Originally posted by todeswulf

A lot of it is from the deeply troubled SWG vet community. LA and SOE broke there wookiee and they want revenge..problem is all they are getting is a reputation for being nutjobs.

Getting a reputation? More like well established reputation for being nutjobs.

scarred SWG vet here, and i for one am really looking forward to this game.  I just hope that the company learns from the mistake that was the NGE and stays far away from anything that is like it during developement.

Originally posted by dhayes68

So they should just close this forum? No reason to discuss it til it releases? Don't be silly. Let me lay it out how it works.

Dev/Pub releases bits of information over time, people interested for one reason or another discuss those tidbits. If the tidbits released lead people to think the game will be good or bad, this is the place to discuss it.

Whats your problem?

You honestly think bashing everything we know about the game is "discussing it"? Seriously? Discussing it is one thing (which most posts on here AREN'T doing), bashing it at every turn is another. And pretty much every single thread begun on here does nothing but bash everything we know about it.

My problem is that this is childish and it never happens with any other game. People on other game threads post about how they hope the game will have certain features, and will go in certain directions, they don't post about how this game is a massive fail already and how much its going to totally suck because they've been burned by SWG (which was a totally different company).

Personally, I loath WoW. Its gaming light. And the players are annoying. The very last thing I want is for this game to become WoW. Or almost as bad... Guild Wars. And yet, I don't post on here about that. I just say that I hope it has certain features or doesn't have certain features.

I've never seen more negative people than I have on this game forum.

THAT is why I say enough already. Because it is enough. We've all heard how you bloody people hate the game, even though you don't know anything about.

How about this, if you don't like it, and aren't willing to actually help with fixing what you don't like (in which case you should go post on the official game forums on their web site, not on here) ,  then don't post. Do you go to the mall and stand right in the middle of it yelling about how much you hate one of the stores because they refused to give your money back for an item you didn't want? Or do you go directly the store, and if they refuse, you suck it up and just tell your family and friends not to shop there? Same thing.

Enough already.

Seriously, does it really matter so much, many months if not years from release?

People are disenchanted with the MMORPG genre due to many overhyped, cool-sounding games that turned out to be..... well, not so great. And especially turned out to be an utterly different game than what was announced and hyped till the very last minute.

BioWare is acting with a lot of secrecy, self-consciousness and a little bit of arrogance, which is understandable when you look at their past, and the license they are working with. However, and I am neither for nor against this game at all yet, this is something we have all seen too often already.

Brad McQuaid, Gaute Godager, Paul Barnett/Mark Jacobs, several others more, all promised heaven and delivered... well, a stiff breeze of nice-smelling air at best.

Add to that the SWG-factor, and its not surprising that people will not AGAIN assume the best, when it seems to always come down to the worst in the end anyway.

Once more is known and once more features are decided upon, once we actually know what sort of gameplay experience they are aiming for in terms that are not PR speak, I would think people will change their tone.

I used to visit gaming forums in the 90s. Gamers used to be a mellow, easy-going, helpful and generally happy bunch back then. Not to mention positive and constructive. I don't know what happened in these 15 or so years (well, actually I kind of do: both gaming and the internet have gone mainstream), but the whole gaming scene seems to have grown into this giant ball of anxiety, conspiracy and inarticulation.

Really, what's the big deal, folks? Some people are designing a game, and when it's done we'll get to see what it is like. If you've done any sort of creative work, you'll appreciate that it's really not done till it's done. Be it business strategy, deliberation or just coyness, these people may choose to withold any kind of information they feel is not wise to disclose. Why do you see this kind of stuff as an obligation for them?  Slandering a creative group for not disclosing what you want them to, calling it "Darkness" and saying they deserved the drama-mongering that ensued?... Well, it's just absurd. 

That someone is making a game which they think is going to be in some way different and fun is a good thing. Whether we have rich info on it or not.... Why be so frustrated over it? If it turns out to not be your cup of tea, well, it happens. We can't expect everything to be tailored to every one of us, can we?

Originally posted by Nikopol

I used to visit gaming forums in the 90s. Gamers used to be a mellow, easy-going, helpful and generally happy bunch back then. Not to mention positive and constructive. I don't know what happened in these 15 or so years (well, actually I kind of do: both gaming and the internet have gone mainstream), but the whole gaming scene seems to have grown into this giant ball of anxiety, conspiracy and inarticulation.

 

Really, what's the big deal, folks? Some people are designing a game, and when it's done we'll get to see what it is like. If you've done any sort of creative work, you'll appreciate that it's really not done till it's done. Be it business strategy, deliberation or just coyness, these people may choose to withold any kind of information they feel is not wise to disclose. Why do you see this kind of stuff as an obligation for them?  Slandering a creative group for not disclosing what you want them to, calling it "Darkness" and saying they deserved the drama-mongering that ensued?... Well, it's just absurd. 

 

That someone is making a game which they think is going to be in some way different and fun is a good thing. Whether we have rich info on it or not.... Why be so frustrated over it? If it turns out to not be your cup of tea, well, it happens. We can't expect everything to be tailored to every one of us, can we?

 

But that's the whole point. games aren't made by what you describe as 'creative groups'.

Thy're created by large, extremely well-financed commercial organisations which, like EA and SOE, have a reputation for treating their customers like cattle.

I heartily disagree. In my experience, any sort of creative endeavour is ultimately realized by creative people, no matter what sort of heat you're getting from "above". Games are not created by businessmen, and movies are not created by businessmen. You always reserve the right to give them the good old finger and/or up and leave. Anywhere the creative people say "the suits are making the games", they are dodging responsibility.

And Bioware is a company that's been able to keep a distinct creative style up to now. Can we call such a company a corporation that treats its customer as cattle? They are not my favorite developers but they have their own way of doing things and they seem to be keeping true to it in this case. 

Originally posted by Nikopol

I heartily disagree. In my experience, any sort of creative endeavour is ultimately realized by creative people, no matter what sort of heat you're getting from "above". Games are not created by businessmen, and movies are not created by businessmen. You always reserve the right to give them the good old finger and/or up and leave. Anywhere the creative people say "the suits are making the games", they are dodging responsibility.

 

And Bioware is a company that's been able to keep a distinct creative style up to now. Can we call such a company a corporation that treats its customer as cattle? They are not my favorite developers but they have their own way of doing things and they seem to be keeping true to it in this case. 

Before you go any further down this path whihc may lead to potential embarrassment, I strongly recommend you google;

John Smedley

Brad McQuaid

Richard Garriott

Nany Macintyre

John Riccitiello

 Well, if we get rid of the negative posts, can we also get rid of the positive posts?

Originally posted by hubertgrove

Originally posted by Moirae

I mean, my god, log into this forum and all we see is how much everyone thinks this game is going to be terrible. Yet we know very little about the game.

 

Stop. Please. Just stop until we know more. We don't need a whole page of people with nothing but posts that the game will fail, that the game sucks (when you haven't even played it yet) and moaning about possible options when we don't even have a clue whether they will be added yet.

 

I've never seen anyone do this with any game but a Star Wars.

 

Enough already.

 

'Enough'?

We'll tell you when it's enough.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kHmvkRoEowc

 

If you ban Hubertgrove, half of those negitive and troll post will stop right away! 

Being on MMORPG.com for awhile I can tell you any sense of reason or peace is always thrown out the window by some trollish post. It's never going to stop. That's just how it is.

I'm not a star wars fan but was kinda interested in this untill it started to sound more like a single player game which I hate in MMOs. I'd prefer forced parties to get anywhere in an MMO but anyway, I'm less interested now but will still be paying attention to see what it ends up being like.

Originally posted by hubertgrove

Originally posted by Nikopol

I heartily disagree. In my experience, any sort of creative endeavour is ultimately realized by creative people, no matter what sort of heat you're getting from "above". Games are not created by businessmen, and movies are not created by businessmen. You always reserve the right to give them the good old finger and/or up and leave. Anywhere the creative people say "the suits are making the games", they are dodging responsibility.

 

And Bioware is a company that's been able to keep a distinct creative style up to now. Can we call such a company a corporation that treats its customer as cattle? They are not my favorite developers but they have their own way of doing things and they seem to be keeping true to it in this case. 

 

Before you go any further down this path whihc may lead to potential embarrassment, I strongly recommend you google;

John Smedley

Brad McQuaid

Richard Garriott

Nany Macintyre

John Riccitiello

No need for inflammatory language, old chap, and there is no way I am going to be embarrassed over something like this... There is no reason to, and I see you have conveniently avoided the context - I hate quoting myself, but allow me to remind you: Anywhere the creative people say "the suits are making the games", they are dodging responsibility.

I, too, have done creative work where corporations or "big shots" had a say. Believe me, every project said to be made by suits is ultimately realized by creative people who have chosen to go the way of "yessir" to the suits. I've had the misfortune of temporarily finding myself in such projects as well. I never blame the suits in these - for they are usually (not always, but usually) a mirror of what the majority of consumers demand - I always blame the creative team. In the end, they should be the ones to stick to their "vision", no? 

Anyway, I do not want to make a long-winded discussion of this... It would just be more fuel for what I consider misguided drama. Just the sort of thing that makes the gaming scene, in my opinion, a very bitter place to start with. So I'm taking my piece of responsibility in this one, and packing up and leaving this particular thread :)

Well, since this seems to be the official game-bashing thread, I figured I'd throw in my 2 cents.  Not that it makes one whit of difference, but I like to pretend the devs read these things.

I've been watching this game for some time now, with a fair amount of anticipation initially-it's being produced by Bioware, the current employer of he who was known as Ashen Temper.  As time goes on though, and more information comes out, I'm beginning to lose interest.  It's seeming a whole lot like a single player game with some multiplayer aspects, and not that much of an MMO environment.  Also, there appears thus far to be a serious lack of opportunity to Play to Crush.  I'd really hoped for much more of the focus to be on meaningful pvp.

If I wanted a single player, with a little multiplayer on the side and limited pvp, I'd go play Sacred 2 or something.  Play to Crush, Bioware, c'mon.

Edit:  Oh yeah, and I don't give two shits about the "story".  If I wanted to read a book, I'd...you guessed it, read a book.  I could even get one of those nifty choose your own adventure books if I wanted an interactive story experience.

Originally posted by Moirae

I mean, my god, log into this forum and all we see is how much everyone thinks this game is going to be terrible. Yet we know very little about the game.

 

Stop. Please. Just stop until we know more. We don't need a whole page of people with nothing but posts that the game will fail, that the game sucks (when you haven't even played it yet) and moaning about possible options when we don't even have a clue whether they will be added yet.

 

I've never seen anyone do this with any game but a Star Wars.

 

Enough already.

If you can stomach that "your game" is getting some criticism maybe you shouldn't spend time on the forum?

Game forums usually contains discussions. If a developer reveals hyped info in little bits over many months / years then surely we can discuss these?

It isn't about SWG for me. It is about lazy developers out for a quick buck. And Bioware is no different. 8 stiff classes forced into the eq / wow formula with even more linear gameplay (called stories) ??? How can this even be called a mmo??

The number of people saying it's going to suck or be mediocre is the same amount of people saying it's going to be awesome and kill WoW.

I know it's clichèd, but yin and yang. Without those people, you'd have an overhyped game. They're keeping the moderates grounded.

noooooo, NOT ANOTHER NEW WORD TO FIGURE OUT... NASAYERS? where do they get these words?

Originally posted by Keyh

The number of people saying it's going to suck or be mediocre is the same amount of people saying it's going to be awesome and kill WoW.

I know it's clichèd, but yin and yang. Without those people, you'd have an overhyped game. They're keeping the moderates grounded.

You pretty much summed up pre-launch for most games. You always have two sides, but in the end everything evens out.. Until the game launches and it turns out to be a turd in a bucket, that is...

Edit: Not that SWTOR is going to be a turd..( /pray)

Originally posted by Draccan

Originally posted by Moirae

I mean, my god, log into this forum and all we see is how much everyone thinks this game is going to be terrible. Yet we know very little about the game.

 

Stop. Please. Just stop until we know more. We don't need a whole page of people with nothing but posts that the game will fail, that the game sucks (when you haven't even played it yet) and moaning about possible options when we don't even have a clue whether they will be added yet.

 

I've never seen anyone do this with any game but a Star Wars.

 

Enough already.

 

If you can stomach that "your game" is getting some criticism maybe you shouldn't spend time on the forum?

Game forums usually contains discussions. If a developer reveals hyped info in little bits over many months / years then surely we can discuss these?

 

It isn't about SWG for me. It is about lazy developers out for a quick buck. And Bioware is no different. 8 stiff classes forced into the eq / wow formula with even more linear gameplay (called stories) ??? How can this even be called a mmo??

Nothing I see on here amounts to "discussing the negative and positive". It amounts to bashing and negativity and nothing more.

Who gives a flying duck about what the Naysayers thinks, I know the game is gonna rock bigtime and I dont care what some mentally challanged kids or fanboys think.

Originally posted by booboofinger

We are the Knights Who Say Nay!

Now go and and bring us a shrubbery !

WE are no Longer the knights who say Nay. We are now the knights who say ichi ichi ichi aaaa woooooooooop

Originally posted by segyn

Originally posted by booboofinger

We are the Knights Who Say Nay!

Now go and and bring us a shrubbery !

WE are no Longer the knights who say Nay. We are now the knights who say ichi ichi ichi aaaa woooooooooop

Haha thanks for that laugh :)

I heard they have one programmer with only 4 fingers writing this game on a commodore 64. Its gonna ROCK!!

Thread locked.