Originally posted by ktanner3

So what? I care more about exploring worlds than I do my own ship.  We've known a long time this wasn't going to be Second Life in space, so what is so shocking about this?

MUAHAHAHA!

Some instanced zone for some exploring.

designers nowadays have no creativity, its instance all the content and queue this and that server.

I expected no less from these nobodies creating this.

They should just go ahead and allow open beta and start the item mall! OHH yeah and go ahead and add the trading card game that SOE would have already done.

vaporTrek!

Shard i don't understand your beef with a game that hasn't been released but you're intitled to hate whatever you wish, since you seem so keen on making perdictions on this product allow me to do the same but first:

1: Cryptic Studios has been around since 2000 and has survived on nothing but online gaming, to call Cryptic a 'nothing/nobody company' is absurd and foolish.

2: Calling it VaorpTrek is just a tad premature at this point.

Now on to the crystal-ball gazing:

Star Trek Online will consist of a small but dedicated fanbase very much like CoH/CoV has done over the years, this is to be expected as Star Trek is still very much deeply entreched in geek culture and is not going to appeal to casual gamers or hardcore online gamers who, by the time this game is released, will be engrossed in a new game or still working on the one they have.

There is no reason why bridge interiors can't be added later on, EvE is adding the Ambulatory system which will give characters avatars when in space stations. not having this hardly made a ripple in the EvE community, people still play it....and Star Trek online will be played as well.

And..done.

There are plenty of good Star Trek games in which you never see the interior of your starship(s) and nobody talked about it then, this game will have pretty much the same basic concept only in a massive online mode and people are up in arms about it now, whatever.

Starfleet Command III is a game in which you do not see the inside of your ship, you can play online against others on the Dynaverse servers which are run by the SCIII community and still being updated reguardless of you not being able to strut around the bridge while three Warbirds are trying to turn your ship (which you can build from scratch) into swiss cheese.

Originally posted by TheGrue

Shard i don't understand your beef with a game that hasn't been released but you're intitled to hate whatever you wish, since you seem so keen on making perdictions on this product allow me to do the same but first:

1: Cryptic Studios has been around since 2000 and has survived on nothing but online gaming, to call Cryptic a 'nothing/nobody company' is absurd and foolish.

2: Calling it VaorpTrek is just a tad premature at this point.

Now on to the crystal-ball gazing:

Star Trek Online will consist of a small but dedicated fanbase very much like CoH/CoV has done over the years, this is to be expected as Star Trek is still very much deeply entreched in geek culture and is not going to appeal to casual gamers or hardcore online gamers who, by the time this game is released, will be engrossed in a new game or still working on the one they have.

There is no reason why bridge interiors can't be added later on, EvE is adding the Ambulatory system which will give characters avatars when in space stations. not having this hardly made a ripple in the EvE community, people still play it....and Star Trek online will be played as well.

And..done.

There are plenty of good Star Trek games in which you never see the interior of your starship(s) and nobody talked about it then, this game will have pretty much the same basic concept only in a massive online mode and people are up in arms about it now, whatever.

Starfleet Command III is a game in which you do not see the inside of your ship, you can play online against others on the Dynaverse servers which are run by the SCIII community and still being updated reguardless of you not being able to strut around the bridge while three Warbirds are trying to turn your ship (which you can build from scratch) into swiss cheese.

You're trying to talk rationally with irrational people. They completely ignore the fact that interiors are planned for the game because they want it NOW. It's almost like dealing with children who cry because they wanted ice cream but are being made to eat their vegetables first.

Originally posted by Starbuck1771

Originally posted by ktanner3

Originally posted by Hagonbok

I'm glad that they made the decision to hold off adding them. It's eviidence to me that they want to remain focused on much more vital core elements of the game instead of fluff that few will care about. Too many games waste time and resources on useless things like this before release, and too often have other much more important features and elements suffer because of it.

Kudos to Cryptic for showing smarts yet again.

 

That's how I feel. I'd rather spend time exploring the galaxy than my own ship. They already said that interiors will be added in later. The point of the game is to explore strange new worlds, not strange new quarters.

There is no viable reason they cant work on both which is what you fail to understand. You dont want to comprimise on the situation in the slightest amount. You dont understand other people feel differently then you and tyou try to make them the bad guys for it. Well guess what dispite how you feel people are still discussing the situation on the STO forums. Will it stop anytime soon? Well that will be up to the guys at Cryptic but I don't see it happening especialy since they fail to listen to the potential subscribers. Hmmm reminds me of SOE and SWG.
 

Well yes there is a viable reason, and they gave it.

Every game in development has made decisions that weren't popular with some individuals. There's never been a game that hasn't. They can't "listen" to everyone. Or in other words, they can't please everyone on everything. That's impossible. 

I know that the tactic being taken by some in regards to this is to make it seem like this is a decision that's alienated a large proportion of the fanbase, but the truth be told it hasn't. Not in the slightest. It's peeved off a handful of hotheads, same as what happens with every game at some point. The issue is already over for pretty much all the people that it was an issue for (it wasn't an issue at all for most) and they've moved on to talk about other much more important and exciting features the game will offer.

By the way, SOE DID listen to their potential subscribers. They listened to the @600k to 700k people that bought the box but didn't bother to subscribe after the first month the game was live because it was such a boring grindfest with terrible combat mechanics. That's what brought about the changes, and those changes probably would have worked to get people back were it not for another game becoming a large black hole in the market and drawing most customers to it.

Wow well I am completely not surprised about this. The whole story of the development of this game has been one disappointment after another.

Ideally a star trek game should have two different playtypes...a solo game on a smaller ship; and a grouping game on capital ships where you take on different roles and go on extended missions. Either way you should be able to walk around your ship.

Oh and missions are going to be instanced? I thought this was an mmo? More BS.

 ps the poster above is completely clueless. Interiors have been a huge topic ever since this mmo was announced.

I won't even bother mentioning how average the graphics look.

Originally posted by Hagonbok

Originally posted by Starbuck1771

Originally posted by ktanner3

Originally posted by Hagonbok

I'm glad that they made the decision to hold off adding them. It's eviidence to me that they want to remain focused on much more vital core elements of the game instead of fluff that few will care about. Too many games waste time and resources on useless things like this before release, and too often have other much more important features and elements suffer because of it.

Kudos to Cryptic for showing smarts yet again.

 

That's how I feel. I'd rather spend time exploring the galaxy than my own ship. They already said that interiors will be added in later. The point of the game is to explore strange new worlds, not strange new quarters.

There is no viable reason they cant work on both which is what you fail to understand. You dont want to comprimise on the situation in the slightest amount. You dont understand other people feel differently then you and tyou try to make them the bad guys for it. Well guess what dispite how you feel people are still discussing the situation on the STO forums. Will it stop anytime soon? Well that will be up to the guys at Cryptic but I don't see it happening especialy since they fail to listen to the potential subscribers. Hmmm reminds me of SOE and SWG.
 

Well yes there is a viable reason, and they gave it.

Every game in development has made decisions that weren't popular with some individuals. There's never been a game that hasn't. They can't "listen" to everyone. Or in other words, they can't please everyone on everything. That's impossible. 

I know that the tactic being taken by some in regards to this is to make it seem like this is a decision that's alienated a large proportion of the fanbase, but the truth be told it hasn't. Not in the slightest. It's peeved off a handful of hotheads, same as what happens with every game at some point. The issue is already over for pretty much all the people that it was an issue for (it wasn't an issue at all for most) and they've moved on to talk about other much more important and exciting features the game will offer.

By the way, SOE DID listen to their potential subscribers. They listened to the @600k to 700k people that bought the box but didn't bother to subscribe after the first month the game was live because it was such a boring grindfest with terrible combat mechanics. That's what brought about the changes, and those changes probably would have worked to get people back were it not for another game becoming a large black hole in the market and drawing most customers to it.

Well said. It's usually the same hotheads that do this in every game because they have their "vision" of what all MMOs should be and to hell with anything else. ANd lately it seems to be sour pusses from SWG who act like they were raped of their childhood and feel the need to turn every game into what they feel they are owed.They are always the ones who bring SWG into the argument so they are easy to spot.
 

Originally posted by Praxus

Wow well I am completely not surprised about this. The whole story of the development of this game has been one disappointment after another.

Ideally a star trek game should have two different playtypes...a solo game on a smaller ship; and a grouping game on capital ships where you take on different roles and go on extended missions. Either way you should be able to walk around your ship.

Oh and missions are going to be instanced? I thought this was an mmo? More BS.

 ps the poster above is completely clueless. Interiors have been a huge topic ever since this mmo was announced.

I won't even bother mentioning how average the graphics look.

1) the player crew was a small issue at the beginning for @ 20 or 30 people on the main forums.

2) Instanced missions have been a part of MMOs for a long time. In fact, part of pretty much every single mmo for a long time.

Thanks for trying though.

Originally posted by Hagonbok

Originally posted by Praxus

Wow well I am completely not surprised about this. The whole story of the development of this game has been one disappointment after another.

Ideally a star trek game should have two different playtypes...a solo game on a smaller ship; and a grouping game on capital ships where you take on different roles and go on extended missions. Either way you should be able to walk around your ship.

Oh and missions are going to be instanced? I thought this was an mmo? More BS.

 ps the poster above is completely clueless. Interiors have been a huge topic ever since this mmo was announced.

I won't even bother mentioning how average the graphics look.

1) the player crew was a small issue at the beginning for @ 20 or 30 people on the main forums.

2) Instanced missions have been a part of MMOs for a long time. In fact, part of pretty much every single mmo for a long time.

 

Thanks for trying though.

I don't get the whole anti-instance thing from some people. What's more immersing? Waiting by a spawn with 10 other people for that NPC(and then get told by another NPC how JUST YOU was important in killing so and so) or warping into a spot where it's just you or your group? I don't see what the big issue is here with that.

It's not an issue, but some want to make it into one without thinking about the long term aspect of it.

I don't miss the waiting for a group to get done with some boss before it's my turn, and i sure don't miss that group that can't handle it, start running away while pulling everything that's around them while making a bee-line to the exit...which is usually where your group is, then having to wait until the dungeon dies down and so on.

Then we get to the spawn campers, they're always fun...sometimes if your very lucky they'll move aside to let you grab the monster without any fuss, but mostly it's just a new hassle with a group, a hassle i don't miss.

Then we have bots, i know they still exist reguardless, but i would much rather have a fishing or mining bot than a group of bots waiting for my quest monster to spawn, this still happens but at least with instancing we get some protection.

Then we get the people who talk about how adding instancing make the game less realistic, to that i say when they can tell me how it makes it less realistic when i'm running around as a five foot human with a ten foot boradsword cutting a bloody swath through a group of garter snakes because 'townsfolk A' needs skins then i'll be more than happy to listen to them.

Yup, as soon as I see this kind of "instancing is bad' talk I know instantly that it's someone that's either too young to remember what it was like before they were prevelent, or someone that just hasn't played many of these games.

Originally posted by Hagonbok

Yup, as soon as I see this kind of "instancing is bad' talk I know instantly that it's someone that's either too young to remember what it was like before they were prevelent, or someone that just hasn't played many of these games.

..Or one of those spawn campers who get off on griefing others. Either of the above is reason enough to enjoy instances in a game.

I would have thought that after LotR everyone would have seen how good and immersing instances can be. Obviously LotR had to come up with some way of having an immersive player story, which wasn't going to be knackered up by campers or gold farmers - and it is done quite excellently.

As for interiors, I'm sure that they will release with some ship interiors, after all they are no more difficult to do than the outside world. Knock up a basic starbase, add a few custom textures and you have starbase 1 to 1000.

I would have thought personal ship interiors is going to be akin to housing, and most MMOs don't launch with that.

Once again, I feel we are back to the arguement over how "complete" a game should be at launch, and comparing a new game against one that has been running (and upgraded) for years.

Originally posted by jircris

If you actualy read the damned thing you would have seen this.  "CZ: At launch, we are probably only going to have ship interiors available during mission instances, however we hope to add the ability to players to freely walk around their ship and host gatherings in an expansion pack."

I'm not going to pay once to play the game then pay a second time to get all the features I wanted originally.

STO's only unique features for MMO veterans were going to be that a party = a ships crew.

I dont like COH because its just a thousand identical instances with no variety or dynamic environments.

MMO players > trekkies.

Also a lot of players are both and will not blindly play a game based on its IP.

Originally posted by ArcAngel3

Originally posted by Brenelael

Originally posted by jircris

If you actualy read the damned thing you would have seen this.  "CZ: At launch, we are probably only going to have ship interiors available during mission instances, however we hope to add the ability to players to freely walk around their ship and host gatherings in an expansion pack."

 

I did read the whole thing several times but until they add the part in red they can shove their game where the sun don't shine!

 

Bren

 

It sounds like they're doing what they did with City of Heroes.  They released a fairly solid core game that was heavily instanced and combat focused.  Later (sixth update) they added super hero bases.

A pro for this would be fairly solid gameplay at release, with a lot of devotion to core systems.

A con for this was that the game lacked depth and immersion at release and probably lost people and reputation forever as a result.

If they can include starship interiors without making the game a buggy mess at release, I think it would be worth waiting for.

If, however, they have a fixed release date, I'd say polish the core systems and then add the interiors as soon as possible; again as soon as they can be released in a highly polished state. 

 

waiting for is an option.  But theses days how many people are willing to wait around (while paying) for a game in hopes that they will add the feature?  Seriously, I can not play the game and wait until they add the feature.
 

Originally posted by grimboj

Originally posted by jircris

If you actualy read the damned thing you would have seen this.  "CZ: At launch, we are probably only going to have ship interiors available during mission instances, however we hope to add the ability to players to freely walk around their ship and host gatherings in an expansion pack."

 

I'm not going to pay once to play the game then pay a second time to get all the features I wanted originally.

STO's only unique features for MMO veterans were going to be that a party = a ships crew.

I dont like COH because its just a thousand identical instances with no variety or dynamic environments.

 

MMO players > trekkies.

Also a lot of players are both and will not blindly play a game based on its IP.

Since very, very few online games don't have expansions one must wonder what online games you're currently playing.

It would be an expansion, and if they go the route that EvE is going it won't cost you a red cent, saying you'll have to 'pay again' is jumping the gun.

So, let's say for arguments sake you get Star Trek Online and this expansion does come out and you do indeed have to pay, again for arguments sake lets say it carries a fairly standard price of $39.99...along with more planets to explore and more detailed planet enviorments they also have more ship parts, the starship/ship interiors and let us say they add the Breen as well as a playable race, i don't know about you but that sounds like it would be worth the $39.99 to me.

Originally posted by warrior41
....

 I won't play a dumbed down WoW clone.

....

Is it even possible to dumb down the already dumbed down dumbest game out there?

At least cryptic don't make promises they can't deliver. If an mmo is released with features that a player expects because it is promised but isn't in the game, that player leaves never to come back. When the feature does get implemented no-one left really wants it any more! Countless examples of this, PvP in EQ2...

Sorry, I just think they most of you had unrealistic expectations.  I'm still interested in playing it.

Originally posted by TheGrue

 i don't know about you but that sounds like it would be worth the $39.99 to me.

If they introduce retroactive expansions like EQ2 where you get every previous expansion included in the price then I will play at that point. One of the points I meant is that I'm not going to pay a subscription fee while I wait for this omgwtfpwnbbq expansion - the current spec for the game sounds pretty abysmal.

So you will have a "spaceship mount" and you will be killing rats in space. Just like WoW, with a "Stars" screensaver on background.

I agree some of the posters. A ship sould be like a ship. Hell.. there are FPS mods that let you do that, like the star wars mod for BF1942. 

Originally posted by Teiman

So you will have a "spaceship mount" and you will be killing rats in space. Just like WoW, with a "Stars" screensaver on background.

I agree some of the posters. A ship sould be like a ship. Hell.. there are FPS mods that let you do that, like the star wars mod for BF1942. 

I'm curious, so maybe you can answer a question for me? How do people decide to make themselves look totally foolish by very clearly not knowing anything at all about a game, but make a post insulting it just the same?