Originally posted by Orphes 

Well, they are not close to (what?) 100% as Xeon above post hints.

As I don't want to get in a percentage speculation I wrote 100% and if for no other reason it's wrong as one can't expect all people play at one single time on the 24h that makes a day.

Yeah, I'm not saying it is 100% at all and maybe it is 20%. I'm just speculating along with you. 

Either way I don't think it is worth debating if the number is 5,000 or 10,000 subscribers at this point (except to get xeno, rawr!).  At that level of subscribers the game generates somewhere between 1 and 2 million dollars total in a year. 

There is a win back promotion for old players as well as the largest patch the game has ever seen and the peak online population is the same as before the patch and winback? 

All the positive qualities of the game aside, I'm not sure what is left to debate at this point.

"The Game is Dying"
 

We all will die someday, but when,no one knows.  Right now I and many others enjoy playing this game, so we will until it dies.  This could be in a year or 5 years...... There are many new people playing everyday, and many people coming back.  Yes people do leave.  If you dont like the game or dont like playing, then move it along and stop making stupid post. 

Originally posted by Daffid011 

 

All the positive qualities of the game aside, I'm not sure what is left to debate at this point.

My last two posts here I have done them before. Same mantra over and over. I'm pushing "back" on the browser more times then "post message".

Originally posted by boojiboy

 With regard to LiveGamer, I agree... most people are not even aware of it's existance and as far as I know, it doesn't even work.  Complete failure, they should just pull the plug on LiveGamer.

I have been reading a bit about how Live Gamer has been broken for a while when it comes to selling certain things (characters and some items) on the official forums.  However, I've read that selling gold to others is very stable.  And, there are more people that know of the existence of this horrible program than you may think.  Of course, as to who uses it or not would only be known by Live Gamer and SOE themselves.

However, if they pulled the plug on this blight of a program, then I would probably return.  As I have said previously, I enjoy VG and have more good things to say about it than bad.

Originally posted by darkbladed

remember when people said if PoTa was half-arsed itd mean the death of the game?

From what Im reading on the forum PoTa has been very mishandled and is a huge faction grind.

I also hear that post 50 XP will take forever (and cannot really be soloed or small grouped very well)

So now when I said months ago that VG was swirling down the crapper people screamed and said;

"PoTa was gunna be awesome and if it wasnt that then I could say the game was dying"

Well guess what...

 

The Game is Dying!

 

Only saying it cause I was told to.

Good luck

Also for those who like it keep enjoying it.  Its great that you are having fun. 

From my understanding The Matrix online is still running, you guys really need to do your math before making foolish posts like this Vanguard can't be any worse off than that game which SOE acquired quite sometime ago.
 

Originally posted by jaxsundane

Originally posted by darkbladed

remember when people said if PoTa was half-arsed itd mean the death of the game?

From what Im reading on the forum PoTa has been very mishandled and is a huge faction grind.

I also hear that post 50 XP will take forever (and cannot really be soloed or small grouped very well)

So now when I said months ago that VG was swirling down the crapper people screamed and said;

"PoTa was gunna be awesome and if it wasnt that then I could say the game was dying"

Well guess what...

 

The Game is Dying!

 

Only saying it cause I was told to.

Good luck

Also for those who like it keep enjoying it.  Its great that you are having fun. 

From my understanding The Matrix online is still running, you guys really need to do your math before making foolish posts like this Vanguard can't be any worse off than that game which SOE acquired quite sometime ago.
 

You should really keep up to date with your facts. Matrix online is closing down July 31 so the matrix is still running excuse  dosent really cut it anymore.
 

Originally posted by jfencil

Originally posted by jaxsundane

From my understanding The Matrix online is still running, you guys really need to do your math before making foolish posts like this Vanguard can't be any worse off than that game which SOE acquired quite sometime ago.
 

You should really keep up to date with your facts. Matrix online is closing down July 31 so the matrix is still running excuse  dosent really cut it anymore.
 

Yeah, that made me actually laugh. lol.

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Originally posted by boojiboy
I am a /who count all fiend and I can safely say the population has seen a small uptick since PotA, but nothing big.  There are three major influences on the server population right now:
1)  PotA did bring a good chunk of people back to the game.  Very apparent in my guild, my friends list and on the boards.

---

I thought only a small number had returned until I witnessed last nights guild key event.

Where a large number of people turned up to get the next part of the key quest (3 quest in the series requires certain spawnable guardians to be killed all over Telon).

Now I feel a lot of folks have returned.

Live Gamer did send a bunch of people away (me included) though I was considering returning if they did a somewhat good job on the pota/55+ content but they didnt which caused me to free up 20gb off my harddrive (once a game is off my drive I dont usualy put it back on).

And like someone said the upsurge of people recently is from the free month they are giving people to try pota.

In a month the game will look far less populated

And by "dying" I didnt mean "closing down";  Star Wars Galaxies has been "dying" for a 3-4 years now and until it stops making enough money to support itself or they need the server space for another game it will keep on running (or until they lose the licence etc).  So in 5 years VG may still "be around" but when its only 400 players in game I, like many, will consider it dead.

What I dislike is people see all the fanboying around here (and the main boards as anything negative is deleted) and think the game is a thriving and bug free game.  Then people spend money on a box and a month and SOE gets thier dirty hands on more money.  I say if a company screws a game (or 7) up and tries to push it under the rug for added revenue they should be outed.

And thats just what I will continue to do

Out SOE for their shenanigans!

 The problem with Vanguard isn't the content its the lack of people. If everyone today who purchased back when the game launched said frack it and signed up the game would undoubtly be growing now. But right now the game is fun for a few weeks then u start to see less and less more people around u so u end up abandoning the game because its a MMO not a MSPO (massive single player online). I try to go back every year see how its doing but i end up only geting about 2 weeks of entertainment out of that comeback tour. The game wont die, just look at MXO and Planetside. But it will never and i mean never shine in the spot light do to what happened at launch.

the big reason those subs arent still playing/coming back is the lack of content

Originally posted by darkbladed

the big reason those subs arent still playing/coming back is the lack of content

 

Unless someone is ultra hard-core and plays Vanguard 24/7 from their mother's basement, there is no way they've gotten through all the content. 

That said, the most recent game update is very group content focused and if someone is a solo'er at heart, then they might be disappointed and leave.  I know one such solo'er that was really hoping there would be a large content update for soloing... and there wasn't.

Originally posted by Goldknyght

 The problem with Vanguard isn't the content its the lack of people. If everyone today who purchased back when the game launched said frack it and signed up the game would undoubtly be growing now. But right now the game is fun for a few weeks then u start to see less and less more people around u so u end up abandoning the game because its a MMO not a MSPO (massive single player online). I try to go back every year see how its doing but i end up only geting about 2 weeks of entertainment out of that comeback tour. The game wont die, just look at MXO and Planetside. But it will never and i mean never shine in the spot light do to what happened at launch.

Current events must not be your strong point.  MXO is heralded to be exterminated on the end of July.

sorry I meant "Viable Content"

Noone wants to grind SoD for 8 months in order to get the charm

But as long as youve tried SoD and BoD (not everyone can get a group together for that 20 minute long raid encounter either) then youve done the content, not completed but done

Just like some people hate crafting in EQ and if they are a level 80? with full top tier raid gear the havent "completed all the content" but they have done all the content that interests them and thats why people leave; no content that interests THEM.

Noone cares if theres still content that interests others, it wont keep them in game, they need something for them to do which is why 1 server of WoW has more players online at 3PM in the afternoon on a weekday than the whole game of VG primetime weekend.

---

Originally posted by darkbladed
Noone cares if theres still content that interests others, it wont keep them in game, they need something for them to do which is why 1 server of WoW has more players online at 3PM in the afternoon on a weekday than the whole game of VG primetime weekend.

---

Just because people have made it to end game on an MMO and left from boredom doesn't mean the game isn't fun for anyone else. Getting bored with an MMO is nothing new. Why do you think people try different ones or play more than one at a time?

A lot of people have grown tired of WoW's endless end game grind, whether it's raiding or arenas. Despite having an enormous player base and gigantic budget, people are still leaving WoW. WoW's player base isn't as big as it used to be, and it'll only keep getting smaller as more and more good MMOs enter the market. It's just part of the genre. Actually it's part of the entire gaming industry. People get bored with games and move on.

Originally posted by Nizur

 

 

A lot of people have grown tired of WoW's endless end game grind, whether it's raiding or arenas. Despite having an enormous player base and gigantic budget, people are still leaving WoW. WoW's player base isn't as big as it used to be, and it'll only keep getting smaller as more and more good MMOs enter the market. It's just part of the genre. Actually it's part of the entire gaming industry. People get bored with games and move on.

That's stretching a bit too far don't you think?  Claiming WoW's playerbase is getting smaller, when in fact WoW has done nothing but grow since it got launched in 2004.  While it's true their subs are not growing as fast as it used to be, it could be slowly leveling off, but it is definitely not "getting smaller" as you claim.  I don't even play WoW anymore, but I can at least acknowledge that 800lbs gorilla and give credit where its due.

When it comes to Vanguard, the last thing people in VG need to worry about is the subscription numbers.  Vanguard can't get any smaller, it's already running on 4 servers, 1 of them being a PvP server that has 100 players on during primetime.  The other 3, well despite people's optimistic views about the game, primetime last night on Xeth only hit 600.

People in VG should be happy that the community is tight in VG.  The playerbase now consist of people that enjoy Vanguard and want to play Vanguard, rather than a bunch of nomad MMO players that jump games every few months.   But it's kinda hard to argue the lack of endgame in Vanguard, that was always one of the top complaints from players that actually want to like VG, not those that left early, but those that stuck it out and finished the game's content.   IMO they should've released AA's instead of pota, that would've given people a lot of things to do and work towards rather than the 51-55 grind that exist today.

AA's are just another form of grind.  AA's are just empty experience bars that need to be filled up.

POTA is real content.  

Originally posted by Daffid011

AA's are just another form of grind.  AA's are just empty experience bars that need to be filled up.

POTA is real content.  

Ask around, pota isn't real content to many players, because it's a revamped zone with many of post-50 content being re-used content.  Many things are content people have already done before, just now they are harder to kill.  Right now there's a lack of incentive to level and keep grinding, because the upgrades they get are minimal.

AA's on the other hand, enhances your characters in big ways, plus they could give you utilities you would otherwise not have.  Of course AA's are more complex and difficult to design, so the dev team probably went with the easier route by revamping existing content and tagging 5 levels on.

Argument can be made from both sides, but take a look at what current playerbase are saying:

forums.station.sony.com/vg/posts/list.m

I appologize and you are correct.  I didn't mean to say that revamped zones are awesome or new content, but isn't there a brand new raid area or is that just a revamped area too?  Please don't tell me that POTA is nothing more than recycled areas.  I know a lot of it was filled junk that had difficulties tweaked to give the appearance of 51-55 content, but there are completely new areas with new models and such right? 

The abilities of AA may be cool, but the entire concept of AA is just psuedo leveling once a character reaches max level.  More empty experience bars to fill without bonuses to health/mana and needing to replace your gear.  It doesn't make any part of the actual game world better or more enjoyable.  It is just more level grind put on top of the game. 

Well obviously the ideal situation would be to release AA's and new content (a new zone and a raid zone) at the same time.  But yeah, I think most people are more ticked off about the 51-55 grind than anything.  The thing is they didn't release interesting and fun content for the grind, so people don't feel motivated to even grind to 55.  It's like a grind for the sake of grinding.

At least with AA's people would have new things to get and work towards.  That's the argument it seems for many people.