I dont normally post in forums but ... Is it true Aventurine is charging his customers twice or three times? And ppl still support them? LOL . Been playing MMORPG's since 2001 and never ever thought I would see something like this . Fanboyism ftw !

This happens a lot and not just in MMOs.  Almost anyone that charges a sub fee has this issue.  It just comes down to people not being able to run a company, but its not like this is a rare thing.

Originally posted by Ravik

This happens a lot and not just in MMOs.  Almost anyone that charges a sub fee has this issue.  It just comes down to people not being able to run a company, but its not like this is a rare thing.

Actually if you had ever been in the retail sales or banking industry and had any real world experience you would never say that.

Yes it is very rare for this to happen. The rate of the occurance with AV can only lead to the conclusion that it is a deliberate act and that they are hoping people don't notice the extra charges on their statements.

They know probably too well that most people don't check them carefully, or get them electronically and blindly pay them. That of course makes the ability to scam someone out of extra funds much easier and when caught they can always just say "oh we are so sorry, it must be some international currency transaction problem".

Total and unadulterated BS.

 I have not seen it happen ingame or on forums (people complaining about this). If it did it was at launch and everyone was refounded, but I repeat, I have never seen this happen.

The game has been sold to 40-50k people already (i am guessing but no one can do better than that) and its not an issue

Dont believe every little troll around here.

Originally posted by Einstein-DF

 I have not seen it happen ingame or on forums (people complaining about this). If it did it was at launch and everyone was refounded, but I repeat, I have never seen this happen.

The game has been sold to 40-50k people already (i am guessing but no one can do better than that) and its not an issue

 

Dont believe every little troll around here.

 

forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php

Or just search for "billing" on the official forums. There are hundreds of posts with various billing problems. Some of those posts are very recent. Posts from people being charged twice, posts from people being charged and not being able to play the game. There is even a post from a person who didn't buy the game but was charged anyway because he put his credit card info on the account screen.

As for the account numbers, what exactly are you using as a basis for your guess? Didn't AV turn off the ability to view total number of existing characters? Why even bother posting those numbers, unless your whole point was to mislead people?

Originally posted by jomargue

I dont normally post in forums but ... Is it true Aventurine is charging his customers twice or three times? And ppl still support them? LOL . Been playing MMORPG's since 2001 and never ever thought I would see something like this . Fanboyism ftw !

I am in a 130 person guild of NA and EU players and haven't heard of a single person getting double charged.   But since the game is based in Greece and you have to pay in EUROs,  NA players do get charge $ 15.00 for the subscription and a second charge for the exchange rate difference between EUROs and Dollars.

      It seems that Aventurine has been a disaster at just about everything outside of the game itself......Advertising, marketing, billing, handling of accounts, IT, you name it this company is subpar in every area......

Originally posted by Theocritus

      It seems that Aventurine has been a disaster at just about everything outside of the game itself......Advertising, marketing, billing, handling of accounts, IT, you name it this company is subpar in every area......

Almost the opposit of some other released MMos : )

Originally posted by Einstein-DF

 I have not seen it happen ingame or on forums (people complaining about this). If it did it was at launch and everyone was refounded, but I repeat, I have never seen this happen.

 

The game has been sold to 40-50k people already (i am guessing but no one can do better than that) and its not an issue

 

Dont believe every little troll around here.

 

You are a very bad guesser.  15-20K tops...and even that's assuming that they've had a 50% loss rate on their retention.

That one world of theirs does not support more than 10K....

Anyone know if they take the prepay style credit cards (some mmos won't accept them)

Originally posted by Einstein-DF

 I have not seen it happen ingame or on forums (people complaining about this). If it did it was at launch and everyone was refounded, but I repeat, I have never seen this happen.

 

The game has been sold to 40-50k people already (i am guessing but no one can do better than that) and its not an issue

 

Dont believe every little troll around here.

 

My friend, double or triple charging has happened and there are several thread on the original forum. Why the blind eye? I had it happen to me and a few others in know on the vent server. Wasn't a big deal, I just called my CC company. Though, the lady on the phone said Aventurine SA is in "trouble" with billing company for so many charge backs, that they may issue a fee to them. Whatever that means..?

Secondly, The game server don't support 10k players and previsouly just before the initial 34 days were up (just after the server ques were fixed) that weekend had almost everyone on that had the game. People were everywhere, yet no log-in ques, etc.

For a brand new game 4 weeks after release on a friday night with major wars going down, you don't think nearly 90% of everyone who bought the game, wasn't tryin gto get in and play..? That means, only about 9k - 10k people have bought this game. More since the initial 34 days are up and a couple thousand people didn't renew.

Which allowed Aventurine to backfill those spots with new people. If Darkfall had more than 18k subs, they would already have a second server open. Your guestimate is wrong and doesn't consider server capacity, load or even time frames. A good guess in favor of Aventurine 12k people. But, most likely a couple grand less.

I wager this is an urban myth that is perpetuated by people's concerns.

I havent seen any evidence

Originally posted by Czzarre

I wager this is an urban myth that is perpetuated by people's concerns.

I havent seen any evidence

Except for the link I provided. But I guess a post on the Intrawebz is not enough.

Yeah it was old thing, first Aventurine couldnt get their billing system to charge their customers, then when they fixed that, some people got charged twice!

Just about everyone was refunded though.

Aventurine has actually made very decent low budget game but they suck at running it.

Originally posted by phrank

Originally posted by Ravik

This happens a lot and not just in MMOs.  Almost anyone that charges a sub fee has this issue.  It just comes down to people not being able to run a company, but its not like this is a rare thing.

 

Actually if you had ever been in the retail sales or banking industry and had any real world experience you would never say that.

Yes it is very rare for this to happen. The rate of the occurance with AV can only lead to the conclusion that it is a deliberate act and that they are hoping people don't notice the extra charges on their statements.

They know probably too well that most people don't check them carefully, or get them electronically and blindly pay them. That of course makes the ability to scam someone out of extra funds much easier and when caught they can always just say "oh we are so sorry, it must be some international currency transaction problem".

Total and unadulterated BS.

 

^ Erm let me geuss you work for Halifax LOL, I have worked in retails sales, and the banking industry well investment banking anyway :)  and I think your talking bollocks my friend.

 

Tis you full of BS, double billing is 'accidental' banking.  Its a term referred to legally in court actions.  Banks (proper certified ones not building societies) have a duty of care that includes 0% mistakes.  This means banks are never wrong or they are in breach of their services act.  They are permitted to make a mistake if the mistake occurs when they are ensuring charges are correctly billed and transferred.  So banks frequently send requests for transfer twice to both customer and biller, since banks benefit from the transaction either way whether or not its processed correctly they dont care they've made their money. 

 

So whats happened is the company has sent out a request for your money.  The bank has received that request and just to make sure theyve applied it twice.  Think about it logically, who benefits most ?  the company taking two months subs at a time or the bank utilising every customers subscription to fund its market transfers for the day ?

Originally posted by jomargue

I dont normally post in forums but ... Is it true Aventurine is charging his customers twice or three times? And ppl still support them? LOL . Been playing MMORPG's since 2001 and never ever thought I would see something like this . Fanboyism ftw !

lol... in comparison of Dark and Light, is that everything checked now?

Oh wait, let's wait for a lawsuit on their software... THEN it will be the next Dark and Light.

Originally posted by heartless

Originally posted by Einstein-DF

 I have not seen it happen ingame or on forums (people complaining about this). If it did it was at launch and everyone was refounded, but I repeat, I have never seen this happen.

The game has been sold to 40-50k people already (i am guessing but no one can do better than that) and its not an issue

 

Dont believe every little troll around here.

 

 

forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php

Or just search for "billing" on the official forums. There are hundreds of posts with various billing problems. Some of those posts are very recent. Posts from people being charged twice, posts from people being charged and not being able to play the game. There is even a post from a person who didn't buy the game but was charged anyway because he put his credit card info on the account screen.

Yeah... I read that bit from Einstein and figured what he was really saying was: "I ignore or overlook any incident of billing issues", because there have certainly been a significant number of them.

Or... to let Kirk Cameron demonstrate:



No different than those who've insisted there are no hackers in DF because they haven't seen any. Same as the people who insist DF was never intended to have quests, or that killing mobs was "carebear" and not part of the game, even though Tasos and AV have indicated the complete opposite in the past. They see what they want to see, whatever fits their "vision" of what DF is, and ignore the rest.

As for the account numbers, what exactly are you using as a basis for your guess? Didn't AV turn off the ability to view total number of existing characters? Why even bother posting those numbers, unless your whole point was to mislead people?

He's basically throwing out numbers to hype the game (without going overboard) and -  his presumptuous claim that "no one can do better than that" notwithstanding - it's quite possible that others could guess more accurately. No one knows either way unless AV releases their numbers. Einstein would just prefer people don't bother and assume his guess is "good enough".

Once you understand the motives behind half the stuff the handful of rabid fans around here post, it's pretty easy to see through what they say and why they say it. Some of them don't even try to conceal it.

I did do a search on the main page and it was no where near as serious as stated.  Most of the threads are about not being able to buy the game.  Think on the front page of the search results 2 or 3 were billing issues of being charged.

God knows how many of them were never really charged but think they made it through the buying window.

I have also had billing issues before.  And had gotten a responce back pretty fast.

There are currently enough issues with darkfall that we do not need people pulling them out of fantasy land.  THis is not dark and light 2.

Originally posted by gotha

I did do a search on the main page and it was no where near as serious as stated.  Most of the threads are about not being able to buy the game.  Think on the front page of the search results 2 or 3 were billing issues of being charged.

 

God knows how many of them were never really charged but think they made it through the buying window.

 

I have also had billing issues before.  And had gotten a responce back pretty fast.

 

There are currently enough issues with darkfall that we do not need people pulling them out of fantasy land.  THis is not dark and light 2.

No, it's not.

The creators of D&L had a much better infrastructure.

And they updated their website now and again.

Originally posted by LimaBravo

Originally posted by phrank

Originally posted by Ravik

This happens a lot and not just in MMOs.  Almost anyone that charges a sub fee has this issue.  It just comes down to people not being able to run a company, but its not like this is a rare thing.

 

Actually if you had ever been in the retail sales or banking industry and had any real world experience you would never say that.

Yes it is very rare for this to happen. The rate of the occurance with AV can only lead to the conclusion that it is a deliberate act and that they are hoping people don't notice the extra charges on their statements.

They know probably too well that most people don't check them carefully, or get them electronically and blindly pay them. That of course makes the ability to scam someone out of extra funds much easier and when caught they can always just say "oh we are so sorry, it must be some international currency transaction problem".

Total and unadulterated BS.

 

^ Erm let me geuss you work for Halifax LOL, I have worked in retails sales, and the banking industry well investment banking anyway :)  and I think your talking bollocks my friend.

 

Tis you full of BS, double billing is 'accidental' banking.  Its a term referred to legally in court actions.  Banks (proper certified ones not building societies) have a duty of care that includes 0% mistakes.  This means banks are never wrong or they are in breach of their services act.  They are permitted to make a mistake if the mistake occurs when they are ensuring charges are correctly billed and transferred.  So banks frequently send requests for transfer twice to both customer and biller, since banks benefit from the transaction either way whether or not its processed correctly they dont care they've made their money. 

 

So whats happened is the company has sent out a request for your money.  The bank has received that request and just to make sure theyve applied it twice.  Think about it logically, who benefits most ?  the company taking two months subs at a time or the bank utilising every customers subscription to fund its market transfers for the day ?

 

AV has double billed either purposely or accidently through their credit card processing service. They are not processing them through a bank in case you missed that little fact in your Wiki search.

Having been in several retail business' and having some experience in the field I have NEVER processed a credit card through a bank directly, it has always been through a card processing service. The days of Bank of America and Bankamericard are long gone and I would have thought your Wiki search would have shown that.

Therefore the whole bank issue is moot and I really don't see how it is the least bit germaine to this discussion anyway.