I don't think there is any stealth skill, but I thought that shadows were dark enough that at night your character would not be visible. ( assuming you would not be wearing reflective armor )

Originally posted by Loke666

Originally posted by mcpoopypantz

Originally posted by Murdus

Originally posted by safwd

Originally posted by altairzq

That was years ago, when people where were decent. Now people is garbage in the 50% of cases, which is more than enough to ruin any gaming experience.

That is a fair point.

Back in UO and  AC days there was a different bunch of gamers in MMOs. The crowd was mostly older people who grew up with D&D and Muds. Sure there were asshats but most people were fairly respectfull.

Now you are going to have the PVP crowd that grew up with Halo. I think it could be a bit different world then what you all remember from UO, AC and Shadowbane.

I am 17 years old, was too young when UO/AC was still around.

Honestly, I am very jealous of you guys... My first MMO was WoW and I joined a guild and literally felt like I was surrounded by a bunch of idiot a-holes. I really wish I could have experienced real MMO play during the UO AC days, but I guess that will never come back, and most of those players aren't around anymore, and if they are, they are much more rare than the others.

Gaming has evolved greatly nowadays, but the communities of a few games have gotten more and more shallow, save a few great ones (DDO, for example). But I truly am jealous, and would give away all these bland new MMOs to play the oldies the way they once were.

The crap today.. WoW, War, Aoc.. NONE of it even holds a candle to the golden says of UO

 

I think Safwd and Murdus got a point, I think the gamers have changed more than the games. You could make a remake of UO and Everquest with exactly the same features but modern graphics but it still wouldn't be the same thing.

In the old days RPG gamers usually played pen and paper games too, and that affected both how they saw the games and the community as whole. Today few people does that and now that.

I never played UO or EQ, just Meridian 59 and Linage but still, the gaming crowd are different today, both on good and bad terms. However today full PvP games tend to attract certain crowds, while other players go to other kind of games. In UO time everybody played UO because there were nothing else to play. The RP players, the PvPers, the builders, the explorers... All together. I don't think we will see that again.

I am deffinatly not saying that young people cannot play or play bad however, I do play with people of all ages and some of the really good players are almost noobs but the moron % is sure up in MMOs nowadays.

Anyways my point is that you're not gonna get your UO back because it is you and the other players that have changed. Even the earliest MMO players are not really the same as they were once. Everything changes.

Exactly.
Im not saying that age= game maturity. I played with a number of people in EQ that were in their teens and were excellent respectfull players, and many who were much older then their teens that were complete asses.
But the crowd was small back then, now the crowd is HUGE. WoW brought in a whole new group of players, the FPS crowd. Im not saying that everyone who came in with that crowd is an asshat but that crowd coming in grew the genre probably 400% or more. Its alot easier to find the asshats now.
 

I guess if Darkfall gets released and contain what it says it will you will see a lot of so called Hardcore MMO players trying it, I doubt you will see carebears and casual players trying it. Full player loot is one of those things that companies stopped having of simple reasons. if you want to grab the masses you don't want to have anything that can "spoil" the fun. If you look at MMO players today they all want progress, they want their character to progress and become more powerful, majority of these do not want to loose their gear.

Look at AoC when they talked about introducing player loot with the consequence system, suddenly you had a few of the self proclaimed hardcore pvpers there going spastic about loosing gear they had earned. You had the casual players saying it would be a bad idea for people to loose the stuff they ahve earned, even tho most of it would be easy to replace.

I support the idea of a game where your own skills is the driving force, where pvp does matter where it has real consequences. Dying means you loose gear or xp it's all fine. Then iut brings a whole new element into gameplay. But the majority do not agree with me on this, they would hate if they lost a item they had looked for and finally got it. Darkfall will probably be a small but nice game if they can get everything the have said to work. The masses of MMO players will probably not be interested simply because they don't really like the fact they can loose their gear. After WoW people have been obsessed with their gear, Gear is suddenly now the main force behind progressing your character for many. Sad but true...

The hardcore pvpers that have missed a game like ultima will probably love darkfall as long as it delivers, but they will be a minority of the MMO player base.

Originally posted by altairzq

That was years ago, when people where were decent. Now people is garbage in the 50% of cases, which is more than enough to ruin any gaming experience.

This is not in any way a blanket generalization.  Its not overly stereotypical nonsense. Really, honest its not!

Originally posted by Ekibiogami

Yes the game had little towns. and moderiate citys. Eve has a Huge Fing Core of space that i can safly wander around in. I could go from tradeing hub to Tradeing hub w/o getting ganked (As long as i wasent stupid). UO Did not have that. The odd thief in town was anoying but i could deal with it. Not being able to walk out side the town Border was BS tho.
 

My Respect for the game just went up.

Erm, UO had recallrunes you could mark where you wanted in the world. You could travel  to every city or dungeon in seconds. If you wanted the best loot or money you had to travel to the pk hotspots like Destard or lichelords in Deciet. And that was what we like..risk vs. reward.  Even in a small world like UO you had to be a newbie if you didn`t manage to get money for the normal gear.

The start of UO and I would guess DF will be harsh, atleast in the first month. But in a large world like DF, I can`t understand why you wont find a desolate place to grind if you want too. So I guess it will be ok for anybody to play DF after the mayhem in the start have settled.

If DF deliver what it has promised and gear is no longer is an issue, think about the endgame you`ll have in this game

Originally posted by kaydinv

Originally posted by Ekibiogami

Did we play the same UO?

I played at launch, Was addicted then the Uncontrolled ganking started. No care, No Safe areas, No reason to play the game at all. If you wanted to play as a fisher man/ map maker(Me) you were completly screwed. Only way i might play this game if I hear there is no fing stealth. If there is then this is a gank fest and thats the end of the topic. will it die? no UO is 11? years old now...Nudderd and butcherd, But its still there.

Eve has the best pvp system of any game ive seen. You can be ganked anywhere by anyone. But in High sec. atleast there is Concord to gank them back. and there is More than Enough High sec. to keep me happy.

 

Nothing you said made any sense. You make it sound like UO didn't have safe zones by pointing out that it's one of the great things about EVE when, in fact, UO did have safe zones (towns). You could even fish in town, so maybe the reason you didn't enjoy the game is because you didn't even realize there were ways to work around your problems.

By the way, Darkfall supposedly does not have stealth/hiding.

In the beginning it didnt' have safe zones you could be killed right inside the city.  The addition of the God like Teleporting Guards was the response to that.    UO once the ganking started was the worse game ever.   It was probably safer to walk around in a real medievil period than it was in UO and thats sad.  Hell walking the streets in the ghetto is safer.

You couldn't adventure, you couldn't mine, you couldn't fish, you couldn't do anything other than pray the far off place you were hoping to reach didn't have stealth pkers waiting.    They implimented systems to help balance it but the 'tagging' system failed ultimately because a real PK didn't care he had friends or alts for his activities that needed to be done in the city.

Then Origins made the worse mistake ever they created shards for each server that you could walk between.   Bad people got stuck in Felucia until they could figure out how to realign themselves and good people oculd travel back n forth.  They split the player base and destroyed the 'eco system' of the game.  Granted at the time no other game had ever gone through this problem before but still it sucked. 

Atleast dev's are somewhat learning from their mistakes.   Perma-Stealth & FFA PVP games do not mix.

Time will tell.

I say the demographic of online gaming is completely different from the time of UO.  Online gaming was something mostly adults did back then and it still had it's fair share of assholes.  Fast forward to today where I would guess more younger people play then adults and let's be real the mental age of adults online is pretty terrible.  That to me is a receipt for disaster.

But again time will tell.  I have always been skeptical of DF and to be quite honest it's fanbois are more annoying then most.  But I will wait and see how it goes after it is released to the public.

I like the concept of DF but concept doesn't mean shit it the execution sucks.  AoC can attest to that.

I think DF will be a good game, and I think people are going to be surprised by the number of honorable people that play the game.

In UO, and EQ early on, reputation meant something. I think that in DF it will again. That's not all good with no bad, but it is mostly good. Players that ninja will get a bad rep and good guilds will reject members that don't represent them well.

Originally posted by Ekibiogami

Did we play the same UO?

I played at launch, Was addicted then the Uncontrolled ganking started. No care, No Safe areas, No reason to play the game at all. If you wanted to play as a fisher man/ map maker(Me) you were completly screwed. Only way i might play this game if I hear there is no fing stealth. If there is then this is a gank fest and thats the end of the topic. will it die? no UO is 11? years old now...Nudderd and butcherd, But its still there.

Eve has the best pvp system of any game ive seen. You can be ganked anywhere by anyone. But in High sec. atleast there is Concord to gank them back. and there is More than Enough High sec. to keep me happy.

Not sure what server you played on but I played on GL and was in a guild of about 100-150 ppl and we where a Non PK guild and had a real blast then when some of the Big PK guilds started to pop up we turned in to a kind of PK hunter guild. We had lots of friends in other guilds and we all used ICQ and when the PKs poped up they would shoot us a IM and we would group up and go in and clear them out and Damn it was fun.

Now as far as a Fishing SOS and Treasure mapper you do alot of that solo but I did tons and never had a problem you just have to remember to look over your shoulder.

We can only hope like hell this game can bring that great feeling back.

Originally posted by banthis
 

In the beginning it didnt' have safe zones you could be killed right inside the city.  The addition of the God like Teleporting Guards was the response to that.    UO once the ganking started was the worse game ever.   It was probably safer to walk around in a real medievil period than it was in UO and thats sad.  Hell walking the streets in the ghetto is safer.

You couldn't adventure, you couldn't mine, you couldn't fish, you couldn't do anything other than pray the far off place you were hoping to reach didn't have stealth pkers waiting.    They implimented systems to help balance it but the 'tagging' system failed ultimately because a real PK didn't care he had friends or alts for his activities that needed to be done in the city.

Then Origins made the worse mistake ever they created shards for each server that you could walk between.   Bad people got stuck in Felucia until they could figure out how to realign themselves and good people oculd travel back n forth.  They split the player base and destroyed the 'eco system' of the game.  Granted at the time no other game had ever gone through this problem before but still it sucked. 

Atleast dev's are somewhat learning from their mistakes.   Perma-Stealth & FFA PVP games do not mix.

Oh stop being so dramatic.  It's obvious UO and (probably) DF aren't for you.  I played UO for a good many years starting on release and I was a newbie for a good portion of those.  I did everything, from mine, fish, kill mobs, etc.  I had the time of my fuggin life.  I never had an adrenaline rush in a video game quite like being chased through the woods by a red with your pack full of resources or money from killing mobs.  Everything in pre UO:R was so perfect, i could just about cry thinking about the memories I had.

Originally posted by karat76

 I have to agree. For the first week or so of my time in UO it was a blast and the gank fest began. Nothing like being killed by a guy dyed pink named The gay golfer. Didn't even take my loot just since I was naked and mining just tossed my ore around. I imagine now it will be only worse.

This made me LOL.

Originally posted by Crashloop

I guess if Darkfall gets released and contain what it says it will you will see a lot of so called Hardcore MMO players trying it, I doubt you will see carebears and casual players trying it. 

I disagree, there are PLENTY of things pve'rs can experience here that are like no other game. There's incredible mob AI, when you kill a population of mobs, they don't just "spawn" back, that area will remain dormant until a nomad mob population settles there, and there's always a risk of getting pked and thus excitement in pve that is absent in all other mmos (if you find ways to avoid pve, if you suck (and can't kill goblins)then yeah, this game will suck for you). When you kill a rare mob in DF (like a dragon) it stays dead forever (though similar mobs will probably be caught being "nomads" looking for a lair, that exact mob will never come back.)

Also there are MANY features that favor casuals, such as the fact a noob can stand up to someone who devotes his life to the game, and the fact a battle is not only decided by gear as casuals can now use their 1337 CS skills to make up for their small playtime.

issed a game like ultima will probably love darkfall as long as it delivers, but they will be a minority of the MMO player base.

Darkfall is a game that appeals to the original UO fans in a new generation, we have no idea what its market is until it releases.

At OP, you don't understand what a carebare is, they are NOT welcome, none of the posters understand what carebears can DO.

Carebears ARE NOT pve'rs, people who don't like pvp, and crafters, no one cares if these people come to a game. Carebears are the people i listed previously who want to change the game to their fitting, and WHINE about it to the devs. In a game where pvp is what the economy centers around, what diplomacy and MANY game features will be focused on: turning pvp carebear b/c of the whines of carebears will RUIN THE GAME for everyone but them!

Carebears are NOT welcome in pvp centered games, saying they are is completely retarded. I doubt the devs will listen to carebears though, because they said "they don't want to fall for the same mistakes UO fell for." They loved pre-trammel UO and know the danger of carebears. All this is assuming that the game is even worth playing and is a success, of course, if its a disaster, pvpers could care less if they carebear the game b/c they won't be playing it...

Originally posted by asdar

People think this game is going to be all ganking and immature trash talk and I want to stand up for what I think is the majority of Darkfall players.

I played UO, and what was special about UO was the community that was created in response to FFA, and the intensity inherent in a wide open game.

Games today are simple, you go attack and kill easy and boring mobs over and over again. One or two games have PvP, but usually very controlled and with safe zones and looting rules. They have crafting, but it almost never means anything. You might make some money, but it's not necessary to the game and there's no such thing as reputation. I hear boring on every message board, for every game I look at, and I look at a lot.

In UO, and hopefully Darkfall, crafting is essential. You're going to lose your equipment and need replacement gear. That gear will come from crafters, and you'll want to establish a relationship with a crafter you trust. That right there is what's missing from every other game for crafting. Bam, crafting is important and the economy is thriving in one rule.

Because the world is dangerous you'll learn to look around, travel in groups, plan things out more carefully giving the game the sense of danger that's totally lacking in every game now. Guilds will be more than just chat rooms, people will band together for safety and to get an advantage and guilds will come to your rescue or to enact revenge and so guilds will be close knit again.

There will be a place for gankers, and right alongside that place will be a place for people that only gank gankers. This gives you a chance to be a hero, and to make a difference. Reputation will mean something again and gankers will be rejected from respectable guilds.

Before you jumpe on the carebear or ganker bandwagon give Darkfall a chance as a good and exciting game where you can play a more exciting, more meaningful existence. Look to Eve as a guide to what will happen, given enough of a player base, except that the action will be on the ground, which is more to my taste and hopefully yours.

A very good post OP. Alhough I never played UO this is pretty much how I feel about the game. Its so refreshing to see an mmo coming out that allows the players to actually roleplay with their actions rather than just having to resort to typing irrelavant nonsense in the chat channel.

I resubbed to WoW recently due to the fact that all mmos are shit and its unfortunately the best of the bunch. I went on a RP server and came across a group of players "roleplaying"......or should I say "typing stories to each other". I have to say that it was quite possibly one of the most pitiful things I have seen in an mmo. They were actually pretending that an evil army was invading the village they were in. One of them would type stuff like "An army of frostwyrms appear in the sky and start breathing ice balls onto the village" and "Groups of undead are attacking from the trees to the south" (even though obviously they werent) and in response other players would type "Quick! Take cover! Fight off the invaders! Form ranks!". They would actually group up and get into formations and type out what they were doing!

THIS is what people call roleplaying in mmos and it really is the saddest waste of time I have ever seen. Oh its harmless and dont get me wrong people are entitled to waste their time however they choose but to actually pay a monthly fee to log into a game that doesnt cater to what you want and then "pretend" that it does is just the surest sign of epic sadness.

Thankfully in Darkfall people wont have to pretend to roleplay like a bunch of utter losers. They will actually be able to roleplay with their actions for real in the game world which is quite a rare thing in todays story driven PvE crapfest mmos.

Originally posted by rageagainst

Originally posted by Crashloop

I guess if Darkfall gets released and contain what it says it will you will see a lot of so called Hardcore MMO players trying it, I doubt you will see carebears and casual players trying it. 

I disagree, there are PLENTY of things pve'rs can experience here that are like no other game. There's incredible mob AI, when you kill a population of mobs, they don't just "spawn" back, that area will remain dormant until a nomad mob population settles there, and there's always a risk of getting pked and thus excitement in pve that is absent in all other mmos (if you find ways to avoid pve, if you suck (and can't kill goblins)then yeah, this game will suck for you). When you kill a rare mob in DF (like a dragon) it stays dead forever (though similar mobs will probably be caught being "nomads" looking for a lair, that exact mob will never come back.)

Also there are MANY features that favor casuals, such as the fact a noob can stand up to someone who devotes his life to the game, and the fact a battle is not only decided by gear as casuals can now use their 1337 CS skills to make up for their small playtime.

issed a game like ultima will probably love darkfall as long as it delivers, but they will be a minority of the MMO player base.

Darkfall is a game that appeals to the original UO fans in a new generation, we have no idea what its market is until it releases.

At OP, you don't understand what a carebare is, they are NOT welcome, none of the posters understand what carebears can DO.

Carebears ARE NOT pve'rs, people who don't like pvp, and crafters, no one cares if these people come to a game. Carebears are the people i listed previously who want to change the game to their fitting, and WHINE about it to the devs. In a game where pvp is what the economy centers around, what diplomacy and MANY game features will be focused on: turning pvp carebear b/c of the whines of carebears will RUIN THE GAME for everyone but them!

Carebears are NOT welcome in pvp centered games, saying they are is completely retarded. I doubt the devs will listen to carebears though, because they said "they don't want to fall for the same mistakes UO fell for." They loved pre-trammel UO and know the danger of carebears. All this is assuming that the game is even worth playing and is a success, of course, if its a disaster, pvpers could care less if they carebear the game b/c they won't be playing it...

Yeah Its really anoying when the Minority in a target game are messing it up for the pvpers aint it. Next mmo thats pve plz Stfu.
 

Ffa pvp in a game (+full loot) will lead to ultimate disaster (thats what UO was named for) thats what it is to me  .. while in our reallife there just a few psychopaths very few ..or mass murders ..unfortunatly in every pvp game there are a ton of thoose ... the only penalty hard enough to stop ppls playing psycho in RL is our ethics and the LAW we got we do have that in RL .. but in a computer game no rule or penalty comes to my mind to stop such players .If ppls like to test how it is to be psycho or a murderer they do it, and there aint any rules to prevent ppls from overdoing things in a game ..second account ? new account ... just test a pvper on another server even if you only have 1 char per server ..mass murdering i come or a bunch of newbie pvper come kill your super skilled char ( you think is god) ..you loose your gear .. you go ld and loose your gear you get killed when your low on health and loose your gear .. sadly there no options to prevent loosing your gear ..and if its full loot and you have hard earned good gear it kinda sucks to loose it ..so why even bother .. (i actually would like to have some meaning to my magic sword of firestorm) and not to loose it on the first breeze of enemy.

since noone is able to not die in a ffa pvp all will die sometimes because of some circumstances in or outside game reasons  .. so actually you have to life with no gear ..or just some mundane shit to equip ..since the really awesome gear will be gone soon anyway ..what a waste . unless you always walk with the most giant sized army of friends on the server you kinda have no chance ...to keep what you got ..thats something bothering me ...

dead comes swift in games ..but you always continue coming back to life ..so actually you cant call it diyng its more like a penalty for not being able to do what you tought you could ...do ..but why should that penalty be like a real dead does it make sense ..for a game ...for some it might for me it doesnt.

the only real dead in a game is when you stop playing the game then your gone ...

the economy part with gear sounds nice but its just gear changing ppls hands anyway as long as it isnt destroyed by diyng it doesnt make a difference ..i want some other way for a economy in a game and i kinda dislike gear that cannot be reapaired to full or even decaying gear . I never heard of Excalibur decaying. To name a item most might know. Why should my magic xy of whatever be gone after 20 hours of fighting something.

btw i will try darfkfall its the only interesting sounding game to me atm but i dont think it will holde me for long if there arent different rule set servers ..for each theyre own.

btw im a Carecat not a bear (see picture not gender) ..

Originally posted by Kabon

Ffa pvp in a game (+full loot) will lead to ultimate disaster (thats what UO was named for) thats what it is to me  .. while in our reallife there just a few psychopaths very few ..or mass murders ..unfortunatly in every pvp game there are a ton of thoose ... the only penalty hard enough to stop ppls playing psycho in RL is our ethics and the LAW we got we do have that in RL .. but in a computer game no rule or penalty comes to my mind to stop such players .If ppls like to test how it is to be psycho or a murderer they do it, and there aint any rules to prevent ppls from overdoing things in a game ..second account ? new account ... just test a pvper on another server even if you only have 1 char per server ..mass murdering i come or a bunch of newbie pvper come kill your super skilled char ( you think is god) ..you loose your gear .. you go ld and loose your gear you get killed when your low on health and loose your gear .. sadly there no options to prevent loosing your gear ..and if its full loot and you have hard earned good gear it kinda sucks to loose it ..so why even bother .. (i actually would like to have some meaning to my magic sword of firestorm) and not to loose it on the first breeze of enemy.

since noone is able to not die in a ffa pvp all will die sometimes because of some circumstances in or outside game reasons  .. so actually you have to life with no gear ..or just some mundane shit to equip ..since the really awesome gear will be gone soon anyway ..what a waste . unless you always walk with the most giant sized army of friends on the server you kinda have no chance ...to keep what you got ..thats something bothering me ...

 

dead comes swift in games ..but you always continue coming back to life ..so actually you cant call it diyng its more like a penalty for not being able to do what you tought you could ...do ..but why should that penalty be like a real dead does it make sense ..for a game ...for some it might for me it doesnt.

 

the only real dead in a game is when you stop playing the game then your gone ...

 

btw i will try darfkfall its the only interesting sounding game to me atm but i dont think it will holde me for long if there arent different rule set servers ..for each theyre own.

btw im a Carecat not a bear (see picture not gender) ..

FFA PvP + full loot will only be an ultimate disaster for YOU if you dont like having a death penalty and the only way for you to view progress in a game is based on what gear you have picked up. For other more open minded people who have not had their imagination stunted by the latest mmos, they will probably find Darkfall to be a very refreshing change......thats assuming its a well made game of course.

Why would you be bothered about losing an item anyway? Its only a game. Besides you can go on a quest to try and get it back if its really that important.

I don't know, I think this game won't be full of gankers.  I mean if there are gaurds and there aren't any levels, then i would assume there is a much more even playing field.  I usually don't like PvP in mmo's because the PvP is just click and let your character attack.  I think i will play this game because i love FPS and this is as close to a fps fantasy mmorpg that you can get... sounds like a win to me.  If the game turns out to be unplayable because of the gankers i just wont play and its only $50 dollars.  The only thing i am really worried about is the player built cities that can be destroyed.  You can't be online to protect the city all the time.

Edit: Btw I don't know a lot about the game so just be gentle if i am wrong about anything i said.

 Perhaps you missed my original thread. Carebears are more than welcome. Their game ruining, game changing mentality is not.

Originally posted by Jessonater

 Perhaps you missed my original thread. Carebears are more than welcome. Their game ruining, game changing mentality is not.

Carebears are NOT welcome in this game. All you want is Lunch meat to play with.

POTBS and others are full of greiffers that only want to gank and Skatter. they have no care for the game just their halo fix. and the fact that they just pissed on someone else is Iceing on the cake.

Honestly why claim 10k on one server? are they planing on one after launch? thats the most i can see playing this thing. are they going for the next Eve? One shard? or what?

Originally posted by Jessonater

 Perhaps you missed my original thread. Carebears are more than welcome. Their game ruining, game changing mentality is not.

you don't understand the definition of carebears, carebears are non pvpers (crafters, pve'ers, explorers, and roleplayers) that WHINE TO THE DEVS about changing a game to SUIT THEM. This would KILL a game that's BASED ON pvp for EVERYONE except carebears.

If they didn't have a game ruining, game changing mentality, they wouldn't be carebears, they would be pvers, roleplayers, etc. Get your definitions straight son, the OP is wrong period.