Originally posted by ronan32

i played diablo 2 and thought it was a hack n slash pile of crap..i dont get the hype, maybe its just blizzard groupies.

Nope. It is you.

Hack-n-slash + cool loot is fun. There is a huge market out there who LOVE hack-n-slash games. It speakes to our primal needs for power & violence.

For those of you that say no its not a MMO you truely don't know what diablo 2 had to offer.

I would still be playing this, and i played this a good 6 years ago if the server wasnt so laggy and hack filled.  The game allowd a player to do more in it than just about any new MMO out on the market. 

If I wanted to make a BS character just to run really really fast, but not do much of anything else I could do it, and I could do it in a time efficent manner.

People always made new characters to try out new things.  Yes there were the cookie cutter builds and what not but there was alway the ability to make a unique character.

In MMO's the fights are static and you literaly have no control on what you can do.  Your stuck in the battle till you kill the monster or die.  Thats it nothing else, you can't run you can't run around walls you can't do anything to void them.

Diablo 2 and definetly with D3 you will be able to do all of that.  There will be no "cannot due to being in combat."  And monsters will not always be able to hit you just because you are in combat.  If you run from a monster that is slower than you, it will not be able to hit you.  If a monster is faster than you and you can't kill it, hope you have a tp on you.

This mentality that its a "hack n slash pile of crap" some people have is comical.  You don' t even know whats availible in the game because you never looked deep into it.  Combat makes these types of games.  MMO's the combat is more or less a side project to having a massive grind and the illusion of doing something great.

But back on topic, will this game kill MMO's of corse not, will it put a dent in many of them.  Yes for sure it will.  Just as most other new games put a dent into them for a short amount of time.

But will it be a lasting effect or just a month or two, we can only wait and see.   But personally i think it will have an effect on them a lasting one too.  One that will make the devs of said MMO consider why D3 is doing so well even though it is not an MMO.

Which in turn will hopefully inspire some some devs to make a change to the basic MMO.

Diablo 1/2 were great back then just like fallout 1/2, but  I believe gaming has evolved since then and hack/slash rpgs where the view is from up above are history. I am not saying Diablo 3 won't do well but its not going to be the new WoW.

Update: After watching the Wizard trailer, Im alittle impressed. Should be a good game.

Diablo appeals to me, I have a good time playing those kinds of games.  The only game I won't uninstall is Diablo 2 modded with Eastern Sun mod.  Once D3 comes out, I will be out of looking for another "multiplayer" experience for the duration until I'm entirely sick of D3 so for me at least yes mmo's will be dead.

Since there is nothing I like to play in this genre currently I'm now experiencing all the games I missed on the DS and just checking this board and others to see what may be coming out in the near future until D3 comes out.  Once it does, I will play that game until I've maxed out every character, and then play every mod for that game until the really "next step" MMO comes out.  I might get into Jumpgate though if that plays as good as it's looking, that may be the mmo that keeps me interested and paying.  Will see though.

Originally posted by Zorndorf

Originally posted by SaintViktor

Originally posted by googajoob7

i find if i play a single player rpg its usually on the side of an mmo or visa versa . all a single player game does is reduce the time i may spend in a multiplayer .

 

Yeah but Diablo 3 is not single player or multiplayer, it is both. Battlenet will be a huge social gaming experience where you can play and talk to people from other games and alot more details to come.

 

The problem is : it is NOT a multiplayer game in the sense an MMORPG is.

It is a co-op game with 4 or so players wanting to join a common fight. The chatting in the boxes is pathetic when you played mmorpg's these last 8 years.

Co-op games with pure hack/slash themes and with an exclamation mark above the quest givers head are SOOOO passé.

So that was nice 10 years ago. D3 is what Pac Man is to Mario. Gone. Very good gameplay back then but since then gamers found other ways to look at questgivers with signs above their heads.

Just load up your D2 and try to level up your character by dungeon crawling now. Boooooooooooring.

You say constantly you are bored with Wow. But you can do a million/zillion other things you can't do in Diablo (from fishing to Bg's, from City Raids to organising weddings, from storming a castle to do cooking quests.)

-----

Second thought is the terrible 2D/3D false graphics views. Terrible for a PC game that will be launched in 2010. I play Dungeon Siege on the PsP like that.

-----

I am convinced there is still a huge market for SC2 - rts. But I am just not convinced there well be a huge market for D3.

Far too many women, older people, and "social" players are playing the mmorpg's these day and they will NOT go back to CO-OP styles of hack'n slash games with "chatting rooms".

The best mmorpg's have their focus on different playing options. One theme gameplay is that way of the past.

The pure video game player will like it, yes. But with the same usual time span of any "normal" PC/video game, meaning 6 months and then it will die a peaceful death.

-----

I even think Blizzard knows this very well, hence that's why they develop 3 mmo's today

The Wow expansions, the (supposed) SF mmo and the new (secret) mmo on the new XBox console (using the Wow engine).

------End conclusion for the OP -----

I believe the new secret Blizzard mmo on next generation XBox console to have a far wider impact than anyone can imagine and at least it will be based on a full 3D world.

Short playing sessions of 25 to 30 minutes and evolving characters in a polished 3D unhampered style animated world is the thing of the future. Expect an XBox based on that engine to sell 20 million copies worldwide.

Expect this new kind of mmorpg to have a massive impact on the mediocre mmo trials we see today.

Compared to the mmorpg's launched on consoles, Wow will look like rocket science.

 

 

Well to say there won't be a market for Diablo 3 is like saying cows will stop giving milk. On July 26th 2001, Diablo 2 LOD expansion became the fastest selling expansion pc game history. findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0EIN/is_2001_July_26/ai_76765695/ Selling over 2 million copies. I can't imagine what mmo wouldn't give to sell 2 million copies of their game today. This is not even including the millions Diablo 2 sold. So believe, Diablo 3 will have a huge market of players swarming to come play. So if anyone else really is in denial that Diablo 3 will not impact the mmo genre I'll be glad to serve up some more fact finding information. ;)

Originally posted by galliard1981

 pking...death consequence...death penalty.

Wait, what does that have to do with Diablo 3?

Originally posted by SaintViktor

 

Well to say there won't be a market for Diablo 3 is like saying cows will stop giving milk. On July 26th 2001, Diablo 2 LOD expansion became the fastest selling expansion pc game history. findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m0EIN/is_2001_July_26/ai_76765695/ Selling over 2 million copies. I can't imagine what mmo wouldn't give to sell 2 million copies of their game today. This is not even including the millions Diablo 2 sold. So believe, Diablo 3 will have a huge market of players swarming to come play. So if anyone else really is in denial that Diablo 3 will not impact the mmo genre I'll be glad to serve up some more fact finding information. ;)

Agreed.  It's funny how two million doesn't sound like much anymore, but I think you have to adjust for "player inflation".  Back in those days 400k was tops for mmos, and we had millions in D2.  Now, we have a lot more pc gamers, a lot more mmos, and the market has become completely different.  Should be very interesting to see how many copies of D3 sell.  I personally predict that we're going to see some massive numbers, well above 10 million.  It is clear that Blizzard recognizes this too, because they're making a whole new battlenet setup for D3.  If they didn't think they'd get those kind of numbers I think they'd be just fine with using battlenet in its current form.  Also, just look at the website for D3.  It is clear they are putting a ton of work into the game and we'll soon see Blizzard's masterful marketing in motion.  You compare the D3 website to any mmo website that has come out in the past four years and it's amazing how amateur other mmos websites look.  Obviously, a website doesn't make a game.  But the quality and polish of the website is an indication of the kind of dedication the dev has for the game.

The post you quoted had some good points.  I don't agree with a lot of them, but it is true that comparing D2 to today's mmos shows D2's age.  But that poster was comparing a 10 year old game to WoW the beheamoth.  It's simply not a fair comparison.  I can assure anyone that Blizzard is well aware of this and has compensated in their design for D3.  It's highly unlikely to expect that D3 is going to be as far behind mmos as D2, particularly in the multiplayer context.

In the end, though, people here just simply underestimate the diablo hack and slash find phat lootz and trade them playstyle.  They just can't see that mmos can be really boring when compared to a truly fun game that has lots of incentive to play long term.  I don't think we're ever going to get through to them.

Originally posted by Zorndorf

Originally posted by SaintViktor

Originally posted by googajoob7

i find if i play a single player rpg its usually on the side of an mmo or visa versa . all a single player game does is reduce the time i may spend in a multiplayer .

 

Yeah but Diablo 3 is not single player or multiplayer, it is both. Battlenet will be a huge social gaming experience where you can play and talk to people from other games and alot more details to come.

 

The problem is : it is NOT a multiplayer game in the sense an MMORPG is.

It is a co-op game with 4 or so players wanting to join a common fight. The chatting in the boxes is pathetic when you played mmorpg's these last 8 years.

Co-op games with pure hack/slash themes and with an exclamation mark above the quest givers head are SOOOO passé.

So that was nice 10 years ago. D3 is what Pac Man is to Mario. Gone. Very good gameplay back then but since then gamers found other ways to look at questgivers with signs above their heads.

Just load up your D2 and try to level up your character by dungeon crawling now. Boooooooooooring.

You say constantly you are bored with Wow. But you can do a million/zillion other things you can't do in Diablo (from fishing to Bg's, from City Raids to organising weddings, from storming a castle to do cooking quests.)

-----

Second thought is the terrible 2D/3D false graphics views. Terrible for a PC game that will be launched in 2010. I play Dungeon Siege on the PsP like that.

-----

I am convinced there is still a huge market for SC2 - rts. But I am just not convinced there well be a huge market for D3.

Far too many women, older people, and "social" players are playing the mmorpg's these day and they will NOT go back to CO-OP styles of hack'n slash games with "chatting rooms".

The best mmorpg's have their focus on different playing options. One theme gameplay is that way of the past.

The pure video game player will like it, yes. But with the same usual time span of any "normal" PC/video game, meaning 6 months and then it will die a peaceful death.

-----

I even think Blizzard knows this very well, hence that's why they develop 3 mmo's today

The Wow expansions, the (supposed) SF mmo and the new (secret) mmo on the new XBox console (using the Wow engine).

------End conclusion for the OP -----

I believe the new secret Blizzard mmo on next generation XBox console to have a far wider impact than anyone can imagine and at least it will be based on a full 3D world.

Short playing sessions of 25 to 30 minutes and evolving characters in a polished 3D unhampered style animated world is the thing of the future. Expect an XBox based on that engine to sell 20 million copies worldwide.

Expect this new kind of mmorpg to have a massive impact on the mediocre mmo trials we see today.

Compared to the mmorpg's launched on consoles, Wow will look like rocket science.

 

 

I agree 100%..

I think Mike sums it up nicely..

www.mmocrunch.com/2009/03/22/diablo-3-the-last-non-mmo-diablo/comment-page-1/

I liked Diablo 1.  I hated  Diablo 2. It had no appeal to me and certainly didn't provide the same entertainment value as an MMORPG does. (for me)

So maybe there's lots of current MMORPG players dying to relieve their great Diablo 2 experience, but in my case its just not going to happen. In fact, I'm most likely to never even try D3, as I'm pretty sure it would be a waste of money in my case.

Starcraft 3 is a different story, because I truely loved that game in the day and will buy it strictly for nostalgia's sake.

Originally posted by Thoric485

Originally posted by galliard1981

 pking...death consequence...death penalty.

Wait, what does that have to do with Diablo 3?

have u not heard about hardcore mode in d2? most likely it will return. if not, i am not playing diablo. i am not playing either if pvp/pk is harder than was in d2. but i strongly believe it will remain very similar.

Somebody here said that keeping in secret release date is masterful marketing. i strongly disagree, because darkfall kept their release date in secret too and was called vaporware for this. please ppl be consequent in your opinions.

Phat lootz ftw!!!

Originally posted by galliard1981

Originally posted by Thoric485

Originally posted by galliard1981

 pking...death consequence...death penalty.

Wait, what does that have to do with Diablo 3?

 

have u not heard about hardcore mode in d2? most likely it will return. if not, i am not playing diablo. i am not playing either if pvp/pk is harder than was in d2. but i strongly believe it will remain very similar.

Somebody here said that keeping in secret release date is masterful marketing. i strongly disagree, because darkfall kept their release date in secret too and was called vaporware for this. please ppl be consequent in your opinions.

Phat lootz ftw!!!

Yes, of course i've heard about PvP/PK and hardcore mode in Diablo 2. And when they announced D3 i kept that little hope that maybe they will not manupilate the design of the series to match their recent trends and respect their early work. But this quote about PK:

"We're - in general - not big fans of griefing for any game. It's really only "fun" for one person, and that definition of fun isn't generally something we're going to want to encourage. It's far more positive to encourage and support meaningful and skillful options and systems within a game, than a mechanic for people to instantly turn against one another for no meaningful gameplay reasons.

I definitely remember running with my friends, and someone toggles it, and bam everyone is dead and your one friend is laughing. Ok, ok, good joke I guess, and then you run back and *bam*, you've toggled it to get them back. After a while everyone usually agrees to a truce because it's just a waste of time. But I also remember running with random players and losing extremely nice items because of it, not cool. I'm sure that it was a feature that was right up some people's alleys, I won't deny there are some that would enjoy nothing more than to see others frustrated, but is that truly something that should be encouraged through design - if not directly opposed?

We have a large focus on cooperative play for Diablo III, and the mechanics and design decisions related to multiplayer are likely going to be based on supporting and encouraging it as much as possible, and not breaking it down.

That doesn't mean that PvP won't have its own focus, but those are details and features we aren't yet discussing. "

doesn't really give me high expectations.

Originally posted by Thoric485

Originally posted by galliard1981

Originally posted by Thoric485

Originally posted by galliard1981

 pking...death consequence...death penalty.

Wait, what does that have to do with Diablo 3?

 

have u not heard about hardcore mode in d2? most likely it will return. if not, i am not playing diablo. i am not playing either if pvp/pk is harder than was in d2. but i strongly believe it will remain very similar.

Somebody here said that keeping in secret release date is masterful marketing. i strongly disagree, because darkfall kept their release date in secret too and was called vaporware for this. please ppl be consequent in your opinions.

Phat lootz ftw!!!

Yes, of course i've heard about PvP/PK and hardcore mode in Diablo 2. And when they announced D3 i kept that little hope that maybe they will not manupilate the design of the series to match their recent trends and respect their early work. But this quote about PK:

"We're - in general - not big fans of griefing for any game. It's really only "fun" for one person, and that definition of fun isn't generally something we're going to want to encourage. It's far more positive to encourage and support meaningful and skillful options and systems within a game, than a mechanic for people to instantly turn against one another for no meaningful gameplay reasons.

I definitely remember running with my friends, and someone toggles it, and bam everyone is dead and your one friend is laughing. Ok, ok, good joke I guess, and then you run back and *bam*, you've toggled it to get them back. After a while everyone usually agrees to a truce because it's just a waste of time. But I also remember running with random players and losing extremely nice items because of it, not cool. I'm sure that it was a feature that was right up some people's alleys, I won't deny there are some that would enjoy nothing more than to see others frustrated, but is that truly something that should be encouraged through design - if not directly opposed?

We have a large focus on cooperative play for Diablo III, and the mechanics and design decisions related to multiplayer are likely going to be based on supporting and encouraging it as much as possible, and not breaking it down.

That doesn't mean that PvP won't have its own focus, but those are details and features we aren't yet discussing. "

doesn't really give me high expectations.

 

faaaaaak man, maybe you were right, but i didnt want to believe it
 

http://img261.imageshack.us/img261/9349/akzz7r.jpg

if this picture is not fake, this lame gaaaay "allow pvp" feature will be implemented in d2 patch 1.13, and most probably later in d3

in this case my poll would change probbaly. so far it surpassed my expectations

time to bump this thread from 2 years and see how ratios change. its hot toppic now i guess

Originally posted by Interesting

DIABLO 3 is a phenom.

 When it releases everyone will buy the box.

 

Not quite everyone. I won't be buying it. There's no way I'm buying a single player game that needs me to be online to play it. That's a ridiculous concept.

Originally posted by galliard1981

I personally started playing mmos because d2 became hacked too much. Basically i played it to get lvl/items and start pvping or pking nubz. I like death consequence so i played only hardcore mode. Later was looking after mmos with some death penalty. When d3 comes out, i will certainly stop playing mmo. I dont know how blizz does it but diablo is like drug.

I am wondering how many other ppl are there who also started their mmo adventure when they got fed up with d2, but are impatiently waiting for d3.

That's some serious Diablo love there. :P

I myself has never been a huge fan of Diablo-esque games. The isometric perspective and relentless clicking makes me tired sooner than most people.

EDIT: Ugh. I didn't realize this was a necro thread. I didn't mean to contribute! Wish I could delete my posts...

A more valid question is "Will the Diablo Franchise die when Diablo III comes out" I am sure that is a much closer reality than your question.

Hell NO !

I honestly can't consider D3 a true mmorpg. I don't need to spell it out but it is hardly a Massively designed title so I'm kind of confused why it's disgust here at all. I'm not flaming the game believe me, I watched my sons play the first one for hours and hours and loved the music. It's just that since it is a coop hack & slash it shouldn't be confused with an mmo, and therefore mmo's won't die.

Originally posted by Amjoco

I honestly can't consider D3 a true mmorpg. I don't need to spell it out but it is hardly a Massively designed title so I'm kind of confused why it's disgust here at all. I'm not flaming the game believe me, I watched my sons play the first one for hours and hours and loved the music. It's just that since it is a coop hack & slash it shouldn't be confused with an mmo, and therefore mmo's won't die.

 

I am worried only in the respect that mmos are moving towards hack and slash coop themselves, and what impact will a "true" hack and slash coop game have, moreover that diablo 3 will have their ah for cash and all items tradeable and a paradigm that "every build should be viable" to encourage character uniqueness, already a advantage over the BoP- and TOPDPSfest current mmos have become...

Flame on!

:)

Originally posted by Thillian

What is Diablo? Never played it.

Basically a game where you keep killing mobs in hope of getting a good drop from them.

And ... thats all.