23 pages,

 And still going, nothing out last's the Darkfall thread!

Originally posted by terafis

Tasos and the Adventurine are serious about releasing an MMO for all those gamers who have been left out in the cold over the past 8 or more years, with a full loot, ffa pvp,skill based, sandbox, modern graphics MMO.

 

There are literally tens of thousands of people who are waiting for a game of this type to be released. And more, much much more people introduced to the MMO genre through WoW will come across once it is released, because it is a game based around PVP WITH CONSEQUENCE.

No more hand holding carebear hugs and kisses, no more whack-a-mole combat, no more level grinding, no more stupid 'kill  10 bats' CRAP.

And they DON'T F****ING CARE if you don't like full loot pvp sandbox, they don't want to hear your snivelling whining about 10 hour raids to gain a shiney, they don't want to listen about your needs for 'teh lvl grind'. If you don't like those concepts, or for some reason think the game is all smoke and mirrors, then GTFO of the house, you whining, weak-willed worm.

Originally posted by ganbee

23 pages,

 And still going, nothing out last's the Darkfall thread!

Yea man love it or hate it....but there is no denying that this game is on the radar of a lot of MMO gamers one way or another. I doubt anyone is stubborn enough to not play the game if it releases and is amazing if they were bashing it all along. 

I wish i could necro that "Petition to remove Darkfall from MMORPG.com" thread.  Oh common sense...im glad I have it.

I would guess,

30+ pages tonight alone!  We need some marketing!=)

You think mmorpg.com would be willing to travel to Greece for an interview? Come on they don't do anything more then a web interview for free.

Well they got an interview,

Somewhat, we will see what happens! This game is so secret, that there either holding a Golden ticket or they will burn in flames!

 Thanks MMORPG.com, wonderful interview.  It is straight-forward, cutting, and is tailored to the majority of the community's concerns.  I loved the harsh questions.

What I was even happier to see was the reaction incited by Tasos' attitude.  I believe it was a deliberate move on Tasos' part; he knew the persona he projected would stir things up.  It's a ton of criticism, but, in the end, it's all buzz, and will just result in more people being familiar with the Darkfall name.

When the game comes out, people familiar with the controversy will be more liable to check the reviews (whenever those reviews appear /cough) and other information.

If the game turns out good enough, I bet the vast majority of people offended by Tasos' attitude (though still genuinely interested in the games prospects) will try the game anyways.  And anyone who is so offended by his tone as to be put off entirely from even trying the game, well... they wouldn't have fun in Darkfall anyways, no matter how good it turned out to be.

Would be nice if this guy would give us actual facts instead of extremely vague answers... hopefully we actually WILL get a release date in a "few" days like he said. I still cannot believe this game might actually come out at the end of this year. It would be awesome, but we will just have to wait and see.

Damn Stradden, I didn't think you could do it.

Right when I got to the part where you asked him how many players were in the beta, I was fully expecting another side-step tactic.  He started one, then actually gave some numbers...I'm stunned that he shot himself in the knee-cap with honesty.  Really, well done.

I'm actually feeling better after reading this article.  Yes, Taso sounded like an ass, but whatever.  Once again its their game, their PR specialist.  As long as beta's going to start soon, and launch is when it's "ready", I'll happy.

Thank you for getting him to open his mouth...Never thought I'd say that, but I did.

I really hope the game does well.

But after reading the interview, I really don't think he will get any of my money. 

What an a$$

Tasos Flambouras == Derek Smart.

Originally posted by NormireX

Ok so I think this might be my first actual post at MMORPG.com.  I've been here for a few years though.  But anyway didn't anyone else think this Tasos guy came off as a bit of an egotistical jerk?  I mean just the way in which he answered the questions it was if he was acting like he and his company are far superior than anyone else.  Sorry but to me he just came off as a bit of a prick.

I found him to sound confident in his product and annoyed at his critics egotistical might seep in there a bit as well but I think you have to have atleast a bit of an ego to really be good at what you do. I can't say I blame them for being annoyed at having to answer to foolish charges of vaporware when from what I know of lot's of mmos this game didn't take much longer than most I hear of and that's with vastly less resources than alot of these major companies like Funcon.

Originally posted by ParkCarsHere

Would be nice if this guy would give us actual facts instead of extremely vague answers... hopefully we actually WILL get a release date in a "few" days like he said. I still cannot believe this game might actually come out at the end of this year. It would be awesome, but we will just have to wait and see.

I must add though with less than a month to the new year I'm skeptical of a release thisyear but I'm not like alot of the trolls I would much rather see a company take there time and relase a very good game as opposed to what we've seen from the likes of Funcom or even Mythic who scrapped something like 5-9 percent of the game some weeks before launch which may be better than what Funcom did but still doesn't sit too well with me mmos in my opinion area great lesson in patience and I think as far as gaming goes I'm getting up there in the mastery of the art.

Originally posted by pb1285n

 Interesting

Not very informative but interesting none the less.

Agreed.

What are these new technologies? I've yet to read about them in one beta review.

Why can a small group come up with all this tech, but not a large group?

He says most MMOs are running the same development time as DarkFall, but then he says they are a smaller group so it will take longer. He just said it was the same time, though.

All buzz isn't goood buzz. Just ask Vanguard.

I think these would be valid questions. Of course, it it does release, and is the game he is vaguely saying it is by not saying anything, then its not a big concern.

I like Tasos for his committment to the game, as opposed to the marketing.  I agree with him 100% that a good game is good marketing, and most advertising budgets at this stage is just a waste.

Still, he did little to convince me that this game is on track.  He said "several hundred" beta testers are testing the game, but why can't he give us an actual number?  Why is it this game has been in beta now for over four years, "ready to be released today," and yet isn't released?  I have a hard time thinking that it's about quality control.  VCs and banks typically don't give small developers as much slack as this, especially these days.

I think Darkfall would be a welcome addition to the MMO scene.  Unfortunately, this interview seems to be pretty high in assertions, and very little proof in the forms of names, dates, or numbers.

Very nice and informative interview. Very straightforward questions and answers.

5 year of development, there you have it. 5 years. And they have achieved alot during these years. Good to see that we finally can leave the development time to rest. Its 5 years, not 7.

Reassuring to read that game is ready for launch. These 4 weeks of december 2008 will be the most exiting days of my MMORPG life.

Release to be announced any day was the best info of them all. But this i never worried about cause so far Tasos never told us a lie.

Some complaints about his tone in the answers, What do you expect after seeing a thread like the one with a title, remove Darkfall from MMORPG.com being able to grow like it did, wasnt it like 10 pages long before it finally ended? Trolls on this site have been allowed way to much space as i see it.

This is a good answer on the vaporware issue from Tasos - "We don't pay much attention to speculation but it's not the length of development that has led some to speculate...this has been going on since day one. I'd question the motives of those speculating all these years. We're almost talking about obsessive "trolling" either looking for a reaction, more information, or  trying to hurt our efforts."

I would go for "trying to hurt our efforts" as the right answer why people troll on Darkfall. And if thats the right answer, why try to hurt another MMORPG that might be the one that take us out of the poor quality games we seen release this year?

This answer from Tasos made me laugh so hard "All the "trolls" have achieved is to inadvertently help perpetuate the buzz for Darkfall." Think about this abit all you that feel you're a part of the troll community, what you really achieved is hyping this game. PR for Darkfall. 210.000 members at the Darkfall main forum as we speak. For this i sincerely thank you.

On PR Tasos answers just like he did all along, the game will speak for itself and they put their funds on developing which of course is the way to go for a smaller company. "We expect a great deal of word of mouth". And that is what counts. Make the game as good as possible and let it live on it's own strength. If the game is as outstanding as we all hope they wont need a huge PR market. Game will have all the subs they need and more.

200 people in beta sounds like the right numbers. Will also prevent leaks. Other companies should learn from Aventurine.

Originally posted by Borluc

It sounds like honesty.  I don't know how people can say he is being an ego maniac or too defensive when he is faced with questions like "so, people have called your game vaporware, how do you respond?".  Give me a break.  In fact, that is a very disrespectful question to ask if you want to conduct a serious interview.  The interview was hostile and asked very little about the game itself.   Despite that, Tasos was able to respond logically.  Don't know about most people, but I'd prefer that larger companies would also adopt the Darkfall method of monetary allotment.  Most of them spend too damn much on advertisement and damn near all of it turns out to be bull.

You want real vaporware?  Check out Warhammer online.  Age of Conan.  They promised many things and delivered someone completely different.  In light of that, I simply do not understand the criticisms many people are throwing out there atm. 

 

 

Because 200+ comments is ridiculous (and proof that this game doesn't need a massive marketing budget...), I'm going to stop reading the thread here and say that Borluc has it right.

Originally posted by Gerec

Originally posted by Borluc

It sounds like honesty.  I don't know how people can say he is being an ego maniac or too defensive when he is faced with questions like "so, people have called your game vaporware, how do you respond?".  Give me a break.  In fact, that is a very disrespectful question to ask if you want to conduct a serious interview.  The interview was hostile and asked very little about the game itself.   Despite that, Tasos was able to respond logically.  Don't know about most people, but I'd prefer that larger companies would also adopt the Darkfall method of monetary allotment.  Most of them spend too damn much on advertisement and damn near all of it turns out to be bull.

You want real vaporware?  Check out Warhammer online.  Age of Conan.  They promised many things and delivered someone completely different.  In light of that, I simply do not understand the criticisms many people are throwing out there atm. 

 

 

 

Because 200+ comments is ridiculous (and proof that this game doesn't need a massive marketing budget...), I'm going to stop reading the thread here and say that Borluc has it right.

I also agree with Borluc. It was hostile questions. Questions based on the unjustiful trolling that been going on over the years here at MMORPG.com. Its like saying we on MMORPG.com believe in the trolls and their aggressive trolling have been the most interesting part over the years. Lets only ask questions based on this.

Keep in mind with this statement that I am not at all against DF or with it at this point.. If it comes out and is wonderfull then great if it's awfull fine too. I'm just a little taken aback by some of the cockiness on the part of the Dev team.

I just don't understand how a self proclaimed "small company" can constantly boast how they're better than everyone else. If the game is going to break the mold and be amazingly awsome while having close to NO bugs at launch like so many things i've read are claiming then FANTASTIC but I honestly don't see it.

We've seen it with big "AAA" titles that don't properly stress test and when launched, the servers and game have a Siezure when met with all the different hardware/software configurations out there. Something tells me we're in fore a big let down and it worries me because everything about the game SOUNDS so good on paper.

I'm still reserving my judgment for when the game releases and i'm still looking forward to it but everytime I hear an interview or update it makes me think that this game can do 1 of 2 things... either revolutionize the way we think of MMO's or it's going to be HORRIBLE. Unfortunatly the company making it backed themselves into a world where there will be no medium ground. Either be GREAT or be a GREAT letdown.

Great, great interview!  One of the best I have ever read.  Your questions were to the point and I thought Tasos answered them with the grace of a ninja!

Rock on DF ;)

I always seem to kill topics....

Originally posted by Pyrostasis

Originally posted by downtoearth

Originally posted by Zorvan

Originally posted by downtoearth

Originally posted by Pyrostasis

Just wanted to throw my 2 cents in.

Is there a lot of hate towards DF? Yes.

Could Tasos's rather blatant arogance in the thread be due to the hate? Sure, probably is.

Then my question would be, Why has Adventurine, and Tasos cultured and fueled this hate?

Every thing they release is vague, extremely vague. They dodge questions that arent about gameplay, or NDA game features, but about development cycles. They dont do any main stream media previews, and when they finally hit a mainstream outlet, they come off as curt and rude.

Sure MMORPG.com asked some tough questions... but... its nothing that most of us that are labeled as "Haters" by the fanbois have been screaming about for years.

Most of us that are skeptical about DF, have been following the game since we played UO and AC1. We were at one point in time rather hopeful about the game (at least I know I was)... but you can only fake start beta so many times, pretend to be close to launch so many times. Eventually you get to the point that you want to see some hard evidence before you get your hopes up again.

Adventurine could turn around the DF negativity TOMORROW, by letting IGN, MMORPG, Gamespy, and a few others into beta, and giving them freedom to post what they think. Information would flood out, skeptics would have their doubts either shattered or confirmed, and DF would get some much needed publicity.

Adventurine however has chosen to treat DF like the roswel incident. We know somethings going on in that dessert, but we dont know if its aliens or a weather ballon.

IF darkfall is as close to release as Tasos claims, then there is no reason to NOT get the media behind them. Its free advertising.

However, assuming everything is as good as Tasos says (which we have no third party to verify that) the only thing that disturbs me is beta. Several hundred people is less than 1000. Most MMO servers now have 2000 - 10000 people on one server. With so few people there, they have no way of stress testing the servers or their network. Even if Darkfall is as badass as we are being led to believe, we are being setup for experiencing server side lag and conectivity issues that havent been seen since the first week of Ultima Online launch back in August of 1997.

actully this has been convered in journal but it wasnt full of details how but yea they found a way to do tis called npc/ai that cause just as much stress as real players. also you can packet spam the server.

but ir emeber taoss saying the server cant till the diffrence between a real player and the npc/bots/ai in game
  pretty good hint how they did it

Ah, yes. The amazing Darkfall AI which not only controls all those goblins but also beta test the game.
 

I still get a laugh from that one.

 

that isnt what tasos meant by a i helping them it really hard ot explain. let me put this in a way youll understand

bots/ai/npc cause same stress as real players. (server cant tell the diffrence from players or npcs) ai skilsl up jsut like a rela player it roams it does stuff  jsu tliek a real player would it builds yada yada yada. to what extent do they help who knows but the main one i bet is stress granted theys till need to let alto of people in to double check everything. but i have seen a fake npc logged into (cough swg pre cu emulator that was causign the same stress as a real person)

There we go, I can argue that.

See, bots and AI cant cause the same stress for multiple reasons.

#1 they were programed by the same people who programed the game.

#2 Computers are only as good as they were programed

#3 Players do things programers never intended them to do or try, that pretty much breaks 2 and 1

#4 Players use third party apps to try and break the game and cheat...AI doesnt do that.

#5 Most importantly, Players connect from outside the building, from different regions, states, etc. AI connects internally. Its not going to stress test the network infrastructure.

#6 Players use different pcs, millions and millions of different systems, AI doesnt test that.

 

Thats just a few rather simple issues I can come up with that AI cant solve.... and those issues alone could cause MASSIVE problems.

You are wrong and here is why:

You are combining two separate methods of testing and saying they can't test everything with one testing methodology.

Automated Server Stress - This is, supposedly, being done by "bots" or whatever to test the load on the server.

Professional QA Testers - These guys are testing the features and functionality of the game.

When you use both, you can test as much shit as any other developer does. Having thousands of testers rarely produces any feature/functionality issues. Having those thousands of testers generates stress on the server which leads to problems that have nothing to do with functionality. There is really no other reason to have that many people testing a game.

So no, you are wrong. With the idea of automated stress testing accompanied by professional testers, you will find all the same issues you would find using manual stress testing (actual users) accompanied by professional testers.

You are wrong.

Really all I got out of this is how much of an ass Tasos is. Throughout the whole interview he had an attitude. Ya well this...ya well that. And oh ya btw we can launch today but we don't want to...

Dream the fuck on...

Have fun digging yourself out of that whole of ignorance, Pyrostasis.

been in development since 2003?  Thats funny, the first time I heard about the game was in 2001 and it was slated for release in 2003.

talk about being on the defensive the entire interview.  I dont think this guy was being completely honest about its development cycle.