Originally posted by Dr.Rock

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

With Turbine there is nothing to check it against as they do not nor are required to post any financial statements.DDO also requires other people to do things in a reasonable amount of time. For me soloing gets tedious after level 4, so without enough people DDO becomes nearly unplayable.

 

Edit: Also remember Sarr is the one claiming the game is growing when almost all evidence is to the contrary. If he wants to make claims that his posts are facts he needs to back them up.

Can you be more specific on that evidence, I am not saying either of you is right, but I do feel there is a lot of emotion and very little evidence on either side.

My own observations and for clarity they are just that, although it would be hard to see the delay of mod 9 as good for DDO in the short term (until we know reasons and what happens next hard to see beyond that) I would be hard pressed to see any dramatic affect on number of players in game compared to this point in the normal module cycle.

Until I see something with my own eyes I will continue to treat rhetoric (positive or negative) with a healthy dose of disinterest.

As for your edit, no he doesn't, he can state what he likes, in whatever way he likes, within the rules of the forum. In the same way you state a lot of things and rarely seem able to back them up, I just assume you can't, I don't delude myself that I have any right to make you do so.

I am done wasting my time explaining to the blind what the sky looks like. DDO has nhever been to this poing ina  normal module cycle. It is now 8 months no MOD so this is the first time ever and if the loing time fanboys now posting their disappointment on the boards is not evidence of a mood change in the general population of DDO nothing I can say will change that.

Disinterest? You are here arguing everyday, you lack disinterest in abundance.

This isn't at all scientific.  I just logged on and looked at my 'who'  TAB.  I have no idea how accurate it is, or even if it has a numbers cap, but according to that their are approx. 500 ppl on Thelanis right this moment (I am currently logged in).

edit: 10 LFM up in the group TAB.  No endgame groups.  Highest is a shroud flag ging run.

Originally posted by BoBoDaClown

This isn't at all scientific.  I just logged on and looked at my 'who'  TAB.  I have no idea how accurate it is, or even if it has a numbers cap, but according to that their are approx. 500 ppl on Thelanis right this moment (I am currently logged in).

edit: 10 LFM up in the group TAB.  No endgame groups.  Highest is a shroud flag ging run.

Add another 200 for people using the anon option and you are looking at around 700 on Thelanis.

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Deewe

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Deewe

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Dr.Rock

Originally posted by hidden1

When will Turbine start working on DDO II ?

I somehow doubt they ever will, the IP has too much baggage if the current state of things is anything to go by.

 

My hope is a better company gets the chance if there is a DDO 2.

 

You mean FunCom or even... SOE. Not sure.

No I do not mean either of those. There are better game companies than Turbine.
 

Not to say Turbine is perfect not the best one still I would be interested in knowing their names.

 

 

It is all a matter of personal opinion. You may hate the ones I like I may hate the ones you like.

Well then we can agree your "My hope is a better company gets the chance if there is a DDO 2." statement is a pee in the wind.

I'd suggest you to avoid that unless you don't mind having your shoes wet :p

Originally posted by Deewe

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Deewe

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Deewe

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Dr.Rock

Originally posted by hidden1

When will Turbine start working on DDO II ?

I somehow doubt they ever will, the IP has too much baggage if the current state of things is anything to go by.

 

My hope is a better company gets the chance if there is a DDO 2.

 

You mean FunCom or even... SOE. Not sure.

No I do not mean either of those. There are better game companies than Turbine.
 

Not to say Turbine is perfect not the best one still I would be interested in knowing their names.

 

 

It is all a matter of personal opinion. You may hate the ones I like I may hate the ones you like.

Well then we can agree your

 

NO we do not agree. Turbine turned the D&D MMO into a barely hanging on, niche game with limited appeal to D&D players or the MMO crowd. Turbine has a good combat engine and a good dungeon creation tea, but other than that they offer poor management and a lot of PR failures. DDO should have been better, D&D deserved a better MMO than this one.
 

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Dr.Rock

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

With Turbine there is nothing to check it against as they do not nor are required to post any financial statements.DDO also requires other people to do things in a reasonable amount of time. For me soloing gets tedious after level 4, so without enough people DDO becomes nearly unplayable.

 

Edit: Also remember Sarr is the one claiming the game is growing when almost all evidence is to the contrary. If he wants to make claims that his posts are facts he needs to back them up.

Can you be more specific on that evidence, I am not saying either of you is right, but I do feel there is a lot of emotion and very little evidence on either side.

My own observations and for clarity they are just that, although it would be hard to see the delay of mod 9 as good for DDO in the short term (until we know reasons and what happens next hard to see beyond that) I would be hard pressed to see any dramatic affect on number of players in game compared to this point in the normal module cycle.

Until I see something with my own eyes I will continue to treat rhetoric (positive or negative) with a healthy dose of disinterest.

As for your edit, no he doesn't, he can state what he likes, in whatever way he likes, within the rules of the forum. In the same way you state a lot of things and rarely seem able to back them up, I just assume you can't, I don't delude myself that I have any right to make you do so.

 

I am done wasting my time explaining to the blind what the sky looks like. DDO has nhever been to this poing ina  normal module cycle. It is now 8 months no MOD so this is the first time ever and if the loing time fanboys now posting their disappointment on the boards is not evidence of a mood change in the general population of DDO nothing I can say will change that.

 

Disinterest? You are here arguing everyday, you lack disinterest in abundance.

Trust me I have no real interest in your point of view, emotional outbursts and insults do little to add any credibility to it. It is easy to dismiss as personal feelings that you are reflecting on to others, and ignoring anyone who just doesn't see it the same way.

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Deewe

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Deewe

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Deewe

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Dr.Rock

Originally posted by hidden1

When will Turbine start working on DDO II ?

I somehow doubt they ever will, the IP has too much baggage if the current state of things is anything to go by.

 

My hope is a better company gets the chance if there is a DDO 2.

 

You mean FunCom or even... SOE. Not sure.

No I do not mean either of those. There are better game companies than Turbine.
 

Not to say Turbine is perfect not the best one still I would be interested in knowing their names.

 

 

It is all a matter of personal opinion. You may hate the ones I like I may hate the ones you like.

Well then we can agree your

 

NO we do not agree. Turbine turned the D&D MMO into a barely hanging on, niche game with limited appeal to D&D players or the MMO crowd. Turbine has a good combat engine and a good dungeon creation tea, but other than that they offer poor management and a lot of PR failures. DDO should have been better, D&D deserved a better MMO than this one.
 

What i would´ve loved to see is, open world just like TR had but also with the same ammount of dungeons/instances that currently is in DDO with a open for all PvP (consecual ofc) in all areas along with balanced classes and a good sandbox crafting system.

I actually enjoyed  what little bit of DDO I played....unfourtunately it had to much to compete with for anyone to take it seriously.....its a different pace than the "tank and spank" play style most are used to...i would have liked it to have more solo play options but that in and of itself defeats the purpose of D&D in any traditions sense(meaning you never played Pen and Paper D&D alone)

Originally posted by Bennyblyfot

Well b4 i left the EU servers i made a daily head count about 4 times a week for 14 dayish(yes i know some players doesn´t show) but overall i saw a decrease in population (the head count was made during peak times). As i started to play on one of the U.S servers i asked my friends to make some headcounts for me to make some coparance to the U.S servers and well it wasn´t very nice numbers. Somewhere between 150-75 shown, each time i made the heade count the number seemd to be decreasing, on the few times i made the count on the U.S servers the numbers where constant around 250+ but also decreasing at the end of my sub May 2009 26th.

This easy count showd me that the population overall was decreasing on both sides of the atlantic. I have no documents to back it up so you will have to take my word for it or logg in and do a propper servey.

I don´t have a sub running and i refuse to pay turbine anymore cash so you can call me lazy all you want, i´m not botherd and i have no interest to make the porper arangements to look in to it and make a servey. 

My analysis on CoH was over a 9 month period and it couldn't show me a trend, sorry 14 days is laughable. I also took a snapshot of numbers over the weekend after your original post (I even posted one of them in another thread), and players online were 2 to 4 times your numbers (250 to 350), so I would have to say either you are making figures up, or using your own weak analysis Sarr is correct and there has been an increase from your numbers.

One thing is for certain I will not be taking your word for it.

Originally posted by Dr.Rock

Originally posted by Bennyblyfot

Well b4 i left the EU servers i made a daily head count about 4 times a week for 14 dayish(yes i know some players doesn´t show) but overall i saw a decrease in population (the head count was made during peak times). As i started to play on one of the U.S servers i asked my friends to make some headcounts for me to make some coparance to the U.S servers and well it wasn´t very nice numbers. Somewhere between 150-75 shown, each time i made the heade count the number seemd to be decreasing, on the few times i made the count on the U.S servers the numbers where constant around 250+ but also decreasing at the end of my sub May 2009 26th.

This easy count showd me that the population overall was decreasing on both sides of the atlantic. I have no documents to back it up so you will have to take my word for it or logg in and do a propper servey.

I don´t have a sub running and i refuse to pay turbine anymore cash so you can call me lazy all you want, i´m not botherd and i have no interest to make the porper arangements to look in to it and make a servey. 

My analysis on CoH was over a 9 month period and it couldn't show me a trend, sorry 14 days is laughable. I also took a snapshot of numbers over the weekend after your original post (I even posted one of them in another thread), and subscriptions were 2 to 4 times your numbers (250 to 350), so I would have to say either you are making figures up, or using your own weak analysis Sarr is correct and there has been an increase from your numbers.

One thing is for certain I will not be taking your word for it.

250-350 subs sure, i know that ALOT of people have x2 accounts, and i know of people having accounts on both the servers, then add people who have accounts/payment running for say 6 motnhs and are now so bored that they don´t play or atleast play alot less. I didn´t say the 14 days i looked at it was a good servey but if you calculate your sub numbers with what i just mentioned i´d say 150ish people online at peek wouldn´t be to far from the truth.

The only thing laughabel is the blind trust you put in your sub numbers. And exactly during wich time period did you do the 9 month period? did it include spring 2009?

Originally posted by Bennyblyfot

Originally posted by Dr.Rock

Originally posted by Bennyblyfot

Well b4 i left the EU servers i made a daily head count about 4 times a week for 14 dayish(yes i know some players doesn´t show) but overall i saw a decrease in population (the head count was made during peak times). As i started to play on one of the U.S servers i asked my friends to make some headcounts for me to make some coparance to the U.S servers and well it wasn´t very nice numbers. Somewhere between 150-75 shown, each time i made the heade count the number seemd to be decreasing, on the few times i made the count on the U.S servers the numbers where constant around 250+ but also decreasing at the end of my sub May 2009 26th.

This easy count showd me that the population overall was decreasing on both sides of the atlantic. I have no documents to back it up so you will have to take my word for it or logg in and do a propper servey.

I don´t have a sub running and i refuse to pay turbine anymore cash so you can call me lazy all you want, i´m not botherd and i have no interest to make the porper arangements to look in to it and make a servey. 

My analysis on CoH was over a 9 month period and it couldn't show me a trend, sorry 14 days is laughable. I also took a snapshot of numbers over the weekend after your original post (I even posted one of them in another thread), and people online were 2 to 4 times your numbers (250 to 350), so I would have to say either you are making figures up, or using your own weak analysis Sarr is correct and there has been an increase from your numbers.

One thing is for certain I will not be taking your word for it.

 

250-350 subs sure, i know that ALOT of people have x2 accounts, and i know of people having accounts on both the servers, then add people who have accounts/payment running for say 6 motnhs and are now so bored that they don´t play or atleast play alot less. I didn´t say the 14 days i looked at it was a good servey but if you calculate your sub numbers with what i just mentioned i´d say 150ish people online at peek wouldn´t be to far from the truth.

The only thing laughabel is the blind trust you put in your sub numbers. And exactly during wich time period did you do the 9 month period? did it include spring 2009?

I have corrected my typo for the avoidance of doubt.

My blind trust? I thought you put this method forward as a method of getting some hard facts? Of course at the time we didn't realise that hard facts is 14 days and then make the numbers up to suit yourself anyway.

To quote:

"Sarr please do a propper servey on how many people you have online on avrage on the EU servers, that will take some time from your posting, i know, but your the one that´s been saying that the game is growing not me so i suggest you get some hard facts."

I assume you are now wriggling away from this method?

As for the 9 months I will quote myself, as you obviously didn't read it.

"Out of interest using in game player counts is not reliable, I tested that theory quite extensively over a long period on CoH as I could check the trend againt the quarterly posted subscription numbers. I wrongly believed that players online would at least show a subscription level trend, my theory was wrong."

and

"My analysis on CoH was over a 9 month period and it couldn't show me a trend, sorry 14 days is laughable".

So I fail to see whether this 9 month period on CoH covered Sping 2009 has any relevance?

Finally if you had bothered to read the other topic it included time and server.

"Keeper (20:30)

Level 1 to 5 - 87

Level 6 to 9 - 42

Level 10 to 12 - 41

Level 13 to 16 - 141"

So you did such an in depth analysis and came up with 75 to 150 people online, but one simple spot check shows your figures are made up. I will let people actually playing on the EU servers check for themselves to see how credible you are.

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Deewe

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Deewe

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Deewe

Originally posted by Rokurgepta

Originally posted by Dr.Rock

Originally posted by hidden1

When will Turbine start working on DDO II ?

I somehow doubt they ever will, the IP has too much baggage if the current state of things is anything to go by.

 

My hope is a better company gets the chance if there is a DDO 2.

 

You mean FunCom or even... SOE. Not sure.

No I do not mean either of those. There are better game companies than Turbine.
 

Not to say Turbine is perfect not the best one still I would be interested in knowing their names.

 

 

It is all a matter of personal opinion. You may hate the ones I like I may hate the ones you like.

Well then we can agree your

 

NO we do not agree. Turbine turned the D&D MMO into a barely hanging on, niche game with limited appeal to D&D players or the MMO crowd. Turbine has a good combat engine and a good dungeon creation tea, but other than that they offer poor management and a lot of PR failures. DDO should have been better, D&D deserved a better MMO than this one.
 

I know you understood my point, you are more clever than that :)

My point was to say you can't bash a studio or a person and say some would do better without providing their names. It's easy to say something is bad, it's more difficult to proove someone can do better. Even  more not doing so isn't really fair.

Originally posted by Dr.Rock

Originally posted by Bennyblyfot

Originally posted by Dr.Rock

Originally posted by Bennyblyfot

Well b4 i left the EU servers i made a daily head count about 4 times a week for 14 dayish(yes i know some players doesn´t show) but overall i saw a decrease in population (the head count was made during peak times). As i started to play on one of the U.S servers i asked my friends to make some headcounts for me to make some coparance to the U.S servers and well it wasn´t very nice numbers. Somewhere between 150-75 shown, each time i made the heade count the number seemd to be decreasing, on the few times i made the count on the U.S servers the numbers where constant around 250+ but also decreasing at the end of my sub May 2009 26th.

This easy count showd me that the population overall was decreasing on both sides of the atlantic. I have no documents to back it up so you will have to take my word for it or logg in and do a propper servey.

I don´t have a sub running and i refuse to pay turbine anymore cash so you can call me lazy all you want, i´m not botherd and i have no interest to make the porper arangements to look in to it and make a servey. 

My analysis on CoH was over a 9 month period and it couldn't show me a trend, sorry 14 days is laughable. I also took a snapshot of numbers over the weekend after your original post (I even posted one of them in another thread), and people online were 2 to 4 times your numbers (250 to 350), so I would have to say either you are making figures up, or using your own weak analysis Sarr is correct and there has been an increase from your numbers.

One thing is for certain I will not be taking your word for it.

 

250-350 subs sure, i know that ALOT of people have x2 accounts, and i know of people having accounts on both the servers, then add people who have accounts/payment running for say 6 motnhs and are now so bored that they don´t play or atleast play alot less. I didn´t say the 14 days i looked at it was a good servey but if you calculate your sub numbers with what i just mentioned i´d say 150ish people online at peek wouldn´t be to far from the truth.

The only thing laughabel is the blind trust you put in your sub numbers. And exactly during wich time period did you do the 9 month period? did it include spring 2009?

I have corrected my typo for the avoidance of doubt.

My blind trust? I thought you put this method forward as a method of getting some hard facts? Of course at the time we didn't realise that hard facts is 14 days and then make the numbers up to suit yourself anyway.

To quote:

"Sarr please do a propper servey on how many people you have online on avrage on the EU servers, that will take some time from your posting, i know, but your the one that´s been saying that the game is growing not me so i suggest you get some hard facts."

I assume you are now wriggling away from this method?

As for the 9 months I will quote myself, as you obviously didn't read it.

"Out of interest using in game player counts is not reliable, I tested that theory quite extensively over a long period on CoH as I could check the trend againt the quarterly posted subscription numbers. I wrongly believed that players online would at least show a subscription level trend, my theory was wrong."

and

"My analysis on CoH was over a 9 month period and it couldn't show me a trend, sorry 14 days is laughable".

So I fail to see whether this 9 month period on CoH covered Sping 2009 has any relevance?

Finally if you had bothered to read the other topic it included time and server.

"Keeper (20:30)

Level 1 to 5 - 87

Level 6 to 9 - 42

Level 10 to 12 - 41

Level 13 to 16 - 141"

So you did such an in depth analysis and came up with 75 to 150 people online, but one simple spot check shows your figures are made up. I will let people actually playing on the EU servers check for themselves to see how credible you are.

Alright it makes more sense when you don´t have typos, anyway you still can pull numbers down "abit" from dual accounts. If the headcount was made on the 6th (saturday) it´s still a low population during peaktime.
 

And i didn´t say my headcaount were good (looks like i have to repeat my self a 3rd time so you might read it this time) and as a ex-hardcore player my headcounts were correct at the time i made them, i admit some of em were made during weekdays but still during the peaktimes. 

As for the relevance spring 2009, ofc it is, it has been during this time the game has seen the largest outgoing flow of players and since it´s closer in to writing moment it would be the most fair and give the most accurate headcount, since noone is playing or looking to start to play last year.

And i still stand by my statment on what i think Sarr should do.

I do understand that some people will return to DDO "when" mod 9 is released, the rest about that you can read in my prev posts. And this arguing has derailed since your "jumping" in to a ongoing discusion that started with me saying that DDO has lost alot of players due to lack of comunication and the ammount of  content beeing released in mod8 and the lack i see beeing released in mod9.

does it matter? referring to one of Dr. Rock's post

i would compare your post to this example:

"You said that the business lost $100.00 last week. We actually only lost $50.00."

it is irrelevant as to whether there are 150 players or 350 players on a server at peak times because those numbers equal epic failure for DDO and its future

Originally posted by Bennyblyfot

Alright it makes more sense when you don´t have typos, anyway you still can pull numbers down "abit" from dual accounts. If the headcount was made on the 6th (saturday) it´s still a low population during peaktime.

While we are on the subject any chance you could check your spelling and grammar once in a while.
 

And i didn´t say my headcaount were good (looks like i have to repeat my self a 3rd time so you might read it this time) and as a ex-hardcore player my headcounts were correct at the time i made them, i admit some of em were made during weekdays but still during the peaktimes. 

Your numbers are clearly made up, if I can do a spot check (not even at peak time) and get twice the number of your highest recorded value (311 to 150 [the highest figure you recorded in 14 days]) and in the time you say numbers have been dropping, then sorry you are totally fabricating that number. But then anyone can prove you wrong they just need to do a count themselves. They can even do it in the US, if they get more than 250 at any time of the day, then they know you are making it up.

Unless you want to admit that numbers are actually increasing then I can read your post a 100 times and still see it is clearly lies.

As for the relevance spring 2009, ofc it is, it has been during this time the game has seen the largest outgoing flow of players and since it´s closer in to writing moment it would be the most fair and give the most accurate headcount, since noone is playing or looking to start to play last year.

Clearly you seem unable to comprehend the relevance of a similar analysis on CITY OF HEROES that could be double checked against actual subscription numbers, disproved the theory that in game numbers can be used to give trends for subscription numbers. 

Originally posted by Dr.Rock

Originally posted by Bennyblyfot

Alright it makes more sense when you don´t have typos, anyway you still can pull numbers down "abit" from dual accounts. If the headcount was made on the 6th (saturday) it´s still a low population during peaktime.

While we are on the subject any chance you could check your spelling and grammar once in a while.
 

And i didn´t say my headcaount were good (looks like i have to repeat my self a 3rd time so you might read it this time) and as a ex-hardcore player my headcounts were correct at the time i made them, i admit some of em were made during weekdays but still during the peaktimes. 

Your numbers are clearly made up, if I can do a spot check (not even at peak time) and get twice the number of your highest recorded value (311 to 150 [the highest figure you recorded in 14 days]) and in the time you say numbers have been dropping, then sorry you are totally fabricating that number. But then anyone can prove you wrong they just need to do a count themselves. They can even do it in the US, if they get more than 250 at any time of the day, then they know you are making it up.

Unless you want to admit that numbers are actually increasing then I can read your post a 100 times and still see it is clearly lies.

As for the relevance spring 2009, ofc it is, it has been during this time the game has seen the largest outgoing flow of players and since it´s closer in to writing moment it would be the most fair and give the most accurate headcount, since noone is playing or looking to start to play last year.

Clearly you seem unable to comprehend the relevance of a similar analysis on CITY OF HEROES that could be double checked against actual subscription numbers, disproved the theory that in game numbers can be used to give trends for subscription numbers. 

 

Well once people start to throw check your grammar replys there is no point in to keep a discusion going, and i will not make any excuses for my bad spelling or typos, if you don´t like it stop quoting me.

Now will you acctually stop highjacking my posts and trying  to make them look like something they are not.

All i can say is that DDO with 350 people or 75 is still the same  failure and if you enjoy playing it i suggest you go and do so b4 they close down the EU servers.

Originally posted by Dr.Rock

Originally posted by Bennyblyfot

Alright it makes more sense when you don´t have typos, anyway you still can pull numbers down "abit" from dual accounts. If the headcount was made on the 6th (saturday) it´s still a low population during peaktime.

While we are on the subject any chance you could check your spelling and grammar once in a while.
 

And i didn´t say my headcaount were good (looks like i have to repeat my self a 3rd time so you might read it this time) and as a ex-hardcore player my headcounts were correct at the time i made them, i admit some of em were made during weekdays but still during the peaktimes. 

Your numbers are clearly made up, if I can do a spot check (not even at peak time) and get twice the number of your highest recorded value (311 to 150 [the highest figure you recorded in 14 days]) and in the time you say numbers have been dropping, then sorry you are totally fabricating that number. But then anyone can prove you wrong they just need to do a count themselves. They can even do it in the US, if they get more than 250 at any time of the day, then they know you are making it up.

Unless you want to admit that numbers are actually increasing then I can read your post a 100 times and still see it is clearly lies.

As for the relevance spring 2009, ofc it is, it has been during this time the game has seen the largest outgoing flow of players and since it´s closer in to writing moment it would be the most fair and give the most accurate headcount, since noone is playing or looking to start to play last year.

Clearly you seem unable to comprehend the relevance of a similar analysis on CITY OF HEROES that could be double checked against actual subscription numbers, disproved the theory that in game numbers can be used to give trends for subscription numbers. 

 

Todays announcement pretty much backs up what people have been telling you. DDO went F2P, games with a growing population or real success do not go that route. End of story, today Turbine said DDO is in deep ****, but they said it nicely.
 

Well finaly we got the news, and the truth more or less. From what i see Cm will not keep DDO and update it to the new free toplay since there is no more money in it for them i forsee DDO-EU clsoing down in a year or so. The Eu popultaion will have to move to the U.S just like the Japaneese had to.

So all i can say is I TOLD YOU SO.