I'm glad to see I'm not alone.

And to all of the supporters who flooded in acting like none of us have played the game since the NGE was implemented, MANY of us, including myself, log in when we get free vet trials. We still think the game is crappy, still think it is horrible, and still think it doesn't hold a candle to the old game. So stop talking to us like we are uninformed, we get free vet trials every 2-3 months(does that piss you guys off that SOE basically offers us to play for free half the year while you guys have to pay?) and we can see for our very selfs how horrible this game really is.

Originally posted by BadgerSmaker

Originally posted by Antaran

Originally posted by Thunderous

Originally posted by BadgerSmaker

A lot of the things people state that they miss are still in SWG today, crafting, player cities etc.

Popular systems like the 32 Profession/250 skill point system is gone, in its place is 9 Profession/45 point Expertise and buff stacking to further customise your character.

SWG still provides a sandbox environment for those that don't want the more mainstream route of questing/levelling etc, the storyteller system is also pretty good for allowing players to make their own content.

All that said, if you are still angry at SoE after three years then I doubt there is much that can be done to change that.

 The crafting is 1/10th what it was and is basically a grind

 

have you even tried the game?  crafting hasn't really changed that much ever, few minor tweaks here and there but it's still the same complex system it always was, it's only decay thats been removed and SOME loots better than crafted gear. i myself bought a crafted pistol for my smuggler the other day, 1150 DPS, 36 Acid, can whack out a hell of a lot of damage with that.

 

I get a bit confused when people state that crafting is significantly less enjoyable than it was in Pre-CU, as you say, little changed.  With the NGE, SoE did try to go for loot drop > all so that players didn't have to go in for any of that pesky player interdependancy in a bid to attract more "casual" players, but have since seen the error of their ways.

All high end weapons are now in either schematic or deconstructable form, that you can take to a crafter to be customised into uber pew-pew/stabby-stab.

Weaponsmith recently had a complete overhaul, it now works like armousmith in that you can use any weapon skin and just core it with uber stats.

Instead of dropping loot now SOE wants to sell it with the TCG gambling scheme.

Originally posted by Abrahmm

I'm glad to see I'm not alone.

And to all of the supporters who flooded in acting like none of us have played the game since the NGE was implemented, MANY of us, including myself, log in when we get free vet trials. We still think the game is crappy, still think it is horrible, and still think it doesn't hold a candle to the old game. So stop talking to us like we are uninformed, we get free vet trials every 2-3 months(does that piss you guys off that SOE basically offers us to play for free half the year while you guys have to pay?) and we can see for our very selfs how horrible this game really is.

but see, the problem is that even though you come back and play for 10 days, you still dont realize all teh changes. 'vets' are still railing against the manual aim system and lack of target lock, still think the crafting system is shallow, still think there are only a couple foods, still think there is no need to buy armor,  still think smuggler isnt viable, still think all servers are dead, . . .

there is so much misinformation out there that people continue to use against SWG that it's difficult for us to believe that anyone came back and put effort into 're-learning' the game

Originally posted by Abrahmm

I'm glad to see I'm not alone.

And to all of the supporters who flooded in acting like none of us have played the game since the NGE was implemented, MANY of us, including myself, log in when we get free vet trials. We still think the game is crappy, still think it is horrible, and still think it doesn't hold a candle to the old game. So stop talking to us like we are uninformed, we get free vet trials every 2-3 months(does that piss you guys off that SOE basically offers us to play for free half the year while you guys have to pay?) and we can see for our very selfs how horrible this game really is.

Do you eat teaspoons full of dung every three months as well just to complain of the smell?

Do you then proceed to taunt anything that does enjoy the smell/taste?

You'd be better served realizing that your post makes you appear to be even more mentally unstable over pixels than originally let on in your brain as you put your post together.Feeding the beast with your time only makes it more hungry.

Hospice nurses usually have loved ones leave the room when they see that the patient is taking his last breaths. Why? Because if they are still on the room the patient will NEVER die. They will continue to draw breath because the brains natural reactive response does not severe from things auditory for up to 15 minutes.

Leave the room, let this game die. I know you love it, but you can't hang on because it will continue to suffer.

No doubt things have improved since the NGE first came into the game.  How could they have not...

The only real question I have is.

Why was SOE so content to keep this smaller player base... for 3 years.  Yet so happy to make sure the old larger player base left?

They are a "for profit" company that is part of a very large "for profit" corporation.  Its just not logical..

The game according to them was bleeding subs.  However, I don't think anyone in their right mind could claim the CU or NGE didn't bleed a heck of a lot more.

So my questions was and still is... Why were they so happy to retain these smaller numbers?

I don't even care what system may have been better.. or even to debate that.  Its just like I say... for profit in general means dicking people over to make MORE money.. not less.

Originally posted by Antarious

I don't even care what system may have been better.. or even to debate that.  Its just like I say... for profit in general means dicking people over to make MORE money.. not less.

When I play on medium/high population servers I see more people playing than I ever did in Pre-CU and CU, SWG is busy and growing.

I'm really not at all surprised that people are still angry at SoE for the NGE, I still bear a grudge against Electronic Arts for what they did with Ultima Online.  MMORPGs are more than just a game, people get really immersed in them and when a company trashes them the wounds go deep and take a long time to heal.

It saddens me when I see SWG players telling vets to "Get over it" etc.  We are all part of the SWG community, even if you haven't played in years.  SWG isn't something you forget lightly.

Originally posted by BadgerSmaker

 

When I play on medium/high population servers I see more people playing than I ever did in Pre-CU and CU, SWG is busy and growing.

 

I haven't got the time or the inclination to give that statement the response it deserves, I'm sure someone will be along shortly though. That's possibly the most outrageous statement I've ever read, even Obraik  hasn't had anything even remotely close to that, anyhow, said more than I intended, I'll just kick back with the popcorn from here.

Originally posted by BadgerSmaker

A lot of the things people state that they miss are still in SWG today, crafting, player cities etc.

Popular systems like the 32 Profession/250 skill point system is gone, in its place is 9 Profession/45 point Expertise and buff stacking to further customise your character.

SWG still provides a sandbox environment for those that don't want the more mainstream route of questing/levelling etc, the storyteller system is also pretty good for allowing players to make their own content.

All that said, if you are still angry at SoE after three years then I doubt there is much that can be done to change that.

For me being an Elder Armorsmith still in game. the new system AFTER all the upgrades they recently did is alright.   diffently not the same game  I enjoyed in the passed.  However the fact that a user can create an customize gear is what keeps me coming back to swg.  no other system has that.  Yes crafting is a hit and miss due to resources and what your out fitted as, but I like that much better then WoW's crafting system.

Combat Needs ALOT of work still.  I've played EQ and EQ2, I 've enjoyed both combat Systems (and both are from SOE) . take in SWG's combat system, and there needs alot of work.    As for PVP.  Who can forget the MASSIVE city attacks on imps or Rebels.  I remeber  the massive battles that would put wow city raids to shame.   I haven't seen a day like that since rustuss.  MO duel / faction battles.  Guild wars...

That was some of the good times of the old system.  what can I say of the new system?  Spy system (but needs work), Smugglers are actualy decent now. 

If I wanted a glow stick I'd play KOTOR.. a non mmo..  I want the Star wars universe. and frankly, I felt I was in that universe.  I felt I was apart of that.

I guess just wrong view.

I do give Kudos to all you Senitors and what you are doin. keep it up..

Originally posted by BadgerSmaker

Originally posted by Antarious

I don't even care what system may have been better.. or even to debate that.  Its just like I say... for profit in general means dicking people over to make MORE money.. not less.

 

When I play on medium/high population servers I see more people playing than I ever did in Pre-CU and CU, SWG is busy and growing.

I'm really not at all surprised that people are still angry at SoE for the NGE, I still bear a grudge against Electronic Arts for what they did with Ultima Online.  MMORPGs are more than just a game, people get really immersed in them and when a company trashes them the wounds go deep and take a long time to heal.

It saddens me when I see SWG players telling vets to "Get over it" etc.  We are all part of the SWG community, even if you haven't played in years.  SWG isn't something you forget lightly.

My response to the "get over it" NGE'rs is to "get over" any delusion that any of us are going to return at this point.  I gave SOE all the time and patience I had to somehow turn the NGE into "better than pre CU" when all we kept getting were token gestures at best, such as the half assed "auto aim/fire" change, the terrible expertise systems which are NO substitute for 32 professions, 250 SP's, have at it, etc.  I went to the summits, I participated in the discussions and all I got were forum bans.  Then my server (Bloodfin) started to empty and most of my guild (FOAD) disappeared.  It became my time to go as well.

I quit for the final time summer 2007 and I won't be back under any circumstances at this point.  I gave SOE most of a  year and a half (I was unsubbed through part of 2006 as well), that was more than reasonable.  I did everything I could to accept the game as it was, while of course not ever liking it as much as the original.

Given all that has happened since, with "kill Foozle" instances and "scavenger hunts" being the Devs (and current players) idea of content and not mine, plus the new addition of the TCG scam, I'm glad I didn't give them another year.  At this point not even classic servers, even the reinstatement of Bloodfin as it was the day before the First Cataclysm (ie: CU) with all my characters would bring me back, not when I'm going to get something like that anyway with or wthout SOE.

BTW, Badger, I did run around some during the latest "PLEASE COME BACK" vet trial.  If you think that Bloodfin has a population today that is even 1/4th what it was Pre-CU, you need to have your head examined.  Seriously.  You see, I played on that server back then.  You didn't.  And I know they weren't all off to "kill Foozle" all the time, even those restrict you to once a day...

Even the "merges" that are about to happen won't bring back high population servers for very long, it's just putting some more sand into the top of the hourglass , people are still leaving, the sand will run back down to where it was before the free transfers within a few months at most.

The fact that SOE chooses to continue to place it's hope on marketing exclusively to people that they've defrauded, lied to, cheated, stolen from, and generally pissed on for potential new subscribers instead of to new potential victims also shows that at all levels, management remains clueless and doless.

Originally posted by BadgerSmaker

Originally posted by Antarious

I don't even care what system may have been better.. or even to debate that.  Its just like I say... for profit in general means dicking people over to make MORE money.. not less.

 

When I play on medium/high population servers I see more people playing than I ever did in Pre-CU and CU, SWG is busy and growing.

I'm really not at all surprised that people are still angry at SoE for the NGE, I still bear a grudge against Electronic Arts for what they did with Ultima Online.  MMORPGs are more than just a game, people get really immersed in them and when a company trashes them the wounds go deep and take a long time to heal.

It saddens me when I see SWG players telling vets to "Get over it" etc.  We are all part of the SWG community, even if you haven't played in years.  SWG isn't something you forget lightly.

So, there are 400k playing SWG then?

WRONG, INSERT COIN.

Originally posted by BadgerSmaker

Originally posted by Antaran

Originally posted by Thunderous

Originally posted by BadgerSmaker

A lot of the things people state that they miss are still in SWG today, crafting, player cities etc.

Popular systems like the 32 Profession/250 skill point system is gone, in its place is 9 Profession/45 point Expertise and buff stacking to further customise your character.

SWG still provides a sandbox environment for those that don't want the more mainstream route of questing/levelling etc, the storyteller system is also pretty good for allowing players to make their own content.

All that said, if you are still angry at SoE after three years then I doubt there is much that can be done to change that.

 The crafting is 1/10th what it was and is basically a grind

 

have you even tried the game?  crafting hasn't really changed that much ever, few minor tweaks here and there but it's still the same complex system it always was, it's only decay thats been removed and SOME loots better than crafted gear. i myself bought a crafted pistol for my smuggler the other day, 1150 DPS, 36 Acid, can whack out a hell of a lot of damage with that.

 

I get a bit confused when people state that crafting is significantly less enjoyable than it was in Pre-CU, as you say, little changed.  With the NGE, SoE did try to go for loot drop > all so that players didn't have to go in for any of that pesky player interdependancy in a bid to attract more "casual" players, but have since seen the error of their ways.

All high end weapons are now in either schematic or deconstructable form, that you can take to a crafter to be customised into uber pew-pew/stabby-stab.

Weaponsmith recently had a complete overhaul, it now works like armousmith in that you can use any weapon skin and just core it with uber stats.

Yeah I was releaved when I saw that implimentation.   It's what made me love SWG the most over other games was the crafting system.  I'm an adventurer style combatant  pvp if am in the mood or role play allows.  Crafting made me feel a part of things.  System still has a long way to go.  Yes they can come back with schems,  that was prefered method all along (I was thrilled when I got a BH schem in the past  gave me something other then comp to create).  Harvesting (as a combatant) I find a little awkward still. was better with the old setup.   the combining of the crafters to me has been something I don't enjoy.  I've yet to make a weapon ( or Sell for that matter).  The appearance tab (heard about that recently) has me cause to worry.  I'm not one of those money greedy buggers when it comes to selling ether, I always sold at a decent price and will continue to do so (with the exception of rares).

I don't like what they did with officer,  I enjoyed the old system ( and the fact one would get exp buff while in a group with them).  There was an update right before the NGE where the officers got some love, that was short lived due to NGE ( man I had fun with those comands).  pre NGE and post NGE smuggler was not the greatest ( fun to RP, but somewhat buggie), the smuggler revamp and the smuggler quests improved things (quests could be expanded. and the contraband stuff could be used in trader items.  I know there has been some talk of that in the trader forum.

Creature handler was ... not bad idea, I just don't plan on dropping expertise from ether character to have a cute rancor chasing me (if I get a third char slot, I'd do that with a jedi however)

I never did get into BH though I liked the idea of the terms, and the bh vs Jedi should always be kept  up.. as Jedi were to have been hunted. 

just my sane thoughts compared to the sillness of some of the posts I've seen in here.

Before the NGE they were called Squad Leaders.

Wow... 3 years... I could have sworn its been longer.

Originally posted by BadgerSmaker

Originally posted by Antarious

I don't even care what system may have been better.. or even to debate that.  Its just like I say... for profit in general means dicking people over to make MORE money.. not less.

 

When I play on medium/high population servers I see more people playing than I ever did in Pre-CU and CU, SWG is busy and growing.

I'm really not at all surprised that people are still angry at SoE for the NGE, I still bear a grudge against Electronic Arts for what they did with Ultima Online.  MMORPGs are more than just a game, people get really immersed in them and when a company trashes them the wounds go deep and take a long time to heal.

It saddens me when I see SWG players telling vets to "Get over it" etc.  We are all part of the SWG community, even if you haven't played in years.  SWG isn't something you forget lightly.

If there are more people playing this game now than there was during pre_CU then why are there so many people asking for server merges on the OBoard? The game is not growing, it is stagnant.

Originally posted by BadgerSmaker

 When I play on medium/high population servers I see more people playing than I ever did in Pre-CU and CU, SWG is busy and growing.

Just to clarify are you claiming that there are more people then pre-CU, or just that you see more then you did pre-CU?

Because that claim can be totally misconstrued by some, and be very misleading.

Originally posted by Suvroc

Originally posted by BadgerSmaker

 When I play on medium/high population servers I see more people playing than I ever did in Pre-CU and CU, SWG is busy and growing.

 

Just to clarify are you claiming that there are more people then pre-CU, or just that you see more then you did pre-CU?

Because that claim can be totally misconstrued by some, and be very misleading.

It's relative to the server that you played on. Like it or not, there seems to be a new influx of people playing. Not huge numbers, but it seems that there is some growth.

Originally posted by Suvroc

Originally posted by BadgerSmaker

 When I play on medium/high population servers I see more people playing than I ever did in Pre-CU and CU, SWG is busy and growing.

 

Just to clarify are you claiming that there are more people then pre-CU, or just that you see more then you did pre-CU?

Because that claim can be totally misconstrued by some, and be very misleading.

either way it is a falacy.  My gawd Badger are you sure you are not related to Obraik or sipping from his drink?

Originally posted by Koolaider

Originally posted by Suvroc

Originally posted by BadgerSmaker

 When I play on medium/high population servers I see more people playing than I ever did in Pre-CU and CU, SWG is busy and growing.

 

Just to clarify are you claiming that there are more people then pre-CU, or just that you see more then you did pre-CU?

Because that claim can be totally misconstrued by some, and be very misleading.

 

It's relative to the server that you played on. Like it or not, there seems to be a new influx of people playing. Not huge numbers, but it seems that there is some growth.

There will always be a slight rise and fall to server populations, but overall (from my personal observations) it's been declining quite steadily the last year. I fully expect that trend to continue, but on an ever decreasing slide. However it'll be a little more disguised when the server transfers begin.

yes, galaxies will limp on for a year or two until the new one comes out and then it will die off completely.  Used to be a good game until a few years ago.  Server merges will only allow them to move the old servers to be used by something else.  They won't bother to do much for galaxies because it is a money drain for them now.

Link : http://stargate.mgm.com/specialops/link.php?link=35&id=6769

Originally posted by Suvroc

Originally posted by BadgerSmaker

 When I play on medium/high population servers I see more people playing than I ever did in Pre-CU and CU, SWG is busy and growing.

 

Just to clarify are you claiming that there are more people then pre-CU, or just that you see more then you did pre-CU?

Because that claim can be totally misconstrued by some, and be very misleading.

can't say misleading, however there is a good chunk of people out there, least on the server I'm on.  more then After NGE and more then... post NGE upgrade. I wouldn't say my server is where it's at post Cu however.

Best thing about SWG at the moment I would say ( if all you trolls are still having a beef) would be the lack of lame players.   Still same old SWG  style community, all the annouying people went to WoW and other games.   I think that's what I enjoy most is Decent people to run around with.  I've ignored, and reported soo many people in WoW  (trade channel and generial chat was silenced more then once) that to me wow would have been better if it wasn't for the stupid players.  people help each other out in swg, there is rp,  there is player events, guild assitance.  No game is perfect.  

Honestly, that has to be a big reason for me coming back to swg, to get away from all the bird droppings for brains like I've seen.

My only comment, seeing another SOE game that IS well polished, is why did they not take the combat system from that group.. obviously two different development teams, however if I knew one group was having a problem, I shift gears and bring in another.  it's business.  Swg does need a good fix with good developers. They got a good start with fixing the " outter ring of things" to keep it going... now they need to fix inner ring.. like the game core and combat.  credit sinks, decay (and yes decay is needed no matter how much combat people whine).

For the knuckledraggers in these forums that like to think they can read, badger is correct, if you don't like the game, go somewhere else. let people who do enjoy.  and keep in mind as all these MMO states " game play may change"

Badger.. keep the fixes comin to those Devs.. seem they actually awake and doing what they are suppose to do now. keep on them.  I love the fact there is communication now.

and to that one poster, you are correct, it was squadleader, what was once thought of the most broken proff in the game pre- NGE  and pre -cu., Boy did I have fun as a Squadleader/carbineer.  was doing leeroy jenkins tactics before that newb made 10th level (jedi's make great bait).

 ill never buy anything sony for the rest of my life.

Originally posted by Wallid

For the knuckledraggers in these forums that like to think they can read, badger is correct, if you don't like the game, go somewhere else. let people who do enjoy.  and keep in mind as all these MMO states " game play may change"

We have gone somewhere else. Remember that the next time you log on to an empty server.

Originally posted by Abrahmm

And I'm still pissed off about it.

The most frustrating part is not being able to find a game that has anywhere near what SWG used to offer.

I think the fact that it has been so long and so many of us are still mad shows a lot for how special this game was to it's players.

How you guys feeling?

I can't agree with you at all I don't trust SOE due to the debacle and they have certainly made it a harder sell to purchase the other products they deliver but I have been over this nge thing for a very long time. It's like the kid who takes his ball home in the middle of the game it might be wrong but it is there ball after all I have moved on to bigger and better things and am glad for it

Originally posted by pdxgeek

Originally posted by Wallid

For the knuckledraggers in these forums that like to think they can read, badger is correct, if you don't like the game, go somewhere else. let people who do enjoy.  and keep in mind as all these MMO states " game play may change"

We have gone somewhere else. Remember that the next time you log on to an empty server.

QFE

That's why they are abandoning half of them in the next month or so.

So that the other half are less than empty more or less.