Originally posted by NeroScuro

4. Oh right, and Tasos has never lied. Perhaps he's been intentionally vague at times, but that's not lying. Hell, every MMO company does this, they're just better at it than Tasos. He has never given factually, objectively incorrect information. So the trolls are now both lying and hypocrites to boot.

Yes, he has lied, alot. Do a little searching and you will see. For example.

"The announcement during ADW was that the open beta phase is scheduled to end early in December. More importantly this means that the game will be ready to release at that point."

Posted by your Lord right here: http://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?t=77544
 

Also, from 2004.

"When is Beta?
Darkfall is currently in the final stages of internal beta testing. This means that the game is being tested in-house in preparation for public playtesting. A beta registration form will become available on this website soon."

Again, from your Lord, http://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?t=8495
 

He is also fond of using many vague phrases and statements, which some can argue is not lying, but it really is just a way for him to weasel out of his previous statements. For example:

"I never said that public beta would be two weeks. I said several weeks. Public beta will be as long as it needs to be. "

From 5-2008, right here: http://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?t=55937

Originally posted by Murdus

 

I've been following Darkfall for only a year and a half now. I've defended it many times, declining the vaporware attacks, the featurlacking attacks, the Tasos attacks, and now the "Noob previews the game!" attacks.

I'm pretty sure that I've just realized that anyone who thinks the game is coming out... well if you look at it with an objective view, there is NO reason to believe that it is... literally. The ones who say it is vaporware, or it will be a complete failure have NO reason to believe that it is.

No one is right here, seriously. Its either you trust Tasos or you don't. There are no probabilities, there are no chances, it is mere trust.

To decide who you trust you have to take into account what THEY have at stake. It is a business, it is there to make profit. Could Tasos successfully pull this off and trick over a hundred thousand fans to make an easy $500,000 dollars... its pretty damn possible. Could he be the underdog who swoops in to rescue the MMORPG market? ... its pretty damn possible.

That is kinda true, but there are 'milestones' that have to be met for the January 22nd 'launch' to be real.

1. There official website still does not mention Jan 22nd.
2. There is no official pricing system in place, and nowhere does it indicate how players will even get the game.
3. No beta - only one person who is not a dev has released any information about gameplay, and she has been friends with the devs for 5 years
4. No reporters/reviewers have played the game, let alone written any articles about gameplay.
5.  The last piece of 'official news' on the website is the noob preview (again, a friend of 5 years).  The official website hasn't been touched in over a month.. which is ok if you are a year away from launching, but this late they should at least be updating something.

Anyone who thinks they are going to play anything but an alpha/beta on Jan 22nd is fooling themeselves.

Companies mostly allow access to the client 1 to 2 weeks prior to release for a MMO. So if this holds true for DF your looking at a jan8 or jan15 release of the client.

I take it DF will be in OB on jan22 ? so if its in OB then the client should be free and free to play while in OB. Is this correct ?

Digital Download?

Originally posted by pewtpewt

DARKFALL 08!! YES WE CAN
 

You gonna change this?

Originally posted by stayontarget

Companies mostly allow access to the client 1 to 2 weeks prior to release for a MMO. So if this holds true for DF your looking at a jan8 or jan15 release of the client.

I take it DF will be in OB on jan22 ? so if its in OB then the client should be free and free to play while in OB. Is this correct ?

yea except open beta should be before that

Originally posted by downtoearth

Originally posted by stayontarget

Companies mostly allow access to the client 1 to 2 weeks prior to release for a MMO. So if this holds true for DF your looking at a jan8 or jan15 release of the client.

I take it DF will be in OB on jan22 ? so if its in OB then the client should be free and free to play while in OB. Is this correct ?

 

yea except open beta should be before that

open beta should be going on right now based on what Lord Tasos has said.

The reason you can't find a release date on Gamestop and or any other major game retailers is because they have already put darkfall in the vaporware bucket alongside duke nukem forever. they will believe it when they see it is there moto right now.

Originally posted by Briansho

Originally posted by downtoearth

Originally posted by stayontarget

Companies mostly allow access to the client 1 to 2 weeks prior to release for a MMO. So if this holds true for DF your looking at a jan8 or jan15 release of the client.

I take it DF will be in OB on jan22 ? so if its in OB then the client should be free and free to play while in OB. Is this correct ?

 

yea except open beta should be before that

 

open beta should be going on right now based on what Lord Tasos has said.

well tech shaar said it plans change it snot that big a deal as long as it happens and it was actully said at the event thing not really ina ny annuncmeant plus they never gave a date jsut a time frame . all well it iwll happen some time here press beta is first tho which shouldnt be no more than a week im guessing then public beta after that they have to see what server cap is

Originally posted by mcpoopypantz

Originally posted by Gameloading

Originally posted by precious328

The launch is less than 1 month away and I see no information on entities such as Gamestop etc. Have they mentioned anything on how us westerners can obtain a copy of Darkfall? Moreover, why hasn't there been any leaked footage on YouTube? It's been known that EVERY mmorpg that's in beta has had countless videos and NDA breaks that reside on YouTube. All I can seem to find in terms of Darkfall are a million fan films on the same old video.

 

The game won't be avaible in stores.

It'll only be avaible through digital purchase. Make no mistake, Darkfall is a low budget game. It's a Roma Victor, a Mourning, Dark & Light, Irth Online, nothing more.

It's tons better then the horrible game Archlord you were a longtime fanboy of though
 

Nope, ArchLord is better than RV, Mourning, D&L and Irth Online and Darkfall is comparable to those games as Darkfall is also low budget trash.

Originally posted by downtoearth

Originally posted by stayontarget

Companies mostly allow access to the client 1 to 2 weeks prior to release for a MMO. So if this holds true for DF your looking at a jan8 or jan15 release of the client.

I take it DF will be in OB on jan22 ? so if its in OB then the client should be free and free to play while in OB. Is this correct ?

 

yea except open beta should be before that

then jan22 is not going to be live or is that date for OB.

I think its about time DF starts putting out some basic info. All we know is that the world is coming to an end on jan22.

But how, when, where and for how much is still up for debate.....crazy way to run a roll out of a game.

http://www.mmorpg-center.com/video-167-Darkfall-Online--Gameplay-Trailer.html

i saw this and i will never play this game , it's bad

Originally posted by NeroScuro

Originally posted by winter

 1. Ok sure, now go back to your post and read what you wrote. go ahead I'll wait. You don't notice where you say there are people in the OPEN BETA? Its your #2 point. here let me quote "There are members of the public in the open beta." Sorry but If you don't know what your typing then your not gonna have a very strong case.

2 Sorry but go back to his posts. he never said he hoped DF would be released in 2008 as you infer, he never said he hoped Open beta would end in early December. he said these things would happen no wiggle room, which for him is admittedly very odd.

 I agree the game will be what it will be dispite what Tasos does or does not claim but then i wasn't the one claiming Tasos has never lied just wanted to set things straight for the record. He has, he does, and as you yourself noted above he is really no different then any other MMO's PR man except perhaps abit worse at his job.

 

1. Oh right, I made a typo. See, I was confused because you just latched on that one mistake and completely ignored almost the entirety of the rest of my post. It was almost as though you were trying to imply the rest of my points are automatically moot because of a typo, but of course you weren't doing that! That would just be retarded, now wouldn't it?

2. We're just getting into an argument about semantics here. All I'm going to say is, he never said these things would happen. No PR person, no matter how bad, would ever promise anything they weren't 100% beyond doubt of.

He said that he hoped things would happen, he said it was scheduled, he said it was their commitment. None of those things are a promise. They're misleading and confusing, no argument there, but you wouldn't say someone was lying if they broke a schedule - they'd be late, that's it.

 Generally typos are spelling errors, when you claim other people are posting misleading and incorrect info yet then type a game that is in closed beta is in OPEN beta thats a fairly large typo. Even weirder to say you made a honest mistake with a typo but say I'm retareded for pointing out the glaring misinformation you were spreading?
 

  I did not latch on that one thing though. I saw 2 things wrong with your arguement. #2 and #4. I went even more in depth on number 4 yet you ignored that and claim that I latched on number 2? Sorry you are wrong, you were proven wrong and now rather then admit you were wrong your going the "I made a typo your a retard route"? Sorry but insults don't win arguements and so far yours has not beeen based in facts. Guess I need to get the direct quotes as Tasos never said he hoped Df would be out in 2008 or that he hoped Open beta would end in early December. A commitment is much like a promise, if you say your are commiting to doing something and then you don't I would classify that as a lie. Sure would hate to have to start quoting the dictionary though.

 Edit: The past is the past though not much sense beating a dead horse though, so lets look to the future. Tasos/AV has commited to a Jan 22nd launch of DF. there was no "We hope to have DF by the 22nd", or "We plan to have DF out byt the 22nd" So if DF is not released by the 22nd are we still gonna hear how Tasos never lied? I mean if so what exactly does classify as a lie to the fans? Yes i could go goggle the dictionary but we all know different people have different prospectives so i am wondering at what point some people draw the line.

  Lets say your cars in the shop, and I tell you "sure your car will be ready tonight, its totally fixed and runs better then almost any other car on the street", so you come in later that night and i tell you. "sorry your cars still not ready come back next week. did I lie? or am I just late on a schedule? 

When it says the NA players are welcome I'm sure that you will still have to pay in Euro's like everyone else as I very much doubt that they will set up special payment options.  You can expect the game to be around $60 and the montly fee $21 assuming that they use standard prices.  I hope that there is the option to pay in pounds sterling otherwise the UK will get shafted as well, US gamers getting charged in pounds would be paying $50 for the game and $14.50 for the sub, again assuming that they use industry standard prices.

Originally posted by winter

 

  Lets say your cars in the shop, and I tell you "sure your car will be ready tonight, its totally fixed and runs better then almost any other car on the street", so you come in later that night and i tell you. "sorry your cars still not ready come back next week. did I lie? or am I just late on a schedule? 

 

This would be considered lying because you wouldn't know it runs better than any car on the street if it wasn't actually fixed. So because it wasn't fixed and you said something you proposed as a fact to the consumer that could only be true if it WAS fixed... that is a lie.

The cake i mean car is a lie.

Originally posted by winter 

  Lets say your cars in the shop, and I tell you "sure your car will be ready tonight, its totally fixed and runs better then almost any other car on the street", so you come in later that night and i tell you. "sorry your cars still not ready come back next week. did I lie? or am I just late on a schedule? 

 

What kind of comparison is that?? Lol.

For starters it still wouldn't be a lie if the garage owner did actually believe that it was ready and ran better than almost any car on the street.  Lying is telling intentional falsehoods, not saying something that later turns out to be incorrect.  It would be impossible to say if the DF devs were lying from your position.  If you were in the England you could actually be taken to court for libel and forced to pay compensation for writing that they have lied.  It happens all the time over here and you would almost certainly be convicted as it would be near impossible to prove your accusation. 

Secondly in this situation the garage has your car. The DF devs don't have anything of yours and are not obliged to provide anything to you.  It doesn't matter what they do it won't have any impact on you.

Originally posted by winter

Originally posted by NeroScuro

Originally posted by winter

 1. Ok sure, now go back to your post and read what you wrote. go ahead I'll wait. You don't notice where you say there are people in the OPEN BETA? Its your #2 point. here let me quote "There are members of the public in the open beta." Sorry but If you don't know what your typing then your not gonna have a very strong case.

2 Sorry but go back to his posts. he never said he hoped DF would be released in 2008 as you infer, he never said he hoped Open beta would end in early December. he said these things would happen no wiggle room, which for him is admittedly very odd.

 I agree the game will be what it will be dispite what Tasos does or does not claim but then i wasn't the one claiming Tasos has never lied just wanted to set things straight for the record. He has, he does, and as you yourself noted above he is really no different then any other MMO's PR man except perhaps abit worse at his job.

 

1. Oh right, I made a typo. See, I was confused because you just latched on that one mistake and completely ignored almost the entirety of the rest of my post. It was almost as though you were trying to imply the rest of my points are automatically moot because of a typo, but of course you weren't doing that! That would just be retarded, now wouldn't it?

2. We're just getting into an argument about semantics here. All I'm going to say is, he never said these things would happen. No PR person, no matter how bad, would ever promise anything they weren't 100% beyond doubt of.

He said that he hoped things would happen, he said it was scheduled, he said it was their commitment. None of those things are a promise. They're misleading and confusing, no argument there, but you wouldn't say someone was lying if they broke a schedule - they'd be late, that's it.

 Generally typos are spelling errors, when you claim other people are posting misleading and incorrect info yet then type a game that is in closed beta is in OPEN beta thats a fairly large typo. Even weirder to say you made a honest mistake with a typo but say I'm retareded for pointing out the glaring misinformation you were spreading?
 

  I did not latch on that one thing though. I saw 2 things wrong with your arguement. #2 and #4. I went even more in depth on number 4 yet you ignored that and claim that I latched on number 2? Sorry you are wrong, you were proven wrong and now rather then admit you were wrong your going the "I made a typo your a retard route"? Sorry but insults don't win arguements and so far yours has not beeen based in facts. Guess I need to get the direct quotes as Tasos never said he hoped Df would be out in 2008 or that he hoped Open beta would end in early December. A commitment is much like a promise, if you say your are commiting to doing something and then you don't I would classify that as a lie. Sure would hate to have to start quoting the dictionary though.

 Edit: The past is the past though not much sense beating a dead horse though, so lets look to the future. Tasos/AV has commited to a Jan 22nd launch of DF. there was no "We hope to have DF by the 22nd", or "We plan to have DF out byt the 22nd" So if DF is not released by the 22nd are we still gonna hear how Tasos never lied? I mean if so what exactly does classify as a lie to the fans? Yes i could go goggle the dictionary but we all know different people have different prospectives so i am wondering at what point some people draw the line.

  Lets say your cars in the shop, and I tell you "sure your car will be ready tonight, its totally fixed and runs better then almost any other car on the street", so you come in later that night and i tell you. "sorry your cars still not ready come back next week. did I lie? or am I just late on a schedule? 

 

Its late on a schedule. When my gf says she will be ready to go out at 9pm and at 9 says "Im runnign a little late need 15 more minutes" I dont yell LIAR!!! I know she just had to push the time back a little... and im fine with that cuz she will look better when she is ready.

Originally posted by Blodpls

Originally posted by winter 

  Lets say your cars in the shop, and I tell you "sure your car will be ready tonight, its totally fixed and runs better then almost any other car on the street", so you come in later that night and i tell you. "sorry your cars still not ready come back next week. did I lie? or am I just late on a schedule? 

 

 

What kind of comparison is that?? Lol.

For starters it still wouldn't be a lie if the garage owner did actually believe that it was ready and ran better than almost any car on the street.  Lying is telling intentional falsehoods, not saying something that later turns out to be incorrect.  It would be impossible to say if the DF devs were lying from your position.  If you were in the England you could actually be taken to court for libel and forced to pay compensation for writing that they have lied.  It happens all the time over here and you would almost certainly be convicted as it would be near impossible to prove your accusation. 

Secondly in this situation the garage has your car. The DF devs don't have anything of yours and are not obliged to provide anything to you.  It doesn't matter what they do it won't have any impact on you.

  It was a question nothing more nothing less. Thank you for answering, However your threats were unwarrented. If you feel I am slandering Tasos and feel the need to take me to court for libel please do go ahead and start the proceedings, otherwise please cut with the internet threats/scare tactics, sorry they just don't impress me.

  I may have gotten the wrong impression and while I do appreciate your response on the subject the extra info on libel suits/ slander seems to be more just a attempt to brow beat and shutup anyone thats not 100% fan. You were at least partially correct as was I.... (Damn i really didn't want to go to the dictionary with this one. )

lied, ly·ing (lng), lies
v.intr.
1. To present false information with the intention of deceiving.
2. To convey a false image or impression: Appearances often lie.
 

 Your choice of the definition is #1 and yes I can not prove Tasos is presenting false information with the intent to decieve.

 However mine would be #2 In which i think we can all agree that Tasos (perhaps unknowingly) has conveyed a false image or impression of when the game would launch (DF 2008).

  So as you can see perhaps I am not guilty of libel as you claim. I'd rather not get into legal speak with you as that was not the point of my original question. Consider the question a survey if you will.  

This has turned into an argument about cars and the definition of lying.

/thread imo.

Originally posted by behindtheed

This has turned into an argument about cars and the definition of lying.

 

/thread imo.

Liar.

heres what I dont get, even F2P asian grinders have splash adds up on this website in the frames.....yet not a damn thing about DF....in fact no marketing....at all....anywhere....period. I wanna see this game, but christ if they cant even pony up a few bucks to get the box art flashed on a few gameing sites, not even BIG gameing sites...I have serious reservations.

Originally posted by ianicus

heres what I dont get, even F2P asian grinders have splash adds up on this website in the frames.....yet not a damn thing about DF....in fact no marketing....at all....anywhere....period. I wanna see this game, but christ if they cant pony up a few bucks to get the box art flashed on a few gameing sites, not even BIG gameing sites...I have serious reservations.

Though I'm sure many gamers like you think that re-playing  an animated add over and over again on the side of a website, and cool pictures with flashy colours make a good game. The rest of us are happy with the numerous articles and interviews Darkfall does on many gaming websites, including this one - and simply word of mouth about the game, because the promising content in the game is what will sell it, not over hyping and advertising.

Originally posted by behindtheed

Originally posted by ianicus

heres what I dont get, even F2P asian grinders have splash adds up on this website in the frames.....yet not a damn thing about DF....in fact no marketing....at all....anywhere....period. I wanna see this game, but christ if they cant pony up a few bucks to get the box art flashed on a few gameing sites, not even BIG gameing sites...I have serious reservations.

 

Though I'm sure many gamers like you think that re-playing  an animated add over and over again on the side of a website, and cool pictures with flashy colours make a good game. The rest of us are happy with the numerous articles and interviews Darkfall does on many gaming websites, including this one - and simply word of mouth about the game, because the promising content in the game is what will sell it, not over hyping and advertising.

word of mouth....yes it would appear that the developers of DF have truely harnessed the power of the internet! Seriously they could at least spend a few bucks getting the word out instead of looking like amatuers...Perhaps if they were selling cookies and freash baked bread down the street I could buy your "word of mouth" argument...but its about as solid to stand on as said freash baked bread....pita anyone??

Originally posted by ianicus

Originally posted by behindtheed

Originally posted by ianicus

heres what I dont get, even F2P asian grinders have splash adds up on this website in the frames.....yet not a damn thing about DF....in fact no marketing....at all....anywhere....period. I wanna see this game, but christ if they cant pony up a few bucks to get the box art flashed on a few gameing sites, not even BIG gameing sites...I have serious reservations.

 

Though I'm sure many gamers like you think that re-playing  an animated add over and over again on the side of a website, and cool pictures with flashy colours make a good game. The rest of us are happy with the numerous articles and interviews Darkfall does on many gaming websites, including this one - and simply word of mouth about the game, because the promising content in the game is what will sell it, not over hyping and advertising.

 

word of mouth....yes it would appear that the developers of DF have truely harnessed the power of the internet! Seriously they could at least spend a few bucks getting the word out instead of looking like amatuers...Perhaps if they were selling cookies and freash baked bread down the street I could buy your "word of mouth" argument...but its about as solid to stand on as said freash baked bread....pita anyone??

You missed the point. If you think pictures are a better way to advertise then interviews and articles, then you need to (edit: because death threats are bad) live a long happy life.

Originally posted by behindtheed

Originally posted by ianicus

Originally posted by behindtheed

Originally posted by ianicus

heres what I dont get, even F2P asian grinders have splash adds up on this website in the frames.....yet not a damn thing about DF....in fact no marketing....at all....anywhere....period. I wanna see this game, but christ if they cant pony up a few bucks to get the box art flashed on a few gameing sites, not even BIG gameing sites...I have serious reservations.

 

Though I'm sure many gamers like you think that re-playing  an animated add over and over again on the side of a website, and cool pictures with flashy colours make a good game. The rest of us are happy with the numerous articles and interviews Darkfall does on many gaming websites, including this one - and simply word of mouth about the game, because the promising content in the game is what will sell it, not over hyping and advertising.

 

word of mouth....yes it would appear that the developers of DF have truely harnessed the power of the internet! Seriously they could at least spend a few bucks getting the word out instead of looking like amatuers...Perhaps if they were selling cookies and freash baked bread down the street I could buy your "word of mouth" argument...but its about as solid to stand on as said freash baked bread....pita anyone??

 

You missed the point. If you think pictures are a better way to advertise then interviews and articles, then you need to give up on life asap

wow..."give up on life" lol its statements like that which cause me to pity people like yourself (and question your age). Here's a quick marketing 101 for you. Word of mouth is on the BOTTOM of the marketing totem poll, something thats usualy generated  by the end user because they have USED the product for which they are spreading the word....in THIS case...you and I know not a SINGLE person that has acctualy played the game, thus any word of mouth "advertiseing" at this point is speculative at the very most, AKA worthless hot air. The only benefit to word of mouth at this point is "hey I saw some info about this game, looks interesting...I think it was called uhhh....darktrip? dark....slip? something like that dude, check it out!". As you can see not nearly as effective as it could be in some instances im sure. Heres where a good marketing campaign comes in. Throw up some adds highlighting confirmed game mechanics and information about the game that would inspire people, more people than just haunt these boards, to take a look at the game, than keep your website regularly updated (which they have not) and keep players informed with firm info on progress (which they have not). Case closed.