Originally posted by _Shadowmage

 

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Originally posted by AgtSmith
ROFL @ the DDO fans for their refusal to acknowledge the clear reality of the situation.  DDO didn't fail as an MMO because it had the wrong pricing model it failed because it is not a good MMO, period. 

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Well not having played it I cant comment on whether or not its a good MMO. But not having played it - I can state that for me and the 5 guys I played D&D 2nd ed & Neverwinter nights with - we choose not to play because we had no interest in paying for a game (D&D) we could already play for free online (Neverwinternights).

Having just seen this announcement and as we are looking for something else to play - this game would be right up our alley.

 

But are you and your friends the type who will pay to use micro transactions or become paying members if you like the game?

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Originally posted by Rokurgepta
But are you and your friends the type who will pay to use micro transactions or become paying members if you like the game?

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It just depends if there are enough players like me to make a difference for DDO.

There wasnt for Tabula Rasa - look where that ended up.

Originally posted by _Shadowmage
Well not having played it I cant comment on whether or not its a good MMO. But not having played it - I can state that for me and the 5 guys I played D&D 2nd ed & Neverwinter nights with - we choose not to play because we had no interest in paying for a game (D&D) we could already play for free online (Neverwinternights).

Having just seen this announcement and as we are looking for something else to play - this game would be right up our alley.

 

This is an excellent way to play DDO, there is nothing like the first time through a quest with a group of friends, it is exactly the PnP experience (with the obvious limitations of an AI DM) I believe they were trying to replicate.

It's funny how everyone says free to play. Is CS (Cash Shop) system really free to play?

I have played CS system games before and I would not call it good way to make games for players. Mostly because CS system, the game play for player is gimped. Meaning that many games features are limited for free players and CS is required to enjoy the game fully. So, in the end P2P is better choise.

http://www.ddo.com/vip

DDO is trying to have P2P and CS system in same game. This cause other problems, like what's the main thing in P2P systems?

- P2P is fair to everyone, everyone gets same content same ways.

- Every player who has reach higherst level in P2P game has earned they accomplishment

So, when You allow in same server someone to use CS, You lower the accomplishment of these players. They feel like they work is notthing if someone can just buy they way up. So so much from been fair. Why would anyone anymore even play monthly fee. CS systems games, the company allways says CS doesn't provide advances over other players, but so far they allways have. Simple reason is, players don't buy from CS stuff if it's not worth of buying.

So, DDO's free to play was end of they P2P side, not because it's not better, but because CS is destroying it, because they can't exist both in same time in same game. it just doesn't work, because there is conflict between why to use them in first place.

Originally posted by Liliane

It's funny how everyone says free to play. Is CS (Cash Shop) system really free to play?

Yes it is, you can play some of the game without paying anything, which makes it free. Now if you were to say GW was not F2P then you would be correct as there is always a box purchase required to get to any of the content.

I understand your concerns with regard to CS and the possible unfair advantages. Only time will tell how well they balanced the VIP/CS payment model by the number of players and associated revenue.

Originally posted by moorewr

Originally posted by SwampRob

To AgtSmith:  Seriously, lay off the DOOM pills.   Geez, every post of yours....

The thing is, the game is going to be free!   I am certainly going to give it a try, and encourage others to do so.   I've nothing to lose by giving it a shot and making my own decisions.   Will it hook me or others?   That remains to be seen.   But AgtSmith's whole purpose seems to be "It's Dead!  Don't go near it!  Don't touch it!"      

Why the hell not?

 

His grievance certainly seems personal. Very strange.

 

Guys your missing the big picture here, and arguing about the color while blindfolded...

MONEY is the key to all of this, as always, and yeah something is fishy about it..

Originally posted by Dr.Rock

I understand your concerns with regard to CS and the possible unfair advantages. Only time will tell how well they balanced the VIP/CS payment model by the number of players and associated revenue.

Yes, time will tell - but we already know from info they have released about some severely game altering concessions for the cash shop already like buying supplies on the fly in a dungeon and buying resurrections, both of which severely alter play and the 'integrity' of the game which has been that you complete a mission without wiping or take a big hit (and many missions are auto fail if you wipe).  As someone else said, who will buy stuff if it isn't key stuff, if it isn't crucial?  Of course nobody will, or few will - so the idea of this hybrid system is just silly and I think highlights the likelihood of other motives like I have mentioned.

And for the delusional fanboys flaming some of us for calling out turbine for their blatent lies and deceipt and for, essentially, scamming the players keeping DDO afloat all this time ...

"We know the recent job listing has caused a bit of a stir, but please be aware that this posting is for an unannounced future project. We appreciate the thoughts and feedback on both sides thus far."  - Sapience

Story at Massively

Was Sapience lying - seems so - but could this indicate waht I have been saying that this RMT DDO is about a new project and not about DDO at all - testbed.

Originally posted by Liliane

So, DDO's free to play was end of they P2P side, not because it's not better, but because CS is destroying it, because they can't exist both in same time in same game. it just doesn't work, because there is conflict between why to use them in first place.

 

Different games attract different customers who share different preferences. We have to keep in mind that DDO was not designed for a FFP model which normally has a very low benchmark of quality.  The beneift here is players will be getting an MMO with the quality of a subscription based model.  I'm not saying it will work, nor have I said it won't, but I do agree that it might. 

This is a good article about Micro Transactions and even touches on hybrid subscription/free models: http://www.gamasutra.com/view/feature/4046/what_are_the_rewards_of_.php

The article provides some interesting insight that anyone commenting on Item Malls and hybrid subscription plans should read. 

Originally posted by mindspat

The beneift here is players will be getting an MMO with the quality of a subscription based model.  I'm not saying it will work, nor have I said it won't, but I do agree that it might.  

Are they?  In all fairness to preferences can we not say that as a pay MMO DDO has been judged to be less than 'quality', thus the lack of subs and need (to the extent that is even the real motivation for this) to make this change. 

For anyone who played the game and is leaving because of the announcement, which game are you looking at?  I personally was more offended by the dishonesty than the model, although I wasn't happy about that either.

Originally posted by Wind-breaker

For anyone who played the game and is leaving because of the announcement, which game are you looking at?  I personally was more offended by the dishonesty than the model, although I wasn't happy about that either.

January 2009

 "We know the recent job listing has caused a bit of a stir, but please be aware that this posting is for an unannounced future project. We appreciate the thoughts and feedback on both sides thus far."

June 2009

They have been working on it for "a year" according to their official announcement.  They knew all along.

They word things like that because it could be argued that "Eberron Unlimited" is, in fact, a future project. It is intentionally misleading while they simultaneously try to act all Mr. Rogers-like...as if they deeply care about, or listen to, their players.

I don't think this transition is going to bring them the profits they are fantasizing about. It is a niche game. But still, If it helps to keep the game alive and provides a positive experience for their player base, great.  I  liked DDO's combat system, the traps, and the puzzles. 

Everyone should try it for themselves to see if it is for them. It's definitely a niche game.. Overall I had a decent experience with DDO but Turbine sometimes makes me want to call 911.  I'd be shocked if this free to play model came out by the end of the summer. Early September probably makes more sense, if not later. They aren't exactly great with hitting their deadlines.

Translation "I hope this doesn't do well cause Aion is releasing soon"

Agreed.  Really there is no defending their actions.  However, I did love the player community and the active combat.  This is why I want to know where people are going to end up.

Originally posted by levsix

Originally posted by Wind-breaker

For anyone who played the game and is leaving because of the announcement, which game are you looking at?  I personally was more offended by the dishonesty than the model, although I wasn't happy about that either.

January 2009

 "We know the recent job listing has caused a bit of a stir, but please be aware that this posting is for an unannounced future project. We appreciate the thoughts and feedback on both sides thus far."

June 2009

They have been working on it for "a year" according to their official announcement.  They knew all along.

They word things like that because it could be argued that "Eberron Unlimited" is, in fact, a future project. It is intentionally misleading while they simultaneously try to act all Mr. Rogers-like...as if they deeply care about, or listen to, their players.

 

I don't think this transition is going to bring them the profits they are fantasizing about. It is a niche game. But still, If it helps to keep the game alive and provides a positive experience for their player base, great.  I  liked DDO's combat system, the traps, and the puzzles. 

 

Everyone should try it for themselves to see if it is for them. It's definitely a niche game.. Overall I had a decent experience with DDO but Turbine sometimes makes me want to call 911.  I'd be shocked if this free to play model came out by the end of the summer. Early September probably makes more sense, if not later. They aren't exactly great with hitting their deadlines.

I think what happened was they were planning this model for a future project but then they decided that since DDO was near the close the doors level they might as well try this new idea with a game that already has been paid for. Since DDO was going to die off soon anyway this is less risky than developing an entire game around an unknown payment method. Now they get to work out the kinks with a game they already paid for and if it works they win twice because they prove this hybrid method can work and they revive DDO.

Originally posted by Wind-breaker

Agreed.  Really there is no defending their actions.  However, I did love the player community and the active combat.  This is why I want to know where people are going to end up.

Darkfall is actually a lot of fun if you get in with a group of active players that cover your timezone.  It's not as much as a disaster as its elluded to be and the Risk Vs Reward element means you're likely to consistently have an exciteing experiance everytime you login.  Darkfall is EXTREMELY tactile, much like how DDO feels.  If you suffered the horrendous state of the game during open beta or the first few weeks of its launch you should know the game is playing quite well; this doesn't mean there aren't flaws. 

Star Wars Galaxies is playable and somewhat fun although if you're not able to get past any flaws of Darkfall I would avoid this. 

Avoid Turbine games.  Turbine has proven to be as truthfull as a crackhead needing a quick fix - they'll give you content, they swear!

EVE Online is quite incredible although it requires a guild for it to be action oriented enough to get your attention if you get bored easily. I would advise joining EVE University right from the start.  You can get a 20 day trial (pm me with email and I'll send you one) which is plenty of time to get the hang of things.  I'd be willing to sponsor you or another ex-DDO player who's looking to get into EVE University and learn how to "pew-pew" while screaming "Yarr!!' in local.  :)

on the brite side, it's summer here in North America which means we have plenty of time to enjoy the Sun till something better comes around.  I think I'm going to use my subscription fee from DDO to see at least 2 movies in the theater each month.   :D

Originally posted by Rokurgepta 

I think what happened was they were planning this model for a future project but then they decided that since DDO was near the close the doors level they might as well try this new idea with a game that already has been paid for. Since DDO was going to die off soon anyway this is less risky than developing an entire game around an unknown payment method. Now they get to work out the kinks with a game they already paid for and if it works they win twice because they prove this hybrid method can work and they revive DDO.

Possible but unlikely.  The 'something big' super secret stuff has been stirring for some time adn if you look at this DDO Unlimited thing one of the big parts is the quick download and play option whic goes way back to the changes in MOD with Korthos (which nobody could understand redoing the noob area for a game suffering for content at the top and mid levels.  Turbine knew, and knows, exactly what they are doing.  Yes, DDO Unlimited is a trial baloon or test dummy but not on a whim.

it may be a good thing or a bad one i dont know

Out of interest which companies have never been accused of misleading their customers? I know from my experience NCSoft, Cryptic, Funcom, Blizzard, Adventurine, SOE and who did I miss(?) have all been accused, who exactly hasn't?

Grow up guys, you are acting like someone stole your virginity.

Originally posted by Dr.Rock

Out of interest which companies have never been accused of misleading their customers? I know from my experience NCSoft, Cryptic, Funcom, Blizzard, Adventurine, SOE and who did I miss(?) have all been accused, who exactly hasn't?

Grow up guys, you are acting like someone stole your virginity.

WHen my money is involved I will decide if being mislead is a bad thing or not and will complain as much as I want about it. Telling unhappy people to grow up makes you look childish. Turbine is showing very poor form to the veteran players who kept them gpoing through the bad times.