Originally posted by DarthRaiden

Originally posted by Devour

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

Originally posted by xzyax

Player Housing   - definitely  NO. Player houses are not needed  and they will  harm my game play experince i don't want them in DarkFall

 

 

How the eff would player housing harm your gameplay experience?

"OH NOES THERE MIGHT BE THINGS OTHER THAN JUST ZERGIN OTHER PLAYERS =((("

 

they will create safezones for my prey , enemy  clans could abuse them to clutter the surrundings of my city and could abuse them to block and / or camp my hunting arrea.

So what benefit and use is there for a house that i should be able to enter at any time i wish to kill the owner and loot his goodies and / or should be able to destroy it easily with basic skills  if its presence is an obstacle for me ?

Well it would loose the ability of being usefull to the owner , so that why it is not needed in DarkFall.

have you played ultima online? make the same concept...  and your world being so big with only a limited amount of players you could easily have places where building is not allowed by the system. you would only be able to place houses x meters from a path and beyond. some areas (like NPC cities) would have a no build radius. and other important places as well. and if they added the traveling mobs then your hunting area would not really exist, thus impossible to camp no?

the house could be destroyed but you would need the right tools for that and to be fair those tools should be hard and rare so you would think 2x if it would be worth it to destroy this house or keep it for a worthier target.

Originally posted by bryan1980

Will Aventurine ever add more content?     What content have they added already.  Your question should have been " will AV add ANY content".

I played for 2 weeks, you have an big empty map and a bunch of naked people with newbie weapons running around playing counterstrike.   The game lacks any features of real sandbox games like UO.

A ton of people are quitting... those are the spots that are being offered in the store.  The reason there isn't a second server is because AV can see the dropout rate and knows that in a few weeks, they will have a hard time replacing players who quit on one server.  The store is gradually staying open longer and longer.. as it gets harder and harder to replace those who quit.
 

Look at ebay, you can't sell accounts.  I tried to sell my account 'at cost' and there were no buyers.

Will Aventuring add more content ?

It appears thay will,  we have seen some just in the last couple of week  ( Gates, more quests if that is your thing) .  i suspect that the main focus at this time is to stablize the game.

I am sorry you missed the hundreds of MOB camps, Epic MOBS, Dragons, ruins, dungeons, player cities, cool islands, etc...   When you race acorss the "empty" world.   You are amazing lucky that you also seemed to miss the thousands of players riding around on Mounts wearing armor and using real weapons and not the newbie ones.

The combat style is very Counterstrike, twitch, FPS like so I guess you at least tried that part of the game before you quit.

If you really want to sell your account then I suggest you let people know on the DF forums,  there are still a bunch of guilds that are fighting to get accounts, the shop still sells out quickly each day it is opened and it still is open during crappy time for NA players.

Yeah, I tried going fishing the other day.  Outta no where I get shot with some fireball.  I start running and realize I'm not being chased when another fireball comes from above.  Fricken Red Dragon is flying over me circling.  Had to hide under a tree, but he never went away.  Was a very cool experience.

Originally posted by kasta

 Personally, I think of it as less of a sandbox and more of a litter box, but that's just me.

This person wins the thread.

Discussion over.

P.S. I like how the rabid fanboi's report every single post/thread they don't agree with.

Originally posted by javac

Originally posted by parrotpholk

But in no way is it sandbox.

 

 

sandbox == player-driven; themepark == developer-driven. L2MMO.

{ Mod Edit }

 

Then I guess that UT3 is a sandbox game or Quake  if we are using the DF model of sandbox as the shining example. Ok I see now. So as long as the world is more or less void and you can pvp then its sandbox. But then sandbox could also now be the end all excuse for releasing an empty game. I guess Dark and Light was just way to sandbox for anyone to handle then.

Originally posted by Vorret

I don't get it...

When people suggest things that would improve the game and make it more sandbox, you got people come in here and shout : ZOMG NO IT'S A PVP GAME.

Then, when you're in a thread that says DarkFall isn't SandBox enough and people are saying stuff like well of course it's a PvP game you got the same people come in and say : ZOMG NO IT'S A SANDBOX GAME YOU CAN DO OTHER STUFF THAN PVP.

Which one is it? PvP game OR Sandbox game?

At one point people will have to pick one and stick with it.

Great post. If they are too intellectually limited to see why player housing would be a GOOD thing, and that a game company can include it into their MMO's gameplay without it being exploited then I have no words for them. Then again, considering the game is full of cheaters/hackers/exploiters I can see why even the fanbois are paranoid when it comes to a new feature. UO had player housing, isn't that the game the developers themselves claim to derive their business model from? Figure most of the DF fanbase probably doesn't know what UO was considering their first MMO contained cartoonish graphics and a "dumbed down" gameplay.

"Sandbox is a design style of MMO that doesn't lead the player around in a linear fashion, it gives the player tools to shape the game environement."

Finally, someone clears it up for the rest of these people. DF is not a sandbox game. It forces its playerbase to pvp regardless of choice. There is no alternative options/careers such as Eve online and Ultima Online, which were the best sandbox games I've ever played. This doesnt mean that someday Darkfall cannot rectify this flaw. Time will tell. Unfortunately the playerbase is doing a great job ruining the game before the lack of content does.
 

Originally posted by kasta

 Personally, I think of it as less of a sandbox and more of a litter box, but that's just me.

You, sir, are a literary genius.

I think based on the qualifications of what most consider that DF is a Sandbox game...

Unreal Tournament 3 is among the best Sandbox games ever!!!

No levels, no skill-system. Pure player skills! DF has no comparison. Plus, UT3's character models are WAY better than DF. Rock on!

Originally posted by Devour

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

Originally posted by xzyax

Player Housing   - definitely  NO. Player houses are not needed  and they will  harm my game play experince i don't want them in DarkFall

 

 

How the eff would player housing harm your gameplay experience?

"OH NOES THERE MIGHT BE THINGS OTHER THAN JUST ZERGIN OTHER PLAYERS =((("

Na'h...  this is DF there is and will be nothing else.

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

Originally posted by xzyax

I think the vast majority of current subscribers would be perfectly happy for the next 1-2 years if Aventurine just worked on getting everything they had intended to be in the game up and running with a decent amount of polish.

 

Weather - very fluff stuff wouldn't change anything if not tied to physics and change the dynamics of my arrows.  Nothing biggy really i am not missing it now.

Fully populating Dungeons and NPC Ruins/Cities. would be nice but what are NPC needed for in a PvP game, not my priority but wouldn't harm my game experience on the other hand. maybe would drag more PvE crowd in the game that would be added  to my future prey and content then. So don't mind it.

Migrating Mobs. Yep would be intresting. An addition i would like to see.

Mobs attacking Player Cities. Interesting aswell. A nice addition

Player Housing   - definitely  NO. Player houses are not needed  and they will  harm my game play experince i don't want them in DarkFall

Etc...

 

Once they have everything in and running smoothly then they could work on adding additional content. 

 

What would additional content  look like? 

I would think that adding more skills and choices to pretty much every aspect of gameplay would be sufficient for some time to come.  More crafting options (i.e. new weapons and armor), new magic schools, more spells in current magic schools, new melee skills, new archery skills, new mounted combat skills, etc.  

There are numerous ways they could "expand" without having to actually creat new land mass.

Eventually if they are around long enough they will probably want to have another island continent that players can sail off to... but that is a long ways off I'm guessing. 

 

As for me no new mellee skills are needed. Add in combat twitch mechanics instead. For example bonus damage depending on the dynamics of  running speed on a hit. Add in a swing mechanic. More swing time = more damage.

Add in just the group casting magic spells and i am in mage heaven.

The game is very good as it is right now and offer for me content for the next years already.

Ahh... Darth, what would we do without you? 

If they implemented Weather like this...

"Sail your ship through rough seas, then become hampered by fog as the waters calm. Struggle as your battlefield-bound army marches into a severe storm. In Darkfall, the weather is more than just window dressing. "

"Expect realistic weather effects, such as rain, snow, wind blowing in the trees, wind blowing in the grass on the ground, thunder and lightning."

"Weather can also turn the tides of battle, which is constituted by wind direction, fog and rain which limits player sight and movement."

"A nice touch that will be included is a weather system that actually impacts the game world. If a strong storm hits a region, players will have a heck of a time traversing it. Rain and snow will be a lot more than just eye candy in this game."

"Weather will play a part in this game as well. Rain and snow causes very low visibility. A weather map will be accessible in game showing weather patterns and their direction of movement. A guild can anticipate a rain storm and use it to ambush another guild. During good weather players can be seen from an extremely long distance."

"There is also a weather map where you can zoom in to get local weather."

...then I'm not so sure you would think it was just "Fluff" 
 

As for Player Housing...

I liked the idea from someone else had about allowing the Houses to be attack-able when the owner is online.  That way they aren't able to just hide inside scared out of their wits from players like Darth. 

For me anyway... I just can't consider an MMO truly sandbox without the ability to have some sort of personal housing... at least in this setting.  (EvE with it's setting is obviously an exception).

UO pulled it off, SWG pulled it off... and the vast majority of players list Housing as one of the best features they liked about those games.

Yeah... probably make restrictions on how close to a city, road, dungeon, etc.   I want to leave some work for the Devs to think through. 

With personal housing in game they could be one step closer to localized banking.  Something that I think DarkFall will eventually need for the long-term health of the player economy. 

Without localized banking... what purpose do Pirates play?  What will people be transporting?  What would Pirates be pillaging?

Anyway...

I wasn't necessarily putting forth "THE LIST" that they need to complete.  I was merely pointing out that there are indeed aspects of the current game that could be added onto or finished without having to resort to "NEW" content.  They have more than enough ideas to work on just putting in stuff they mentioned before, but haven't got around to getting working yet.

Originally posted by Moaky07

Originally posted by bryan1980

Look at ebay, you can't sell accounts.  I tried to sell my account 'at cost' and there were no buyers.

I just looked...3 accounts for sale. One had like 2 bids on it for 125ish bucks. Seemed like they had a lot of gear/skills. Unsure as no clue about game.

Another wasnt getting any bites at 50 bucks.

And last had their char for like 275. Strange things also is it listed only local pickup on it(I guess disks,,,refuses to ship). That seems odd/shrug

I wouldnt call 3 accounts conclusive one way or another. Gonna check PA.com

 

Heh totally different story there,,,,20 accounts up with cheapest being around 90 bucks.

That still isnt an indication that game is failing totally IMO...although if peeps always fight with newb weapons it seems strange a few of these folks would have all the chit they do. Wonder why these accounts would be being dropped...although if they are easy account to build I can see a younger person doing it for the money, and building a new char.

For the players it will be a shame if DF doesnt survive, cause those playing seem to enjoy ita lot. Although after reading tacos in that interview the other day, I could see why folks dont seem to like him so much. Kind of gave of that vibe of "Me know how".

Anyways just stopped by to see if forum PvP was still going on...looks to of calmed down but gonna check a few more threads just in case. heh :)

People are very suspicious of sold accounts at the moment due to reports of these being banned accounts (hence the high stats, lots of gold, etc). Most of my guild members are now in the game with 4-5 people still waiting to buy. they don't want to buy an existing account due to name/race/spec. of about 60 members, 2 have quit. both were big former WOW players.

edit: i'd be shocked if DF didn't have a fairly high rate of turnover simply due to it being sandbox and hardcore PVP and the sheer numbers of carebears you see & read on these and the official forums who need NPCs/quests/wowhead.com to tell them what to do next. high initial turnover is good for DF while demand is still high as it generates a lot of income from purchases without eating up server spots. the only people that really know how DF is doing are in Aventurine.

The fact that people like Javac still blame the players and other MMOs for causing the failboat that is DF just astounds me. IF DF had been released as promised, ya know the whole feature complete thing then it would have been a smashing success. It has nothing to do with sandbox or the super awesome LMB melee pvp. Its all about the hype created by Tasos and the fanboys about how it was going to be revolutionary.. And what we got instead was a shell, hell a cracked one at that of a sorta FPS sorta RPG and sorta but not really sandbox MMO. Thats the failing and not people being spoiled by WOW or that they are to carebear. Butt hey whatever makes you feel good about your purchase I guess.

Originally posted by parrotpholk

The fact that people like Javac still blame the players and other MMOs for causing the failboat that is DF just astounds me. IF DF had been released as promised, ya know the whole feature complete thing then it would have been a smashing success. It has nothing to do with sandbox or the super awesome LMB melee pvp. Its all about the hype created by Tasos and the fanboys about how it was going to be revolutionary.. And what we got instead was a shell, hell a cracked one at that of a sorta FPS sorta RPG and sorta but not really sandbox MMO. Thats the failing and not people being spoiled by WOW or that they are to carebear. Butt hey whatever makes you feel good about your purchase I guess.

your denial of reality is hilarious:

1) darkfall has been sold out for a month

2) people are still lining up to buy

3) numerous positive & glowing reviews from gaming sites

4) hugely diverse gameplay possiblities

5) largest battles seen in a fantasy MMO

6) second most visted/viewed MMO on mmorpg.com for the past 6 months, second only to WAR and above tons of other far more commercial MMOs and despite zero traditional marketing.

7) small indie development team, developed on tiny budget compared to other MMOs

by any objective measure, DF is a massive, groundbreaking success REGARDLESS of what you bitter little kids think of it.

Not being able to purchase the game because of the erratic nature of Aventurine's online store antics does not equate to being sold out.  Thats like saying that your local McDonalds is sold out of Big Macs whenever the store is closed.

Originally posted by Shoju

Not being able to purchase the game because of the erratic nature of Aventurine's online store antics does not equate to being sold out.  Thats like saying that your local McDonalds is sold out of Big Macs whenever the store is closed.

No, no... Try this: Sorry sir but this restaurant is full - go to macdonald's if you're hungry.

Originally posted by Zodan

Originally posted by Shoju

Not being able to purchase the game because of the erratic nature of Aventurine's online store antics does not equate to being sold out.  Thats like saying that your local McDonalds is sold out of Big Macs whenever the store is closed.

 

No, no... Try this: Sorry sir but this restaurant is full - go to macdonald's if you're hungry.

Hardly, a server queue is representative of 'the restaurant being full'. Having to shut the whole online store process down (for often days at a time) is representative of Aventurine's inability to provide a functioning infrastructure capable of supporting an expanding playerbase.  If they could, then Aventurine would be able to support having the online store open 24/7.

Originally posted by Shoju

Originally posted by Zodan

Originally posted by Shoju

Not being able to purchase the game because of the erratic nature of Aventurine's online store antics does not equate to being sold out.  Thats like saying that your local McDonalds is sold out of Big Macs whenever the store is closed.

 

No, no... Try this: Sorry sir but this restaurant is full - go to macdonald's if you're hungry.

Hardly, a server queue is representative of 'the restaurant being full'. Having to shut the whole online store process down (for often days at a time) is representative of Aventurine's inability to provide a functioning infrastructure capable of supporting an expanding playerbase.  If they could, then Aventurine would be able to support having the online store open 24/7.

 

I am sure you realize that there is only one server at the moment, thus there is only one restaurant with limited amount of tables.

Infrastructure is currently based on them having only one server, selling too many copies would either cripple that server or make lot of unhappy customers waiting for their food at the table.

Originally posted by Shoju

Originally posted by Zodan

Originally posted by Shoju

Not being able to purchase the game because of the erratic nature of Aventurine's online store antics does not equate to being sold out.  Thats like saying that your local McDonalds is sold out of Big Macs whenever the store is closed.

 

No, no... Try this: Sorry sir but this restaurant is full - go to macdonald's if you're hungry.

Hardly, a server queue is representative of 'the restaurant being full'. Having to shut the whole online store process down (for often days at a time) is representative of Aventurine's inability to provide a functioning infrastructure capable of supporting an expanding playerbase.  If they could, then Aventurine would be able to support having the online store open 24/7.

lol.

this is the correct analogy: a restaurant has a finite number of meals. it sells them all in the first 4 hours of trading. being unable to make or sell more meals without opening a new restaurant, it closes the front door and turns away any new customers.

aventurine's business model, unlike mcdonald's or WOW's, is focusing on quality, not quantity/throughput, and i say kudos to any/all game developers who put the emphasis on quality over quantity anyday.

Darkfall is based on a 320-cpu server cluster (correction: 320 at release. they may have added more by now). you don't just roll those out in a production capacity in a day or even a couple of weeks. there's physical + software installation, validation, security, backup and redundancy to take care of, plus all the support personnel required to execute same.

---

 

aventurine's business model, unlike mcdonald's or WOW's, is focusing on quality, not quantity/throughput, and i say kudos to any/all game developers who put the emphasis on quality over quantity anyday.
 

---

If I wasn't an avid forumfall pvp watcher I'd think you were joking right there.

Darkfall is a joke in the mmo world right now. The way AV handled the closed beta and launch didn't speak quality to me. Nor does this weird halfway released state make me feel confidant in AV's ablities. 
Still the combat looks good so I'm still waiting on this one. If the security flaws are fixed(NOT holding breath for that!) and a free trial comes out I'm going to play it.

'Sold out' is a meaningless buzzword.  If I am playing guitar in my room and don't let anyone in then technically my performance is also 'sold out' since no one else can buy tickets for it.  You guys might as well argue that the game has 'synergy' with its playerbase.

Originally posted by javac

Originally posted by parrotpholk

The fact that people like Javac still blame the players and other MMOs for causing the failboat that is DF just astounds me. IF DF had been released as promised, ya know the whole feature complete thing then it would have been a smashing success. It has nothing to do with sandbox or the super awesome LMB melee pvp. Its all about the hype created by Tasos and the fanboys about how it was going to be revolutionary.. And what we got instead was a shell, hell a cracked one at that of a sorta FPS sorta RPG and sorta but not really sandbox MMO. Thats the failing and not people being spoiled by WOW or that they are to carebear. Butt hey whatever makes you feel good about your purchase I guess.

 

your denial of reality is hilarious:

1) darkfall has been sold out for a month

2) people are still lining up to buy

3) numerous positive & glowing reviews from gaming sites

4) hugely diverse gameplay possiblities

5) largest battles seen in a fantasy MMO

6) second most visted/viewed MMO on mmorpg.com for the past 6 months, second only to WAR and above tons of other far more commercial MMOs and despite zero traditional marketing.

7) small indie development team, developed on tiny budget compared to other MMOs

 

by any objective measure, DF is a massive, groundbreaking success REGARDLESS of what you bitter little kids think of it.

Are you really typing this with a straight face??

1.  it is sold out because it has one server that can't handle many people.  They had to remove mobs from the game because they took the place of players (in Tasos own words).   Should my band brag about being sold out because I can only fit 15 people in my garage?

2.  Yes, because it has a single server.  A lot of people (myself included) have already quit.  So now AV is reselling our spots.  If there was really huge demand, they would have a second server by now.  The fact is, that for probably another few months they will be able to replace players who quit.. but AV knows they don't have enough demand for another server, which is why you hear nothing about it.

3.  Where?  I've yet to hear anything except an 'average' review.  Most of the reviews I've read accurately talk about the lack of features and the massive hacking/exploiting/macroing that is going on.

4.  LMB combat.   there are no other features in the game except simplified combat

5.  Really, where are the vids?  All I've seen is a bunch of people talking about 200v200 and showing a vid of 20v20.    Tasos said there was a battle with 2000 people.. yet none of those 2000 people made a vid of it?    Every 2 hours on my server, there is a 100v100 fight in Wintergrasp (WOW).  Eve routinely has 500+ battles (all captured on vid).  The only thing we have from DF is people talking about the huge numbers, and the vids always show very modest numbers.  Show me a vid that has anything close to 100 people on it... WOW has that every 2 hours

6.  Yes, Darkfall is popular on this site, mostly for amusement.  Half the people thought it was vaporware, and most of the others knew it would be a feature-less pos game.  But because Tasos is such a comical figure, it's entertaining to follow this game.

7. Yes, but they charge the same per month as real games.  If you want to have an amateur peice of crap game, at least make it free2play like runescape.

How can you say DF is massive.. it has ONE server!!!   You can talk about 20k accounts, or 5k concurrent users.. but all the videos point to 20v20 fights (mostly naked people).  If you consider DF as massive, then there are like 100 mmorpgs that are super-massive.

Originally posted by javac

Originally posted by parrotpholk

The fact that people like Javac still blame the players and other MMOs for causing the failboat that is DF just astounds me. IF DF had been released as promised, ya know the whole feature complete thing then it would have been a smashing success. It has nothing to do with sandbox or the super awesome LMB melee pvp. Its all about the hype created by Tasos and the fanboys about how it was going to be revolutionary.. And what we got instead was a shell, hell a cracked one at that of a sorta FPS sorta RPG and sorta but not really sandbox MMO. Thats the failing and not people being spoiled by WOW or that they are to carebear. Butt hey whatever makes you feel good about your purchase I guess.

 

your denial of reality is hilarious:

1) darkfall has been sold out for a month

2) people are still lining up to buy

3) numerous positive & glowing reviews from gaming sites

4) hugely diverse gameplay possiblities

5) largest battles seen in a fantasy MMO

6) second most visted/viewed MMO on mmorpg.com for the past 6 months, second only to WAR and above tons of other far more commercial MMOs and despite zero traditional marketing.

7) small indie development team, developed on tiny budget compared to other MMOs

 

by any objective measure, DF is a massive, groundbreaking success REGARDLESS of what you bitter little kids think of it.

They're laughing at you javac, not with you  =/

I started playing not to long ago, if my MMO experience would've only been 1 other MMO in history, then maybe I would agree this game has 1 or 2 things groundbreaking features, but that's not the case, and fanboys like this need to stop lying before other innocent people get duped into trying a game they will clearly not like. This game has nothing groundbreaking. Not even the first person perspective is innovative, you want to see a great GROUND BREAKING first person combat system? Go check out Chronicles of Spellborn. Anyone that says the combat requires skill in DF is sadly mistaken (my experiences so far is only from a week, but from what the ingame friends have told me it is basically the same system, through out the entire game)

STOP LYING TO PEOPLE! This is not quality. Most MMOs start by a small indie company and have done MUCH better. Recently I found out this game has been in development for over 8 years! And this is what I have to look forward to? No wonder the fanboys are bitter. And I won't even get started on the fact I was double billed according to my new statement, I'll wait until I hear more info before I make some off-the-wall thread...

Originally posted by javac

Originally posted by parrotpholk

The fact that people like Javac still blame the players and other MMOs for causing the failboat that is DF just astounds me. IF DF had been released as promised, ya know the whole feature complete thing then it would have been a smashing success. It has nothing to do with sandbox or the super awesome LMB melee pvp. Its all about the hype created by Tasos and the fanboys about how it was going to be revolutionary.. And what we got instead was a shell, hell a cracked one at that of a sorta FPS sorta RPG and sorta but not really sandbox MMO. Thats the failing and not people being spoiled by WOW or that they are to carebear. Butt hey whatever makes you feel good about your purchase I guess.

 

your denial of reality is hilarious:

1) darkfall has been sold out for a month

2) people are still lining up to buy

3) numerous positive & glowing reviews from gaming sites

4) hugely diverse gameplay possiblities

5) largest battles seen in a fantasy MMO

6) second most visted/viewed MMO on mmorpg.com for the past 6 months, second only to WAR and above tons of other far more commercial MMOs and despite zero traditional marketing.

7) small indie development team, developed on tiny budget compared to other MMOs

 

by any objective measure, DF is a massive, groundbreaking success REGARDLESS of what you bitter little kids think of it.

Alright first off...you cant sell out of a digital download. The open sales then close them when a predetermined number has been reached. Could be 100 or could be 5000 you nor anyone else knows. However I suspect if it was in the 1000s as Tasos has claimed then your queue issues would be back in full swing.  Show me a actually video of these largest battles in history and I might believe you. You can you tube large scale seiges from DAoC and L2 all day and tell how many people are there.

Huge gameplay possibilities? Not even gonna go there with you as its been hashed 1000 times. Its a huge visited forum but how many are actually saying nice things..lets see you, para, darth, popin (who admits to not playing) ummm yeah I am sure there are a couple I am missing but only a couple. Where are these glowing reviews? Where o where art though reputable gaming review? O yeah its some comic lady and a greek game site thats said decent things. Any other review talks about missing features, huge downtime and the worst billing system since manual CC entry.

They are in no way quality over quantity. This isnt even up there with mcdonalds but more like the ghetto knockoff that every big city has. They have out and out lied as a company, hell there are still people who payed on day one and still get the account not active error with ZERO resolution. Website still advertises a game that Tasos beats off to in his sleep at night and still has no real link to the store. Hell people have to ask on forums what the link is and how you buy. And the list goes on and on and on.

I am fine if you want to say YOU are having a ball and if your clan is having a good ol time but do not say that AV is all about quality when all and I mean ALL evidence points otherwise. I hope that MO can pull off what DF so badly failed at because the world needs games like this to be honest to fill that niche. Earthrise and MO will be a telling sign of the future of the industry for if they go poof then it just may never happen. O well was nice chatting with you.

Darkfall is a sanbox without the sand... Or the toys, or even the other players (due to their ridiculous sales model). So, in truth; Darkfall is just an enclosed square of wood, devoid of fun; that you have to wait in line to get into, and have to pay for.

Premium price for amateur production values.

****

by any objective measure, DF is a massive, groundbreaking success REGARDLESS of what you bitter little kids think of it.

****

Success? If it was a massive success, they wouldn't be limping forward right now. If you like macroing in cities; far be it from me to argue that point; but if you think - BY ANY STRETCH OF THE IMAGINATION - that this game is doing well, and has a solid business model you are just beyond help, professional or otherwise. Kill yourself.

Originally posted by javac

by any objective measure, DF is a massive, groundbreaking success REGARDLESS of what you bitter little kids think of it.

A massive, groundbreaking success.... by any objective measure.

Really.

Others have already addressed that truly... truly... ridiculous statement.

...so I have just one question for you, javac.

What the hell are you smoking?