no offense taken for a reg version fo the game is 5 $ pre order, for the higher ones like the collectors eddition its 10$ the only gave ever that had a 15$ pre order was halo 3 and that was for the legendary  item, you would be amazed at how half and half it is, i am a gamer and when i worked there i could answer almost any question, but with others if you asked when does darkfall come out , they were like whats darkfall, so i would fill him in on it and leave. yes if u order online your refunds are about nil, vice going to the store to cancel its 100% for the pre- orders,

Originally posted by kiersteadmo

no offense taken for a reg version fo the game is 5 $ pre order, for the higher ones like the collectors eddition its 10$ the only gave ever that had a 15$ pre order was halo 3 and that was for the legendary  item, you would be amazed at how half and half it is, i am a gamer and when i worked there i could answer almost any question, but with others if you asked when does darkfall come out , they were like whats darkfall, so i would fill him in on it and leave. yes if u order online your refunds are about nil, vice going to the store to cancel its 100% for the pre- orders,

 I'm glad you knew something outside of what you are told. It saddens me to see gaming retail turn in to Mc Donald's style knowledge of the industry.

Originally posted by Disastorm

Originally posted by Lambon

Originally posted by tombear81

• This "game" has had so many promises about features and already broken ones about release and chances to try before buying..
• A coffee morning which seemed a desperate plea for cash mostly.

• The fact one week from launch the developers realise they dont have the infastructure in place for demand. (Like an MMO launch never get initial surges of people.. well duh .. yes they do !)
• One week before a supposed launch no one was sure where they could download the client or even begin to download in prepartion.  I assume the "game" is 15 Gigabytes of there abouts.
• Irritating good old US of A peoples by not even knowing when the game will launch there.
• Marketing footage shot from the back of a room using a s85T camera like FRAPS has never been invented.
• A STUPIDLY large list of features.
• CRAP animations .. oh yes they are !

• The fact the Mr Tasos won't allow his game to be placed in any critical reviewing or previewing arena. Oh yeah that bodes well... erm.. NOT !

You'd be a real sucker to pre-order this game because of the above. At best this is pure incompetance at worst this is a scam that will probably work given  the desperation of many MMO fans particularly those desperate for a sandbox game.

*If* you get burned they'll be ZERO sympathy  from most people. In fact I'd keep pre ordering very, very quiet least its time to start a new account on MMORPG. OF course on the 20 million to one (metaphorical) odds this game is alright ... I wish you luck my pretty pre order lemmings, I for one salute you.

This is simply the most beautiful post I have read today. It's almost ridiculous how these retarded zealous fans just take everything Tasos SAYS and believe it must be true...Do you people even think for yourselves?

This thing sounds like a god damn cult. That's right, the beginning of a religion.

I hope you anti-darkfall people realize just exactly what kind of people you're trying to convince here. Zealous religious retards.

 

That might be true if thats all they were doing, but of course most of the "fanboys" don't only listen to tasos.  They listen to the leaks from official beta testers that about 80% of the leaks make the game sound very good.  And no, the beta testers are not only friends and family anymore since the 22nd wave it sounds like they have at least a thousand or thousands of "real" testers.

this, of course mmorpg.com'ers ignore the leaks, because they seem to be positive (acutally, nvm, the "negative leak" I think was widely posted on and believed by all the "skeptics" here, who don't believe leaks, but make exceptions for things that prove their point)

well the reason is they hire anyone, you dont have to be gameing smart at all

Too true.  Any links to the negative leak?

Originally posted by SSRat

Too true.  Any links to the negative leak?

pm'ed

Originally posted by Isane

Originally posted by admriker4

I dont need beta access to see if the game isnt a scam.

But what I do require is a reputable reviewer see the game. Tasos has hidden this game from mmorpg.com and others and then asks for preorders.

Its simple really, show us the game actually exists and works and most of the scam claims will go away. If Tasos has nothing to hide he'll let someone besides his sister review the game

 

MMORPG.com is an irrelevance and the best think any developer can do is not pander to this cesspit. It has become more about ranting kiddies. Avoiding this hole is the best option with respect to longevity and success.

Yowsa I(n)sane, you've become such a bitter hater and troll on these forums.  What you fail to realize is that it isn't MMORPG.com that is irrelevant, but you and your posts that no longer seem to have meaning anymore.

Darkfall isn't a scam, just another MMORPG to release with the air of failure swirling around it.

PM it to me as well please

Same here. I'm always up for a good laugh.

SO I guess it takes the DF forums to go down for this thread to get enough traction to have multiple pages.

Too many bored people.

Try some indie games like Cave Story or Darwinia. I have yet tried the second game but the first is fun for a platforming RPG.

Darkfall will be available to try out on the 25th of February and you could heckle the game all you want if it isn't for you. (That is if you can get in without preordering :p )

Originally posted by mutantmagnet

SO I guess it takes the DF forums to go down for this thread to get enough traction to have multiple pages.

Too many bored people.

Try some indie games like Cave Story or Darwinia. I have yet tried the second game but the first is fun for a platforming RPG.

Darkfall will be available to try out on the 25th of February and you could heckle the game all you want if it isn't for you. (That is if you can get in without preordering :p )

Your assuming of course Darkfall does indeed launch.

IMHO, DF is a scam.

I dont wonder if they will took your money on release and then close the company. Considering how is going the stuff with them now, that can be very possible.

DF will launch.  I'm not sure they'll make their new deadline, just as I thought they'd miss their old deadline, because Tasos is a POS and I don't believe anything that nugget says.

The quality of the game remains to be seen, but I'm guessing they have it at least half right.

What I'm worried about is the things they seem to have not thought of until a week or two ago...you know...

customer service, server load, stress testing, billing, network security, buying a clue....etc.

No way in hell I'd pre order this, unless I just wanted to financially support the company and didn't care if they're non existent customer service (or by the time of release, rapidly patched together Macguyver'd CS and billing support) screwed me over.

There are no boxes to buy..there is nothing to return.  If you buy this and get hosed...you are assed out.  Just keep that in mind.

You souls that are braver than me...you go ahead and play.  If everything is solid 6 months in, I might come try it out.

You know Flagship Studios story right? They made Hellgate London and Mythos, .. no scams and decent games, i can say even good for the RPG style. So.. if a company like Flagship can enter in such kind of troubles, i think everything can happen with DF...

You don't have to be a visionary at this point to see that the game indeed is NOT vaporware nor a scam.
If you look at the lastest available information over the course of the last few days, you'll easily find out by the sheer speed and content of the patches they#re rolling out that they were telling the truth in regards to the state of the game and why the beta wasn't full featured lately. - there is no way a dev team sized like AV could code everything they're adding almost daily on the fly, so it was mostly ready long before, just being rolled out to be fixed and tweaked now.
What this means to me is the following:

-the game is there and it's real

-AV have a considerably weird way of handling some things, but I don't expect a scam on their end. The state of beta seems too solid to me for that (it's by far not what I remember for example DnL to be in that stage of beta)

-by all available information beta is in it's very last stage, still being a closed beta right now that is slowly moving to a stress testing stage

Does that mean the game will have to be great or can't fall flat on it's belly on release? Does that mean there couldn't be any further delay?
Hell no, all of this can still happen, but that goes for each and every MMO release, doesn't it?

For me however this is enough to keep having a close eye on it and indeed have a try, once it's available. It's absolutely appealing enough by now and it's safe to say it'll be different.
How much is there really to loose? If I count how much money I burned for board games that didn't turn out to be to my liking, it'll be by far more than I did on MMOs that failed me. However in almost all cases the sheer fun of trying it out was well worth the initial investment, so the possible damage is neglectible.
I'll happily leave it to the drama queens on both ends of the scale to make any more out of the information around and the enormous risk on the side of the customer connected to the purchase of a video game. At least it's good to see how so many people are able to live so sorrow-free in general that they have the luxury to go all emo on games. - Life is good ;)

Originally posted by mutantmagnet

So we have a situation where not everyone will be able to try out the game before preordering.

We also have a situation where Aventurine rep mentions they didn't expect demand to be this high despite the growth of their forum registry going from ~50k to ~300k from August to December which was a good enough tip off, so either they are lying (if you believe they are scammer), dumb or naive (regardless of your belief).

One thing that is being overlooked though is that a number of you also believe Darkfall doesn't appeal to a lot of people and would never get above 100k subs at best.

This is where I think those who see Darkfall as being a scam are unfair in their criticism.

You think by not having the servers available to make this beta phase open to everyone interested they are trying to sucker many into preordering. Yet they even said they probably can't get enough servers to let everyone play on Feb 25th, so they'll turn away people if the demand is too high and only allow the preorders to play.

Should a company buy servers to accommodate every gawker who passes through when even you don't believe the game can retain them as subscribers?

Doing that is the same as burning money. Even Warhammer, as well made as it was from tier 1-2 couldn't retain the initial rush of customers as subs despite few had reached the tier 3 slosh.

Everyone else who thinks this is a scam, but believes a game of this type could sustain more than 200k subs in today's market all I can say is just hold Aventurine to their word.

If you weren't able to try the game yourself by the time the game launches then don't buy the game until they offer an ongoing free trial.

But keep in mind if the other people are correct and Darkfall's gameplay can't sustain subscriptions then you'll just have to wait.
Obviously if Aventurine and their publisher launches the game; but only buys a number of servers that can accommodate everyone willing to buy the game, because these gamers trust the word of those who do try the game, they most likely will not set aside resources to allow people to try out the game when they are in a financial whole and their publisher is going to take 35% of the revenue.

To anyone else who is on the fence about what Aventurine is doing I suggest to do the same and hold them to their word. Don't buy the game without trying, unless you trust the people who do get to try it from January 22 till launch.

If you are unsure to trust the people who get to try the game then consider these as warning flags. Aventurine has an NDA in force after February 15th (when preordering begins) and Aventurine's idea of thousands of players is really just a thousand testers.

To those thinking of preordering even if you don't get to see the game beforehand, (like myself) I'll most likely see you on the 25th ;)

Peace.

I'll stop believing it's a scam when I see proof of it's existence. Show me some actual reviews by noted game journalists and some in game videos with the user interface. Until then I'm not going to believe the game is anything more than a foriegn scam.

The game so far is real as in there is a client and testers can play it.

The 'game' some people have in thier head and are all excited for and giddy about might not exist (This only because some people have been assuming the game is the panacea to all thier gaming woes and will be just as they envisioned)

Originally posted by ktanner3

Originally posted by mutantmagnet

So we have a situation where not everyone will be able to try out the game before preordering.

We also have a situation where Aventurine rep mentions they didn't expect demand to be this high despite the growth of their forum registry going from ~50k to ~300k from August to December which was a good enough tip off, so either they are lying (if you believe they are scammer), dumb or naive (regardless of your belief).

One thing that is being overlooked though is that a number of you also believe Darkfall doesn't appeal to a lot of people and would never get above 100k subs at best.

This is where I think those who see Darkfall as being a scam are unfair in their criticism.

You think by not having the servers available to make this beta phase open to everyone interested they are trying to sucker many into preordering. Yet they even said they probably can't get enough servers to let everyone play on Feb 25th, so they'll turn away people if the demand is too high and only allow the preorders to play.

Should a company buy servers to accommodate every gawker who passes through when even you don't believe the game can retain them as subscribers?

Doing that is the same as burning money. Even Warhammer, as well made as it was from tier 1-2 couldn't retain the initial rush of customers as subs despite few had reached the tier 3 slosh.

Everyone else who thinks this is a scam, but believes a game of this type could sustain more than 200k subs in today's market all I can say is just hold Aventurine to their word.

If you weren't able to try the game yourself by the time the game launches then don't buy the game until they offer an ongoing free trial.

But keep in mind if the other people are correct and Darkfall's gameplay can't sustain subscriptions then you'll just have to wait.
Obviously if Aventurine and their publisher launches the game; but only buys a number of servers that can accommodate everyone willing to buy the game, because these gamers trust the word of those who do try the game, they most likely will not set aside resources to allow people to try out the game when they are in a financial whole and their publisher is going to take 35% of the revenue.

To anyone else who is on the fence about what Aventurine is doing I suggest to do the same and hold them to their word. Don't buy the game without trying, unless you trust the people who do get to try it from January 22 till launch.

If you are unsure to trust the people who get to try the game then consider these as warning flags. Aventurine has an NDA in force after February 15th (when preordering begins) and Aventurine's idea of thousands of players is really just a thousand testers.

To those thinking of preordering even if you don't get to see the game beforehand, (like myself) I'll most likely see you on the 25th ;)

Peace.

 

I'll stop believing it's a scam when I see proof of it's existence. Show me some actual reviews by noted game journalists and some in game videos with the user interface. Until then I'm not going to believe the game is anything more than a foriegn scam.

While there is a such thing as a single employee embezzling money from the company and running to the hills (was that DnL that had that situation?) there is no such thing as a scam in the MMO business in this case.

And what I mean by that is there is no actual PLAN for DFO to not be existent and take pre-orders and never have a game. That isn't a scam for us, that's a scam for them.

There's no way an MMO company can pay back a budget of 20 million with just initial sales. It has to run at least 3-5 years sucessfully before seeing a profit.

So people should really stop saying that DFO, or any other game for that matter is a scam. It's not possible.

Originally posted by nathanpinard

Originally posted by ktanner3

Originally posted by mutantmagnet

So we have a situation where not everyone will be able to try out the game before preordering.

We also have a situation where Aventurine rep mentions they didn't expect demand to be this high despite the growth of their forum registry going from ~50k to ~300k from August to December which was a good enough tip off, so either they are lying (if you believe they are scammer), dumb or naive (regardless of your belief).

One thing that is being overlooked though is that a number of you also believe Darkfall doesn't appeal to a lot of people and would never get above 100k subs at best.

This is where I think those who see Darkfall as being a scam are unfair in their criticism.

You think by not having the servers available to make this beta phase open to everyone interested they are trying to sucker many into preordering. Yet they even said they probably can't get enough servers to let everyone play on Feb 25th, so they'll turn away people if the demand is too high and only allow the preorders to play.

Should a company buy servers to accommodate every gawker who passes through when even you don't believe the game can retain them as subscribers?

Doing that is the same as burning money. Even Warhammer, as well made as it was from tier 1-2 couldn't retain the initial rush of customers as subs despite few had reached the tier 3 slosh.

Everyone else who thinks this is a scam, but believes a game of this type could sustain more than 200k subs in today's market all I can say is just hold Aventurine to their word.

If you weren't able to try the game yourself by the time the game launches then don't buy the game until they offer an ongoing free trial.

But keep in mind if the other people are correct and Darkfall's gameplay can't sustain subscriptions then you'll just have to wait.
Obviously if Aventurine and their publisher launches the game; but only buys a number of servers that can accommodate everyone willing to buy the game, because these gamers trust the word of those who do try the game, they most likely will not set aside resources to allow people to try out the game when they are in a financial whole and their publisher is going to take 35% of the revenue.

To anyone else who is on the fence about what Aventurine is doing I suggest to do the same and hold them to their word. Don't buy the game without trying, unless you trust the people who do get to try it from January 22 till launch.

If you are unsure to trust the people who get to try the game then consider these as warning flags. Aventurine has an NDA in force after February 15th (when preordering begins) and Aventurine's idea of thousands of players is really just a thousand testers.

To those thinking of preordering even if you don't get to see the game beforehand, (like myself) I'll most likely see you on the 25th ;)

Peace.

 

I'll stop believing it's a scam when I see proof of it's existence. Show me some actual reviews by noted game journalists and some in game videos with the user interface. Until then I'm not going to believe the game is anything more than a foriegn scam.

 

While there is a such thing as a single employee embezzling money from the company and running to the hills (was that DnL that had that situation?) there is no such thing as a scam in the MMO business in this case.

And what I mean by that is there is no actual PLAN for DFO to not be existent and take pre-orders and never have a game. That isn't a scam for us, that's a scam for them.

There's no way an MMO company can pay back a budget of 20 million with just initial sales. It has to run at least 3-5 years sucessfully before seeing a profit.

So people should really stop saying that DFO, or any other game for that matter is a scam. It's not possible.

Actually it's been done before. Mourning clearly was a scam focused on reaping money from initial preorder client sales. The Chronicle also was to a degree. Both of which though had almost nothing to show potential customers in terms of videos, content, etc. compared to all that is available for Darkfall.

I don't know where you got the 20 million figure from. There is no way to prove how much money has been spent on development for Darkfall. Even if you could show that millions were loaned to the developers, they could have just paid themselves six figures a year for the past  X amount of years it's been developed like good ole Brad McQuaid did with Vanguard.

I don't believe Darkfall is a scam, but people have reasons to be cautious if they have been burned before. I will take the risk and preorder the client even if I don't get a beta invite. Darkfall will either meet my expectations or it won't. I just don't see any other MMOGs worth playing.

Yes, but to pay those people 6 figures, they'd need an initial investment. In this case, they'd be screwing the bank in Greece. Us as well, but themselves even more.

Anyway, there's a lot of conspiracy that goes on within various entertainment media as it is.

Also, the quote today was 10.7 million spent on the game, with a possibility of the game being 12 EU for the subscription.

I said 20 as a guess with the exchange rate to USD. Though I'm sure I"m wrong in this case.