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3/12/09 9:42:42 AM#51
Originally posted by Zyonne
That is so easily the dumbest thing I have read ever, in the history of my life.
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3/12/09 9:46:09 AM#52
The term is right, "Tunneling" however, yes that rather stupid statement. Being smart in design is somehow cheating. LOTRO also uses it, as do many other "seamless" MMO's, Darkfall is in no way unique in this regard. |
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Originally posted by Mrbloodworth Which is, ultimately, the point I was trying to make. What's so different about Darkfall's server technology? Per Tasos, "Darkfall being a sandbox, real-time, seamless world able to support over 10 thousand concurrent users requires considerably more infrastructure and support in place than your average MMOG." Is it the fact that the game can support (allegedly) over 10k concurrent users in a single world that makes it different than the "average MMOG"? Other MMOs have seamless worlds, apparently using similar technology as Darkfall. Other games persist in real time and other games have sandbox features. None of these features are unique. The only unique feature (in regards to server infrastructure), out of his comments on why it's not a matter of just adding new servers, appears to be how many concurrent characters a single world/realm/"server" can handle. ~Ripper
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3/12/09 11:35:00 AM#54
Originally posted by rhinok Which is, ultimately, the point I was trying to make. What's so different about Darkfall's server technology? Per Tasos, "Darkfall being a sandbox, real-time, seamless world able to support over 10 thousand concurrent users requires considerably more infrastructure and support in place than your average MMOG." Is it the fact that the game can support (allegedly) over 10k concurrent users in a single world that makes it different than the "average MMOG"? Other MMOs have seamless worlds, apparently using similar technology as Darkfall. Other games persist in real time and other games have sandbox features. None of these features are unique. The only unique feature (in regards to server infrastructure), out of his comments on why it's not a matter of just adding new servers, appears to be how many concurrent characters a single world/realm/"server" can handle. ~Ripper
Indeed and the operative part of Tasos' statement being 10k concurrent users, (which in fact they are very close to, if they haven't already surpassed it).
So yes, Tasos' statement is basically true. |
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heartless
 Hard Core Member
Joined: 1/05/04
Imagination will often carry us to worlds that never were. But without it we go nowhere. -Carl Sagan |
3/12/09 12:00:06 PM#55
Originally posted by robertb
Indeed and the operative part of Tasos' statement being 10k concurrent users, (which in fact they are very close to, if they haven't already surpassed it).
So yes, Tasos' statement is basically true. Cramming 10,000 players on one server is not a major feat. The problem is how they are going about it. Besides the long queue times and now I read reports that they turned off mob respawns near starter towns because apparently more players logging in creates bigger sync issues. Not to mention constant server crashes... errr maintenance. The amount of players on a server is not as important as providing a stable environment for those players.
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3/12/09 12:00:48 PM#56
I don't know why that doesn't mean it's not seamless... This is always the case, and will always be like that. However it will be done differently. Right now, mmorpg's go for a zoning system, that gives the feeling of being one vast world. So it loads zone per zone. In the future, it's likely not going to be zone per zone, but you load everything around you. You can't expect everything to load at the same, especially not with $60 RAM. You know it, the best way to realize your dreams is waking up and start moving, never lose hope and always keep up. |
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3/12/09 12:03:09 PM#57
Originally posted by heartless
Indeed and the operative part of Tasos' statement being 10k concurrent users, (which in fact they are very close to, if they haven't already surpassed it).
So yes, Tasos' statement is basically true. Cramming 10,000 players on one server is not a major feat. The problem is how they are going about it. Besides the long queue times and now I read reports that they turned off mob respawns near starter towns because apparently more players logging in creates bigger sync issues. The amount of players on a server is not as important as providing a stable environment for those players.
You read that? Interesting... What did you actually experience while in the game, may I ask?
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heartless
Hard Core Member
Joined: 1/05/04
Imagination will often carry us to worlds that never were. But without it we go nowhere. -Carl Sagan |
3/12/09 12:03:33 PM#58
Double post.
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heartless
Hard Core Member
Joined: 1/05/04
Imagination will often carry us to worlds that never were. But without it we go nowhere. -Carl Sagan |
3/12/09 12:05:44 PM#59
Originally posted by robertb Cramming 10,000 players on one server is not a major feat. The problem is how they are going about it. Besides the long queue times and now I read reports that they turned off mob respawns near starter towns because apparently more players logging in creates bigger sync issues. The amount of players on a server is not as important as providing a stable environment for those players.
You read that? Interesting... What did you actually experience while in the game, may I ask?
So I would have to personally experience it in order for it to be true? If the tree falls in the forest is there a sound? If I haven't seen Watchmen, does the movie actually exist?
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3/12/09 12:11:23 PM#60
Originally posted by heartless
Well since people currently in game are telling me that this is actually not the case, I was just wondering if you actually had first hand information.
I am at work now and can't actually verify this myself, one way or another. |
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heartless
Hard Core Member
Joined: 1/05/04
Imagination will often carry us to worlds that never were. But without it we go nowhere. -Carl Sagan |
3/12/09 12:13:48 PM#61
Originally posted by robertb
Well since people currently in game are telling me that this is actually not the case, I was just wondering if you actually had first hand information.
I am at work now and can't actually verify this myself, one way or another. That may not be the case everywhere and honestly, would you know every single person in the game? People are reporting it, I don't know how true it is but it's interesting to note.
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3/12/09 12:35:21 PM#62
I believe the definition of a seamless world is being able to get from point A to point B with no "loading screen". Which is how DFo works. All large world mmo's that are seamless will still have zone "lines" or boundaries. Which when you cross over them, you may notice a stutter, or lag. This is just the nature of the beast. But it is still considered "seamless" UO is seamless, and you would still feel the lag when crossing a server line. |
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3/12/09 12:38:18 PM#63
Originally posted by heartless That may not be the case everywhere and honestly, would you know every single person in the game? People are reporting it, I don't know how true it is but it's interesting to note.
Where my clan city is located, there are some ruins fairly close by. In these ruins there a mobs that spawn and my clan famrs them for gold, etc.
After a certain amount of farming, they stop spawning for a while.
Perhaps this is what is being reported, though simply misuderstood. |
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heartless
Hard Core Member
Joined: 1/05/04
Imagination will often carry us to worlds that never were. But without it we go nowhere. -Carl Sagan |
3/12/09 1:10:59 PM#64
Originally posted by robertb That may not be the case everywhere and honestly, would you know every single person in the game? People are reporting it, I don't know how true it is but it's interesting to note.
Where my clan city is located, there are some ruins fairly close by. In these ruins there a mobs that spawn and my clan famrs them for gold, etc.
After a certain amount of farming, they stop spawning for a while.
Perhaps this is what is being reported, though simply misuderstood. I think that this is happening with those mobs right outside newbie zones. It would make sense because the influx of new players would put a strain on those zones.
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3/12/09 1:12:35 PM#65
I know in WAR you also have a brief studder when you cross between connected zones. What's interesting to note is that connected zones in WoW feel completely seamless without any hitching. However you typically move from zone to zone through small "tunnels" in the environment closing you into any specific zone. Perhaps much of the next environment is being loaded in the background while the player moves through this "tunnel"? This "tunnel" thing seems to be the most obvious difference between zone transitions in WoW and WAR. If my guess is anywhere near the mark, Darkfall, similar to WAR, does not have these tunnel transitions? A few areas in WoW seem to break this "rule" however and are still seamless. Westfall vs Elwynn Forest vs Duskwood seem connected differently. And then when you consider Outland and Northrend, you can pass any zone pretty much anywhere due to flying mounts. But then what's the point of the tunnels? Simply to box the player in so he doesn't enter the wrong zone accidently? There must be something Blizzard is doing differently with their zone architecture if most other games' zones don't have the same seamless transition. |
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3/12/09 2:13:56 PM#66
When the LOTRO servers were having frequent issues months ago you'd actually get stuck in a zone. You could move about freely within the zone but once you tried to cross the invisible border you would "rubber band" in place and couldn't get anywhere. It definitely shatters the illusion of the seamless world. |
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3/12/09 3:00:35 PM#67
Originally posted by Mrbloodworth
You should really stop posting. You claim of experience is completely invalidated by the fact you have no clue what you are talking about, so far, you have talked about 3 different issues. I could give a rats ass if you can program a "hello world" app, you clearly know nothing about MMO server architecture.
I clearly know nothing about server architecture? You completely dodged my signature question and you expect people to view you as credible? splat |
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3/12/09 3:57:02 PM#68
Originally posted by kdparton
That is so easily the dumbest thing I have read ever, in the history of my life.
Ok, enlighten me. How is that dumb? Maybe I should have put quote marks around tunnels, but I assumed it was obvious I meant it as world design rather than literal tunnels. Between all zones in WoW there are either narrow passages, or huge empty areas. This allows your client to load the next area while you are running through an area with nothing going on, and by the time you reach the point of server transition, the loading process is almost always done. This is clever design, by all means, and is often referred to as tunneling. It *is* just a way to create an illusion that the next area loads instantly, though.
Darkfall uses similar techniques for loading, of course, but there aren't mountain ranges, or rivers, or huge empty fields on all the server borders, so the game has no way to guess where you are going to be in 10 seconds with 99% certainty, i.e no tunneling. |
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cosy
 Newshound
Joined: 9/15/04
EvE Rules #491 you should never, ever attack Russians on winter months |
3/12/09 4:03:16 PM#69
Originally posted by rhinok there are 1024 "zone" ( i call them square) and you load them when you are close to them on in game map youu see a little black lineand when you got closer you notice a FPS drop also on some zone you are more affected that other 1 SSD drive sole this problem here you got
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3/12/09 4:07:27 PM#70
Originally posted by Zyonne Ok, enlighten me. How is that dumb? Maybe I should have put quote marks around tunnels, but I assumed it was obvious I meant it as world design rather than literal tunnels. Between all zones in WoW there are either narrow passages, or huge empty areas. This allows your client to load the next area while you are running through an area with nothing going on, and by the time you reach the point of server transition, the loading process is almost always done. This is clever design, by all means, and is often referred to as tunneling. It *is* just a way to create an illusion that the next area loads instantly, though.
Darkfall uses similar techniques for loading, of course, but there aren't mountain ranges, or rivers, or huge empty fields on all the server borders, so the game has no way to guess where you are going to be in 10 seconds with 99% certainty, i.e no tunneling.
Zyonne, they are armchair developers, of course it's dumb! For example, one particular person knows everything there is about server architecture, but yet doesn't know a simple programming question. It really is like that armchair quarterbook, who probably couldn't even run the full 100 yards of a football field, saying an NFL Level QB doesn't know how to play QB.
splat |
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3/12/09 4:17:13 PM#71
Originally posted by heartless I am well aware of the fact. However, if no MMO is truly "seamless" why call this one "seamless"?
Ok, I can do with that. From now on I'll just say that Darkfall is as seamless as any other 'seamless' MMO _______________________________________________ The noob formally not known as not being the formally not unkown known APEist; The Stone Cold Killer of Tarq. |
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3/12/09 4:54:48 PM#72
I am well aware of the fact. However, if no MMO is truly "seamless" why call this one "seamless"?
I really really hope you won't be playing Darkfall, Heartless. Go back to whatever asian eye candy themepark game your waiting for instead. |
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3/12/09 4:57:34 PM#73
Originally posted by Dethnoble
He may just be old, so give him the benefit of doubt. Here's the code snippet in COBOL.
IMoron.
Yeah, I'm bored. Stupid endless queue. :p |
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3/12/09 5:07:43 PM#74
Originally posted by Zyonne
It kinda reminds me of talk show hosts calling experts stupid in their field of expertise. splat |
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3/12/09 5:11:57 PM#75
Originally posted by krieblood
Where my clan city is located, there are some ruins fairly close by. In these ruins there a mobs that spawn and my clan famrs them for gold, etc.
After a certain amount of farming, they stop spawning for a while.
Perhaps this is what is being reported, though simply misuderstood. They tried to give it a real feel. Ok put this in your pipe and smoke it. You take a AK 47 out in a pasture filled with Buffalo. You waste these buffalo with your Fully Automatic machine gun now there blow to pieces corpse everywhere. Where are the Buffalo respawn after you jsut wasted all 80 Buffalo that inhabited the area. There will be some in time after the corspes that lay there rot away. GTG darkfall Q
Cool, I wouldn't mind if once the mobs where killed it took a long time before they repopulated.
If at all. |
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