I think this game sounds really neat on paper, but a deeper look at some of the features makes one think twice.

Now I am not even going to mention FFA Loot and the core features of the game. Those are the things that define the game, but I am talking about things that other MMO's have picked up on to make life more convenient for their fanbase. It seems as though in trying to create a realistic and immersive gaming experience the developers have overlooked a few things:

Travel Times - Travelling a long way to have to get to somewhere sounds great, it gives a real sense of adventure and improves the immersion, this game does not have ports or flight paths but instead one stone that will allow you to port on a very restrictive basis. Some travel is good, but too much travel tends to be very tedious. Also, what if your guildies need help with some griefers and you are too far away to help them. Furthermore, you may be disinclined to go and explore the entire world for exactly this reason, you don't want to be too far from help and supply lines. All this means that you basically have to travel in groups, and that is fine except many of us like to solo and be in groups depending on our time constraints and moods.

Alignment System - This is a feature that will provide some political context to the game and divert you from killing your own race/alignment. However, what about multiple-race guilds or guilds that want to go to war with another guild of their own alignment. Furthermore, this means you will have to travel far in order find someone of another alignment to fight or to meet up with your guild if they are a different race.

Limited Maps - Maps on your screen are unrealistic, no one had a built in GPS in this type of world. Well maps help a lot with navigation and with meeting up with group members. One of the most frustrating parts of MMO's is spending hours trying to find your way around.

No Floating Names - No one has a giant floating name above their head. But if you meet someone in the world how would you know if they are from a friendly or enemy guild. Perhaps if there were some way to identify guilds through emblems but I haven't seen such feature presented.

No Safe Zones and Roleplay - This open style skill-based game could be a roleplayers dream. Except that there are no dedicated RP servers so they will be mixed in with everyone else who may not respect RP conventions. Also RP'ers and people in general like places where they can hang out and relax, with no safe zones anywhere this could be a griefers dream, especially the ones that hate the rp'ers.

These are just some of my thoughts. It may be that the inconveniences I've listed above bring back a sense of adventure and exploration that is missing from MMO's lately, or they could in fact have the opposite effect and prohibit gameplay. Many MMO devs have tried to make life more convenient for players, DF is either rehashing old mistakes or treading a new path, only time will tell.

P.S. I am posting here cause if I posted this on the ForumFall I would get flamed to hell, I am hoping for a more balanced opinion here, but forums being what they are I expect the usual flames. But I would also appreciate some insight and intelligent feedback.

@OP

You can see the name and the guild of the person if you are close enough when you mouse over them, and no that doesn't mean close enough to be attacked immediatly.

Also, it is a given that this game is not for everyone.  Roleplayers that don't like the prospect of getting pk'd will probably not enjoy this game. 

As for travel being too long, again I say this game is not going to be for everyone.  While it has been stated that the world will be large enough for solo players to play and never run into anyone, I would imagine that this game is going to be more geared towards someone that has the free time to put into a game that is going to require say four hours a day.  Again the world is supposedly so huge (and supposedly filled with enough content) that a casual gamer could find somewhere to be entertained for a couple of hours.  This is merely speculation though.

Personally I feel that Agon will NOT be the world for a LOT of players that find problems with what you listed in your post.  But see there are people in the world like me who are disabled and don't particularly care for t.v. that WANT  world where we can spend say 10 hours a day playing with an immersive experience such as DF is SUPPOSED to offer.  And these people don't have to be disabled.  There are many people that would rather spend their free time in a virtual world than doing other forms of entertainment.  Now some might call this sad and perhaps it is, but I don't care.  It's about time that a game came out that appeals to those of us who want a living, breathing, cyclic world for a change.

Some people read fantasy for hours on end, some people role play for hours on end...so why not a world that appeals to people like me?  Is that too much to ask?

Originally posted by JJMicromegas

I think this game sounds really neat on paper, but a deeper look at some of the features makes one think twice.

Now I am not even going to mention FFA Loot and the core features of the game. Those are the things that define the game, but I am talking about things that other MMO's have picked up on to make life more convenient for their fanbase. It seems as though in trying to create a realistic and immersive gaming experience the developers have overlooked a few things:

Travel Times - Travelling a long way to have to get to somewhere sounds great, it gives a real sense of adventure and improves the immersion, this game does not have ports or flight paths but instead one stone that will allow you to port on a very restrictive basis. Some travel is good, but too much travel tends to be very tedious. Also, what if your guildies need help with some griefers and you are too far away to help them. Furthermore, you may be disinclined to go and explore the entire world for exactly this reason, you don't want to be too far from help and supply lines. All this means that you basically have to travel in groups, and that is fine except many of us like to solo and be in groups depending on our time constraints and moods.

Yes but see what you sacrifice if you allow instant travel, all the challenging factors regarding sieging of enemy cities, all the resource traffic logistics, ambushes, the degree of achievements like having traveled to far locations, the possible offer of services like escorting etc..

     

Alignment System - This is a feature that will provide some political context to the game and divert you from killing your own race/alignment. However, what about multiple-race guilds or guilds that want to go to war with another guild of their own alignment. Furthermore, this means you will have to travel far in order find someone of another alignment to fight or to meet up with your guild if they are a different race.

It is a good compromise (on Paper), the other extreme would be easy way ganking everyone...btw we don't know how the political map will change and enemy terretory becoming neighbors..plus putting in some challenging factor to Battles regarding organization.

Limited Maps - Maps on your screen are unrealistic, no one had a built in GPS in this type of world. Well maps help a lot with navigation and with meeting up with group members. One of the most frustrating parts of MMO's is spending hours trying to find your way around.

Some very  basic help should be available (like where the fuck i am right now)..this is a game afterall not meant as a torture ;)

No Floating Names - No one has a giant floating name above their head. But if you meet someone in the world how would you know if they are from a friendly or enemy guild. Perhaps if there were some way to identify guilds through emblems but I haven't seen such feature presented.

Point over him and wait for sec..

No Safe Zones and Roleplay - This open style skill-based game could be a roleplayers dream. Except that there are no dedicated RP servers so they will be mixed in with everyone else who may not respect RP conventions. Also RP'ers and people in general like places where they can hang out and relax, with no safe zones anywhere this could be a griefers dream, especially the ones that hate the rp'ers.

Its on players to impose them...an RP dream where players can shape the rules you know ;)

These are just some of my thoughts. It may be that the inconveniences I've listed above bring back a sense of adventure and exploration that is missing from MMO's lately, or they could in fact have the opposite effect and prohibit gameplay. Many MMO devs have tried to make life more convenient for players, DF is either rehashing old mistakes or treading a new path, only time will tell.

P.S. I am posting here cause if I posted this on the ForumFall I would get flamed to hell, I am hoping for a more balanced opinion here, but forums being what they are I expect the usual flames. But I would also appreciate some insight and intelligent feedback.

Originally posted by JJMicromegas 

These are just some of my thoughts. It may be that the inconveniences I've listed above bring back a sense of adventure and exploration that is missing from MMO's lately, or they could in fact have the opposite effect and prohibit gameplay.

That's the idea, bordorline ADD kids will hate it, other people will love it.

Originally posted by JJMicromegas

No Floating Names - No one has a giant floating name above their head. But if you meet someone in the world how would you know if they are from a friendly or enemy guild. Perhaps if there were some way to identify guilds through emblems but I haven't seen such feature presented.

This one kinda hit me just now...

Let's pretend i'm not an RPKer, and am in a guild that is at war with another guild. What happens when I see an enemy guild member? How will I know that he's in that guild?

From the screenshots i've seen, when you mouse over somebody, all it shows is their name (no guild, no red/blue status, etc...). This can cause trouble for people who are at war. I really hope they don't expect you to memorize the names of everybody in the enemy guild (and your own guild for that matter...)

Originally posted by jakojako

Originally posted by JJMicromegas

No Floating Names - No one has a giant floating name above their head. But if you meet someone in the world how would you know if they are from a friendly or enemy guild. Perhaps if there were some way to identify guilds through emblems but I haven't seen such feature presented.

 

This one kinda hit me just now...

Let's pretend i'm not an RPKer, and am in a guild that is at war with another guild. What happens when I see an enemy guild member? How will I know that he's in that guild?

From the screenshots i've seen, when you mouse over somebody, all it shows is their name (no guild, no red/blue status, etc...). This can cause trouble for people who are at war. I really hope they don't expect you to memorize the names of everybody in the enemy guild (and your own guild for that matter...)

Members from guilds who share war will appear red to each other ?  would it help you..

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

Originally posted by jakojako

Originally posted by JJMicromegas

No Floating Names - No one has a giant floating name above their head. But if you meet someone in the world how would you know if they are from a friendly or enemy guild. Perhaps if there were some way to identify guilds through emblems but I haven't seen such feature presented.

 

This one kinda hit me just now...

Let's pretend i'm not an RPKer, and am in a guild that is at war with another guild. What happens when I see an enemy guild member? How will I know that he's in that guild?

From the screenshots i've seen, when you mouse over somebody, all it shows is their name (no guild, no red/blue status, etc...). This can cause trouble for people who are at war. I really hope they don't expect you to memorize the names of everybody in the enemy guild (and your own guild for that matter...)

 

Members from guilds who share war will appear red to each other ?  would it help you..

 

By the red/blue status I mean show if they are outlawed rpkers or whatever. I don't want them to literally glow red, but maybe have their name turn red after you mouse over them?

Just so people would know that they're outlawed and can be killed freely

I don't think you guys quite understand, it's not just knowing whether it's a rival guild or not. But your guild list will have people that are KoS, others that are neutral, others that are friendly, others that you are specifically suppose to ignore, and a whole myriad of relationships in between. And you need to be able to identify these types.

Furthermore, if you are ganked and killed it will be important to know who is doing it and whether it was a rival guild. Above there seems to be some contradictory statement as to whether the mouse-over will reveal the persons guild name or not. Can we get some confirmation on this.

Originally posted by JJMicromegas

I don't think you guys quite understand, it's not just knowing whether it's a rival guild or not. But your guild list will have people that are KoS, others that are neutral, others that are friendly, others that you are specifically suppose to ignore, and a whole myriad of relationships in between. And you need to be able to identify these types.

Furthermore, if you are ganked and killed it will be important to know who is doing it and whether it was a rival guild. Above there seems to be some contradictory statement as to whether the mouse-over will reveal the persons guild name or not. Can we get some confirmation on this.

You can tell if you hover over the player from a decent distance, it should have there name aswell as there guild name but only if you hover over them.

It's there so it's easier to hide and then ambush your opponent otherwise you will be hiding behind a tree thinking you are being sneaky when the enemy can see you from a mile way because of all the name, guild etc being visible.

I think the brainy gnomes could make a gps system, hell there are things in fantasy mmo's that never existed in that time or any other time, thats the great thing about fantasy, your open to create anything.

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

Yes but see what you sacrifice if you allow instant travel, all the challenging factors regarding sieging of enemy cities, all the resource traffic logistics, ambushes, the degree of achievements like having traveled to far locations, the possible offer of services like escorting etc..

     

 

They tried long travel times in Shadowbane,  and it didn't work. People would spend an hour walking to a city, just to fight a 3 minute battle.  It was very boring and people hated it.

Then they changed it so you could teleport to other cities and it become much more fun. People could spend most of their time fighting, instead of walking.

Originally posted by JJMicromegas

I don't think you guys quite understand, it's not just knowing whether it's a rival guild or not. But your guild list will have people that are KoS, others that are neutral, others that are friendly, others that you are specifically suppose to ignore, and a whole myriad of relationships in between. And you need to be able to identify these types.

Furthermore, if you are ganked and killed it will be important to know who is doing it and whether it was a rival guild. Above there seems to be some contradictory statement as to whether the mouse-over will reveal the persons guild name or not. Can we get some confirmation on this.

there will be guild tools and overviews for this ..

"Everyone is able to see your clan's diplomatic standings by visiting your in-game clan page."  sept 2006

Originally posted by boognish75

I think the brainy gnomes could make a gps system, hell there are things in fantasy mmo's that never existed in that time or any other time, thats the great thing about fantasy, your open to create anything.

Yeah there are things in fantasy mmo's that never existed in that time...Like gnomes,elves, half man half dog creatures, orcs, dwarves(wait well there were dwarves but they didn't live underground and they ran and still run funny), vampires, magic, "blessed armor", demons, gods, sentars, golems,etc.... WELL LETS DRAW THE LINE AT GPS! I mean common there is no such thing as gps!!!!.....Oh wait....

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

Originally posted by JJMicromegas

I don't think you guys quite understand, it's not just knowing whether it's a rival guild or not. But your guild list will have people that are KoS, others that are neutral, others that are friendly, others that you are specifically suppose to ignore, and a whole myriad of relationships in between. And you need to be able to identify these types.

Furthermore, if you are ganked and killed it will be important to know who is doing it and whether it was a rival guild. Above there seems to be some contradictory statement as to whether the mouse-over will reveal the persons guild name or not. Can we get some confirmation on this.

 

there will be guild tools and overviews for this ..

"Everyone is able to see your clan's diplomatic standings by visiting your in-game clan page."  sept 2006

 

I know what you're saying, but I was talking about random encounters out in the game world where you don't have a chance to search the background of that guild but need to make a split second decision on whether to attack or not.

There are mounts you know...... They wont be too expensive as you can lose them very easily but so can your enemies. So who knows you could have a couple in the bank.

- I would guess that there very well might be navigation skills, and perhaps even navigation items as well?

- I never played Shadowbane, but as I recall it had essentially zero PvE content. And I don't think crafting amounted to much in that game either? Hopefully Darkfall will offer many more things to do than just relentlessly PvP.

Originally posted by jakojako

 

This one kinda hit me just now...

Let's pretend i'm not an RPKer, and am in a guild that is at war with another guild. What happens when I see an enemy guild member? How will I know that he's in that guild?

From the screenshots i've seen, when you mouse over somebody, all it shows is their name (no guild, no red/blue status, etc...). This can cause trouble for people who are at war. I really hope they don't expect you to memorize the names of everybody in the enemy guild (and your own guild for that matter...)

I'd be willing to bet you can see guilds as well on the nameplates. It's probably an option you have to set, or the people in the playtest just weren't attached to a guild.

Even if it doesn't, it works both ways.  You both have the same chance of identifying eachother as an enemy.   If he recognizes your name as the name of an enemy, then he's got a intel advantage on you... and I see no reason that shouldn't be rewarded.

Anwyay, chances are he'll be wearing his own guild colors(guild emblems on his shield/cloak/etc) and hopefully you can be bothered to remember that.

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

Originally posted by jakojako

Originally posted by JJMicromegas

No Floating Names - No one has a giant floating name above their head. But if you meet someone in the world how would you know if they are from a friendly or enemy guild. Perhaps if there were some way to identify guilds through emblems but I haven't seen such feature presented.

 

This one kinda hit me just now...

Let's pretend i'm not an RPKer, and am in a guild that is at war with another guild. What happens when I see an enemy guild member? How will I know that he's in that guild?

From the screenshots i've seen, when you mouse over somebody, all it shows is their name (no guild, no red/blue status, etc...). This can cause trouble for people who are at war. I really hope they don't expect you to memorize the names of everybody in the enemy guild (and your own guild for that matter...)

 

Members from guilds who share war will appear red to each other ?  would it help you..

 

oh a funny thing I just thought up...

let's say you are batteling it out with a player form the same race, but a guild witch your guild is at war with.. and while you are batteling your guild-masters make peace??

Ugh, popped my head back in mmorpg.com and it already hurts (my head)... too much speculating about stuff that NO ONE, including the OP and save the devs, could possibly know.

Originally posted by ghoul31

Originally posted by DarthRaiden

Yes but see what you sacrifice if you allow instant travel, all the challenging factors regarding sieging of enemy cities, all the resource traffic logistics, ambushes, the degree of achievements like having traveled to far locations, the possible offer of services like escorting etc..

     

 

 

They tried long travel times in Shadowbane,  and it didn't work. People would spend an hour walking to a city, just to fight a 3 minute battle.  It was very boring and people hated it.

Then they changed it so you could teleport to other cities and it become much more fun. People could spend most of their time fighting, instead of walking.

 

This seems to be a reoccuring theme with Darkfall.  They are trying to re-invent the wheel and adding stuff that has already been major failures in other games.  And they didn't have an open beta to get the feedback from players.

They will launch without easy travel, then players will complain because they can't meet up with their friends... and then 3 months from now, they will announce they are adding more 'instant travel' options.. which most players knew they needed to be begin with.

Expect to see a lot of the dev's team time fixing issues that other games already fixed years ago.