I assume we all know the benefits of having gear decay and it needing to be replaced.  It creates more point to crafting and stimulates the in-game economy etc.

But recently I was reminded of why I don't always like having my gear decay, if I find an oufit that I like eventually it will be destroyed and I will have to find something else to slap on, in fact the faster my gear decays the less I care about my gear, which seems counter productive if you were trying to make gear highly customizable, especially visual customization.

I think the appearence of my gear plays a big part in my character concept and if I go around changing gear out then my character identity isn't as solid as I would like it to be.  CoX for example let me design and keep my costume the entire time if I desired, which made my character easy to recognize and actually made my costume choice matter more.

So I supose the issue becomes, how do you make it so that the player can develope a look for their character and keep it in perpetuum but still have the economic boosts of item decay?

I figure the easiest solution would be to make it so that when your gear breaks you can go to a crafter, player or NPC, and they can copy your previous design, either entirely, stats and all, or just the appearence, and let the crafter rebalance your gears stats incase you want to try a new tactic out but want to look the same.

Having to replace your gear with better gear gives you the same problem, but I figure a simple upgrade system could be used to keep the gear's look but increase the stat bonuses, if you were doing that type of game anyway.

But I have to wonder is this an issue for anybody else or is it just me, and if so how would you go about it?

Yeah, we need gear to decay to drive crafting, and yeah we'll want to copy our fav threads, to be fair in the distant past and distant future it makes sense that we get bespoke threads. In history without mass production it was common for folk to buy a tailor made outfit. And I imagine with more advanced fabrication techniques we'll have custom made gear in the future.

In my RPGs I employ a 'social standing' description based in part upon the threads and obvious gear your carrying, in some environments all that bulky armour is just not socially acceptable, nor is the ninga outfit; however the armour is handy when attacked and the black suit helps you hide (like you stated on stealth the other day).

Lots of outfits, to suit all occasions, and all need maintaining.

Personally I don't attach the look to the concept, so the situation doesn't really apply to me.  However, I can see times that it would be a ton of fun if the game supported it (I think a mark of shame would be a cool RP feature).

If you had serious cosmetic control a look would be easier to maintain.  Color control isn't quite far enough, you'd also need various models (10-12 per piece and more for helm and shoulders).  The model would have no impact on stats, as stats are effected elsewhere in the crafting process.  So you'd end up with say 8 designs for how a chestplate would look, 3-5 color zones and neither of these would matter for the stats on the piece.  Stats would be determined by matterials used, so you could make the same look using copper, iron, or unobtainium (take your pick of mystical super metal).  Blessed/cursed materials and various gems and decorations could modify stats further.  Taken to an extreme, additional metal could increase the armor although I would reserve that for a weight based game.

Well as far as gear goes I am always in favor of non hierarchal gear, meaning there is no such thing as better, it is subjective, and there has to be a trade off for everything.  The higher the armor the more it fatigues yous and messes with your stealth type of deal.  Of course it is more than just combat stats, I got the idea from Fable but there are also social modifiers that effect how NPCs view you and effect some charisma based abilities, like ruggedness, intimadation etc.

As for visual stuff, I figure that every piece of equipement would be comprised of pieces, like a shirt has a torso, arms and a collar, with multiple styles for each, so you can mix and match and resize, then add colors, blending and patterns to get it the way you want it.

Initially I thought that with people being able to copy designs over and over and without the ability to craft uber gear that crafters would get bored but given that there is enough variety I do not think they would.

I think we still have capacity to have uber gear, the more stats, and I mean wider range of stat types rather then just armour and attack strengths, then the more options for crafters to explore. We cant all be the best at making defensive armour plates, but maybe I've specialised in making steathly armour, maybe I'm really good as I can make armour that moulds to the occasion. Hence you can look bigger and scarier when facing less than professional enemies and then not look like real armour at all when you're trying to get into the fancy dress party.

A bit more role-playing and we can all have some more fun.

Just waiting for the game systems to catch up!

One way you can get around this is to make repairing your gear a profitable means for crafters comperable to selling gear off in the first place. (I just skimmed the thread, so I'm not sure if someone already mentioned this possibility)

Another way could be that what gear you wear doesn't have that much of an impact on your character's looks. I know, I know, everyone wants to show off their brand new helmet or armor. Let's say much of your character's look is based off of statless wearables (clothes that can be bought from a tailor, etc) and your stat-modding gear has smaller influences on how you look. Quick example: plate armor vs flak jacket. If your armor only partially obstructed your clothes (or your clothes partially obstructed your armor) you can both preserve a wanted appearance for your character while still allowing for visual customization based off of your gear. If you could wear an open jacket over a vest, or shoulder/elbow pads instead of full armor sleeves, and helmets that didn't completely cover your head, you allow for people to show off their uber gear and their sense of style at the same time.

Of course, certain genres of games would have more trouble achieving a solution as easy as the examples I gave, but that's just what they are: examples.

Well, offc gear is not eternal, would be odd tho, I throw a though some days ago and offc. its great idea... highly custom armor looks, however i do like the idea of a humble look on low experience level and awesome look on high, to make you feel proud over your char.

In WoWarcraft the idea of all and or everything on raids drop gear maybe you could negate that idea, it is rather sucky when it comes to it :D

Like you say with some items better than others, I think it should be count on the elusiveness of the items you use in the crfating process.

While you as a Blacksmith optains a plan for Hellfire Breastplate, then key ingredient is Acid from an Animal (a hellfire beast, wtf do i know :p) and then you can make the armor with any material, copper and bronze is weak materials, but  easy to find. Iron and Steel is harder to find. High Level metals is DAMM NEAR IMPOSSIBLE to find, but they provide great Metal for the armor.

So the better materials the better armor, maybe rich materials, like silver and gold could go to stats to make gear for Templars, Paladins, Crusaders, i bet they like a Golden Armor ?

So basicly, you find an armor you like the look of and get best materials to make it, and bingo!

Originally posted by Thunderhead

Well, offc gear is not eternal, would be odd tho, I throw a though some days ago and offc. its great idea... highly custom armor looks, however i do like the idea of a humble look on low experience level and awesome look on high, to make you feel proud over your char.

In WoWarcraft the idea of all and or everything on raids drop gear maybe you could negate that idea, it is rather sucky when it comes to it :D

Like you say with some items better than others, I think it should be count on the elusiveness of the items you use in the crfating process.

While you as a Blacksmith optains a plan for Hellfire Breastplate, then key ingredient is Acid from an Animal (a hellfire beast, wtf do i know :p) and then you can make the armor with any material, copper and bronze is weak materials, but  easy to find. Iron and Steel is harder to find. High Level metals is DAMM NEAR IMPOSSIBLE to find, but they provide great Metal for the armor.

So the better materials the better armor, maybe rich materials, like silver and gold could go to stats to make gear for Templars, Paladins, Crusaders, i bet they like a Golden Armor ?

So basicly, you find an armor you like the look of and get best materials to make it, and bingo!

Yeah the way I was thinking was that there wouldn't be any recipes for an overall piece of gear, instead you get designs for individual parts, chest pieces can be made up of a collar, arms and a torso for example and you get individual designs for each of those that you can mix and match, resize etc.  you do not have to have all the parts though because the gear's stats are an average of its parts, not the sum so if you want to make a chest piece with no arms or collar you can, or just make armored arms and no chest you can.

The materials for the gear all have their ups and downs, I wouldn't want to have any form of best material or make certain materials obsolete, so they all have positives and negatives, and of course you can mix materials to alter the stats more.

As for moving up in terms of appearence as you level, I am not using levels or skill levels so I guess high level is this sense means having a lot of abilities, the player crafters you buy gear from at the beginning do not have as many options to alter the appearence of gear but as you level they do to and can craft you more elaborate and personalized gear.

Yeah I agree CactusmanX, bits of equipment combining to make your finished gear, this mean a lot more individuality as well as far greater customisation of abilities, heavier arms means more defence but slower movement of arms with all the associated reductions, etc.

I've been using an apparent social standing stat based on your look (as I mentioned earlier I think), the nice fluffy bits on your outfit will be often expensive due to the crafter needing to spend more time and material resources on them not to mention require more skill, so a lot of fluffy bits make for a mor oppulant outfit, and that will provide higher social stat. Of course you might opt for a much cheaper suit of armour that provides very little defence and/or manoeuvre, yet has a lot of fluffy bits, thats the price of fashion.

Advantages of SS stat: common folk will assume you've friends in high places even local leaders will assume you have associations amongst the elite of this or other regions, as such you will be better treated and far less likely to find yourself on the end of a noose. ie. NPC guards will be more likely to take yourside in a fight, if your opponent looks like scum (and they dont know them) then the guards may even take your side if you started it. Even if they dont help you subdue your opponent, they at least wont kill you and nick your gear, you might not even be arrested. I know not every game has this level of complexity in social interactions but I include it for examples of what could be available.

The way I was thinking for social stats of gear is that the social stats and combat stats would be seperate, to a degree and balanced differently.

Where the combat stats of the gear are balanced through tradeoffs, ie more protection -> more restriction, social stats are self balancing, since there are multiple social stats you could have on your gear, like ruggedness and poshness, putting a lot of points into one catergory will make NPCs that like that attribute like you more but it will also make NPCs that do not like that attribute like you less so specing your appearence into a category has pros and cons.

If you want to have gear that has really high social stats then you have to forego more combat stats, but to a certain degree combat stats and social stats can coexist with no diminishing effects.

I did think that players would just end up piling on tons of gear to get every little ounce of stats they can out of it, which I think is bad because I want players to have more options as to what they wear and not be forced to load themselves down with gear if they do not want, so I decided to calculate gear bonuses differently, by using gear averages, much like how a single piece of gear is the average of its parts so is the bonuses you get from gear. So if you are wearing 5 pieces of gear and someone else is wearing 7 they do not automatically have more stats than you because they have more gear.

For you to get full credit though you have to have 3 or more pieces of gear on, I don't want players running around wearing only a belt to cut down on people running around in their underware.  This also encourages players to have suits of gear that have like stats.

Something else I would want to do with gear is gear for crafters, this includes tools but also clothing that gives them utility slots to store their tools and such so they don't use inventory space or maybe speed up the crafting process a bit.

Sounds good. The multiple threads of social standing stat is something I agree with, the simplified version I usually quote cuts down on the amount of space I take up (I do tend to waffle). I also employ a hit location system hence armour provides bonus to a location rather than providing some percentage to the whole, but this is another level of complexity that you wont need to consider using your method.

Originally posted by CactusmanX

I assume we all know the benefits of having gear decay and it needing to be replaced.  It creates more point to crafting and stimulates the in-game economy etc.

But recently I was reminded of why I don't always like having my gear decay, if I find an oufit that I like eventually it will be destroyed and I will have to find something else to slap on, in fact the faster my gear decays the less I care about my gear, which seems counter productive if you were trying to make gear highly customizable, especially visual customization.

I think the appearence of my gear plays a big part in my character concept and if I go around changing gear out then my character identity isn't as solid as I would like it to be.  CoX for example let me design and keep my costume the entire time if I desired, which made my character easy to recognize and actually made my costume choice matter more.

So I supose the issue becomes, how do you make it so that the player can develope a look for their character and keep it in perpetuum but still have the economic boosts of item decay?

I figure the easiest solution would be to make it so that when your gear breaks you can go to a crafter, player or NPC, and they can copy your previous design, either entirely, stats and all, or just the appearence, and let the crafter rebalance your gears stats incase you want to try a new tactic out but want to look the same.

Having to replace your gear with better gear gives you the same problem, but I figure a simple upgrade system could be used to keep the gear's look but increase the stat bonuses, if you were doing that type of game anyway.

But I have to wonder is this an issue for anybody else or is it just me, and if so how would you go about it?

I reject that items breaking is a good idea. It is a terrible idea that will piss off the people paying to play.  Imagine, you obtain a sword of uberness one day and the next it breaks... The next day this person cancels their account.

Instead, you can have items decay and their perforamce decay at a rate that is slow at first and accelerates to 50% of max capacity.  This would be a money sink more than a justification for trades people unless trades people could sell portable fix it items for self repair..

I would suggest that the justification for trades peoples effort be focused on consumable enhancements (like potions for armor/swords) that lasts for a certain number of hp damage or casts or a formula that links both.  For example, a smith could sell a reinforcement that adds 10 ac points to a charater that has 1000 points.  This enhancement will last until this charater loses1,000,000 hit points (assuming the charater has 2,000 hit points.  Once the meter runs out, the reinforcement goes away.  These type of enhancements could be made for each class.

The basic idea would be to renew your equipment on average once a week for the average player.  Unfortunately, a single crafter can support 100+ players easy.  I guess it depends on the crafting system and all of that but I think supply would overwhelm demand... generally...

There is nothing wrong with special metals and all of that but making a rare combine with maxed skills is a roll of the dice and not unlike other games out there.  What I think is needed is the demand for crafting volume.  This includes raw materials which can be found or bought. 

In im opinion, the justification for the trades is a method to encourage collecting raw materials and as a money sink.  I really do believe that all low and middle level materials should be purchaseable through a vendor for a high price.  This is a great money sink.  Alternatly, the same items can be collected through adventuring...

Originally posted by kb2tvl

I reject that items breaking is a good idea. It is a terrible idea that will piss off the people paying to play.  Imagine, you obtain a sword of uberness one day and the next it breaks... The next day this person cancels their account.

Instead, you can have items decay and their perforamce decay at a rate that is slow at first and accelerates to 50% of max capacity.  This would be a money sink more than a justification for trades people unless trades people could sell portable fix it items for self repair..

Item decay is just a means to make crafters more useful, I don't have any particular love of it though.  I have thought about a system where items break, not for good but temporarily and crafters can fix them for a fee, fixing items would require raw materials though, which makes materials more useful.

I would suggest that the justification for trades peoples effort be focused on consumable enhancements (like potions for armor/swords) that lasts for a certain number of hp damage or casts or a formula that links both.  For example, a smith could sell a reinforcement that adds 10 ac points to a charater that has 1000 points.  This enhancement will last until this charater loses1,000,000 hit points (assuming the charater has 2,000 hit points.  Once the meter runs out, the reinforcement goes away.  These type of enhancements could be made for each class.

Defianatly have lots of consumables, I hadn't thought about the enhancements idea though, but I think it has a lot of promise depending on how it is implemented.

The basic idea would be to renew your equipment on average once a week for the average player.  Unfortunately, a single crafter can support 100+ players easy.  I guess it depends on the crafting system and all of that but I think supply would overwhelm demand... generally...

Nothing bad about that, if there are a lot of crafters willing to offer thier services then the price of those services would be cheaper, makes for better competition.

There is nothing wrong with special metals and all of that but making a rare combine with maxed skills is a roll of the dice and not unlike other games out there.  What I think is needed is the demand for crafting volume.  This includes raw materials which can be found or bought. 

Yeah you need volume for crafting, I was thinking that NPCs could by items too so you could make items for them as well, keeping the crafter busy and a high demand for mats.

In im opinion, the justification for the trades is a method to encourage collecting raw materials and as a money sink.  I really do believe that all low and middle level materials should be purchaseable through a vendor for a high price.  This is a great money sink.  Alternatly, the same items can be collected through adventuring...

This is why I have a different take on gathering, for one NPCs gather reasource by themselves and two simple physical labour like mining can be done by anyone, couple this with an auction house and you can make it easy for crafters to get hold of mats.

People quitting because a sword breaks and the desperate need for money sinks, you and I are definitely thinking about different games. I'm looking for the next generation that I hope will attract and maintain players use to the limited worlds they currently pay to play, not to simply propagate the existing systems.

I want gear to decay not simply to give crafters something to do (fix gear) but because I want you to be the important part of the equation not your gear, hence very few uber-gear and a lot of well crafted and as often as possible specalist gear. When you fall in battle your going to drop that sword, now your enemies got it you might change your mind about it decaying. And I need you to drop your gear 'cos its part of a much larger flow of 'realism' needed to provide a natural economy in a player led game world.

Sure I like the idea of a few legendary pieces of gear that are 'unbreakable', but we cant all have them, who the hells making this stuff, and if its that easy then why cant they just try harder and make me something better... and of course thats when we find a game becoming little more than a grab for loot and very little to do with anything else. Dont worry, I'm unlikley to get my way (me=), and even if I do I'm sure you can quit when your sword breaks, unless that is you want to try something a little deeper.

Originally posted by CactusmanX

Well as far as gear goes I am always in favor of non hierarchal gear, meaning there is no such thing as better, it is subjective, and there has to be a trade off for everything.  The higher the armor the more it fatigues yous and messes with your stealth type of deal.  Of course it is more than just combat stats, I got the idea from Fable but there are also social modifiers that effect how NPCs view you and effect some charisma based abilities, like ruggedness, intimadation etc.

Yeah I played Fable, it great, but also a deal on gear and when you can equip it. Meaning some gear is Levelbased, or else the game would evolve to ill joke where a first time player get the highlevel made gear and in my oppinion misses the hardship the game provides. I am opposed to the Heavy Armor, you need more STR idea, i have heard before, Coz it would not apply to Rogue and caster classes, what I am too unintelligent to wear this? wtf? :D High Level Gear should have level restriction, so I guess CactusmanX needs to play his game abit first before he would be able to equip his "dream armor" eh?

Originally posted by Thunderhead

Yeah I played Fable, it great, but also a deal on gear and when you can equip it. Meaning some gear is Levelbased, or else the game would evolve to ill joke where a first time player get the highlevel made gear and in my oppinion misses the hardship the game provides. I am opposed to the Heavy Armor, you need more STR idea, i have heard before, Coz it would not apply to Rogue and caster classes, what I am too unintelligent to wear this? wtf? :D High Level Gear should have level restriction, so I guess CactusmanX needs to play his game abit first before he would be able to equip his "dream armor" eh?

In my previous paper based games I often had restrictions upon equipment in so much that you needed certain skills or abilities before you caould employ it, sometimes to the degree that it was completely unwieldable and even dangerous to touch... but this was always due to some magical requirement that was either a design feature of the item (anti-theft etc) or the item simply needed a magical trigger to operate, a trigger that could be learned by careful study and experimentation.

However as my games never had 'levels' unless we're considering the ratring you hold in a given skill, it was impossible to limit access to equipment in this way; and of course my current design is basically a copy of my paper system. This does mean, as you correctly highlighted, that a newbie might accidentally stumble upon the ''most powerful item in the game'' (if such a thing exists), but as its very unlikely to be 'soul-bound' (else how did they get it) it wont take long for a more experienced character to 'bump-them-off' and soon be showing off their new super item. This sounds cruel, but its not automatic for someone to acquire anothers gear and at the end of the day its what happens in real life (yeah, I know, not a good enough reason on its own), it will also prompt a bit of plot development as the first characters to notice this super item and its weak owner will almost certainly be within a town and so bound by laws not to be murdering folk. They can go 'rougue' and steal it, or better yet they can try some other means.

More importantly however is my belief that gear is just the stuff you're carrying and currently using, its not your character and it should not be the most important part of them. You can lose it, it can break (as OP), or you can sell it; and lets not forget at some time you didn't have it, hence you must of acquired it or made it, and so can do so again.

The few super powerful items will be worth hunting down and 'acquiring' and so drive the plot, but lets face it- if they are so powerful that everyone wants them- you will spend all your time fighting off the collectors, or even their rightfull owners who may be the only ones who really know how to use them.

Far more useful will be a set of reliable equipment in which you have specialised your characters skills and so can use more effectivly, gear you've selected for what ever reasons including the way it looks the way it suits your play style and even the cost to replace. The odd 'power-item' will be kept under wraps for the time you might actually need it, and so not attract collectors.

My idea:

Implement a bank note system for gear.   These notes are like a contract and you can use to add stipulations.  These stipulations would be along the lines of Get stat X above X.  Repair to X damage without X happening.   Get X ability(techically the ability to use x ability in the armor) on the equipement.   Remediation cost of X if damage terms are broken on return.   Remediation cost of X if not done on time restraints are met.

The use could then basically put these notes up for auction where crafters could bid on the item, without risk of the item magically disappearing into someone elses pocket.   Or the note could be traded to someone you trust

The mechanic is based on gear not getting completely groken but rather it being along the lines of becoming an antique if it's not taken care by you and from time to time a professional.   The system also provides methods to have users change the stats on the gear to suit them.    You also can't discount the fact that it also adds a certain amount of risk to a crafters life as well.

Finally the most important aspects would be along the lines of letting a person keep the same piece of gear throughout their entire lives and providing a system where crafters don't just mindlessly create new items for the sake of creating new items.

Originally posted by paulscott

My idea:

Implement a bank note system for gear.   These notes are like a contract and you can use to add stipulations.  These stipulations would be along the lines of Get stat X above X.  Repair to X damage without X happening.   Get X ability(techically the ability to use x ability in the armor) on the equipement.   Remediation cost of X if damage terms are broken on return.   Remediation cost of X if not done on time restraints are met.

The use could then basically put these notes up for auction where crafters could bid on the item, without risk of the item magically disappearing into someone elses pocket.   Or the note could be traded to someone you trust

The mechanic is based on gear not getting completely groken but rather it being along the lines of becoming an antique if it's not taken care by you and from time to time a professional.   The system also provides methods to have users change the stats on the gear to suit them.    You also can't discount the fact that it also adds a certain amount of risk to a crafters life as well.

Finally the most important aspects would be along the lines of letting a person keep the same piece of gear throughout their entire lives and providing a system where crafters don't just mindlessly create new items for the sake of creating new items.

Mmmm, interesting; to be honest mate I might need to re-read that a few times before I fully understand the impact of what you've proposed. However (assuming I'm reading this right) I dont like the idea of someone having the same piece of gear throughout their entire lives, I want gear to be destroyed and so recreated thus prompting supply issues all the way from the mines to the soldier. I suppose a repair demand may have the same supply requirements (not convinced) but I dont like the idea of crafters simply repairing things... I want to see development. I notice that you have some development built into you idea- I think its a 're-crafting' system, yeah?
 

Originally posted by ianonmmorpg

Mmmm, interesting; to be honest mate I might need to re-read that a few times before I fully understand the impact of what you've proposed. However (assuming I'm reading this right) I dont like the idea of someone having the same piece of gear throughout their entire lives, I want gear to be destroyed and so recreated thus prompting supply issues all the way from the mines to the soldier. I suppose a repair demand may have the same supply requirements (not convinced) but I dont like the idea of crafters simply repairing things... I want to see development. I notice that you have some development built into you idea- I think its a 're-crafting' system, yeah?
 

It would really depend on how the game went about repair.  For example if to make a new chest piece you used 5 ingots of mithril and that chest piece broke then it could require 5 if not more ingots of mithril to fix it again, if it were halfway worn then you could repair it for the cost of 3 or more ingots.

In fact repair may create more demand for crafting services and for materials as people would be more willing to spend in increments to maintain their good armor  rather than stockpiling junk armor for when their armor breaks, so the demand for rarer materials, assuming that there are rare materials and good armor in your game, could actually increase due to people's increased incentive to used their higher level armor.

As someone who has recently started playing SWG after a 3.5 year break from it, I was remided of how cool it is to "experiment" on items.  Perhaps this would be a useful way to balance an item between ease of use and protection.  If you want more protection, put all your points in protection.  If you want to have better stealth and range of motion, put all your points into that.

How about bringing your "ruined breastplate" to a crafter who could then "copy appearance" and "modify appearance" based on what you want the next one too look like.  This would create a schematic in the crafter's knowledge base that would allow the crafter to learn how to make the breastplate look like the one you just broke.  Also, looted equipment could be in the form of schematics that a crafter could use instead of being equippable right after you cut it out of the dragon's belly.  A crafter could very well be reliant upon someone going out and looting a schematic that could then be assimilated into his knowledge base, and that could be how a crafter "levels" in a skill based game.  A crafter who has played for a year will have 10,000 items he knows how to make, but the crafter who has been playing a week only has the 7 ones he looted off the rats in the newbie yard. 

Originally posted by CactusmanX

I assume we all know the benefits of having gear decay and it needing to be replaced.  It creates more point to crafting and stimulates the in-game economy etc.

But recently I was reminded of why I don't always like having my gear decay, if I find an oufit that I like eventually it will be destroyed and I will have to find something else to slap on, in fact the faster my gear decays the less I care about my gear, which seems counter productive if you were trying to make gear highly customizable, especially visual customization.

I think the appearence of my gear plays a big part in my character concept and if I go around changing gear out then my character identity isn't as solid as I would like it to be.  CoX for example let me design and keep my costume the entire time if I desired, which made my character easy to recognize and actually made my costume choice matter more.

So I supose the issue becomes, how do you make it so that the player can develope a look for their character and keep it in perpetuum but still have the economic boosts of item decay?

I figure the easiest solution would be to make it so that when your gear breaks you can go to a crafter, player or NPC, and they can copy your previous design, either entirely, stats and all, or just the appearence, and let the crafter rebalance your gears stats incase you want to try a new tactic out but want to look the same.

Having to replace your gear with better gear gives you the same problem, but I figure a simple upgrade system could be used to keep the gear's look but increase the stat bonuses, if you were doing that type of game anyway.

But I have to wonder is this an issue for anybody else or is it just me, and if so how would you go about it?

The matter of character identity is one that I find especially important. For those that desire the attention, being recognizable is a great thing. I think that the ability to have an item replaced after it's destruction is a good idea. The point of having items break after all, is not to cause a long-term annoyance that destroys your image, but rather a short-term problem to be sorted out when the opportunity next presents itself.

Depending on the game you are playing however, some aspects of this might not be viable. I think most players would be very upset if a piece of equipment that took them ridiculous long hours of standing about waiting for a raiding party to sync.... forty times, was irreparably destroyed.

Originally posted by Velexia 

The matter of character identity is one that I find especially important. For those that desire the attention, being recognizable is a great thing. I think that the ability to have an item replaced after it's destruction is a good idea. The point of having items break after all, is not to cause a long-term annoyance that destroys your image, but rather a short-term problem to be sorted out when the opportunity next presents itself.

Depending on the game you are playing however, some aspects of this might not be viable. I think most players would be very upset if a piece of equipment that took them ridiculous long hours of standing about waiting for a raiding party to sync.... forty times, was irreparably destroyed.

 

However, in my idea of an ideal game, the weapon was not looted off of a raid boss corpse, but rather was crafted by another player.  It also shouldn't decay unless it is used actively, so standing around waiting with the weapon equipped should not cause it to decay, just using it against a mob. 

Raiding games have their place, but I would rather play a game where crafted items outrule anything lootable.  Otherwise crafting becomes a money sink with no real use.

Originally posted by ketrine

Originally posted by Velexia 

The matter of character identity is one that I find especially important. For those that desire the attention, being recognizable is a great thing. I think that the ability to have an item replaced after it's destruction is a good idea. The point of having items break after all, is not to cause a long-term annoyance that destroys your image, but rather a short-term problem to be sorted out when the opportunity next presents itself.

Depending on the game you are playing however, some aspects of this might not be viable. I think most players would be very upset if a piece of equipment that took them ridiculous long hours of standing about waiting for a raiding party to sync.... forty times, was irreparably destroyed.

 

 

However, in my idea of an ideal game, the weapon was not looted off of a raid boss corpse, but rather was crafted by another player.  It also shouldn't decay unless it is used actively, so standing around waiting with the weapon equipped should not cause it to decay, just using it against a mob. 

Raiding games have their place, but I would rather play a game where crafted items outrule anything lootable.  Otherwise crafting becomes a money sink with no real use.

I agree, my ideal game (Project Vex), is also a game in which items are often hand crafted by  players.  I have little care for raiding, as it seems to be nothing more than a stalling tactic for games that cannot produce interesting material for characters that have reached the end of their journey (leveling). 

My previous post was a nod to the fact that a game must be designed in such a way, that the mechanic of item decay works.  The grind games of yesterday are certainly not.

ketrine and Velexia, tell me about crafting.  What makes a crafter a crafter?  A willingness to manufacture piles of progressively better items?  A willingness to spend skill points on crafting?  A willingness to pay for recipes?  A willingness to use their player skills to craft?  Something else?

Originally posted by JB47394

ketrine and Velexia, tell me about crafting.  What makes a crafter a crafter?  A willingness to manufacture piles of progressively better items?  A willingness to spend skill points on crafting?  A willingness to pay for recipes?  A willingness to use their player skills to craft?  Something else?

It really depends on the mechanics of the game.  It depends on whether or not the designer wishes to make the players grind to achieve their goals... etc.

In Project Vex, creating items requires the use of  "skills."  The skills a purchased via "experience points (or  something similar)" and are available to anyone.  The higher your "skill," the higher the quality of the goods you create.  While crafting components are not spoon-fed to you, you won't have to grind all day to make something.

For example, the creation of a sword would require the character to have access to a forge, and the metal ore for the sword to be made out of.  In many cases, this ore can be purchased from NPCs who employ themselves by doing the grueling work.  The specific materials for the handle, and other minor aspects from the sword are ignored and assume to have been gathered in the background.  It is only the main materials that matter.  In general, crafting is for players to set up their own shops.  If your character lives in a currency based economy, it is more cost effective to purchase someone else's goods.  If your character lives in a trade and barter economy, creating your own goods is going to be more effective.

Edit: The appearance of the item you create (for example a sword) will be the largest part of the crafting process.  You will be given various templates and allowed to design the look of your weapon.  There will also be a random generator and presets for item creation.

Sword example:  Shape of the blade, design on the blade if any, shape and design or the cross guard, pommel, hilt, etc.  For advanced creation you can include other items of value into your creation process, such as inlaid gems.  items that have little value (such as strips of cloth, ribbons, tassels, or feathers will be freely accessible).