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Originally posted by vaultbrain
First person melee games have been around for a long time. The first one I ever played was Hexen, for example. I don't think Oblivion has anything to do with it. It's just more fun for some people to swing a sword in FPV instead of 3rd person.
Hexen, back in the good ol' day of 1996;
As for your other points, they are a bit silly. There are hundreds of first person games out there and they all have their own audience. To think that MMO's can only work in 3rd person view is extremely conservative and a bit naive. |
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The first person view looks like it will be the only view but is not final. I'm very much looking forward for this game regardless. |
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Originally posted by Royalwcheese
Yes it is. FPV wont change to tpv. never. Go read the faq in mo forum. They said it them self that they will never change the option or add an option. They wanted to give a chance to tpv while mounted only, but at the last minute before the video, they said, fuck it. MO will be 100% fps. Thats mean, even while you are mounted, you can only see the neck and around the horse almost like in real life. |
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Ok my bad I like the first-person view, I really like the potential this game shows like i said in another post I hope its the mmo i've been looking for. It actually looks like its going to take skill and not point and click. I hope it doesn't let me down. |
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Originally posted by isolor
And that's exactly why they are doing it. Guys, it's just a game. They are game developers and they are not creating an alternate life. I think people are taking all of this a bit too seriously. Besides the fact that they are developers they are also creative and this is something they want to explore. That's like listening to a rock piece and complaining that they don't use extended harmonies or different forms. Well, it might not use these things, but the writers weren't interested in exploring those things. They were interested in exploring the song they have recorded. If people don't like it, great, they don't have to listen. Or they can take it for what it is and see what the song writers were interested in presenting. Same with games. These developers have an idea they want to pursue and they are doing it. They have very definitive ideas as to the type of gameplay they want to foster. I see no problem with this. If people don't like it then fine, no reason you should. But I don't see why developers have to keep doing same old, same old just because many games do it. This is what they want to do so more power to them. |
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Originally posted by Royalwcheese
Yes it's final, all the game has been built to work well in FPV. It's written in stone. |
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It's really simple : if you don't like FPV this game is not for you !
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Originally posted by Darkeon
See how eerie that is.
I hate that every time I check the MO subforum to see if anything new has been posted, and I get major flashbacks of the DF subforum. I hope its just a conincedence and not a harbinger of things to come. |
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You probably get similiar vibes because (suprise) it's the same people who were interested in DF who are interested in MO |
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It's not hard to distinguish MO followers, from DFo followers who left DFo ship.
-- Remember, your advantage lies in your opponent's weakness (J) |
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Originally posted by joshe
your wisdom is astounding joshe ^^
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-- Remember, your advantage lies in your opponent's weakness (J) |
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Originally posted by popinjay
Ofc it can. Its named FOV (field of view). You just need wide enought screen to cover you IRL FOV. The problem on normal PC monitor is that when change FOV to IRL FOV it looks like fish eye effect.  ______\m/_____ |
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Originally posted by Realbigdeal
Why do I get involved in these futile pissing contests? Lack of anything better to talk about I guess. So ok, I haven't played MO (obviously) but they said they were going for something similar to Mount and Blade at one point. If you play M&B the FPV while mounted is probably pretty close to what it will be like in MO. With the FPV while mounted in M&B you can't even see your horses' head unless you look nearly straight down. Almost like in real life? No, it's not even close. I don't know what the deal is with people who think that that's realistic. Do you guys all have gluacoma or some other degenerative disease that destroys your peripheral vision? Have you all spent your entire lives staring at computer monitors and televisions so that, I don't know...maybe your brains never learned to process visual information other than what lies at the focal point in your field of view? How in the world can anyone say that FPV on a computer monitor is realistic? When I'm riding a horse (and I've been doing it since before I could walk. Literally since before I could walk), while looking straight ahead I can see the horses' head, its' neck, its' shoulders, the front of my own lower torso, and the upper part of my own legs. On my parents farm/ranch we used hoses to move cattle and guess what, I could see cattle to either side of me, not just the ones directly in front of me. Amazing huh? If I turned my head a little I could see what was behind me too. By moving my head and eyes in the normal and almost unconsious way that most people do I could keep a pretty acurate mental map of my entire surroundings updated. If, in real life, my vision had been as limited as FPV is in games my parents probably wouldn't have even let me ride horses much less help with the cattle. I imagine I would have spent a big part of my childhood in the offices of eye specialists trying to figure out what the hell was wrong with me. Some people prefer FPV in games and that's fine but the realism argument needs to be dropped. In fact, it's the absurdly unrealistic nature of FPV that makes me hate it so much. TPV is also unrealistc in that it allows you to see your own back but it actually gives a more realistic field of view and awareness of your surroundings. It's far from perfect but it's a hell of a lot closer to reality than FPV. |
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Errr mate before talking crap about a game...how about you actually visit the webpage and read a line or two abou thte game? I have no idea of nuclear phisics and you will not see me on nuclear phisics forum giving my opinion. I think this is common sense. So back to topic. Where and when did devs say mounted combat will be like Mount & Blade. Please post a link to this info. Becouse I think its just your imagination and urge to bash a game for not having TPV. Becouse, dear friend if you have visited the Mo webpageyouw ould have seen the in-game video and you would have seen how greatly the mounted combat and view is done. |
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Originally posted by adrala
I'm not talking crap about the game I'm talking crap about the "FPV is more realistic" argument. The M&B comarison was quite a while ago. I don't keep track of these things but it must have been at least five months ago. I'm not going to try to dig it up because I don't remember which part of their forums it was on or if it's even still there. If they aren't saying that now I'll just take your word for it. And fair enough, I haven't been keeping close tabs on the game so I went to you tube and looked through some videos of MO. I found one in which the guy gets on a horse and rides it a bit. As long as he kept his camera angled down a little you could see the horses head and I'll admit it was better than the M&B mounted FPV. However, it's still the same old tunnel vision that FPV always gives and will always give. Untill we are all using VR goggles to play games first person view will always be seriously flawed. Again, it's not a desire to dis the game that sucked me into this it was that "realism" BS. I actually hope that MO does well because I like almost everything else that they've said about it except for the FPV only thing. And I'm not trying to change the FPV limitation, I just can't help sometimes chiming in on arguments about FPV versus TPV because I'm just as opinionated as the rest of you. As a side note, I noticed in that video that when the rider looked staight down he was holding the reins with both hands AND holding on to the front of the saddle. No real horseman holds the reins with both hands and only beginners hold on to the saddle. Maybe somebody should mention that to the devs. On the other hand, probably not many people would know any better. |
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Originally posted by Neanderthal And until we can start viewing ourselves from TPV in the real world, TPV will always be seriously flawed.
In TPV realism gets thrown out of the window right from the start. Or are you saying that viewing the world from a magical invisible floating camera that hovers around you is realistic? In FPV you see the world from the eyes of the character and that's a million times more realistic.
The only people who constantly complain about the limited peripheral vision are the people who have not played FPV games in the past and are just not used to it. There are millions of people who greatly enjoy FPV games and don't feel in any way hindered by the few shortcomings it has.
The devs are not trying to cater for everyone, that was never their plan, they are making a niche market. Here's a quote from a dev:
"MO has never been intended for the casual market. We're targeting a niche area in the MMORPG genre that we feel is empty. Not because it hasn't been successful, but because it simply hasn't been explored or exploited since early UO. It's a hardcore area, but not necessarily because it's violent or promotes full loot - it's hardcore because it demands something from you as a player. Some like the idea of a hardcore game because it would allow for more roleplay. Some like it because its.. more difficult, and therefore more rewarding. Some like it because they feel it's more immersive. Other think it's more mature, or that it will attract more mature players. I personally hope for all of the above. If this leaves little room for the casual players, I couldn't care less. There are a hundred other games for them. But you're right, if we counted on even 1/10th of the number of WoW's player base, of course we wouldn't "make it". But we don't. We don't even count on 1/100th of it. We make a game we feel is missing on the market, and I'm very happy to see that this forum proves we're not alone in thinking so. And who knows, maybe the increasing number of carbon-copy casual MMO games out there have actually helped, by nurturing a small but increasing number of players that want something else?"
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I'd like to meet the person who actually liked and used the 3rd person in Oblivion. Sure they offered it but it was terrible. Difference between the single player and the MMO community? The MMO community b**** about everything, if the devs put in a 3rd person view and it would be bad (because they never planned it in the first place) then I would guarentee more people would complain about it and ask for it to be removed than praise it or enjoy it. As for the no perifferal vision (excuse my poor spelling) it is counteracted by how quickly you turn in games. I'm not saying i can't turn that quickly in real life but i sure as hell can't do it over and over again at the same speed.
Anyway i am so fed up with all these silly threads popping up over and over again. Originally posted by Cyborg99 |
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FPV is the closest we can get to reality currently. It's amazingly immersive. While playing Oblivion, I regularly caught myself moving the mouse as if it were a sword in combat (sure, this may be wierd, but I found it awesome!). Combat required some strategy, where you could dodge blows and even block them! I just can't take the regular auto-attack in TPV games. The limitations included in FPV make it even more exciting, because you have to constantly look over your shoulder. |
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Originally posted by L1ghtsabeR
That's fine but I'm not sure how this particular quote relates to the camera view discussion. By including this quote in this discussion are you trying to say that the camera view options of a game determines whether it is a casual or hardcore game? If a game had open PvP, full loot, perma-death, no teleportors, no easy transportation at all, no mini-map, no map, mobs that could one-shot the players, and it took 1000 hours of grinding for a player to make even a tiny gain; would that game then be classified as a "casual" game if it had a third person camera view option? If WoW were a first person view only game would it be classified as a "hardcore" game?
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The point of adding that quote was to show that the devs won't care if people cry about not having TPV or any other feature for that matter. They are creating the game according to their vision and that's that.
Thought the reason for that quote was quite obvious. I guess I didn't count on people trying to misinterpret me on purpose. |
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Originally posted by L1ghtsabeR
Given that the quote was entirely about hardcore versus casual and given that you chose to use that specific quote in a discussion about camera views you shouldn't be suprised if it gives the impression that you think camera views have something to do with whether or not a game is hardcore or casual. Since you say I misinterpretted you does that means that you agree that camera view options have nothing to do with a game being hardcore or casual? |
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Originally posted by Neanderthal
Given that the quote was entirely about hardcore versus casual and given that you chose to use that specific quote in a discussion about camera views you shouldn't be suprised if it gives the impression that you think camera views have something to do with whether or not a game is hardcore or casual. Since you say I misinterpretted you does that means that you agree that camera view options have nothing to do with a game being hardcore or casual? If you read the quote, then it's pretty obvious Mats (the dev) wasn't talking about PoV, but MO in general. In my mind, the quote suited this thread very well, since it describes the design principles of the devs.
And of course I agree that you can make a hardcore game with TPV and you can make a casual game with FPV, or vice versa. That being said, I do believe that controlling your character in FPV takes more skill and situational awareness from the player, than controlling it in TPV. But that too depends largely on game mechanics.
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This thread is a delight |
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Delicious tears. Please cry more. 3rd persion view won't be in, your tears are just so yummy. nomnomnomnom |
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