I bought the retail package as my mate asked me to pick him up a copy so he can make another account and I thought I'd get one for myself and play along. However I got into the game and he and my other 2 real life firends who play also never logged in apart from just to switch skills around. So I had to find people to play with and this is where the game stumbles for me. I tried several corps in the game but most of the time they were dead and people logged on, then logged straight back off. I tried joining Corps that had people on and all they ever seemed to do was boring stuff like mining or gate camping and I just find that really sad as I could waste hours of my life doing anything else that is more fun than watching paint dry. I then joined a Factional Warfare corp like people on these forums told me to do and I expected as the tackler that when I lost my ship they'd replace it for me. However no I was expected to replace it myself....... so I had two options really 1. Mine or 2. Agent Missions. Now both of these are boring as hell and I just didn't want to do any of that so I flew around in an Ibis trying to PVP with no luck so I just gave up until my mate gave me some cash for another ship. All my friends buy time codes and trade them in for ISK btw and thats how they make their money, they have carriers and Titans all through doing this. It seems everyone I meet in the game just basically buys ISK because making it is so unfun.

So I left the Factional Warfare corp cause they wern't any help and tried to join 0.0 corps to experience that but trying to get through to 0.0 left me podded trying to make it through each time in my ship cause every gate is camped. So I tried to to do exploration and find these wormholes which I never did cause all it involved was hours of sending probes out and narrowing the location down until you got 100% signal strength. This is so boring I really don't understand why anyone would watse hours sitting there doing this. All I want to do is have fun PVP fights but it's always unfair fights of gate camps and hoping Worm holes would fix the problem but finding them is boringggggg!

So I joined factional warfare again and all that ever come down to is two sides of gate campers too scared to jump into eachothers zones. The worst part of it all was that everyone just bitches in local or the factional warfare chats and it's full off constant elitist arguing which just pissed me off so much. Noone could ever get organised cause all they were doing is arguing so you just had aload of idiots around a gate. If you try to PUG then heaven forbid they'll actually help if you're being attacked, they just run away and leave you to die! Like thanx for the fucking useless group!

Never go to the EVE forums btw cause again heaven forbid anyone can actually help you there. the constant elitist arguing is worse than the WoW class forums. It's like worse than CS :\ I mean EVE Online has one of the worst and most angry communities Iv'e ever come across and I just don't understand it. I play cause I want to have fun and theres all these people treating it like if you're a noob in EVE you might aswel die in real life cause you suck and EVE is the be all and end all.

I've tried to get into this game but it just isn't any fun and feels like one long grind to get anywhere. People who say you can get in straight away and PVP are wrong cause all you can do is get in and die straight away.

Hmm, I see your point... I also recently started playing EvE again, and I really like it now.

I'm just running missions atm though, but somehow I find it really funny.  Partly because my ship(s) are becoming stronger and stronger, but factional warfare would be really cool indeed^^.

Buying ISK seems to be a part of the game though, but I'd rather earn it myself. Unless people want to give it to me of cource, but that's mostly for a reason. While buying ISK from IRL money trough gamecards is rather lame imo.

EVE is not for everyone.

I like it.

However, the points you mentioned as boring are not boring to me.  I might be wrong, but it seemed that you are looking for endless, "fair" PvP.  Not sure if that exists anywheres.  Any game that has PvP will have gate camping and other forms of ganking.  It is the nature of the beast - Though PvP is, in my opinion, a valuable part of any game - immature people will use it to prove to themselves that they are "the best".  

I have 2 accounts - 2 characters(the weak point of EVE to me is that you can only train 1 character at a time per account - which in a way limits you to 1 character per account.  I have a miner that makes my money and a fighter for ratting and eventually for PvP. 

I researched the game for race and ships I want to use.  I downloaded EVEMON and used the battle clinic section to find a build for the ship I wanted to fly - and made a plan for training the skills.  I also noted the "recommended" skills - for certifcates and will train them also.  My plan is to have a miner who can use a Hulk and a fighter who can fly a well fitted and trained Cruiser.  Once the cruiser is well done I will probably continue on to Battle cruiser.

 EVE is not for everyone, it gives you immense freedom to be the character you want to be.. but research is necessary.  The game is not easy, I've played many MMO's and EVE has the hardest learning curve - even with the latest expansion which tried to address it. 

For me, Corps should be joined early in the Corps history if possible.  This has inherent dangers - the older Corps and Alliances will consider you fresh and easy meat and will dec you continuously.  PvP Gankers will also consider you an easy target.  However it is easier to become part of a team that is forming than trying to fit into one where everyone has been playing for a long time and you are just the FNG(Effin new guy for those who don't know).

To sum up: EVE is not for everyone, it requires work and some dedication, when you supply those the game is worth it.

I just don't find making money in the game fun because it's just doing repetitive tasks over and over again.. I already do that in my real life job and EVE just feels like a waste of time when I'm not having fun. I want to PVP but I have to wait months and months just to have the skills to be useful and I want to progress through the game from playing and having fun, not logging off like all my friends only logging on to switch skills and buying money to afford everything.

I also don't see the appeal of the unfair PVP too because it only ever goes one of two ways. You overpower them and easily win and they try to run away instead of attacking or they overpower you and you try to run away. Most the time it's me trying to be skillful and do 1 vs 1 cause I learnt you can't relly on anyone in the game but then you get some sado who has lots of accounts tackle you and then warp in other ships to finish you off. I just don't see the fun in any of that and it wouldn't be so bad if there wasn't gates because thats all PVP seems to center around. What I'd love to see is like Arenas like the Alliance Tournament and have me and my friend do a 2 vs 2 and you don't know what you're gonna fight until you load in. That would be really kool fair fights where the amount of ALTS you own doesn't effect anything.

I love the market and I love how I'm not tied down to a single class, though I would have prefered it not to be real time training. I just think the game is really flawed and boring when I could have better and fair PVP in CS where it purely revolves around skill and I don't have to spend months doing repetitive tasks for money.

So you want what you want now without earning it. ok, there are plenty of easy games to play.  This is a hard one designed for people who like to EARN what they get rather than have it right from the beginning.  I find it boring to be able to do anything from the beginning without having to earn it.  As I have said in other posts about EVE - it isn't for everyone, thank God.

Originally posted by elderotter

So you want what you want now without earning it. ok, there are plenty of easy games to play.  This is a hard one designed for people who like to EARN what they get rather than have it right from the beginning.  I find it boring to be able to do anything from the beginning without having to earn it.  As I have said in other posts about EVE - it isn't for everyone, thank God.

See this is the immature response from the average EVE community and It makes me thankful for not liking the game.

The thing is the game isn't hard and the only reason people seem to think it is that because it's a boring grind to get to where you want. That isn't hard but just boring and it's like anything tedious in life it's draining and feels hard so don't get the two confused.

Also I don't want games to be easy and I love to feel like I achieved something but I just don't want it to be boring to get there. Why can't achieving something be fun? I have enough of a grind trying to make money in real life without having another one in a game. Why can't I be doing fun Unique quests for money like the fun missions that are in GTA 4 for example, where I have to kidnap Gracie and shes trying to crash the car by grabbing the steering wheel and I punch her to knock her out. Instead of fly here, kill these mobs and fly back, rinse and repeat several thousand times.

 I return to eve now and then, sometimes for a week, sometimes for longer. From what I can gather from your post you want to be part of a well oiled machine, a small gang or community of players that work toward the same goal as you and incorperate you as one of them.......................but without going through the required rigmorale to become one of the team.

Your opinions are not wrong, but you have to understand that what is fun for some is boring mindless rubbish for others. Your points on missions / quests is one that applies to any online rpg. 

eve isnt for everyone. sorry you didnt like it. ttfn.

Seemce like any other ordinary community to me (Yes MMO community of a very popular game

Originally posted by John.A.Zoid

Originally posted by elderotter

So you want what you want now without earning it. ok, there are plenty of easy games to play.  This is a hard one designed for people who like to EARN what they get rather than have it right from the beginning.  I find it boring to be able to do anything from the beginning without having to earn it.  As I have said in other posts about EVE - it isn't for everyone, thank God.

 

See this is the immature response from the average EVE community and It makes me thankful for not liking the game.

The thing is the game isn't hard and the only reason people seem to think it is that because it's a boring grind to get to where you want. That isn't hard but just boring and it's like anything tedious in life it's draining and feels hard so don't get the two confused.

Also I don't want games to be easy and I love to feel like I achieved something but I just don't want it to be boring to get there. Why can't achieving something be fun? I have enough of a grind trying to make money in real life without having another one in a game. Why can't I be doing fun Unique quests for money like the fun missions that are in GTA 4 for example, where I have to kidnap Gracie and shes trying to crash the car by grabbing the steering wheel and I punch her to knock her out. Instead of fly here, kill these mobs and fly back, rinse and repeat several thousand times.

Easy to rate something as immature when it goes against what you believe. I believe that it is you that is immature - wanting the easy fix.  It isn't the game that failed - it is you. You could not hack it and left, your failure.  The only boring thing I see is your post about why you do not like it. In essence all games will be boring to you, not because of the game but because you are in essence boring.  If you did not want responses like this you would not have trolled the EVE board with your whining about EVE being boring.  I repeat - it is you that is boring not EVE. Like it or lump it.
 

I thought the original post had some good points. But then I read the other posts from john zoid and I think he belongs in Counterstrike. Fair PVP?  Arenas? 

What is this community turning into? Why do newbies think 'ARENAS' is great PVP? 2 vs 2? Omg go play Quake. They do that stuff awesome. And you dont even have to grind any skills to show off your 'player skill' that you keep talking bout

This game aint perfect I give you that. But ARENAS? Come on why cant you play WoW for that or WAR? EVE Online has awesome Alliance vs Alliance pvp. We fight for soverienty and ownership of systems. We dont fight for some fake ladder!

just move on, this game aint for you

Originally posted by elderotter

So you want what you want now without earning it. ok, there are plenty of easy games to play.  This is a hard one designed for people who like to EARN what they get rather than have it right from the beginning.  I find it boring to be able to do anything from the beginning without having to earn it.  As I have said in other posts about EVE - it isn't for everyone, thank God.

I don't think that is what he is saying at all.  he just wants to to be able to "earn it" while playing the game... rather than just logging in for a few minutes a day to manage his training queue.  You know, most MMOs do let noobs play too.  In Eve it just seems like you have to wait a few months to play the game.  Just pay your 15 bucks so you can log in and check on your training... no amount of hard work and dedication in game will get you leveled any faster.

I am currently in the trial and as much as I the idea of the game, I just don't know what there is for me to do in my dinky little frigate.  I can run missions, but those aren't fun.. I can mine for the sole purpose of making money but that doesn't sound like much fun to me either.

There are plenty of PvP-centric games that let you get involved in PvP right away.  It isn't absurd or overly critical to wonder aloud why this game doesn't. 

 Waiting for Walking in Stations, then taking EVE more seriously. Continual mining might cause bleeding eyes otherwise.

eve is the only game that lets you pvp from day 1. other games you need to grind to max level first, with eve you just need a warp scrambler.

the only limiting factor in eve is you.

Originally posted by John.A.Zoid
.....

 What I'd love to see is like Arenas like the Alliance Tournament and have me and my friend do a 2 vs 2 and you don't know what you're gonna fight until you load in. That would be really kool fair fights where the amount of ALTS you own doesn't effect anything.

I love the market and I love how I'm not tied down to a single class, though I would have prefered it not to be real time training. I just think the game is really flawed and boring when I could have better and fair PVP in CS where it purely revolves around skill and I don't have to spend months doing repetitive tasks for money.

Okay I will try to breakdown in places where you went wrong:

1. They do have Alliance Tournaments. I've never done them. But they had some tournaments on EVETV etc. Search the site for links.

2. You dont have to do repetitive tasks for money. You just don't. This game is a sandbox man. However since we all on 1 server its highly competitive. People aint eager to share their trade secrets. You can start your own business and make ISK that way.

How about player run banks?

How bout mercenary corps? How bout being a pirate? They fly what- a Battlecruiser? 

How bout Trade? Get the raw mats you need then reshape that into something you want to sell?

I got a 0 alt SP Trader that used to make me my ISK. Why cant you do that too?

And why cant you pvp? I know of many Alliances that use Tech 1 equipment exclusively. Hell yeah they take loss but their losses is much less then that corp using Tech 2 ships. Goons all the time put newbies on frontlines.

Yeah some corps have 3 mil requirement to join but really what is that 1 month? or well it used to be previous to Apoc patch.

Originally posted by Xennith

eve is the only game that lets you pvp from day 1. other games you need to grind to max level first, with eve you just need a warp scrambler.

 

the only limiting factor in eve is you.

THIS!

That is the great thing about this game, anyone can contribute in a meaningful way to PvP!

---

Originally posted by John.A.Zoid
I bought the retail package as my mate asked me to pick him up a copy so he can make another account and I thought I'd get one for myself and play along. However I got into the game and he and my other 2 real life firends who play also never logged in apart from just to switch skills around. So I had to find people to play with and this is where the game stumbles for me. I tried several corps in the game but most of the time they were dead and people logged on, then logged straight back off. I tried joining Corps that had people on and all they ever seemed to do was boring stuff like mining or gate camping and I just find that really sad as I could waste hours of my life doing anything else that is more fun than watching paint dry. I then joined a Factional Warfare corp like people on these forums told me to do and I expected as the tackler that when I lost my ship they'd replace it for me. However no I was expected to replace it myself....... so I had two options really 1. Mine or 2. Agent Missions. Now both of these are boring as hell and I just didn't want to do any of that so I flew around in an Ibis trying to PVP with no luck so I just gave up until my mate gave me some cash for another ship. All my friends buy time codes and trade them in for ISK btw and thats how they make their money, they have carriers and Titans all through doing this. It seems everyone I meet in the game just basically buys ISK because making it is so unfun.

So I left the Factional Warfare corp cause they wern't any help and tried to join 0.0 corps to experience that but trying to get through to 0.0 left me podded trying to make it through each time in my ship cause every gate is camped. So I tried to to do exploration and find these wormholes which I never did cause all it involved was hours of sending probes out and narrowing the location down until you got 100% signal strength. This is so boring I really don't understand why anyone would watse hours sitting there doing this. All I want to do is have fun PVP fights but it's always unfair fights of gate camps and hoping Worm holes would fix the problem but finding them is boringggggg!
So I joined factional warfare again and all that ever come down to is two sides of gate campers too scared to jump into eachothers zones. The worst part of it all was that everyone just bitches in local or the factional warfare chats and it's full off constant elitist arguing which just pissed me off so much. Noone could ever get organised cause all they were doing is arguing so you just had aload of idiots around a gate. If you try to PUG then heaven forbid they'll actually help if you're being attacked, they just run away and leave you to die! Like thanx for the fucking useless group!
Never go to the EVE forums btw cause again heaven forbid anyone can actually help you there. the constant elitist arguing is worse than the WoW class forums. It's like worse than CS :\ I mean EVE Online has one of the worst and most angry communities Iv'e ever come across and I just don't understand it. I play cause I want to have fun and theres all these people treating it like if you're a noob in EVE you might aswel die in real life cause you suck and EVE is the be all and end all.
 
I've tried to get into this game but it just isn't any fun and feels like one long grind to get anywhere. People who say you can get in straight away and PVP are wrong cause all you can do is get in and die straight away.

---

Sorry that you didn't Like EVE, but in my opinion what it seems you expected the game to be another generic MMORPG.

EVE is not like that. It's been said before, EVE isn't for everyone.

Now one thing i will comment about your post.

First, you expected to have your ship replaced? Actually, one of the golden rules of PVP is 'Never fight with what you can't afford to lose.' Ever since from BETA (Which i was part of) that one rule was the very first thing to be learned.

Second, Want to compare factional PVP to Alliance warfare? Your expecting a group of players with no previous afiliation other than being on the same faction to come together in a chain of command to fight the enemy factions? Good luck with that. DOn't get me wrong it does happen, when there are groups of friends, or even when the whole corp going into the war, but if your not part of a previosuly organised group than forget it. Recently i made a second account with a PVPer and what i did was spam 'Tackler looking for corp' in recruitment channel and i got buttloads of messages. I joined a corp and went with them in ops. Thats where all the fun is. 3 weeks after making my character and getting it ready to fly a tackler frigate with T2 modules, there i was battling it out against Battleships in Lowsec trying to defend a POS. Trust me its a whole lot more fun when theres someone calling primary over voice-chat and yelling out orders.

Eve PVP is 20% skills, 50% guts and 30% smarts.

Thirdly, ISK? come on. Yes you have a huge wall of level 1 missions to do but after you get over that, its pure ISK rolling in. My miner mines about 30mil ISK per day (hes in a HUlK), he strips whole asteroid belts dry, And my PVPer still manages to make more than enough to cover loosing a 600,000.00 ISK Frigate with about 5 Mil il T2 modules a couple of times per day. I just pop in do some missions and bam i have my money back. Don't even need to transfer it from my miner (Which explains why hes swimming in ISK).

I don't Sell timecards or buy ISK. You just need to learn how to make money and stick with it. If you have no patience to mine, rat or mission, than go play WOW and its clones, i bet its easier there.

This is just my opinion though. Sorry if it offends you. Your not forced to accept it, as i'm not forced to accept yours. :P

Originally posted by Xennith

eve is the only game that lets you pvp from day 1. other games you need to grind to max level first, with eve you just need a warp scrambler.

 

That is just really untrue.  Lots of games let you get started in PvP right away, or within a few hours of creating your account.  WAR is one example.  You can be involved in meaningful group PvP within 15 minutes of creating your character.  Not only are you involved in RvR, but you are are combat effective.

People like to say that size isn't all that matters in Eve, but how many vets are doing PvP in a frigate?  Even if you did want to do PvP in a frigate, you still have to train all the equipment and weapon usage skills to be even a little bit useful.  Sure you could do PvP from day one, but you'll be dead and flat broke pretty quick.

I want to enjoy this game... I just can't find anything compelling to do while I wait for days on end to be able to pilot a cruiser.  I'm not complaining about the fact that I have to start with a frigate and work my way up.. I'm just wondering what I can do that is fun while I am limited to a small ship and junk gear.

 EVE Radio is pretty funky, and kills time during the grind / mining.

---

Originally posted by Salvatoris

---

Originally posted by Xennith

eve is the only game that lets you pvp from day 1. other games you need to grind to max level first, with eve you just need a warp scrambler.
 

---

 
That is just really untrue.  Lots of games let you get started in PvP right away, or within a few hours of creating your account.  WAR is one example.  You can be involved in meaningful group PvP within 15 minutes of creating your character.  Not only are you involved in RvR, but you are are combat effective.
People like to say that size isn't all that matters in Eve, but how many vets are doing PvP in a frigate?  Even if you did want to do PvP in a frigate, you still have to train all the equipment and weapon usage skills to be even a little bit useful.  Sure you could do PvP from day one, but you'll be dead and flat broke pretty quick.
I want to enjoy this game... I just can't find anything compelling to do while I wait for days on end to be able to pilot a cruiser.  I'm not complaining about the fact that I have to start with a frigate and work my way up.. I'm just wondering what I can do that is fun while I am limited to a small ship and junk gear.

---

Actually you would be surprised. I started an Amarr character just for fun. At 4 days old he ganked a Hulk and won, while having 5 drones on his ass. A punisher, T1 modules, energy vamp and a shield tank was all it took.

With the correct guidance any noob can do PVP from day 1. Granted, it wont be easy, but its doable.

Edit: Forgot to mention i was Solo.

Originally posted by Salvatoris

Originally posted by Xennith

eve is the only game that lets you pvp from day 1. other games you need to grind to max level first, with eve you just need a warp scrambler.

 

 

That is just really untrue.  Lots of games let you get started in PvP right away, or within a few hours of creating your account.  WAR is one example.  You can be involved in meaningful group PvP within 15 minutes of creating your character.  Not only are you involved in RvR, but you are are combat effective.

People like to say that size isn't all that matters in Eve, but how many vets are doing PvP in a frigate?  Even if you did want to do PvP in a frigate, you still have to train all the equipment and weapon usage skills to be even a little bit useful.  Sure you could do PvP from day one, but you'll be dead and flat broke pretty quick.

I want to enjoy this game... I just can't find anything compelling to do while I wait for days on end to be able to pilot a cruiser.  I'm not complaining about the fact that I have to start with a frigate and work my way up.. I'm just wondering what I can do that is fun while I am limited to a small ship and junk gear.

In Warhammer can you contribute to Guild vs Guild PVP (open RvR)? No you cannot. This is what that poster means. Sure, you can do the Level 1-10 scenarios and contribute on a RvR level but one has to question what meaning this has. It's not like you'd ever lose the newbie zone in that title

You cannot make a meaningful contribution as a newbie in that title. In EVE, you CAN and the landscape dynamically changes. You can/will lose your space.

When I was a newbie I moved right out to 0.0. If I could do it, so can you guys. Look for a corp that will utilize you as a Tackler, recon, etc. A bunch of newbie frigs can takedown a Battleship. Battleships are what people use to rat (make ISK in 0.0), etc. There you go right there. Hell, go pick on a miner. Pick on someone flying in a shuttle. Demand a ransom.

Pick on the haulers.

I dont understand EVE is full of victims. There are targets of opportunity all over 0.0. Look for a Corp that will take you in and show ya the ropes

---

Originally posted by Salvatoris
People like to say that size isn't all that matters in Eve, but how many vets are doing PvP in a frigate?

---

Interceptor is a frigate size ship and it is a number one on all killboards. It is the most popular, most participating and most usefull PVP ship in game.
T1 frig? Great fun. Even vets fly them in FW. 

---

Originally posted by Salvatoris
I just can't find anything compelling to do while I wait for days on end to be able to pilot a cruiser. I'm just wondering what I can do that is fun while I am limited to a small ship and junk gear.

---

You have to forget about the size and such, think of ships as different instruments. Some ships perform better in given task - ie. frigates are very agile and can slip through many camps, escape from hunters, they can be easily underestimated, they are cheap. Think about the pros and take the full advantage of them.

EVE is not a leveling game.

Frigates are not lvl 1 ships

Battleships are not lvl 60 ships

Dreadnoughts are not lvl 80 ships

All of them are just different tools, each suited for different task - like when you use a spoon for eating soup rather than a fork or knife, even though fork looks more badass than a spoon and a knife looks more badass than both spoon and fork together.

i just want to comment the thread title

I've tried to give this game another chance...

m8 eve dont need YOU, dont need a favour from a player like YOU and dont need your mercy to give eve a chance

i dont know how to explain this but you get a bad mindset, eve is not a loser game dont need a second chance YOU dont meet the eve sandbox standard you need a second chance

look mate, you're just showing yourself to be pretty clueless and whiny. loads of vets pvp in frigs, either in tech1 trashcan wolfpacks or tech2 stuff in fleets. as pointed out above, ceptors are fantastic frigates and the rifter is a great many pirates ship of choice.

i think you should quit eve, its obviously not for you. good luck.