so he didnt make L+L2?

Originally posted by SgtFrog

so he didnt make L+L2?

No. L1+L2 were developed for and by the Korean division of NCSoft. Garriott's influence only extended to NCSoft West (The US division). At most he published L2 in the states (after it already being established in Korea.)

Wikipedia states that he had some kind of producer credit for Lineage, but I find it hard to believe as Garriott was still with Origin Systems/UO at the time of it's development.

Originally posted by Gennadios

Originally posted by SgtFrog

so he didnt make L+L2?

No. L1+L2 were developed for and by the Korean division of NCSoft. Garriott's influence only extended to NCSoft West (The US division). At most he published L2 in the states (after it already being established in Korea.)

Wikipedia states that he had some kind of producer credit for Lineage, but I find it hard to believe as Garriott was still with Origin Systems/UO at the time of it's development.

i though so,

i was so confused

didnt seem like his game so i was right

he only made ultima and ts

Originally posted by SgtFrog

Originally posted by Gennadios

Originally posted by SgtFrog

so he didnt make L+L2?

No. L1+L2 were developed for and by the Korean division of NCSoft. Garriott's influence only extended to NCSoft West (The US division). At most he published L2 in the states (after it already being established in Korea.)

Wikipedia states that he had some kind of producer credit for Lineage, but I find it hard to believe as Garriott was still with Origin Systems/UO at the time of it's development.

 

i though so,

i was so confused

didnt seem like his game so i was right

he only made ultima and ts

Well not entirely. He did spend alot of time with the developers of lineage to help make the game. So he was a large part of the creation, even though it was not him who nessecarily came up with the idea of lineage.

Originally posted by Zzulu

 

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Hmm. ?

I dont see why anybody would want to work with Gariot at this point.  Tabula Rasa taught the mmo community that his popularity no longer attracts the masses.  I would think that Gariot is now blacklisted due to the way he is bringing a lawsuit against NCsoft, his former employer.

Originally posted by TheHavok

I dont see why anybody would want to work with Gariot at this point.  Tabula Rasa taught the mmo community that his popularity no longer attracts the masses.  I would think that Gariot is now blacklisted due to the way he is bringing a lawsuit against NCsoft, his former employer.

I agree with this.  Filling a lawsuit most likely killed any chance he had at leading another mmo product with a big company, no matter how remote. 

Still, I wouldn't mind seeing him team up with EA on another ultima game to see what it could produce.  At this point in the industry could it do any worse than we are already getting? 

At this point I think it is pretty clear you cannot hand bags full of money and complete unsupervised control of the entire division/company to the creative people who create games.  Garriot, MacQuaid, etc...  These people need someone else in charge to keep them focused and on target. 

Originally posted by NeverLand7

Originally posted by SgtFrog

Originally posted by Gennadios

Originally posted by SgtFrog

so he didnt make L+L2?

No. L1+L2 were developed for and by the Korean division of NCSoft. Garriott's influence only extended to NCSoft West (The US division). At most he published L2 in the states (after it already being established in Korea.)

Wikipedia states that he had some kind of producer credit for Lineage, but I find it hard to believe as Garriott was still with Origin Systems/UO at the time of it's development.

 

i though so,

i was so confused

didnt seem like his game so i was right

he only made ultima and ts

 

Well not entirely. He did spend alot of time with the developers of lineage to help make the game. So he was a large part of the creation, even though it was not him who nessecarily came up with the idea of lineage.

he just managed the L1+L2 Release in NA and EU. thats all.

Originally posted by JGMIII

Originally posted by SgtFrog

Originally posted by JGMIII

Originally posted by SgtFrog

Guy made one supposedly good game and he thinks his king of the world...his time of fame is gone and he just cant take it.

 

Only one game? Are you forgetting all the awesome freaking Rpg games he developed?

UO and Lineage 1 and 2.

Give the guy some credit, sure he dropped the ball with TR but imo that was NCsofts fault. Check out TR the way Garriot wanted to be. It was basically a fantasy MMO with Lazer swords. you should be able to find a demo on youtube.

i was not even aware of that lol, i love L and L2...

/FACEPALM SELF

Yeha man the guy has been making RPGs that Evolved the genre since the 80's his first game sold for like 5 bucks in a little static bag hung on a board at a local PC shop, totally homebrewd .

All everyone ever thinks about is TR, how could just one game destroy a mans legacy when he defined two genres?

In the early 1980s, Garriott developed the Ultima computer game series (sequels after the first were numbered, such as Ultima II, Ultima III and so on). Originally programmed for the Apple II, the first was published by California Pacific Computers, and sold in Ziploc plastic bags to interested parties. The second part was published by Sierra On-Line. By the time he developed his third installment, the games had such a large following that Garriott (along with his brother, Robert, and father and others) established Origin Systems, their own video game publisher, to handle the publishing and distribution of his title, now available on several platforms. Origin went on to become one of the most influential game developers in the history of video games. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_Garriott

Originally posted by SgtFrog

Originally posted by NeverLand7

Originally posted by SgtFrog

Originally posted by Gennadios

Originally posted by SgtFrog

so he didnt make L+L2?

No. L1+L2 were developed for and by the Korean division of NCSoft. Garriott's influence only extended to NCSoft West (The US division). At most he published L2 in the states (after it already being established in Korea.)

Wikipedia states that he had some kind of producer credit for Lineage, but I find it hard to believe as Garriott was still with Origin Systems/UO at the time of it's development.

 

i though so,

i was so confused

didnt seem like his game so i was right

he only made ultima and ts

 

Well not entirely. He did spend alot of time with the developers of lineage to help make the game. So he was a large part of the creation, even though it was not him who nessecarily came up with the idea of lineage.

he just managed the L1+L2 Release in NA and EU. thats all.

 

Well unless Garriot is a lier, he said in an interview that he worked side by side the korean developers of L1-2 in the creation and development process.

Originally posted by JGMIII

Originally posted by SgtFrog

Originally posted by JGMIII

Originally posted by SgtFrog

Guy made one supposedly good game and he thinks his king of the world...his time of fame is gone and he just cant take it.

 

Only one game? Are you forgetting all the awesome freaking Rpg games he developed?

UO and Lineage 1 and 2.

Give the guy some credit, sure he dropped the ball with TR but imo that was NCsofts fault. Check out TR the way Garriot wanted to be. It was basically a fantasy MMO with Lazer swords. you should be able to find a demo on youtube.

i was not even aware of that lol, i love L and L2...

/FACEPALM SELF

Yeha man the guy has been making RPGs that Evolved the genre since the 80's his first game sold for like 5 bucks in a little static bag hung on a board at a local PC shop, totally homebrewd .

All everyone ever thinks about is TR, how could just one game destroy a mans legacy when he defined two genres?

That's because probably 80% of the people here were not born yet when his pre-TR games released...
 

Originally posted by cfurlin

Originally posted by JGMIII

Originally posted by SgtFrog

Originally posted by JGMIII

Originally posted by SgtFrog

Guy made one supposedly good game and he thinks his king of the world...his time of fame is gone and he just cant take it.

 

Only one game? Are you forgetting all the awesome freaking Rpg games he developed?

UO and Lineage 1 and 2.

Give the guy some credit, sure he dropped the ball with TR but imo that was NCsofts fault. Check out TR the way Garriot wanted to be. It was basically a fantasy MMO with Lazer swords. you should be able to find a demo on youtube.

i was not even aware of that lol, i love L and L2...

/FACEPALM SELF

Yeha man the guy has been making RPGs that Evolved the genre since the 80's his first game sold for like 5 bucks in a little static bag hung on a board at a local PC shop, totally homebrewd .

All everyone ever thinks about is TR, how could just one game destroy a mans legacy when he defined two genres?

That's because probably 80% of the people here were not born yet when his pre-TR games released...
 

i was born in 1988 im the oldest person on the internet :P

well i for one dont want old experienced mmo designers designing the next generation of Mo's especially gariott. The fact he had his name bigger than the title showed the gaming world how much he cared about the actual game.

Until a truely creative person has complete control over the license i think we are going to see a lot of cut and paste wow clones appearing on the market ovre the coming years. Hoping star trek online will be indepth enough to get me interested.

But the fact remains corporations control the MMO market now and as such they want a quick turn around and a quick buck. Thats the problem, i suspect Spore would have been truely amazing if EA handt totally butchered the game.

Gariott is old hat he lost his chance to wow us with Tabula Rasa and instead tarnished his own name by proclaiming all he was.

Originally posted by TheHavok

I dont see why anybody would want to work with Gariot at this point.  Tabula Rasa taught the mmo community that his popularity no longer attracts the masses.  I would think that Gariot is now blacklisted due to the way he is bringing a lawsuit against NCsoft, his former employer.

I agree with this as well.  Quite frankly, he made his mark and his money. And now he's old news.  But it didn't have to be this way.  I read where him and his girlfriend worked extensively on Logos.  To me, this could have been a revolutionary step in gaming.   Similar to how Klingon was developed into a complex language, Logos could have been developed into the same over time, possibly gaining a strong fan base, having stories written about it, or including it.  To me, this should have been a writer's dream, and it could have revitalized Garriott's fame and fanbase, if that's what he was after.

All of us who grew up with Ultima will remember him for the richness of what he created. Unfortunately, those who only knew him from TR won't give his legacy or his potential a second thought.

I honestly don't think the guy really cares anymore, anyway.

Originally posted by andrelle

Originally posted by TheHavok

I dont see why anybody would want to work with Gariot at this point.  Tabula Rasa taught the mmo community that his popularity no longer attracts the masses.  I would think that Gariot is now blacklisted due to the way he is bringing a lawsuit against NCsoft, his former employer.

 

I agree with this as well.  Quite frankly, he made his mark and his money. And now he's old news.  But it didn't have to be this way.  I read where him and his girlfriend worked extensively on Logos.  To me, this could have been a revolutionary step in gaming.   Similar to how Klingon was developed into a complex language, Logos could have been developed into the same over time, possibly gaining a strong fan base, having stories written about it, or including it.  To me, this should have been a writer's dream, and it could have revitalized Garriott's fame and fanbase, if that's what he was after.

All of us who grew up with Ultima will remember him for the richness of what he created. Unfortunately, those who only knew him from TR won't give his legacy or his potential a second thought.

I honestly don't think the guy really cares anymore, anyway.

He's going to find another planet for us to live on and develop our brains better. Then, he'll pay Sega to make a mmorpg Dream Super Console and we will all live happily ever after.

      While I liked the Ultima series I wasnt a huge fan of UO.......With todays graphics though UO could be alot better than it was......To me one of the major downfalls of UO was its rule set and its terrible graphics.....

Originally posted by TheHavok

I dont see why anybody would want to work with Gariot at this point.  Tabula Rasa taught the mmo community that his popularity no longer attracts the masses.  I would think that Gariot is now blacklisted due to the way he is bringing a lawsuit against NCsoft, his former employer.

To be fair, his lawsuit against NCSoft is over the terms of his leaving. According to the complaint he filed in court, he was given stock options in NCSoft as part of their purchase of his company, Destination Games. The contract they had stated that if he got fired, his stock options would remain in effect until 2011. If he left on his own, however, they'd immediately terminate on the date of his resignation.

The dispute is over the letter he supposedly wrote last November saying he was leaving NCSoft to puruse other interests in the aftermath of his space flight. Garriott says he never wrote that letter, and that NCSoft did. He's accusing them of firing him, but making it look like he resigned, so they wouldn't have to allow him to keep his stock options. Whether that's true or not, I have no idea. The courts are going to have to decide that.

All of that said, he's a smart guy, but he's past his time in gaming, just like Brad McQuaid before him. If there are any new ideas to come in MMO's, they won't be from either of those two guys. It will be someone else who comes up with the next big paradigm shift in MMO's.

eh what?

Ultima Online = owned by EA, not Garriot.

Garriot = Not EA employee

Originally posted by Lidane

Originally posted by TheHavok

I dont see why anybody would want to work with Gariot at this point.  Tabula Rasa taught the mmo community that his popularity no longer attracts the masses.  I would think that Gariot is now blacklisted due to the way he is bringing a lawsuit against NCsoft, his former employer.

To be fair, his lawsuit against NCSoft is over the terms of his leaving. According to the complaint he filed in court, he was given stock options in NCSoft as part of their purchase of his company, Destination Games. The contract they had stated that if he got fired, his stock options would remain in effect until 2011. If he left on his own, however, they'd immediately terminate on the date of his resignation.

The dispute is over the letter he supposedly wrote last November saying he was leaving NCSoft to puruse other interests in the aftermath of his space flight. Garriott says he never wrote that letter, and that NCSoft did. He's accusing them of firing him, but making it look like he resigned, so they wouldn't have to allow him to keep his stock options. Whether that's true or not, I have no idea. The courts are going to have to decide that.

All of that said, he's a smart guy, but he's past his time in gaming, just like Brad McQuaid before him. If there are any new ideas to come in MMO's, they won't be from either of those two guys. It will be someone else who comes up with the next big paradigm shift in MMO's.

I agree with all that, PLUS Tabula Rasa lost 100 million bucks. I think that's punishment enough for NCSoft no matter what the deal was with Garriott. And Garriott can't push all the blame for that on NCSoft.

Originally posted by Dameonk

The sheer amount of misinformation in this thread is staggering.
 

This thread has a point?

Originally posted by JGMIII

Originally posted by SgtFrog

Guy made one supposedly good game and he thinks his king of the world...his time of fame is gone and he just cant take it.

 

Only one game? Are you forgetting all the awesome freaking Rpg games he developed?

UO and Lineage 1 and 2.

He had nothing to do with Lineage 1...

Originally posted by SgtFrog

so he didnt make L+L2?

no

ncsoft developed it and not in north america either

one hint as to where it was developed and by whom?  Its not a north american game..

L2 boasted garriots chaotic karma kill system and a lot of UO players moved to L2 because of it.   They referred to garriot in L2 as Lord British which is about the only name people seem to recognize.    Aside from that most of the development was .... not north american and it was not released in north america until it was messed with in... (not north america) .  

 http://archive.gamespy.com/interviews/december01/british/

Garriott founded Destination Games and then merged with NCsoft, whose Lineage title has become a smash hit in Korea and Japan.
 

However, the game we're working on right now, called Tabula Rasa, which is solidly a second-generation title, specifically does what you describe, where you blend together the great features of solo-player games where you feel well sheparded and you also feel very special

To be honest if you look at what happened no one really knows how much of lineage 2 was worked on by garriot.   Looking at the development of Aion and all the armour drawings you can see that it was influenced by asian anime and so was lineage 2.   Most people get the impression that he did very little work on L2 and his only claim to fame on L2 is the pvp karma/chaotic system from UO.  

 http://gamesfirst.com/index.php?id=361

GF!: Moving on, are you involved with Lineage 2 at all?
Garriott: Yes. The majority of my work, like I said, is on Tabula Rasa, but next down the importance scale is for me to spend time on Lineage, be it one or two. We're trying to make sure we create a game that is a worldwide game, not merely an Asian game. With Lineage Forever, which Jake is working on, which is really the next big change. This is episode ten that we're on now, and once they get to twelve, we're actually doing a major revamp of Lineage 1, called Lineage Forever, that we're not even showing here. That's separate from Lineage 2, which is a whole different play dynamic than the world of Lineage, whereas the revamp that we're talking about is actually a full 3D game, but still a largely top down view rendered in 3D

So yeah he walked through the office and maybe sat in a chair that is about all the work he actually seemed to do on lineage 2.   The next game he actually developed after UO was tabula rasa to be honest.    A guy with a desk in an office does not mean much in the scheme of things.  All his true efforst were on tabula rasa not L2 its all the guy ever talked about...
 

Garriot, when it all comes down to it is a big one hit wonder and not the biggest hit either.  UO got creamed by EQ and TR failed.   Sure, the single player Ultima's were good in their heyday, but it was all still one franchise.  His career is one game ...a bunch of variations of Ultima.  A pioneer, yes.  But that was it.   He obviously didn't learn anything through the years with TR.

Originally posted by _Seeker

Originally posted by Dameonk

The sheer amount of misinformation in this thread is staggering.
 

 

This thread has a point?

It's the Garriot thread for now. He was the mind behind of the most influential and incredible MMORPG ever made. I think discussing him to some extent isn't entirely pointless to an MMORPG player.