Originally posted by Dewm

one thing i'd like to say..and it might have been said already said....

 

to the people that breath "WOW CLONE!!!!!!!!"  shut the hell up!. thank you... I've play'd WoW, for around 2 years...so its not like "oh no he doesn't like game he is bias!"

 

But BEFORE I play'd wow I play'd a game that came out BEFORE WoW... it was called FFXI. here is a list for those who dont' know, of the jobs they had.

 

Bard                                =           wow mage
Beastmaster                 =           wow hunter
Black Mage                    =           wow worlock
Blue Mage                     =            wow hunter/mage
Corsair
Dancer
Dark Knight
Dragoon
Monk
Ninja
Paladin                              
Puppetmaster
Ranger
Red Mage
Samurai
Scholar
Summoner
Thief
Warrior
White Mage

and so and and so on.....look down the list. Now who is copying? HUH!?

(And btw FFXI came out in 03, WoW came out 04)

Wow started its development many years before that, It might have taken some things from FFXI but most stuff is from Everquest. And don't tell me that FFXI didn't borrowed content from EQ...

Of course EQ borrowed stuff from a game I played called Meridian 59, all game devs borrow from older games. But Wow clone ia usually wrong since most of the stuff was invented in EQ and not Wow, most players are just too young to remember that.

If TOR is cloning something it is cloning KOTOR anyways which is a evolution of the Baldurs gate 1 & 2 and Neverwinter nights games, the difference is that they made it massive.

Originally posted by Draccan

Originally posted by MikeB

Guys keep the thread on topic and cut out the personal attacks, I do not want to have to lock this thread.

If you feel the need to attack a user take a step back, breathe, and ask yourself if it will be worth the infraction.

 

Thanks!

 

Since I started the thread, and since I am not flaming anyone, can you do me a favor and NOT close the thread. I would like my opinion heard without some excuse to close it down.

Thanks!

yeah it sucks when you have to fear that your voice will be silenced for making too much sense to people who don't want to hear it

some people will kill you before they accept the truth (or what they know is truth but are afraid to admit it to themselves).
not saying what you're saying is truth, just the probable (but even then people want to believe its certain they're right and aren't willing to listen to reason)

 think it is fairly obvious by now that if one tries to see SW:TOR in the light of PRE-CU SWG, ST:TOR will be a failure.

The catch tho is that ST:TOR isn't supposed to be PRE-CU SWG. The idea that it would was generated only in and by the mind of the so called "Vets"- a classe where to a point i belong also since played That kind of swg.

Yet is it a group that I am ashamed to be connected with , since it promotes in a rampart way the dogma that any game has to be similar to pre-cu swg or follow the sandbox concept to be good.

Many of the things the OP claim are/will be true. Some are already obvious, others can be projected in the future by anyone with a working brain.

Oh good god Draccan, calm down. And stop trolling while you're at it. Just because the game isn't catering to the lowest common denominator of gamer doesn't mean its going to fail. Enough of the doom crap. If you don't think the game will be good, then don't bother coming here. But considering that we know next to nothing, patience would be a good thing so you don't look like a troll.

OP isnt far from the mark IMO. not that i'm really pissed this game doesnt appeal to me...it wasnt built to. while bioware has made a couple of games i liked i was never a fanboi for them. i thought mass effect was boring. too linear. but then again that game was built for the same playerbase this one is. the instant gratification console kiddies. fine by me seing as most of the devs associated with the last star wars mmo are working on this one and i already  know they dont know what they are doing.

                                                       and as far as bioware is concerned yeah you should worry. making a linear single player game is a far cry from maintaining a live mmo. this will be baptisim by fire indeed.

I would still wonder why you treat your opinion about the game as fact, while disreguarding anything the rest of us say?

How can a game not even in Beta, be a failure? I am really curious.  Are WAR/AoC Failures also because they don't have 11 million people?

It's great you have an opinion. Everyone does. But again, why is your opinion fact in this case that you so loudly troll it to be?  Why do you put down a game that is not out? Why not want a game to do good in its own right?  If people are not going to like it, they could try it and find out, whenever it comes out.  But you felt the need to post "the truth" and not an opinion.

I really think that is why you are getting such replies that resort to name calling.  The way you troll/speak in this thread, in my opinion is rather inciting to some people. Of course, those of us that are not name calling you, we are just wrong, or our opinions are totally incorrect?

If you came onto this forum and said, I sure won't like this game, for what I THINK<---- may happen, and here are my reasons for feeling that way, well, I doubt you would get such replies.  But a troll is a troll is a troll I guess.

I really have no idea why I still come to these forums...

OP should go into the 'THE WORLD IS ENDING!' prophecy business. Just keep gues..ehm predicting and you will get it right some day.

Seems like every new mmo coming out is going to "Fail". You cant always please everyone, the game will apeal to some, and turn off others....hmmm sounds like every single game ever made in existance. It looks cool, might bring a few things new to the table, it might not. We will just have to see when it gets launched. Until then, shut up. These kinds of posts arent helping anyone.

Originally posted by Draccan

 

New trailer looked sweet and awesome. But what is a cinematics trailer for a game? Nothing. Once you play the game it won't matter. Cinematics trailers are just fun. And this one rivalled some of the best cinematics I have seen.

 

But truth is that Bioware is still keeping major parts of what this game is about under wraps. But for sure some things can be concluded now:

1. Classes. Players will be stuck in one class.
http://www.swtor.com/info/holonet/classes
Seems to be eight classes. Jedi: Trooper, Jedi, Smuggler | Sith: Sith, Bounty Hunter

2. Factions. Players will be stuck in a faction - nothings points to mobility in allegiance.
Treaty of Coruscant = no real pvp
http://www.swtor.com/info/holonet/allegiances

3. Space. Not going to be included. We would have known by now.
Some will add: SWG didn't have it at launch, but this isn't 2003. Market is now very over-saturated with mmos and will be even more in a few years. Companies like Funcom counts on selling just enough copies at launch to give them a surplus. They know their games don't have lasting potential. ToR will have even less longevity than AoC.

4. Instances. Hard to say, but I wouldn't be surprised they go the way of AoC.

5. Crafting. Bioware states time and time again that this game is about story and heroes. Crafting is not part of their thought-proces. It isn't that slick, so why include it. Crafting is about creating your OWN story. And Bioware's idea of story-telling is that THEY need to direct your story.

6. Non-combat classes. This game will center on heroes. Meaning, vanilla gameplay with limited options. Don't expect anything but minor non-combat skills.

7.  Release date. Not going to be before 2011. These games always get postponed. Just wait and see. Could even be later.

8. Gameplay linear? Yes it will be. While technically possible to create great stories in a non-linear environment.

9. Housing? Player Cities? Housing and player cities also goes against the grain of their story-driven mmo where players are heroes, not housebuilder or crafters.

10. Combat system. Not much is known. But it will be smaller variety on the WoW/EQ formula. Sort of like other games like TCoS or AoC tries to change the formula. Don't expect something truly different, but something towards those lines. Maybe with a few twitch elements here and there.

11. Jedis. This time period is chosen to appeal to all the kids who wants to have a light-saber swining jedi (or sith). It is the lowest common denominator. There is no two ways about. But the uniqueness of the jedi character will drown in the multitudes of them after a while. Will that feeling of "wow a lightsaber" last?

12. PvP. A bit unclear. Except it to be children friendly. But since it is factional there must be some. A cross between WoW and WAR is not unheard of. Can anyone honestly expect something more hardcore with the direction this game is taking?

13. Graphics. Most likely next-gen graphics. Some improvements on existing ways of doing it. Maybe similar to AoC quality.

 

Conclusion:

This game is the NGE that LA always wanted. It will be linear, story-driven, have few hours of longevity, cater to the light-saber crowds, kids - tie in with graphical style of the Clone Wars, little crafting, not hardcore pvp, not many options, but lots of hand-holding and lead you through the maze..

Some might now jump in and say that it is guess-work, that we don't know all the facts; that maybe there will be deep crafting, hardcore pvp, housing, space flight etc. But these comments are ignorant and nothing to do with the truth. Truth is that the path of TOR is already set and it is set up for eye candy and a hollow gameplay. Not a real MMO as it won't be that massive or free.

Games make and break at launch now. There is no time to make space six to twelve months after (and what good did it really do SWG in the long run). There is no time to make that expansion that fixes all the problems (WAR + AoC). Either you make it or you will suffer a slow, suffocating death.

Bioware has taken the easy route of doing everything as simple and dumped-down as possible. It won't be hardcore pvp, it won't be massive diverse game with many play-options like crafting and non-combat professions.

What game companies does not understand is that the whole foundation of mmos is built around the principle that players should have the option of doing what THEY want in the game. Interact in many ways and not just kill-botting each other or npcs over and over. The combat oriented gamer should want the crafters and non-combatees to give flair and atmosphere to their game - to be able to interact with when needing an armour or a new weapon. This is what breathes life into the genre.

What Bioware is doing is to put one more nail in the mmo genre coffin. This game might get close to a million boxes sold or even 1.5 - but in the end it will be like many other mmos out there with empty, EMPTY servers after six months. People will buy it for the name, Star Wars, but leave when they see there is no freedom in this game. For Bioware it will mean not only breaking even, but also making a big chunk of cash - but for the players - the gaming community - it is just one more way to kill PC gaming..

 

Draccan

 

 

wow can we say propaganda.   Everything you stated is opinion and we all know what opinions are like.

Holy Bucketload of Speculation Batman!

I'm not saying this game is going to be perfect, but it is WAY too early to tell.

Chill, have a beer and a smoke and go relax or something.

anything anyone says until 6 months after the game is launched amounts to shit.

Originally posted by singsofdeath

 Nah. He's perfectly right. That's the way this game is going to be in the eyes of the sandbox/SWG pre-CU/UO crowd. It will be a failure because it doesn't cater to their tastes and thus, can't be good. 

 

Everyone else....well, I'd advise people, as usual, to stay put and wait. As i said before, BioWare has a big chunk of respect from me, simply because so far, they have never disappointed me with a game, so I am fairly optimistic about this one. That the trailer doesn't tell anything about the game, is just common sense. 

 

And that in the end, people should wait for the final product to be just around the corner to make up their minds is also common sense. Except for the sandbox/UO crowd. Because for them, this game is definately not the one. I don't say this with a sense of anger or hatred towards those people, but just as a statement of fact. 

 

Cheers.

I would probably fit in the "pre-cu/pre-nge" fanboi mold.  Yet I'm still looking forward to this game.  If there's absolutely no pvp, it will be a shame.  This has all the workings of a good rvr engine, a chance to make a true galatic war that SWG was never able to do beyond a joke.

Bioware has done outstanding jobs in creating immersion in the single player RPG's they've done.  Overall, that's what an MMO needs to do for the playerbase.  Make them feel part of something.  Some of the things they are trying I like from the RP standpoint in making a real story.  

And being honest, I do not think many of us who loved pre-cu would accept the pre-cu if it were launched today in the state it was.  The lack of polish, and the simple fact it is dated.  So I'm willing to see what this thing does.

Originally posted by Koolaider

I really have no idea why I still come to these forums...

Because it provides entertainment xD

Originally posted by Koolaider

I really have no idea why I still come to these forums...

I agree, these types of unfounded posts cropping up about every popular game is getting a little old.

Even the Darkfall forums have lost their fun.

Edit:  I have no problem with speculation and thinking a game is not going to do well.  What I do have a problem with is posters like the OP completely making up "facts" that have absolutely no basis in reality or what we know about the game.  Then for weeks/months from now the sheep that visit the forums will quote the OP as gospel like he is a visitor from the future who actually knows what he's talking about.

Originally posted by lornj

anything anyone says until 6 months after the game is launched amounts to shit.

true. it will easily pull in a million subs with the shiny graphics and the name. if people are still playing 6 months in.....

Originally posted by Draccan

 

New trailer looked sweet and awesome. But what is a cinematics trailer for a game? Nothing. Once you play the game it won't matter. Cinematics trailers are just fun. And this one rivalled some of the best cinematics I have seen.

 

But truth is that Bioware is still keeping major parts of what this game is about under wraps. But for sure some things can be concluded now:

1. Classes. Players will be stuck in one class.
http://www.swtor.com/info/holonet/classes
Seems to be eight classes. Jedi: Trooper, Jedi, Smuggler | Sith: Sith, Bounty Hunter

2. Factions. Players will be stuck in a faction - nothings points to mobility in allegiance.
Treaty of Coruscant = no real pvp
http://www.swtor.com/info/holonet/allegiances

3. Space. Not going to be included. We would have known by now.
Some will add: SWG didn't have it at launch, but this isn't 2003. Market is now very over-saturated with mmos and will be even more in a few years. Companies like Funcom counts on selling just enough copies at launch to give them a surplus. They know their games don't have lasting potential. ToR will have even less longevity than AoC.

4. Instances. Hard to say, but I wouldn't be surprised they go the way of AoC.

5. Crafting. Bioware states time and time again that this game is about story and heroes. Crafting is not part of their thought-proces. It isn't that slick, so why include it. Crafting is about creating your OWN story. And Bioware's idea of story-telling is that THEY need to direct your story.

6. Non-combat classes. This game will center on heroes. Meaning, vanilla gameplay with limited options. Don't expect anything but minor non-combat skills.

7.  Release date. Not going to be before 2011. These games always get postponed. Just wait and see. Could even be later.

8. Gameplay linear? Yes it will be. While technically possible to create great stories in a non-linear environment.

9. Housing? Player Cities? Housing and player cities also goes against the grain of their story-driven mmo where players are heroes, not housebuilder or crafters.

10. Combat system. Not much is known. But it will be smaller variety on the WoW/EQ formula. Sort of like other games like TCoS or AoC tries to change the formula. Don't expect something truly different, but something towards those lines. Maybe with a few twitch elements here and there.

11. Jedis. This time period is chosen to appeal to all the kids who wants to have a light-saber swining jedi (or sith). It is the lowest common denominator. There is no two ways about. But the uniqueness of the jedi character will drown in the multitudes of them after a while. Will that feeling of "wow a lightsaber" last?

12. PvP. A bit unclear. Except it to be children friendly. But since it is factional there must be some. A cross between WoW and WAR is not unheard of. Can anyone honestly expect something more hardcore with the direction this game is taking?

13. Graphics. Most likely next-gen graphics. Some improvements on existing ways of doing it. Maybe similar to AoC quality.

 

Conclusion:

This game is the NGE that LA always wanted. It will be linear, story-driven, have few hours of longevity, cater to the light-saber crowds, kids - tie in with graphical style of the Clone Wars, little crafting, not hardcore pvp, not many options, but lots of hand-holding and lead you through the maze..

Some might now jump in and say that it is guess-work, that we don't know all the facts; that maybe there will be deep crafting, hardcore pvp, housing, space flight etc. But these comments are ignorant and nothing to do with the truth. Truth is that the path of TOR is already set and it is set up for eye candy and a hollow gameplay. Not a real MMO as it won't be that massive or free.

Games make and break at launch now. There is no time to make space six to twelve months after (and what good did it really do SWG in the long run). There is no time to make that expansion that fixes all the problems (WAR + AoC). Either you make it or you will suffer a slow, suffocating death.

Bioware has taken the easy route of doing everything as simple and dumped-down as possible. It won't be hardcore pvp, it won't be massive diverse game with many play-options like crafting and non-combat professions.

What game companies does not understand is that the whole foundation of mmos is built around the principle that players should have the option of doing what THEY want in the game. Interact in many ways and not just kill-botting each other or npcs over and over. The combat oriented gamer should want the crafters and non-combatees to give flair and atmosphere to their game - to be able to interact with when needing an armour or a new weapon. This is what breathes life into the genre.

What Bioware is doing is to put one more nail in the mmo genre coffin. This game might get close to a million boxes sold or even 1.5 - but in the end it will be like many other mmos out there with empty, EMPTY servers after six months. People will buy it for the name, Star Wars, but leave when they see there is no freedom in this game. For Bioware it will mean not only breaking even, but also making a big chunk of cash - but for the players - the gaming community - it is just one more way to kill PC gaming..

 

Draccan

 

 

Since you seem to have a crystal ball or some kind of future tuned ESP can you give me next months Lotto number please?  If not, that wall of text seems like a waste of keystrokes to me.  ToR will be somewhere on the spectrum of great to suck for sure but only a complete asshat would proclaim to know where it will sit on that scale now.

In all reality I'm so over the overdramtic geek squads who cry about games before they come out. Really.... Over... It... This used to be a place where people could go to get an honest opinion about a game they were interested in now.  I think its time to move to a new web site.  When it comes out, try it, if you don't like it give your reasons and move on.  If its not out yet and still in development, let's not wet ourselves yet.

Phew that felt better.

Made an account for this site just to refute your claims, that's how out of touch I think you are.

1. Classes. SWG's unique ability to allow you to change your class on well established character was truly niche. For those that aren't aware, most of SWG's features have only ever existed in SWG, sorry to break it to you. Classes likely will have that Wow-esque feel for better or for worse. My only fear is that having 4 classes on each side would cause lots of redundancy, but I"m open to see where Bioware's headed.

2. Factions. Once again, Wow-esque. God forbid you roll another toon. As for the treaty? Have you ever heard of that treaty that North and South Korea signed? Exactly. Skirmishes will abound, in some form or another.

3. Space. Jump to Lightspeed made SWG that much better and is easily the best part to come out of that MMO. I would be surprised if Bioware hasn't put some thought into a space expansion. Patience is a virtue. Longevity? They haven't even announced anything related to end-game.

4. Instances. You really have no idea. None of us do. So don't try until we hear something else.

5. Crafting. They've officially announced just two classes. Why would they talk about what you can craft right now?

6. Non-combat classes. Regrettably, you're right with this one. But it doesn't mean it's going to be bad.

7. Release date. 2011? The would mean a 5 year development cycle. With the game being based on the Hero engine, meaning a good amount of the work is already done, I would be surprised if it's not released summer or fall of next year.

8. Gameplay linear? While Bioware's recent titles haven't been shining examples of open-ended gameplay (Mass Effect tried, and was meh on it's optional content), MMOs are too big not to have lots of options. But if you're expecting anything different from many different quest chains, which EVERYTHING does, then your loss. Nevertheless, I get the feeling that you have never played a Bioware title. Your decisions matter greatly and will affect what happens in the game. That alone gives it a bit more depth than Galaxies and Wow put together.

9. Housing? Player Cities? Yeah, your second point out of nine that's very likely to be right. But come on, go build a real house or something.

10. Combat system. Honestly, the only way to effectively pull of the Star Wars feel is for something like a first person shooter. If that's your game style, then great, if not, then go play EVE.

11. Jedis. At least they won't ge their lightsabers until failry into the game, but yes, this will always be the great fear. But Bioware is intelligent enough to hopefully balance it out. Although the Trooper class does make me laugh.

12. PvP. It'll have a teen rating, Episode III was PG-13, and KOTOR was rated T as are most Star Wars games today. Expect something violent, just without any blood. Which, honestly, is all you can really expect. And as NOTHING has been announced to date, you once again, really have no idea.

13. Graphics. "Most likely next-gen graphics. Some improvements on existing ways of doing it. Maybe similar to AoC quality." Just go look a screenshot. They're going for a bit of a cartoony feel to hopefully make the game feel a bit more timeless, which is a fair direction with their art. Games that go for that realistic feel ALWAYS feel outdated a mere 2 years later.

Conclusion: You've basically listed everything from SWG that everyone wants back, but it's not happening. In any game. Ever. Basically, you have to withold judgement until more information becomes available about pvp and end-game content.

As for everyone that suddenly thinks this is best thing since sliced bread because of that trailer, go away or quit early, because I want to be able to enjoy the game like everyone else who's been following it since it's announcement. (Makes me elitist? Already? Well, don't care.)

You do yourself a huge misdeed if you are still in bed with SWG.

Originally posted by tillamook

Originally posted by todeswulf

Originally posted by Teala

Sadly the OP might be right.   What we've seen so far isn't really all that impressive in the way of the game itself.    It seems there will not be much variety in weapons for like the Trooper class - beyond color schemes.   Armor seems a variation of the same.   The fact that there seems to be  no space combat (ship-to-ship) is sad.    I dunno.  I will wait and see what they show us on Wednesday...but to be honest I do not think it will be all that impressive.   God I hope I am wrong.

 

 

The only thing that is epic is the premature failgasims by jaded gamers.  Here is a thought; how about forming an opinion after you actually play a game?  Like oh my god what a concept!!!

The shill is strong with this one.

Here's my guess, most of the people saying this game is fail will be playing TOR within the first year after they here how much fun people are having in it. Some may even be outside Bestbuy standing in line for the midnight launch. xD

Noooooo people having fun in SWTOR no that cant be right *checks crystal ball* see  it says TOR will fail, no point in talking about this anymore Im gonna call Biwoare in the morning and tell them to just close up shop in Austin.

Anyways I highly doubt it will relase later then fall of 2010. Imo they should go for a late spring or early summer relase and then just dominate the gaming world from Dragon Age release to ME2 to TOR now that would be a awesome year of gaming.

And the game is not even out yet and peoples think it's fail already ???

Go read a book or something or find something else to do then come whine on a game that  not even launched  yet or even remotely in beta yet .

Geez

Originally posted by Draccan

 

New trailer looked sweet and awesome. But what is a cinematics trailer for a game? Nothing. Once you play the game it won't matter. Cinematics trailers are just fun. And this one rivalled some of the best cinematics I have seen.

 

But truth is that Bioware is still keeping major parts of what this game is about under wraps. But for sure some things can be concluded now:

1. Classes. Players will be stuck in one class.
http://www.swtor.com/info/holonet/classes
Seems to be eight classes. Jedi: Trooper, Jedi, Smuggler | Sith: Sith, Bounty Hunter

Normally that is the case, you -play one class at a time.

2. Factions. Players will be stuck in a faction - nothings points to mobility in allegiance.
Treaty of Coruscant = no real pvp
http://www.swtor.com/info/holonet/allegiances

Welcome to faction based gaming and if you had watched all of the trailers and dev chats, you would now the "treaty" is failing. In other words, PVP potenital on the horizon.

3. Space. Not going to be included. We would have known by now.
Some will add: SWG didn't have it at launch, but this isn't 2003. Market is now very over-saturated with mmos and will be even more in a few years. Companies like Funcom counts on selling just enough copies at launch to give them a surplus. They know their games don't have lasting potential. ToR will have even less longevity than AoC.

Huh? On the issue of space, I say good - I play an MMO to play a character, not a space ship. SWG introduced space as a way to try and keep players around.

4. Instances. Hard to say, but I wouldn't be surprised they go the way of AoC.

Instancing is here to stay. Sorry but that's just a fact of life.

5. Crafting. Bioware states time and time again that this game is about story and heroes. Crafting is not part of their thought-proces. It isn't that slick, so why include it. Crafting is about creating your OWN story. And Bioware's idea of story-telling is that THEY need to direct your story.

Sure about that? Until I hear Bioware say one way or another, I am not going to claim to know the future.

6. Non-combat classes. This game will center on heroes. Meaning, vanilla gameplay with limited options. Don't expect anything but minor non-combat skills.

Good. Sorry but dancing in a  cantina as a profession was just lame.

7.  Release date. Not going to be before 2011. These games always get postponed. Just wait and see. Could even be later.

Really? You think so? If you look at the history of Bioware games, they are not announced early on but later in the production cycle. I expect the game Q3-Q4 2010.

8. Gameplay linear? Yes it will be. While technically possible to create great stories in a non-linear environment.

9. Housing? Player Cities? Housing and player cities also goes against the grain of their story-driven mmo where players are heroes, not housebuilder or crafters.

Good.

10. Combat system. Not much is known. But it will be smaller variety on the WoW/EQ formula. Sort of like other games like TCoS or AoC tries to change the formula. Don't expect something truly different, but something towards those lines. Maybe with a few twitch elements here and there.

11. Jedis. This time period is chosen to appeal to all the kids who wants to have a light-saber swining jedi (or sith). It is the lowest common denominator. There is no two ways about. But the uniqueness of the jedi character will drown in the multitudes of them after a while. Will that feeling of "wow a lightsaber" last?

You are so caught up with the whole lightsaber = kiddies game that you fail to see past it. The real reason Bioware chose this time period is because SWG failed mainly because they chose a time period that was already scripted and events pre-determined by story and lore. This is the smartest move by Bioware in my opinion. SWG would have done better is they had set it post ROTJ but they didn't.

12. PvP. A bit unclear. Except it to be children friendly. But since it is factional there must be some. A cross between WoW and WAR is not unheard of. Can anyone honestly expect something more hardcore with the direction this game is taking?

I expect it to have a rating similar to WOW. Star Wars is NOT a hardcore universe so it won't be a hardcore game. That should be obvious. And if you think Star Wars is all "kiddie" then you are very mistaken. This game will be dominated by people who grew up with the original movies like myself.

13. Graphics. Most likely next-gen graphics. Some improvements on existing ways of doing it. Maybe similar to AoC quality.

 

Conclusion:

This game is the NGE that LA always wanted. It will be linear, story-driven, have few hours of longevity, cater to the light-saber crowds, kids - tie in with graphical style of the Clone Wars, little crafting, not hardcore pvp, not many options, but lots of hand-holding and lead you through the maze..

Some might now jump in and say that it is guess-work, that we don't know all the facts; that maybe there will be deep crafting, hardcore pvp, housing, space flight etc. But these comments are ignorant and nothing to do with the truth. Truth is that the path of TOR is already set and it is set up for eye candy and a hollow gameplay. Not a real MMO as it won't be that massive or free.

So in other words everyone else speculating is wrong and you are right?

Games make and break at launch now. There is no time to make space six to twelve months after (and what good did it really do SWG in the long run). There is no time to make that expansion that fixes all the problems (WAR + AoC). Either you make it or you will suffer a slow, suffocating death.

Bioware has taken the easy route of doing everything as simple and dumped-down as possible. It won't be hardcore pvp, it won't be massive diverse game with many play-options like crafting and non-combat professions.

What game companies does not understand is that the whole foundation of mmos is built around the principle that players should have the option of doing what THEY want in the game. Interact in many ways and not just kill-botting each other or npcs over and over. The combat oriented gamer should want the crafters and non-combatees to give flair and atmosphere to their game - to be able to interact with when needing an armour or a new weapon. This is what breathes life into the genre.

What Bioware is doing is to put one more nail in the mmo genre coffin. This game might get close to a million boxes sold or even 1.5 - but in the end it will be like many other mmos out there with empty, EMPTY servers after six months. People will buy it for the name, Star Wars, but leave when they see there is no freedom in this game. For Bioware it will mean not only breaking even, but also making a big chunk of cash - but for the players - the gaming community - it is just one more way to kill PC gaming..

 

Draccan

Funny, at one moment people like the OP will criticize the MMO market for being stale, not innovative and trying to copy WOW.

Along comes a game that is trying to be different and innovative (albeit in a different way than many would like) and people want to call the game a failure already.

Anyone else see a case of trying to have your cake and eat it too?

SW:Tor may be a failure in your opinion and you may be worried about it, but I give Bioware some serious pats on the back and congratulate them for trying something new and different. I feel like the MMO genre IS missing story based foci and I think Bioware is on to the next big thing in MMO evolution.

Not every player wants to do what they want to do. I like following a set path and playing a game that tells a story. You sound like a sandbox player who is upset that this isn't SWG 2 and a sandbox (just like the other thousand trolls in this forum).

Next time, just post: "WHHHHHAAAAA, Bioware is making a game without me in mind and I don't like it. WHHHHHAAAAA"

Sorry but that is what your post sounds like to me.

It's not Bioware's fault, I wish them the best

It's the fricken genre as a whole. "This game will knock your socks off! You'll see in a year or two!"

Fool me once...twice...three times...uuggghhh...

Originally posted by Draccan

 

New trailer looked sweet and awesome. But what is a cinematics trailer for a game? Nothing. Once you play the game it won't matter. Cinematics trailers are just fun. And this one rivalled some of the best cinematics I have seen.

 

But truth is that Bioware is still keeping major parts of what this game is about under wraps. But for sure some things can be concluded now:

1. Classes. Players will be stuck in one class.
http://www.swtor.com/info/holonet/classes
Seems to be eight classes. Jedi: Trooper, Jedi, Smuggler | Sith: Sith, Bounty Hunter

2. Factions. Players will be stuck in a faction - nothings points to mobility in allegiance.
Treaty of Coruscant = no real pvp
http://www.swtor.com/info/holonet/allegiances

3. Space. Not going to be included. We would have known by now.
Some will add: SWG didn't have it at launch, but this isn't 2003. Market is now very over-saturated with mmos and will be even more in a few years. Companies like Funcom counts on selling just enough copies at launch to give them a surplus. They know their games don't have lasting potential. ToR will have even less longevity than AoC.

4. Instances. Hard to say, but I wouldn't be surprised they go the way of AoC.

5. Crafting. Bioware states time and time again that this game is about story and heroes. Crafting is not part of their thought-proces. It isn't that slick, so why include it. Crafting is about creating your OWN story. And Bioware's idea of story-telling is that THEY need to direct your story.

6. Non-combat classes. This game will center on heroes. Meaning, vanilla gameplay with limited options. Don't expect anything but minor non-combat skills.

7.  Release date. Not going to be before 2011. These games always get postponed. Just wait and see. Could even be later.

8. Gameplay linear? Yes it will be. While technically possible to create great stories in a non-linear environment.

9. Housing? Player Cities? Housing and player cities also goes against the grain of their story-driven mmo where players are heroes, not housebuilder or crafters.

10. Combat system. Not much is known. But it will be smaller variety on the WoW/EQ formula. Sort of like other games like TCoS or AoC tries to change the formula. Don't expect something truly different, but something towards those lines. Maybe with a few twitch elements here and there.

11. Jedis. This time period is chosen to appeal to all the kids who wants to have a light-saber swining jedi (or sith). It is the lowest common denominator. There is no two ways about. But the uniqueness of the jedi character will drown in the multitudes of them after a while. Will that feeling of "wow a lightsaber" last?

12. PvP. A bit unclear. Except it to be children friendly. But since it is factional there must be some. A cross between WoW and WAR is not unheard of. Can anyone honestly expect something more hardcore with the direction this game is taking?

13. Graphics. Most likely next-gen graphics. Some improvements on existing ways of doing it. Maybe similar to AoC quality.

 

Conclusion:

This game is the NGE that LA always wanted. It will be linear, story-driven, have few hours of longevity, cater to the light-saber crowds, kids - tie in with graphical style of the Clone Wars, little crafting, not hardcore pvp, not many options, but lots of hand-holding and lead you through the maze..

Some might now jump in and say that it is guess-work, that we don't know all the facts; that maybe there will be deep crafting, hardcore pvp, housing, space flight etc. But these comments are ignorant and nothing to do with the truth. Truth is that the path of TOR is already set and it is set up for eye candy and a hollow gameplay. Not a real MMO as it won't be that massive or free.

Games make and break at launch now. There is no time to make space six to twelve months after (and what good did it really do SWG in the long run). There is no time to make that expansion that fixes all the problems (WAR + AoC). Either you make it or you will suffer a slow, suffocating death.

Bioware has taken the easy route of doing everything as simple and dumped-down as possible. It won't be hardcore pvp, it won't be massive diverse game with many play-options like crafting and non-combat professions.

What game companies does not understand is that the whole foundation of mmos is built around the principle that players should have the option of doing what THEY want in the game. Interact in many ways and not just kill-botting each other or npcs over and over. The combat oriented gamer should want the crafters and non-combatees to give flair and atmosphere to their game - to be able to interact with when needing an armour or a new weapon. This is what breathes life into the genre.

What Bioware is doing is to put one more nail in the mmo genre coffin. This game might get close to a million boxes sold or even 1.5 - but in the end it will be like many other mmos out there with empty, EMPTY servers after six months. People will buy it for the name, Star Wars, but leave when they see there is no freedom in this game. For Bioware it will mean not only breaking even, but also making a big chunk of cash - but for the players - the gaming community - it is just one more way to kill PC gaming..

 

Draccan

 

 

14.  Christmas.  Pointless, as Santa Claus does not exist, and you never get what you want for presents.
 

15.  Life.  Only a bitterly cruel ghost image of happier days past.  Must drive car into abutment at high rate of speed.

What a complete wanker...

I thought the video was great.  Hopefully, it's indicative of how much effort and resources are going to be pumped into the development of this game.  You'd have to be a slackjawed mouthbreather to write this game off already.

It is sort of funny to see that fans get so defensive over this and retort to name-calling and using the same old arguments about crystal balls..

You fail to see the bigger picture.

Bioware is aiming at the lowest common denominator with this game. I am sure it will look good, have voice-acting (but not 100% as was promised) and be sort of polished at release. But look at the demographics here.

Who here really believes this game will cater to either mmo veterans? It is aimed at young audience, who either never played an mmo and those who have played WoW.

There is such much likeness between the two. WoW and ToR.

I don't say SW: TOR won't make any money, but I am saying that as a gamer I feel it is hurting the industry by mass-producing more of the same old that is over-saturating the market.

I have been following mmos that are under construction. I stopped updating my mmorpg.com post a long while ago and the numbers of announced mmos have exploded ever since. With E3 even more titles are announced.

So what is the effect of all these mmos? I think less and less of them will survive in the long run. Games will run for shorter spins and unsuccesful ones will be closed sooner (as with TR) instead of lingering for years.

I also feel that mmos will change and more of them will indeed be story-based and created for being played for some months - as with ToR. Essentially like multi-player games without the massive part.