Originally posted by javac

Originally posted by fyerwall

Originally posted by javac

Originally posted by Gameloading

Darkfall online is much more comparable to games such as Mourning, Dark & Light and Irth Online. Small companies promising the world, all of them crashed and burned.

 

A better comparison would be EVE, a small indie company that produced a great game to the surprise of many.

 

All indications are that DF will be successful upon release.

1) > 300K beta signups on official forums with $0 marketing spent

2) numerous positive beta reports

3) massive market potential for a good fantasy PVP sandbox game

 

WAR started with over 500K subs by the way... LOTRO also lost a lot of subs after release though has stabilised now, AoC lost the most of all, something like 75% of subs lost.

Beta apps are a poor source for gauging success. People sign up multiple beta apps due to the lottery nature of the system.

 

there are > 330K beta apps as of right now on the forum; i dropped 10% to 300K as a reasonable error margin. typically, there are many more subs than beta apps - not everyone applies for the beta.

 

regardless, DF is one of the biggest, if not THE biggest indie MMO in terms of grassroots hype & anticipation.

 

i have no doubt that it will be quite successful on release, if release goes as smooth as the beta has. 'success' for DF, as described by Aventurine themselves, is anything over 50K subs. they will pass that easily, the only question is how many subs do they want to limit themselves to in the beginning.

 

lol.... I'm gonna use myself as an exemple... I sign up to so many betas that when I receive the invite I don't even remember what the game is... I'd even go as far as say that I don't try 50% of them and I don't even buy 10% of the 50% I try.  More like... 1 out of 100.

I'll bet 100$ there's many many people like me and many many of those sign up for DarkFall... Will I buy the game IF it's REALLY GOOD. Probably... in like 3-4 months cause honestly, I don't trust Adventurine.

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Originally posted by Gameloading
Darkfall online is much more comparable to games such as Mourning, Dark & Light and Irth Online. Small companies promising the world, all of them crashed and burned.

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QFT. Thread winner right here IMO. Gameloading said it perfectly and nailed it right on perfectly in two small sentences.

- Zaxx

Originally posted by Samuraisword

Just as WoW impacted the industry and showed how many MMOG gamers and subscriptions could be garnished and generated by a single title, Darkfall will show how a lower budget title can be popular and profitable with less money invested because of diversity and quality.

The days of big budget clone MMOGs are over as the layoffs and rapid subscription declines of big budget theme park games such as AoC and WAR are proving. The gravy train is over for the theme park clones. Gamers are becoming more demanding and refusing to play along with the same ole crappy instanced linear dummied down task oriented class progression design.

Outrageous prediction regarding the outcome of the game when it's still in closed beta?    check

Broad generalizations with no supporting evidence?     check

Blurting buzz words or phrases like they actually had any meaning at all?    check

Sorry, but posts like these are as bad as the "Darkfall is vaporwarezzzz!!!!!" posts and if any fanboy feigning neutrality had a brain they would be calling the OP a "troll".

Older games, when the market was much smaller, had many games with more subs than beta sign ups. Nowadays this is simply not true. Vanguard, AoC, WAR, LotRO, PotBS, among other pay-to-play games have had more beta accounts that subscribers. 300,000 subsribers playing Darkfall would be quite the feat, and to me it looks like a huge reach. I am just like one of those other guys who wrote they signed up for the DFO Beta multiple times. Judging by how few people are in Beta now, and how many are being sold and advertised with the text of "I signed up multiple times and have three accounts for sale", would lead me to believe many of us did the same.

The game is going to be just as buggy at launch, if not worse, than WAR or AoC. The game is going to have worse customer service than those games. The content is likely going to be less than either of those games, and there is a huge lack of people like myself who will stick around because of FFA pvp and full loot. The market for a game with bad graphics and full loot pvp is very small currently and I would be shocked if they ever posted subscription numbers, and if they were anywhere near 200k. I am no troll, I am no fanboy, I am a realist. I have seen enough when it comes to MMORPGs and their launches to understand this. Don't expect so much from an Indie team like this.

Originally posted by Varking

The game is going to be just as buggy at launch, if not worse, than WAR or AoC.

DF is the least buggy of all 3 and it's still beta.

DF just needs tweaks, balancing, and improvements to existing stuff. fact is, there are very few bugs and the client is really stable.

i can't comment on customer service, though i will say that DF graphics are pretty underrated, particularly the world and environment effects, they are stunning.

200K subs for DF would be a massive success; realistically, once the carebear crowd lose their gear a few times and qq-ragequit i think the number will stablise around 50-100K and then slowly climb upwards much the same way as EVE.

the only people who'll really be disappointed with DF are the ones who had entirely unrealistic expectations in the first place, mainly due to not reading the wealth of game design info around, or over-reading it into some self-concocted pipe dream (ie: most mmorpg.com trolls fall into this category).

Originally posted by Samuraisword

Just as WoW impacted the industry and showed how many MMOG gamers and subscriptions could be garnished and generated by a single title, Darkfall will show how a lower budget title can be popular and profitable with less money invested because of diversity and quality.

The days of big budget clone MMOGs are over as the layoffs and rapid subscription declines of big budget theme park games such as AoC and WAR are proving. The gravy train is over for the theme park clones. Gamers are becoming more demanding and refusing to play along with the same ole crappy instanced linear dummied down task oriented class progression design.

And people wonder why this game and it's fanbois get so much hate.

I seem to recall the endless praise heaped upon another game back before WoW came out. Back then people posting much like the ones posting here heaping praise upon Darkfell were heaping praise on this other game. This lasted pretty much most of three years until the game actually released.

These fanboi posters hated SOE and still do. They wanted anything that wasn't EQ. Heck, they still do. What was funny was they said a lot of what's being said here. Dark Age of Camelot was suggested to them yet they didn't want to go to it either. So they waited and posted.

Enter the final stages of this game. The management team disentegrated into an absentee team. The money ran out. Beta went as scheduled and bombed horribly. Then the worst possible thing happened to these SOE haters. SOE became the publisher. NOT the owner. That brought howls of outrage.

Then this much hyped EQ killing game launched and was virtually unplayable.

SOE ended up buying the game. The staff was assembled in the parking lot....the parking lot!!!! by the management and fired. Certain ones were retained of course but most were fired unceremoniously in a bloody parking lot. Did their previous owner/president do this? No. He was gone and hasn't been heard from much since.

Since then this game has gotten playable and is according to various sites and players to be a good game finally.

You may have guessed it already but the name of this game is Vanguard:Saga of Heros.

Moral of the story: Don't judge a book by it's cover.

Darkfall may be a good game or a flop. We won't know until it launches. My question for all those of you saying this Darkfell is going to be the game that revolutionizes the industry, what will you say if it isn't?

Hopefully it'll be a success. Let's see.

The state of the industry is too set to ever be revolutionized by anything. At best, some of Darkfall's features have a chance to bring in a market based on long-played mmorpg players with a lot of its features. Sure the gfx kiddies won't come over, but there's a large group of people who've played more than 10 or even 20 mmorpgs and are disenfranchised after years of the same.
If the game play is deep enough and the community evolved enough and the number of subscribers sticks to 100k+ for even half a year.. It'll shake up the design of future projects more so than unstabalize anything that's established now.
Was WoW an EQ killer? Or was EQ getting some dust and practically killed itself? WoW's the only competition WoWs going to have. That's not to say tho' if an innovative game makes a name for itself in a more senior population that it can't make waves.
How many people are left who can say they're new to mmorpgs and are truly a market?
Games need to pull players, even mere %s, from established games to have profitable business.
Admit it or not, Darkfall has some lofty promises that can do just that. Second to fifth place in notoriety goes a long way in the industry now a days.

Originally posted by nikoliath

I think the only thing Adventurine will prove is, if you string along people for nearly a decade, promise a revolution in the industry,and promise the world, you ARE destined to FAIL.

Gaming is becoming more and more accessable, more and more people play games, people who would never have dreamed of doing so. Gaming is not the elitist past-time it once was.

Truth.  Thank you, Niko.
 

well if DF turns out bust im goin back to WAR or AoC until EVE brings out next one and new starting area
so glad i dont own wow account anymore, best $50 i ever drunk

If Darkfall delivers all the features and content, that it has promised (for some time now), it does show some promise, especially for MMO gamers who prefer PvP based MMO's on a Grand scale such as this game.

The gameplay IS there, sure the Graphics and UI look very ugly and choppy, but those things can be changed/improved in the future. However if it's just another company that promises alot of content and fails to deliver (I've seen more promises from this Game then any other) it won't get anywhere fast.

The concept of combining all of the best and successful ideas from previous MMO's as well as a few newer ones, into One, Is not easy either, and does sound lazy, but for a low budget company, they are doing pretty well so far.

I hope this game does get somewhere, It's up to them and their actions and what they do deliver which will determine Failure or Sucess.

Originally posted by Adigiron

A whole lot of people sign up to betas for free gaming as well even when there is little interest in the game itself.  Just another thing to think about when boasting about beta applications.

 

Heck, I have no real interest in playing Darkfall but I would sign up for the beta If I thought I could get in.  I would do it just to see what the hype is about.  In the past I signed up for plenty of betas just out of pure curiosity.

Originally posted by Samuraisword

Just as WoW impacted the industry and showed how many MMOG gamers and subscriptions could be garnished and generated by a single title, Darkfall will show how a lower budget title can be popular and profitable with less money invested because of diversity and quality.

The days of big budget clone MMOGs are over as the layoffs and rapid subscription declines of big budget theme park games such as AoC and WAR are proving. The gravy train is over for the theme park clones. Gamers are becoming more demanding and refusing to play along with the same ole crappy instanced linear dummied down task oriented class progression design.

Eh, Guildwars already proved that more than 4 years ago...

Just like pop music is on the way out you mean?

This game in reality isnt changing anything.  While i hope it does well, but its just another fantasy game with a full loot gimick thrown in. I doubt all the promised features will even be in the game if or when it releases.

More people out there want more thinking outside the box. Games like Earthrise, Fallen earth, and hopefully WOD are the real freash of breath air we need (as far as settings and worlds). The fantasy genere is overcrowed and stuffy already.

Too many assumptions in the OP, not enough real world evidence to back much of it up yet.

"If" DF delivers in about a dozen ways, it could have an impact on the market.  I don't see millions of WOW players leaving their game to come play DF.  Doubt you'll get many folks from EVE either.

I figure at best they'll carve out a niche just like EVE has, and it will encourage Indy devs to keep working on their efforts since they'll be willing to take less reward.

The big boys won't care, they'll all be trying to create the WOW killer.  "The lure of easy money has a very strong appeal" after all.

Feb 25th right? Everything will be revealed right?  Nothing to worry about. Where can I pre-order?

When i first read the topic. All i did was laugh. I am sorry, but i did.

Okay, i will admit, people will play this game, even though this game has been through alot (I am not a fanboi) It's not going to change anything. Every mmorpg has something "different" to offer to the market, this game will not be any different. It's not the savior of the mmorpg industry. In a year or so, a better game might come out, i can't say for sure, but it usually does. Honestly, this game has been through a lot, i don't think it deserves the fanbase it has. From what i have read, there has been a lot of lies, and resets. Once again, this will not be the savior of mmorpgs. Not even close. In my personal opinion, it will be another mmorpg that has a set of "normal" features, and some "unique" features. Like every game does. I think the only difference will be, the game might have a bigger fanbase. A lot of people dislike the games, because of the people managing it, and the lies brought forth. I personally won't be playing this game, not because i don't like the concept, or anything like that. People have gave this game too much attention, and it's getting annoying, well too me at least, i don't mean this as a flame, only personal judgement. I am not going too flame this game off nothing, i have read a lot on this game, and it doesn't look good. If this game is released, it will last because of one simple reason: The game has been through so much hatred, and it's finally released so haha(I can imagine a kiddie fanboi saying that.

-Thrice

Originally posted by zaxtor99

 

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Originally posted by Gameloading
Darkfall online is much more comparable to games such as Mourning, Dark & Light and Irth Online. Small companies promising the world, all of them crashed and burned.

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QFT. Thread winner right here IMO. Gameloading said it perfectly and nailed it right on perfectly in two small sentences.

- Zaxx

Originally posted by Teala

Originally posted by zaxtor99

 

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Originally posted by Gameloading
Darkfall online is much more comparable to games such as Mourning, Dark & Light and Irth Online. Small companies promising the world, all of them crashed and burned.

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QFT. Thread winner right here IMO. Gameloading said it perfectly and nailed it right on perfectly in two small sentences.

- Zaxx

 

I agree as well. well put by gameloading.
 

One flaw with the OP's logic.  Saying that DF will show that you can make a game with much smaller budgets isn't really the case.  DF's budget so far is getting up there.  I definately wouldn't consider it a low budget game.