

And then with this announcement I see people crying foul!  The people crying foul don't want something new, they want the same old thing, or a slightly varied version of the particular game they like.  I would like to address some of the more irritating recent posts.

There is an onslaught of "who cares about story?" and "WoW already focused on story!".  If you don't care about stories in games then fair enough, obviously a game focused on telling a story is not for you.  I get that.  You probably don't like Bioware in general then.  But to say who cares about story.....?  Lot's of people.  All you need to look at is Bioware's sales #'s to see that.  And to the group saying WoW already did story....?  Really?  You are comparing a game with a few lines of text for the quests, which has a feature to "turn quest dialogue off" to a game created in the Bioware style with full voice acting and independent quests for each class and saying it has already been done?

There is another group of posts saying this is a single player game, not an MMO.  I guess I don't follow this at all.  Because it has the capability to solo through the game, it is not an MMO?  Does WoW not have the same option?  Do several of the more popular current MMO's not have this option?  Is an MMO not defined as a bunch of people playing in a persistent gaming world?  Any other definition is just some elitist nonsense IMO. 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MMORPG

And then my personal favorite group of postings centers on whether Bioware's track record indicates anything about their success in an MMO.  Is it not logical to assume that a developer that has released almost entirely AAA titles would be able to release a good MMO?  Of course it doesn't guarantee it, but in the real world you have to make educated guesses.  If you only have $100 to your name, and you have to bet on whether the game will be a success or not, would you really bet that it would not based on their track record?  And I think we've seen recently that "experience" in MMO development is hardly an indicator of future success.  Most company's "follow-up" MMOs have been considered weaker than their first game (EQ2, WAR, AOC, etc).

The bottom line is you guys don't want something new, you just want a variation of whatever game you liked in MMO history.

I AM one of those that wants something thats actually new. I play EQ2. Thats all I play I've tried other games, but they've all become WoW with different graphics.Honestly, I'm tired of it. I'm even tired of EQ2 since I've been playing it for so many years but its still a good game.

I don't  understand most of the threads I see here. Its just people bashing anything "new" about the game. I've never seen anything like it on any other game, though.

I'm quite sick of all of this.