Originally posted by Blodpls

Originally posted by Azrile 

I really don't mind the pre-order thing except for 2 things.   First, Tasos specifically said there would be NO pre-order and that players would get to try the game before they buy it.  Maybe I'm wrong, but I thought he meant every single person would have the opportunity to try the game.  

 

I won't be preordering but if there is still a free trial available on launch then he will be consistant with what he said he wants as nobody will have had to pay for the game before trying it.

Limiting the release ensures that a trial is very unlikely at the start. Maybe months down the road when they roll out enough servers to handle the influx we will see one, but doubtful that many will be able to try it before buying.

Originally posted by Blodpls

Originally posted by Azrile 

I really don't mind the pre-order thing except for 2 things.   First, Tasos specifically said there would be NO pre-order and that players would get to try the game before they buy it.  Maybe I'm wrong, but I thought he meant every single person would have the opportunity to try the game.  

 

I won't be preordering but if there is still a free trial available on launch then he will be consistant with what he said he wants as nobody will have had to pay for the game before trying it.

Well... except all those that aren't able to be part of the very limited trial.  Here is his quote...

"...allowing thousands of players to sample the game for free..."

So how does that equate to NOBODY having to pay before they try it?  

At most you could say...

"Those that are able to partake in the limited trial starting on the 22nd will be able to try the game before they pay for it.  Everyone else will just have to pre-order the game and hope for the best."  

Originally posted by Azrile

Originally posted by Adam1902

Look, right:

The way I see it:

• We STILL get to play on Janurary 22nd. Say they have one server in Open Beta, they will probably select at least 50,000 players, out of the 200,000 odd Tasos said they have applied now. (This may increase remember)
• We STILL get to try before we buy, we'll of been in Open Beta, and played the game by the time they get pre-orders up.

The only difference this makes, is: Pre-orders, which I think is a good thing anyway.
We won't be playing our actual game characters untill Feburary 25th.

We should be happy they're doing this to improve whatever they're working on, to be honest. We should be happy they're not prepared to make an "unfinished release".

However, if we didn't get to play Open Beta on Janurary 22nd, I'm sure alot of people, would of been pretty pissed. Me included.

 

I agree with you completely.  But here is the problem.

Who gets to play on Jan 22nd?  If they allow even 10,000 'real people' to play on Jan 22nd and post videos, comments and reviews.  Then I will agree with you.  But just like many of us knew there would be no release on the Jan 22nd, we also KNOW there won't be 10,000 'real people' able to play darkfall on the 22nd.  What you are going to get on Jan 22nd is nothing more than exactly what you have now.  Tasos will claim 'lots of testers' but none of them will be posting anywhere except for his friends.

I really don't mind the pre-order thing except for 2 things.   First, Tasos specifically said there would be NO pre-order and that players would get to try the game before they buy it.  Maybe I'm wrong, but I thought he meant every single person would have the opportunity to try the game.    But even if I misinterpreted that part of his comment (maybe he meant the community as a whole would get to play before anyone paid money).. the fact still remains that there is not going to be any real 'open' playing on the 22nd.   You, me, and nobody posting on these servers is ever going to get to play this game until Feb 25, and then only if we had pre-ordered.

When Jan 22nd comes and goes and nobody is talking about actually being in the game.. will the fanboys finally smell a rat?  Nope, probaby not.  

  This is a testing phase, not a free trial.  I can see how you might confuse the two...but they are SUPPOSED to serve two different purposes.  In fact, I blame people like you for how terrible some games release....with the way you view testing phases as free trials and all.  He never EVER said all players would get to TEST the game before buying it...he said they could TRY it.  That tells me that he intends to run a free trial program ONCE THE GAME IS RELEASED YOU TARD.

  My god, the sheer stupidity of the people in this forum have managed to turn me, who used to be one of the biggest DF trolls here, into someone who regularly defends them.  Now, he may HAVE said he didn't wanna do a pre-order.  But, you know what?  These guys are indie developers.  They have no money.  I'm willing to bet they opened pre-orders to make sure they could finance extra hardware if player demand was larger than they expected.  Frankly, pre-orders are common to MMO gaming. 

  If anything, you should be LESS angry about DF doing it than anyone else.  The AAA MMO teams doing this sort of crap are just trying to make enough pre-release to get out of the red so that all sub money is clear profit.  These guys might actually NEED it to add server tech.

Originally posted by ProfRed

Originally posted by templarga

I do not care what will happen in regards to the trial and pre-orders. Aventurine went back on their word and now, in my opinion, cannot be trusted for anything they said or promised. This is a slap in the face to gamers and smells just like Age of Conan, Vanguard, Dark and Light among others.

If SOE had posted something like this, everyone would be criticizing them full-force. Just because it is Aventurine, we are supposed to cut them some slack and forgive them for going back on promises? My response is that they lied and are now in the same company as the aforementioned companies.

 

No one is asking you to think otherwise.  I think you are a bit of a drama queen though personally.  You believed something that a PR person said for a game, and then was offended when they couldn't deliver.  It was not even a pre meditated lie.  Tasos was simply an idiot.  Your opinion though and I respect that.

Drama queen? Try more like ethics in business. And why say that to me? Every damn fanboi in these forums believed it a thousand times more than I did. I just call it as I see it and its sad to see people try to defend a lying company. (For example, I am not nor will I ever play a SOE game again because of the recent RMT stuff as it relates to Smed's "promises" - just took me longer to realize that SOE will say anything to get people to sub than others)

And if you think I am a drama queen because I am upset that a company lied to the general public and did a 180 on a promise they made, then fine. Add to that, their justification for their change of course is too simple.

Seriously, what happens if 100k people preorder? Will they honor those pre-orders if they can only have 1-2 servers? Pre-order is a guarantee and the way I see it, there is no way Aventurine (and I have no confidence that Aventurine) can honor any pre-order agreement. Still people defend them and act as if it does not matter because they are new or a startup company. Hell, they are a business and their job is to make money and this latest change of direction only conforms that they will do what they need to make money. Gamers come second to them, money first.

I will be shocked if anyone in this forum is able to play the game on the 22nd and report their findings. I am fairly certain that the 22nd will come and go, and we will know nothing more about the game than we do right now. Unless there comes a point prior to Feb 25th, where there is a true open beta, no NDA, and an influx of user vids, forum posts, etc... I would encourage folks to not pre-order. Any pre-ordering after anything less than a fully disclosed open-beta, is a money grab. Plan and simple. Anyone who can't see that is wearing Tasos colored glasses.

Originally posted by Blodpls

Originally posted by Azrile 

I really don't mind the pre-order thing except for 2 things.   First, Tasos specifically said there would be NO pre-order and that players would get to try the game before they buy it.  Maybe I'm wrong, but I thought he meant every single person would have the opportunity to try the game.  

 

I won't be preordering but if there is still a free trial available on launch then he will be consistant with what he said he wants as nobody will have had to pay for the game before trying it.

True...  but then hasn't Tasos just really kicked the can further down the road.   I repeat that there is no way that you, I, or anyone else on these forums is going to be playing the game within the next few weeks.  They will be collecting pre-order money in February before ANYONE gets to play the game.

Originally posted by atziluth 

Limiting the release ensures that a trial is very unlikely at the start. Maybe months down the road when they roll out enough servers to handle the influx we will see one, but doubtful that many will be able to try it before buying.

Well really thats down to your own impatiance if you must buy it immediately.  I would wait and see what is said about free trials after launch before making inflamitory statements.  You don't know yet whether thats going to be an option, if it is then you will have plenty of opportunity to try the game before paying for it, if there is no free within a reasonable period after launch then I agree that this a bit of a u turn.

Originally posted by miagisan

Originally posted by templarga

I do not care what will happen in regards to the trial and pre-orders. Aventurine went back on their word and now, in my opinion, cannot be trusted for anything they said or promised. This is a slap in the face to gamers and smells just like Age of Conan, Vanguard, Dark and Light among others.

If SOE had posted something like this, everyone would be criticizing them full-force. Just because it is Aventurine, we are supposed to cut them some slack and forgive them for going back on promises? My response is that they lied and are now in the same company as the aforementioned companies.

 

exactly, the same people playing apologetics for Aventurine are the SAME people who bashed other companies in the past for the same exact things. But because they are a FAn of this game, they accept it. The fans for the OTHER games were just idiots who fell for the proaganda.

Yup.

A bit of consistency is all that is asked. 

You can't be bashing one game for doing something that you are making excuses for another company doing.  

How many fans here played the "holier than thou" card because DarkFall wasn't taking any pre-orders?

How many said... well it can't be a scam because they aren't taking any pre-orders?

How many said... well it's not like they are asking for any money before you get to try it for free.

All that is gone now.   Flushed down the toilet in a single update by Tasos. 

Face it... Tasos and Aventurine screwed up.  They got caught in doing a complete 180 on what they've said in the past.  If you don't have the integrity to admit that... well then it's pretty much a lost cause on your behalf. 

Originally posted by Azrile

Originally posted by Blodpls

Originally posted by Azrile 

I really don't mind the pre-order thing except for 2 things.   First, Tasos specifically said there would be NO pre-order and that players would get to try the game before they buy it.  Maybe I'm wrong, but I thought he meant every single person would have the opportunity to try the game.  

 

I won't be preordering but if there is still a free trial available on launch then he will be consistant with what he said he wants as nobody will have had to pay for the game before trying it.

 

True...  but then hasn't Tasos just really kicked the can further down the road.   I repeat that there is no way that you, I, or anyone else on these forums is going to be playing the game within the next few weeks.  They will be collecting pre-order money in February before ANYONE gets to play the game.

Sounds like a great deal -

Pre-order NOW!

Play in 3-6 months when your stage of release is offered (i.e - when we have enough pre-order money to buy more servers to handle it).

Originally posted by templarga

Originally posted by ProfRed

Originally posted by templarga

I do not care what will happen in regards to the trial and pre-orders. Aventurine went back on their word and now, in my opinion, cannot be trusted for anything they said or promised. This is a slap in the face to gamers and smells just like Age of Conan, Vanguard, Dark and Light among others.

If SOE had posted something like this, everyone would be criticizing them full-force. Just because it is Aventurine, we are supposed to cut them some slack and forgive them for going back on promises? My response is that they lied and are now in the same company as the aforementioned companies.

 

No one is asking you to think otherwise.  I think you are a bit of a drama queen though personally.  You believed something that a PR person said for a game, and then was offended when they couldn't deliver.  It was not even a pre meditated lie.  Tasos was simply an idiot.  Your opinion though and I respect that.

Drama queen? Try more like ethics in business. And why say that to me? Every damn fanboi in these forums believed it a thousand times more than I did. I just call it as I see it and its sad to see people try to defend a lying company. (For example, I am not nor will I ever play a SOE game again because of the recent RMT stuff as it relates to Smed's "promises" - just took me longer to realize that SOE will say anything to get people to sub than others)

And if you think I am a drama queen because I am upset that a company lied to the general public and did a 180 on a promise they made, then fine. Add to that, their justification for their change of course is too simple.

Seriously, what happens if 100k people preorder? Will they honor those pre-orders if they can only have 1-2 servers? Pre-order is a guarantee and the way I see it, there is no way Aventurine (and I have no confidence that Aventurine) can honor any pre-order agreement. Still people defend them and act as if it does not matter because they are new or a startup company. Hell, they are a business and their job is to make money and this latest change of direction only conforms that they will do what they need to make money. Gamers come second to them, money first.

I guess I just don't think of a PR person as the company, and I know that they all lie.  Even if they don't mean to lie they do.  They were stupid to set a date.  I think Tasos has handled this pretty poorly, but I just got the overall feeling you were being a bit dramatic.  This is pretty common fair for almost every gaming company when it comes to MMORPG's across the board.  I think Blizzard is the only one to ever go the route of not being idiots and sticking to 'when it's ready.'

I agree with most of your points.  I see where you are coming from, and I respect your decision.  I just feel it's a bit dramatic.  Hell 99% of these boards and DF's board, and the DF channel are so overly dramatic right now that I feel like i'm in the middle of a Beverly Hills High School.  I feel like we aren't talking about an unreleased game, but instead what she said to her about him and then what he did to her because of what she said omg. 

Originally posted by Ezekiel77

I will be shocked if anyone in this forum is able to play the game on the 22nd and report their findings. I am fairly certain that the 22nd will come and go, and we will know nothing more about the game than we do right now. Unless there comes a point prior to Feb 25th, where there is a true open beta, no NDA, and an influx of user vids, forum posts, etc... I would encourage folks to not pre-order. Any pre-ordering after anything less than a fully disclosed open-beta, is a money grab. Plan and simple. Anyone who can't see that is wearing Tasos colored glasses.

Even when Tasos does a complete 180 on everything he's said they believe in up to this point... still some find excuses to defend it. 

How about this...

They drop the NDA and allow everyone that's currently in the Beta to post.   THAT would at least show that they are willing to let the game speak for itself!  

At this point... all it seems is that they've now added the money component that many of us said was coming.  And yet, we still are not able to get in and play the game.  

Originally posted by ProfRed

Originally posted by templarga

Originally posted by ProfRed

Originally posted by templarga

I do not care what will happen in regards to the trial and pre-orders. Aventurine went back on their word and now, in my opinion, cannot be trusted for anything they said or promised. This is a slap in the face to gamers and smells just like Age of Conan, Vanguard, Dark and Light among others.

If SOE had posted something like this, everyone would be criticizing them full-force. Just because it is Aventurine, we are supposed to cut them some slack and forgive them for going back on promises? My response is that they lied and are now in the same company as the aforementioned companies.

 

No one is asking you to think otherwise.  I think you are a bit of a drama queen though personally.  You believed something that a PR person said for a game, and then was offended when they couldn't deliver.  It was not even a pre meditated lie.  Tasos was simply an idiot.  Your opinion though and I respect that.

Drama queen? Try more like ethics in business. And why say that to me? Every damn fanboi in these forums believed it a thousand times more than I did. I just call it as I see it and its sad to see people try to defend a lying company. (For example, I am not nor will I ever play a SOE game again because of the recent RMT stuff as it relates to Smed's "promises" - just took me longer to realize that SOE will say anything to get people to sub than others)

And if you think I am a drama queen because I am upset that a company lied to the general public and did a 180 on a promise they made, then fine. Add to that, their justification for their change of course is too simple.

Seriously, what happens if 100k people preorder? Will they honor those pre-orders if they can only have 1-2 servers? Pre-order is a guarantee and the way I see it, there is no way Aventurine (and I have no confidence that Aventurine) can honor any pre-order agreement. Still people defend them and act as if it does not matter because they are new or a startup company. Hell, they are a business and their job is to make money and this latest change of direction only conforms that they will do what they need to make money. Gamers come second to them, money first.

 

I guess I just don't think of a PR person as the company, and I know that they all lie.  Even if they don't mean to lie they do.  They were stupid to set a date.  I think Tasos has handled this pretty poorly, but I just got the overall feeling you were being a bit dramatic.  This is pretty common fair for almost every gaming company when it comes to MMORPG's across the board.  I think Blizzard is the only one to ever go the route of not being idiots and sticking to 'when it's ready.'

I agree with most of your points.  I see where you are coming from, and I respect your decision.  I just feel it's a bit dramatic.  Hell 99% of these boards and DF's board, and the DF channel are so overly dramatic right now that I feel like i'm in the middle of a Beverly Hills High School.  I feel like we aren't talking about an unreleased game, but instead what she said to her about him and then what he did to her because of what she said omg. 

Yeah, if I am a bit over-dramtic, I apologize. What I do not understand is that I have been saying for the last few weeks now that there is no way they could get all the admin-related stuff ready and that was confirmed today. And what I really do not get, is that the issues and problems that were mentioned in the announcement can not happen over-night - they (Aventurine) must have know for a while now that this wasn't going to happen. And to wait to the last minute (1 week before "launch") is really bad business practice and, as a potential customer, I feel lied too and insulted more than anything.

---

Originally posted by xzyax

---

Originally posted by nathanpinard

Well Aventurine definitely failed their own expectations, but it's expected in a hard business like MMO's. Most of the "promises" were written years before they got into the nitty gritty stuff.
The pre-orders are disappointing, but it makes sense. People that pay, probably should have a priority in getting a slot for the open beta (also called a trial)
They made a few mistakes on how they worded things, but still...the game WILL come out. And really the delay isn't that bad.
Hopefully they didn't underestimate that.

---

They just flushed down the toilet the main card they had left in their hand... integrity.
That is gone now... they no longer get to play that card.
 

---

Actually in terms of their try before you buy philosophy they haven't broken that yet. They are allowing people to try the game before they even preorder it. They just can't take in everyone on the 22nd and they don't think they can take on everyone on the 25th of February.

They should offer an on going free trial at launch but that doesn't make sense because they probably can't take in everyone who would even be willing to pay. This part makes it sound like a scam but I won't be concerned about this unless people joining the beta after the 22nd are under NDA.

Originally posted by templarga

Originally posted by ProfRed

Originally posted by templarga

Originally posted by ProfRed

Originally posted by templarga

I do not care what will happen in regards to the trial and pre-orders. Aventurine went back on their word and now, in my opinion, cannot be trusted for anything they said or promised. This is a slap in the face to gamers and smells just like Age of Conan, Vanguard, Dark and Light among others.

If SOE had posted something like this, everyone would be criticizing them full-force. Just because it is Aventurine, we are supposed to cut them some slack and forgive them for going back on promises? My response is that they lied and are now in the same company as the aforementioned companies.

 

No one is asking you to think otherwise.  I think you are a bit of a drama queen though personally.  You believed something that a PR person said for a game, and then was offended when they couldn't deliver.  It was not even a pre meditated lie.  Tasos was simply an idiot.  Your opinion though and I respect that.

Drama queen? Try more like ethics in business. And why say that to me? Every damn fanboi in these forums believed it a thousand times more than I did. I just call it as I see it and its sad to see people try to defend a lying company. (For example, I am not nor will I ever play a SOE game again because of the recent RMT stuff as it relates to Smed's "promises" - just took me longer to realize that SOE will say anything to get people to sub than others)

And if you think I am a drama queen because I am upset that a company lied to the general public and did a 180 on a promise they made, then fine. Add to that, their justification for their change of course is too simple.

Seriously, what happens if 100k people preorder? Will they honor those pre-orders if they can only have 1-2 servers? Pre-order is a guarantee and the way I see it, there is no way Aventurine (and I have no confidence that Aventurine) can honor any pre-order agreement. Still people defend them and act as if it does not matter because they are new or a startup company. Hell, they are a business and their job is to make money and this latest change of direction only conforms that they will do what they need to make money. Gamers come second to them, money first.

 

I guess I just don't think of a PR person as the company, and I know that they all lie.  Even if they don't mean to lie they do.  They were stupid to set a date.  I think Tasos has handled this pretty poorly, but I just got the overall feeling you were being a bit dramatic.  This is pretty common fair for almost every gaming company when it comes to MMORPG's across the board.  I think Blizzard is the only one to ever go the route of not being idiots and sticking to 'when it's ready.'

I agree with most of your points.  I see where you are coming from, and I respect your decision.  I just feel it's a bit dramatic.  Hell 99% of these boards and DF's board, and the DF channel are so overly dramatic right now that I feel like i'm in the middle of a Beverly Hills High School.  I feel like we aren't talking about an unreleased game, but instead what she said to her about him and then what he did to her because of what she said omg. 

Yeah, if I am a bit over-dramtic, I apologize. What I do not understand is that I have been saying for the last few weeks now that there is no way they could get all the admin-related stuff ready and that was confirmed today. And what I really do not get, is that the issues and problems that were mentioned in the announcement can not happen over-night - they (Aventurine) must have know for a while now that this wasn't going to happen. And to wait to the last minute (1 week before "launch") is really bad business practice and, as a potential customer, I feel lied too and insulted more than anything.

BINGO!

Tasos said on Dec. 4th that DarkFall was READY to launch!

Obviously that is now exposed as a lie.   How many more times does he have to be caught not telling anything resembling the truth before people start to figure out that he is NOT a genuine and trust-worthy person? 

Originally posted by mutantmagnet

 

---

Originally posted by xzyax

---

Originally posted by nathanpinard

 

Well Aventurine definitely failed their own expectations, but it's expected in a hard business like MMO's. Most of the "promises" were written years before they got into the nitty gritty stuff.
The pre-orders are disappointing, but it makes sense. People that pay, probably should have a priority in getting a slot for the open beta (also called a trial)
They made a few mistakes on how they worded things, but still...the game WILL come out. And really the delay isn't that bad.
Hopefully they didn't underestimate that.

---

They just flushed down the toilet the main card they had left in their hand... integrity.
That is gone now... they no longer get to play that card.
 

---

 

Actually in terms of their try before you buy philosophy they haven't broken that yet. They are allowing people to try the game before they even preorder it. They just can't take in everyone on the 22nd and they don't think they can take on everyone on the 25th of February.

They should offer an on going free trial at launch but that doesn't make sense because they probably can't take in everyone who would even be willing to pay. This part makes it sound like a scam but I won't be concerned about this unless people joining the beta after the 22nd are under NDA.

Yup.

That is going to be the other shoe to drop.

Where will the NDA stand come the 22nd.

IF the NDA is still firmly in place on the 22nd... I would hope that EVERYONE sees that a big RED FLAG!  

Originally posted by xzyax

Originally posted by mutantmagnet

 

---

Originally posted by xzyax

---

Originally posted by nathanpinard

 

Well Aventurine definitely failed their own expectations, but it's expected in a hard business like MMO's. Most of the "promises" were written years before they got into the nitty gritty stuff.
The pre-orders are disappointing, but it makes sense. People that pay, probably should have a priority in getting a slot for the open beta (also called a trial)
They made a few mistakes on how they worded things, but still...the game WILL come out. And really the delay isn't that bad.
Hopefully they didn't underestimate that.

---

They just flushed down the toilet the main card they had left in their hand... integrity.
That is gone now... they no longer get to play that card.
 

---

 

Actually in terms of their try before you buy philosophy they haven't broken that yet. They are allowing people to try the game before they even preorder it. They just can't take in everyone on the 22nd and they don't think they can take on everyone on the 25th of February.

They should offer an on going free trial at launch but that doesn't make sense because they probably can't take in everyone who would even be willing to pay. This part makes it sound like a scam but I won't be concerned about this unless people joining the beta after the 22nd are under NDA.

Yup.

 

That is going to be the other shoe to drop.

 

Where will the NDA stand come the 22nd.

 

IF the NDA is still firmly in place on the 22nd... I would hope that EVERYONE sees that a big RED FLAG!  

It depends, is the NDA for closed beta still up? I dont care.

Is there a NDA to the players who gets to do the trial? ....holy crap

A few points of interest:

* Most optimists/fanbois/nonhaters are NOT defending that tasos/aventurine screwed up on alot of statements. They are defending Tasos/aventurine from the haters who makes a dragon out of a feather. The gameplan is changed, reasons for it has been stated, Tasos said they cant let everyone in trial - there just is'nt room. Get over it, its changed.

Question is: What do you think of there new gameplan? (If its truly followed, assume it is - we can argue all day long what we believe will happen with it.)

 - Pre-orders does not effect who gets into open beta

 - Aventurine trying to let ppl try the game before pre order/buy, so they better know how many will truly be playing

 - Aventurine doing there launch very seriously, to avoid previous failures.

* Many haters are taking any form of non-hate post as a Tasos-has-done-nothing-wrong-post, whats up with that.

* For gods sake, Tasos saying the game is feuture complete and ready for launch doesnt neccesarily have to mean it can be launched any second. It could and probably did mean that the Game itself was so playable that it was in a state most game is when they are released. Cant believe most posters here, your as lame as the ones your bashing saying the fanbois twist Tasos words around so they sound better, well your doing the same frickin thing. Learn to comprehend the meanings...

Dark and Light!

mark my words, been there done that

Originally posted by fagercraft

It depends, is the NDA for closed beta still up? I dont care.

Is there a NDA to the players who gets to do the trial? ....holy crap

 

A few points of interest:

* Most optimists/fanbois/nonhaters are NOT defending that tasos/aventurine screwed up on alot of statements. They are defending Tasos/aventurine from the haters who makes a dragon out of a feather. The gameplan is changed, reasons for it has been stated, Tasos said they cant let everyone in trial - there just is'nt room. Get over it, its changed.

Question is: What do you think of there new gameplan? (If its truly followed, assume it is - we can argue all day long what we believe will happen with it.)

 - Pre-orders does not effect who gets into open beta

 - Aventurine trying to let ppl try the game before pre order/buy, so they better know how many will truly be playing

 - Aventurine doing there launch very seriously, to avoid previous failures.

 

* Many haters are taking any form of non-hate post as a Tasos-has-done-nothing-wrong-post, whats up with that.

* For gods sake, Tasos saying the game is feuture complete and ready for launch doesnt neccesarily have to mean it can be launched any second. It could and probably did mean that the Game itself was so playable that it was in a state most game is when they are released. Cant believe most posters here, your as lame as the ones your bashing saying the fanbois twist Tasos words around so they sound better, well your doing the same frickin thing. Learn to comprehend the meanings...

So basically you are saying that now that some of the critics have been vindicated they should use restraint. Your saying this at the same time that the fanbois have been nothing but drama queens towards anyone even questioning the game a little bit.

Do you not see the hypocrisy here? If the game released flawlessly as intended the fanbois would have been relentless in heckling critics. Many on the main boards are still posting like this is all part of a master plan.

When an owner of the company making the game says it could be released "today" that DOES imply that the game could launch that DAY! What is up with all the revisionists and apologists for Tasos. He is an arrogant SOB and has come off that way in every journal/QA he has ever done. You don't get to be arrogant without reprocussion unless you can back up what you say... he clearly has not and is reaping what HE has started.