I too like WoW but I completely agree with what you said about grabbing other games ideas.

The one thing I noticed came by way of new abilities that were ripped off from another game.

A couple months back I stopped playing WOW and started playing warhammer online. I liked some of the new forms of Crowd COntrol they had implemented, namely Knockback effects. You could knock people offa mountain or off a high ledge and kill them or at the very least disrupt the other sides team.

Then here comes WoW with WOTLK and all of a sudden everyone has a knockback effect the same as WAR.

Struck me as funny....

...that its not safe to say runescape was my first and best MMO experiance. Played for 2 years about 6 years ago. Never even heard of an MMORPG before runescape.

Originally posted by Daragoth

Um...ok...thanks for sharing?

Pay no attention to this person... 

Thank you for sharing (sincere).  

Originally posted by Loke666

 

Heh, yeah they kinda did to the genre what Sex pistols did to punk musik.

My opinion is that Wow is not a bad game but somewhat overrated. It doesn't deserve 20 times the players of any other game, it is not 20 times better even if the polish is good.

You don't need to be 20 times better to have 20 times more success...

Nadal is not 20 times better than the number 60 in tennis, but he has 20 times more titles and perhaps even 10 times more money.

BUT ... you have to be overall better. So saying it is "not a bad game" is un understatement (no doubt made up of personal perception after playing it for too long).

What is "better" in Wow should be a really GOOD exercice for someone who thinks Wow is average. Sometimes only a few better things makes a better product.

The very fluid animation and perfect control of the avatar combined by very good art is a good start for me. As is the "jack of all trades" aspect.

Take PvP for example. Wow is a PVE game with PvP thrown in as an aftertought "they" say....

A choice of 2vs2, 3vs3, 5vs5 Arena's, Bg's, open world PvP, daily world PvP quests, a 200.000 dollar PvP competition, Rare PvP titles only handed out to 1(one!) out of 200.000 players tx to server cluster competition and the only PvP Fantasy game at the moment where you have 100/100 fighting over a complete destructable Keep with tank to tank combat, mobile catapults EVERY night on every server...

Mmm, not bad for a game with PvP as .... an afterthought.

So which fantasy game is better in THIS aspect of ... an after thought....

All personal subjective opinions of course ....

but somewhere down the line they STRUCK a chord with a lot of people and this explains why 11.500.000 PAY to play it after 4.5 years.

Hell I still have fond memories of the text-based MUD that I played for close to a decade, of which I started in 7th grade. Evolved into UO and AC around Freshman/Sophomore year and played both of those games for 2+ years before exploring some of the other options. WoW has brought on its own memories, but one will always remember what once was. :)

Originally posted by Zorndorf

Originally posted by Loke666

 

Heh, yeah they kinda did to the genre what Sex pistols did to punk musik.

My opinion is that Wow is not a bad game but somewhat overrated. It doesn't deserve 20 times the players of any other game, it is not 20 times better even if the polish is good.

 

You don't need to be 20 times better to have 20 times more success...

Nadal is not 20 times better than the number 60 in tennis, but he has 20 times more titles and perhaps even 10 times more money.

BUT ... you have to be overall better. So saying it is "not a bad game" is un understatement (no doubt made up of personal perception after playing it for too long).

What is "better" in Wow should be a really GOOD exercice for someone who thinks Wow is average. Sometimes only a few better things makes a better product.

The very fluid animation and perfect control of the avatar combined by very good art is a good start for me. As is the "jack of all trades" aspect.

Take PvP for example. Wow is a PVE game with PvP thrown in as an afterthougt, "they" say....

A choice of 2vs2, 3vs3, 5vs5 Arena's, Bg's, open world PvP, daily world PvP quests, a 200.000 dollar PvP competition, Rare PvP titles only handed out to 1(one!) out of 200.000 players tx to server cluster competition and the only PvP Fantasy game at the moment where you have 100/100 fighting over a complete destructable Keep with tank to tank combat, mobile catapults EVERY night on every server...

Mmm, not bad for a game with PvP as .... an afterthought.

So which fantasy game is better in THIS aspect of ... an after thought....

 

All personal subjective opinions of course ....

but somewhere down the line they STRUCK a chord with a lot of people and this explains why 11.500.000 PAY to play it after 4.5 years.

 

 

 

 

 

  Thank you, dear god thank you.  Its nice to actually hear someone using their brains when discussing WoW.  Its is successful for a wide array of reasons.  Being "easy" is probably the least of which.  I also hate hearing about its "afterthought" PvP as well...especially considering that its PvP is a major draw for many players.  In fact....its offers the ONLY Non-Hardcore PvP that is worth playing.  The only other games with any better PvP also tend to come with "Full loot", and a plethora of other MASSIVE loss penalties.

  Frankly, I don't think many people on this site have a clue when they open their mouths in most cases.  The closest possible contender was DAoC....and it obviously has a great many things lacking even still, since its current playerbase is likely still lagging behind even SWG or EQ.  Its easy to look back at the best things...very hard to look at the big picture.

ah wasted youth

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Originally posted by Gishgeron

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Originally posted by Zorndorf

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Originally posted by Loke666

 
Heh, yeah they kinda did to the genre what Sex pistols did to punk musik.
My opinion is that Wow is not a bad game but somewhat overrated. It doesn't deserve 20 times the players of any other game, it is not 20 times better even if the polish is good.

---

 
You don't need to be 20 times better to have 20 times more success...
Nadal is not 20 times better than the number 60 in tennis, but he has 20 times more titles and perhaps even 10 times more money.
BUT ... you have to be overall better. So saying it is "not a bad game" is un understatement (no doubt made up of personal perception after playing it for too long).
What is "better" in Wow should be a really GOOD exercice for someone who thinks Wow is average. Sometimes only a few better things makes a better product.
The very fluid animation and perfect control of the avatar combined by very good art is a good start for me. As is the "jack of all trades" aspect.
Take PvP for example. Wow is a PVE game with PvP thrown in as an afterthougt, "they" say....
A choice of 2vs2, 3vs3, 5vs5 Arena's, Bg's, open world PvP, daily world PvP quests, a 200.000 dollar PvP competition, Rare PvP titles only handed out to 1(one!) out of 200.000 players tx to server cluster competition and the only PvP Fantasy game at the moment where you have 100/100 fighting over a complete destructable Keep with tank to tank combat, mobile catapults EVERY night on every server...
Mmm, not bad for a game with PvP as .... an afterthought.
So which fantasy game is better in THIS aspect of ... an after thought....
 
All personal subjective opinions of course ....
but somewhere down the line they STRUCK a chord with a lot of people and this explains why 11.500.000 PAY to play it after 4.5 years.
 
 
 
 
 

---

 
  Thank you, dear god thank you.  Its nice to actually hear someone using their brains when discussing WoW.  Its is successful for a wide array of reasons.  Being "easy" is probably the least of which.  I also hate hearing about its "afterthought" PvP as well...especially considering that its PvP is a major draw for many players.  In fact....its offers the ONLY Non-Hardcore PvP that is worth playing.  The only other games with any better PvP also tend to come with "Full loot", and a plethora of other MASSIVE loss penalties.
  Frankly, I don't think many people on this site have a clue when they open their mouths in most cases.  The closest possible contender was DAoC....and it obviously has a great many things lacking even still, since its current playerbase is likely still lagging behind even SWG or EQ.  Its easy to look back at the best things...very hard to look at the big picture.

---

Im not one to knock WoW as I still play, but I will say, for most everyone I know that is a hardcore mmo gamer, WoW while fun is lacking something.

If its so great why is everyone looking to play something new. I mean, you browse these forums right? You see how many posts are about someone looking for something because they are bored of WoW?

As far as the pvp of WoW is concerned.

Wintergrasp is not pvp.
On my server alliance dominates horde simply because of numbers. If horde brings a 1.5 raids, the alliance has 4-5 full raids. We get destroyed and theres nothing much we can do about it. I dont consider that fun.

2v2 3v3 5v5 SUCKS. I really mean it. PvP on a basketball court?
I dont mind organized pvp with equal groups, but throwing people into a relatively small room and seeing who comes out on top? LAME.

Strand of the ancients- not pvp. Lame because no one does AV anymore. AV is 10 times more fun than strand of the ancients.

CLASS BALANCE= A JOKE
I dont understand how they decide who gets nerfed and who gets buffed. From a pve standpoint? From a pvp standpoint? Ret pallys werent bad all those months back when they got there initial buff. Warlocks and priests have been lackluster for sometime but receive no buff. Dks and pallys continually get the love. They just nerfed the 3 min mage build. A build that in one form or another has been around since the game was released. Strikes me funny that Arcane mages are the one class/spec that dominates Paladins....and they nerf it. Sounds like another pally buff to me.

Anytime I think my charachters might have something special, I see someone else with the same ability.

My rogue has disarm. Hunter friend of mine has a pet that can disarm for 6 secs.

My mage has sheep. I see Shamans have there own form of sheep with no healing component involved. So they dont have to worry about healing the target back up.

I could go on and on but I wont.

I still have fun playing WoW but PLEASE you devs, get on the ball and give us something better, harder, more enjoyable to play.

Originally posted by xcryonicx

Everquest WAS a bit of a highlight of my youth.

'

That is all.

I can wholeheartedly agree with this statement. Everquest was the game that started me in the genre at age 10 and I played until I was around 14. It does hold a spot for me and my youth.

UO, AC, EQ, DAoC - These were the golden age of MMOs.  All excellent games which used their competitive advantages (freedom, choice, pve/raids, pvp/rvr) to achieve their rightful acclaim. You can dislike any of these games, but you must concede they all excelled in their respective gameplay.

The MMO genre has changed considerably since that time, both in execution/development and gamer expectations. WoW was the main reason for this change. Good or bad, it's all rather subjective on how you think MMOs "should" be. It is easy to bash WoW, call it lame, boring, easy or all three. However, the game truly excels in the areas where the modern crop of gamers are most concerned: presentation/polish and gameplay (as in the actual tactile feeling of moving your character and interacting with the world).

DDO, AoC, LoTR, Vanguard, CoH, WAR - All of these games, while not terrible, are lacking in polish/presentation and, most importantly, gameplay. In an age where there are so many entertainment mediums vying for the attention of consumers, you (as a developer) cannot expect your product to reach a critical mass/appeal if your gameplay is sloppy, floaty, and unresponsive. There are a ton of console and FPS'ers that play WoW, but would never play any other MMO. These players expect that when a button is pushed for there to be an immediate corresponding action in game (barring ping).

The actual systems in WoW (arena, battlegrounds, raiding, quests, crafting) are really not special or outstanding in their own right. I mean give WAR the responsiveness of WoW and it would have been a much better PvP game (if you're gonna be a PvP focused game in 2008/2009 then you can not have floaty movement with unresponsive actions).

As for me, the MMO highlight would be the early days of DAoC, sieging keeps with my guild. Hibernia FTW.

Anarchy Online was my first mmo. Even if it was not the best game it introducted me to mmo's so it has a special place in my gamer heart.

To be honest... after play Silkroad, WoW was my first MMO (Not something to be proud of) I played for about a year or 2 after getting bored with their repetative content. After playing WoW, i tryed many other MMO's including DAoC(Must have been amazing in it's prime), LotRO, WAR, AoC, VG, but I am currently playing EQII.
I must admit that so far I think EQII is one of the best MMO's of all time. I think if SOE advertised their product more we would see a increase in pop.

Daoc was the highlight of my youth.  I still remember the butterflies in my stomach when me and a bucn of guildies gathered up in the frontiers and just ran around ganking a bunch of noobs, and seeing your guild at the top on the server rank page.... ahhh good times .