Originally posted by Hotjazz

Arrgg, let me pay to betatest Darkfall for 3 months, because DF is the best PvP mmo I`ve played since UO. I just hope they fix the preorder servers so I can get the game as soon as possible.

 

You are right in most of your points though, and I hope they fix those as time goes by. I disagree in some.

 

Harvesting is pure genius in a PvP game like DF. I can get my mats without spending boring time running around the world. A small leftclick macro and I can watch TV or PvP on another PC. This is one of the best part of Darkfall, but I need two accounts.

 

Crafting is also good. The same macro can be used, and all the things I make can be used by other players. This was not possible in games with poor crafting like WOW, AoC and WAR.

 

The community in Darkfall is rough but awsome. In Darkfall you have to make friends and you will get real enemies. The flamewars on forums between the big guilds and the best pvpers are just pure fun. You will know and remember  your enemies in Darkfall. In  WOW I had more than 100000 kill and I didn`t remember one single name from the players I fought. This is because mmo`s like WAR, WOW and AOC are PvE games.

You never really accomplished much in real life, did you?

Originally posted by Darkstar111

He did it first.

 

 Also im willing to stand by any of those points if he or anyone wants to contend them.

-Darkstar

 

OK He alleges communications from the devs is poor (I would actually say its virtually non existant)  I think anyone but the  most dillusional fanboi would agree that is the case. 

By all means point us at these comuniqes. Oh wait there are none (well there has been what three?) Mainly reasosns (sceptics would say excuses) why the servers have been down for such prolonged periods over the last month or so.

Originally posted by rmk70

Darkfall will likely fade off into nothingness after a short period of time. Without the kind of balance of PvE and PvP that Pre-Tram UO had (i.e. playing housing, crafting, harvesting, dungeons, creating hunters, taming etc.) Darkfall will simply fail.

What the hardcore PvPers fail to recognize is that PvE elements helped to support the PvP elements of Pre-Tram UO (the game that Darkfall wants to model itself after). PvE'ers gave reason for PKers and PvPers to stay active:

 

---snip---

sadly I am inclined to agree. Without much in the way of 'content' all you have is a massive arena, a big empty sandbox....no sand.....no spade...no toys. Even sandboxes need sand.  It's more like Fury (with simpler combat) than UO or AC.  Fury was good I am not sure why it failed.

I can't help thinking that even those that are currently enjoying things will tire of it when they discover really there are no consequences as there really isn't much worth fighting over.

Originally posted by Gorilla

Originally posted by rmk70

Darkfall will likely fade off into nothingness after a short period of time. Without the kind of balance of PvE and PvP that Pre-Tram UO had (i.e. playing housing, crafting, harvesting, dungeons, creating hunters, taming etc.) Darkfall will simply fail.

What the hardcore PvPers fail to recognize is that PvE elements helped to support the PvP elements of Pre-Tram UO (the game that Darkfall wants to model itself after). PvE'ers gave reason for PKers and PvPers to stay active:

 

---snip---

 

sadly I am inclined to agree. Without much in the way of 'content' all you have is a massive arena, a big empty sandbox....no sand.....no spade...no toys. Even sandboxes need sand.  It's more like Fury (with simpler combat) than UO or AC.  Fury was good I am not sure why it failed.

I can't help thinking that even those that are currently enjoying things will tire of it when they discover really there are no consequences as there really isn't much worth fighting over.

I was just saying in another thread that this game seems like it was designed around having lots of features and nothing else.  I am referring to the lengthy list of skills, spells, actions, anything the player may choose to enact or execute.  But I agree that this game is missing the point completely, lacking the toys, sand, the elements,  etc. to be worth playing.

It's very dissapointing after so long of a wait.  There's really no excuse for it either.  They may correct it months from now, and a little at a time- but to me it's not enough to stick around and hold my interest.

Originally posted by SignusM

Haha, I have done my research. Check out the official press release. The game started development in 2003. The game from 2001-2003 was under Razorwax. 

So was the game in development 2001-2003? Your original post claimed the game had been in development for 5 years. False. Companies name changed, staff have come and gone and the company has relocated but the game has been in development since '01. Of course if you had said "AV have beed developing the game for 5 years" then you might be able to argue the toss however as it stands you are plain out wrong. Sorry.

Originally posted by poppets

This list of grievances was taken and collected from all Beta review reports

 

* Servers not stress tested

* weak community

* bad communication by dev's

* No player housing

* No Weather

* No Trading system

* Harvesting only viable through macroing, very poorly designed

* No local banks

* No trade caravans

* There ARE safezones

* Buggy UI

* Lack of intuitive chat commands

* Total lack of LFG system, and lack of intuitive group formation systems

* Extremely boring, unimaginative and grindy harvesting and crafting system

* Boring badly designed click fest melee combat, with no variation in weapon skill sets

* No penalties or bonuses on armor types so everyone will wear full plate - why wouldn't they?

* No penalties or bonuses on weapon styles so everyone will use the polearm - why wouldn't they?

* Effectively 1 class because there will be 10k clones of exactly the same build, because the devs have NO CLUE about making skill based diversification, as has been explained to them hundreds of times

* Extremely solo and red unfriendly from minute one of logging in

* Just be aware that you will be PTB (paying to beta) for the first 3 months

New game with poor launch will fall through the gaps in the fast paced gaming community. Save your money people

 Sounds terrible , thanks for the warning

OP "points" has been taken apart by real beta testers

here

forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

OP "points" has been taken apart by real beta testers

here

forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php

 

Taken apart?

That thread is 6 pages of name calling ........... absolutely nothing more.  Did you even read the thread or are you making a joke that just went over my head? 

Because I'm certainly missing something here......

~Hairysun~

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

OP "points" has been taken apart by real beta testers

here

forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php

 

I looked at the link, read everything in it and even looked at other links in the link. The most "taken apart" thing about it was just severe flaming or "it will be turned on soon, i promise." Why would they have features turned off in a beta anyway, and features that they claim is working as well? Shouldnt they test things?

To me theres too many questionmarks about this game still, I'll just have to wait and see i guess

Edit: Damn, Hairysun beat me with several minutes

Originally posted by harmonica 

The people who hate it have never known the touch of a woman.

Actually I would say the people that like it are the ones who will fall in love with any ugly old strumpet :D I was glad I diped my wick before I had to pay,  but this was a fairly ugly, un-sophisticated curiosity. Sadly just another of many many notches on the bed post. (Actually and metaphorically)

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

OP "points" has been taken apart by real beta testers

here

forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php

 

lol real beta testers? they only invited morons and idiots that htey knew on the forums to not flame there game witch has been torn apart after the nda went away and now everyone knows what a shitty game df is and thats its gonna fail and not even worth spending money on ktyhxbye

Originally posted by DarkPony

Yeah, and if you take all of the positives out of all beta reviews you end up with an equally long list.

IT'S A BETA AND NOONE THOUGHT THE GAME WOULD BE PERFECT AT LAUNCH ANYWAY

The bottom line is: is it fun, and fun in the long run too? It appears to be fun for now for most testers, whether that fun will last? And will the devs be quick to address the issues brought up by players?

We shall see ... in a few months or so.

Pretty sure Tasos was telling everyone for months now about how the game was feature complete and release ready... 

No longer is DarkFail vaporware... its graduated to abandonware.

Oh come on people, put your fan flags on the floor for a second and just look at these screen shots. Look at the game, listen to their sound effects. Do you REALLY want to play a game like this?

I'm with this guy, this game is nothing but utter trash. Honestly for the amount of time this has been in development it's utterly dissapointing, I was expecting something new, something innovative. I really wanted Darkfall to succeed so badly, but look at it! 

Just makes me want to pry open your eyes, don't give me this graphics doesn't make a good game rant, because it SHOULD be better. It looks like it came from the 90's seriously, it's utterly shocking!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

/rant end.

Originally posted by Hobgoblin11

Originally posted by poppets

This list of grievances was taken and collected from all Beta review reports

 

* Servers not stress tested

* weak community

* bad communication by dev's

* No player housing

* No Weather

* No Trading system

* Harvesting only viable through macroing, very poorly designed

* No local banks

* No trade caravans

* There ARE safezones

* Buggy UI

* Lack of intuitive chat commands

* Total lack of LFG system, and lack of intuitive group formation systems

* Extremely boring, unimaginative and grindy harvesting and crafting system

* Boring badly designed click fest melee combat, with no variation in weapon skill sets

* No penalties or bonuses on armor types so everyone will wear full plate - why wouldn't they?

* No penalties or bonuses on weapon styles so everyone will use the polearm - why wouldn't they?

* Effectively 1 class because there will be 10k clones of exactly the same build, because the devs have NO CLUE about making skill based diversification, as has been explained to them hundreds of times

* Extremely solo and red unfriendly from minute one of logging in

* Just be aware that you will be PTB (paying to beta) for the first 3 months

New game with poor launch will fall through the gaps in the fast paced gaming community. Save your money people.

 

LMFAO.. you're a f------g idiot. The game is still in beta and about half the things in that list are taken completely out of context.  No.. the game isnt perfect but in spite of your hatred for the full loot, sandbox pvP environment.. many of those things could NEVER be turne on and Df will still be ten times the game that any current game is.

 Not to mention 10 times as empty.

anyone else here excited for the 25th?  I am!

Originally posted by miagisan

anyone else here excited for the 25th?  I am!

Aye and not because of Darkfall either, It's payday on the 25th for me

Originally posted by egg20001uk

Originally posted by miagisan

anyone else here excited for the 25th?  I am!

 

Aye and not because of Darkfall either, It's payday on the 25th for me

ooo nice! /hi5

Originally posted by Raizeen

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

OP "points" has been taken apart by real beta testers

here

forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php

 

 

lol real beta testers? they only invited morons and idiots that htey knew on the forums to not flame there game witch has been torn apart after the nda went away and now everyone knows what a shitty game df is and thats its gonna fail and not even worth spending money on ktyhxbye

I am not sure how to reply, a big part of me want to thank you for trying to keep a$4holes(those who not sure if they like it, the so called "sceptics") away  from the game by  shit talking it so i can get faster in and and enjoy my home for the next few years ASAP.

i think i leave it at that and thank you ..for trying so hard to please me o that matter..

upps before i forget ..the game is shit ..but you all should download the the torrent and seed it. After i got my d/l ready i don't care lol

"As for being a red"

What does red mean?

Originally posted by Hotjazz

Originally posted by Cetra

 Tell me why this game deserves a fee close to AoC 12.99 euro. Darkfall has nothing to offer other than ffa pvp and full looting enabled.  It loses out in everyway in terms of quality compared to any decent mmo in the market now.

 

Haha you are trolling when you mention AoC right? I had friends who invested alot of money in Funcom before the release of AoC. Why shouldn`t they when it was a sure win. People was tired of WOW and AoC was the only new mmo on the horizon at that time. We all bought AoC, but we knew after a few hours how bad that game was. Luckily we sold our stoks before they plummet, and we still laugh when we talk about AoC.

 

You have to remember ffa pvp and full-loot is THE thing that makes a mmo fun. I find it hard to belive that most players don`t like this feature, but I guess most haven`t tried it. The funny thing is that I`m not even a good pvper and loose my fights 90 % of the time in DF. Still I love the ffa full-loot mmo`s.

 

And to me quality isn`t about how the game looks, but what I feel when I play it.

Please tell me you are ESL. The entire economy Funcom in sitting in has failed. I doubt you ever owned stock in the first place. AOC was a complete failure, and the press confirms. As for DF, all I have seen are a bunch of previews that confirms the game doesn't offer the feature list, the billing system is inept, and they are asking $52 (US) to "pre-order." So, what ever happened to "getting a chance to play the game before paying?"

On top, the "oblivion" comparisons...that game was a completely unplayable peice of ... if you are a PC gamer. It was terrible.

Originally posted by premierebori

Originally posted by poppets

This list of grievances was taken and collected from all Beta review reports

 

* Servers not stress tested

We don't know that.

Yes, we do.

* weak community

I don't think so, there are some great people here.

Like Javac. Awsome.

* bad communication by dev's

Absolutely not true, they listen to us and talk back.

Where have you been for the last six months? Three release dates, all lies, and they are actually charging for this one. You paid, didnja?

* No player housing

Yes there is, just you can't place your house anywhere.

So there is no player housing, Jesus.

* No Weather

OK, true, but this is not a game breaking feature.

So, pay $52 to walk over the same texture for 25 miles.

* No Trading system

Probably my biggest gripe.

* Harvesting only viable through macroing, very poorly designed.

Yes, true, maybe they'll improve.

Harvesting should be a key component to any crafting system. Somehow, Ryzom, a sandbox, got this right in 2004, hell, SWG had it worked out by 2004 as well. Right, both failed.

* No local banks

I don't see this as a problem.

Minus the fact that most MMOs have them in place.

* No trade caravans

I can't see this feature being implemented effectively by anyone.

I think it was on the feature list (edited I am sure). List it? Make it happen.

* There ARE safezones

That's good, sometimes you need to go AFK.

In a FFA/PVP/FL/OMGz game, you should have to log out. Somehow, Lineage 2 made this work. It was FFA PvP after all.

* Buggy UI

Least of my concerns.

Until you can't find where your spell/weapon/iquit button is in a pinch.

* Lack of intuitive chat commands

Also on the bottom of my list.

It has been reviewed and established, the chat system sucks. For a FFA/PVP/FL/OMGz games the most important tool is chat, whether voice or typed, nothing is more vital to team survival.

* Total lack of LFG system, and lack of intuitive group formation systems

That's what clans are for.

That's what chat systems are for.

* Extremely boring, unimaginative and grindy harvesting and crafting system

That's an opinion... that I will agree with.

* Boring badly designed click fest melee combat, with no variation in weapon skill sets

Total opinion.

 Actually, many of the previews have confirmed this. Damn lucky you can jump around (like a player of WOW) to minimize your hit box. Unfortunately this means players will be jumping around ALL THE TIME. Think Criss-Cross...

* No penalties or bonuses on armor types so everyone will wear full plate - why wouldn't they?

I can see that one.

* No penalties or bonuses on weapon styles so everyone will use the polearm - why wouldn't they?

Not true, I like bows.

Then you'll die. A lot. Which is cool. You like bows after-all. Based on oblivion, that means you will die. A lot. I mentioned that right. Hey, you like to die. This is your game!

* Effectively 1 class because there will be 10k clones of exactly the same build, because the devs have NO CLUE about making skill based diversification, as has been explained to them hundreds of times

This is also an opinion, what is an obvious build to you is not what I want to play.

This has also been covered in reviews. So, you can play what you like. Good for you, as above, you will die, a lot. People have stated that skills are not effective and their levels matter nothing except by divisions of 25. Hence, this is a level based game.

* Extremely solo and red unfriendly from minute one of logging in

Good, that's the way it's supposed to be.

But to go red all you need to do is be in a group. If one idiot jumps in front of your swing, hello freebie. Wow, hey, THAT SOUNDS LIKE OBLIVION!!

* Just be aware that you will be PTB (paying to beta) for the first 3 months

Yes, I am aware, but the potential is there, thus I'll support the Devs.

The devs that posted 3 items in two months before launch. One of them being, that they had to delay launch. Your money, your choice. My comments, my choice.

New game with poor launch will fall through the gaps in the fast paced gaming community. Save your money people.

 

Originally posted by poppets

This list of grievances was taken and collected from all Beta review reports

 

* Servers not stress tested (true)

* weak community (disagree)

* bad communication by dev's (true)

* No player housing (we knew this for a while.  Besides if there was player housing it would be destroyable.  And as shadowbane proved in that kind of enviroment no one uses player housing)

* No Weather (true.  really wondering where this went)

* No Trading system (true)

* Harvesting only viable through macroing, very poorly designed (Just like UO.)

* No local banks (we knew for a while)

* No trade caravans (knew for a while)

* There ARE safezones (kind of)

* Buggy UI (have not had problems)

* Lack of intuitive chat commands (true)

* Total lack of LFG system, and lack of intuitive group formation systems (true,  but never expected this)

* Extremely boring, unimaginative and grindy harvesting and crafting system (just like UO.  kind of what I was expecting)

* Boring badly designed click fest melee combat, with no variation in weapon skill sets (depends on where you are coming from.  I do want somewhat of a change,  but a million spamable hotbutton skills i not what I am looking for.  Would enjoy the game is top levels looked more savage2 like.  UO and Ac had extremely simple melee systems.  I would like a better designed simple system though.)

* No penalties or bonuses on armor types so everyone will wear full plate - why wouldn't they?  (true)

* No penalties or bonuses on weapon styles so everyone will use the polearm - why wouldn't they?  (board and sword beats polearm,  especially now with stamina per swing increase for polearms.)

* Effectively 1 class because there will be 10k clones of exactly the same build, because the devs have NO CLUE about making skill based diversification, as has been explained to them hundreds of times (would disagree,  alot of people look the same,  but the 10 magic schools have not been totally flushed out yet.)

* Extremely solo and red unfriendly from minute one of logging in.  (it is suppose to be that way. Less so for soloble)

* Just be aware that you will be PTB (paying to beta) for the first 3 months (3 is conservatuve)

New game with poor launch will fall through the gaps in the fast paced gaming community. Save your money people.

 

(Its and indie company so do give them some slack as long as they get it under control.  People need to realize they are not signing up for war here.  You do have to have patients,  and even after things are under control this game is not for everyone.)

Originally posted by Hotjazz

Originally posted by Cetra

 Tell me why this game deserves a fee close to AoC 12.99 euro. Darkfall has nothing to offer other than ffa pvp and full looting enabled.  It loses out in everyway in terms of quality compared to any decent mmo in the market now.

 

Haha you are trolling when you mention AoC right? I had friends who invested alot of money in Funcom before the release of AoC. Why shouldn`t they when it was a sure win. People was tired of WOW and AoC was the only new mmo on the horizon at that time. We all bought AoC, but we knew after a few hours how bad that game was. Luckily we sold our stoks before they plummet, and we still laugh when we talk about AoC.

 

You have to remember ffa pvp and full-loot is THE thing that makes a mmo fun. I find it hard to belive that most players don`t like this feature, but I guess most haven`t tried it. The funny thing is that I`m not even a good pvper and loose my fights 90 % of the time in DF. Still I love the ffa full-loot mmo`s.

 

And to me quality isn`t about how the game looks, but what I feel when I play it.

I have to remember that ffa pvp and free-loot is THE thing that makes a mmo fun.  Why?  Why do I need to remember or even be told that this is fun?  B/c I do not know what fun is?  Interesting way to push forward your argument.

It is hard to believe most players don't like this feature?  You already answered your question.  Indeed a majority of paying gamers do not like it.  So its not good for them, whatever you make out of it.  Maybe you need to drop your excess presumptions and understand the mindset of other gamers.  At least acknowledge that ppl differs and not all agrees with you.  Actually majority does not.

Your last sentence answers everything.  The game is what it is when players play it.  The majority feels a ffa pvp game to be bad.  That explains why they do not like it.  No need insult them or feel bitter.  You can enjoy ffa pvp while acknowleding that many do not.  PERIOD.

Maybe you still wonder why ffa pvp does not always catch the hearts of many gamers.  I can give you a few ideas.  That kind of gameplay always attracts the worst kind of internet ppl, ppl who want to wreck the day of everybody else, ppl who live on creating drama every moment of their live.  Scammers, griefers, gankers ... whatever you call them.  I for one treasure community as one of the features of a game.  ffa pvp does not generally offer nice communities.  Call me carebear or whatever, I love to hang around nice ppl, not the kinds I expect to see in ffa pvpers.  Does that make me better or worse than you?  No.  Just different.

Originally posted by poppets

This list of grievances was taken and collected from all Beta review reports

 

* Servers not stress tested

Cry more.

* weak community

Cry more.

* bad communication by dev's

Cry more.

* No player housing

Cry more.

* No Weather

Cry more.

* No Trading system

Cry more.

* Harvesting only viable through macroing, very poorly designed

Cry more.

* No local banks

Cry more.

* No trade caravans

Cry more.

* There ARE safezones

Lol. k.

* Buggy UI

Cry more?

* Lack of intuitive chat commands

Cry more.

* Total lack of LFG system, and lack of intuitive group formation systems

I think I peed a little.

* Extremely boring, unimaginative and grindy harvesting and crafting system

rly?

* Boring badly designed click fest melee combat, with no variation in weapon skill sets

k

* No penalties or bonuses on armor types so everyone will wear full plate - why wouldn't they?

Cry more.

* No penalties or bonuses on weapon styles so everyone will use the polearm - why wouldn't they?

...

* Effectively 1 class because there will be 10k clones of exactly the same build, because the devs have NO CLUE about making skill based diversification, as has been explained to them hundreds of times

Not even gracing this with a response.

* Extremely solo and red unfriendly from minute one of logging in

Cry more

* Just be aware that you will be PTB (paying to beta) for the first 3 months

Cry

New game with poor launch will fall through the gaps in the fast paced gaming community. Save your money people.

Ok

* Servers not stress tested I wasn't aware you worked for Aventurine

* weak community Opinion

* bad communication by dev's Ok, ill give you this one for the most part.

* No player housing Not Sure

* No Weather Who Cares

* No Trading system Not Sure

* Harvesting only viable through macroing, very poorly designed Opinion

* No local banks Theres a personal bank. Not clear on the issue.

* No trade caravans Not sure, again, IMO who cares.

* There ARE safezones Not sure. IMO, who cares.

* Buggy UI Not sure. First i've heard of that.

* Lack of intuitive chat commands Opinion

* Total lack of LFG system, and lack of intuitive group formation systems LFG system = /tell soandso "Hey, want to group?" Stop expecting a hand-holding user interface to socialize for you.

* Extremely boring, unimaginative and grindy harvesting and crafting system Opinion

* Boring badly designed click fest melee combat, with no variation in weapon skill sets Opinion

* No penalties or bonuses on armor types so everyone will wear full plate - why wouldn't they? Do more research

* No penalties or bonuses on weapon styles so everyone will use the polearm - why wouldn't they? Do more research

* Effectively 1 class because there will be 10k clones of exactly the same build, because the devs have NO CLUE about making skill based diversification, as has been explained to them hundreds of times Not conclusive

* Extremely solo and red unfriendly from minute one of logging in Opinion

* Just be aware that you will be PTB (paying to beta) for the first 3 months Opinion

Out of 20 bullets, there are 5 MAYBE 6 things things that can be proven. 2 or 3 of those 6 can/will be implemented/rectified within a couple months.