I am a refugee from WoW and I tend to play solo as a general rule. Yet I never have trouble finding groups for most anything (although instances can be a bit of a problem, grouping-wise).

I really REALLY like the way grouping works in LotRO. I only wish you could "tune" into the LFF channels of other regions, or that the game would add some kind of server-wide LFF channel perhaps.

Because I play numerous alts, no one character levels up very fast. Friends' lists are thus pretty useless to me. I may add a friend on occasion, but everyone -- EVERYONE -- levels up faster than I do, since I'm "simu-leveling" 4 to 6 classes/characters at once and having fun doing so, spending a few days at a time on any one of them.

The way grouping works in LotRO is (forgive the comparison) like a really good "one-night stand". If the chemistry is right, it can be very nice, and sometimes groups have good chemistry and get on a roll, working through a series of quests or else a variety of quests. "Hey, anybody need to do such and so?" someone will ask. And on it goes. The better groups can go on for some time like that, sometimes with people coming and going. I like the way that works. If the chemistry isn't there, though, or too many people drop out at once, people will just go their separate ways. I'm cool with that. I'm really not looking for "long-term relationships" in LotRO. (I'll do that in real life, thanks all the same.)

If I'm feeling "solitary", off I go on my own. There is plenty to do, always.

I think if you are looking for a more warm and fuzzy social kind of interaction, the right kinship is the way to go. For myself, I really REALLY dislike being in a kinship. It's too much social for my taste. And I usually feel obligated to pay attention to the never-ceasing kinship chat. Kinships also add a certain amount of pressure to go do this or that or go help this person or that. No, thanks.

That said, for my tastes, LotRO hits the social thing just right.

I read so many posts here talking about bad PUG experiences. Wow. Are we playing the same game? My PUG experiences are 95 to 98% positive. And that's the only kind of grouping I ever do.

As for Moria, I cannot speak to that, as my highest toon is a 40 champ. But I am having a blast in this game and think the grouping "ethos" in LotRO is just about right as it is. My only complaint is not in the groups themselves, but, as I mentioned above, in the limitations of the LFF system as it now stands. It's OK, but it could sure be a lot better.

---

Well everyone seems to agree that WoW is the cause of this, so maybe it's redundant for me to say that the same thing is happening in WoW?

---

I don't think its just Wow. The recent games released helped this problem along as well. WAR is extremely easy to solo and is plastered with big RED signs telling soloists, go here.. go there. AoC is a solo fest. Tabula Rasa wasn't group heavy. So it stands to reason that because its a WESTERN style game, its gonna be easier than say, a game from the Asian realm.

Western games play to the ideal that YOU are the star. All content is geared to make it so you get to the max level alone if you like. The mobs you usually find have very little HPs on them and characters usually have way too many skills at lower levels. This is not the gamer's fault. Western developers make games this way, so people find it easy to solo, only grouping when its major content.

If you took 6 people and then told them to go level in LOTRO, what would they be doing? You don't think they would be doing the regular quests, do you? 6 people on a mob even 4 levels over them is WAY overkill in LOTRO. Heck, I can solo a mob 4-5 levels higher without much difficulty, and they die fast. Under a minute and a half, I think we all know this. To LFG for this is kinda dumb.

So its not players are opposed to team play. There's just no real call for it in the game. While I like it and will play it till at least AION comes out, you guys have to admit LOTRO is extremely easy. This isn't EVE or FFXI or something where you depend on help to advance. You can blow on the mobs and just about make them die.

Originally posted by tmr819

I am a refugee from WoW and I tend to play solo as a general rule. Yet I never have trouble finding groups for most anything (although instances can be a bit of a problem, grouping-wise).

I really REALLY like the way grouping works in LotRO. I only wish you could "tune" into the LFF channels of other regions, or that the game would add some kind of server-wide LFF channel perhaps.

Because I play numerous alts, no one character levels up very fast. Friends' lists are thus pretty useless to me. I may add a friend on occasion, but everyone -- EVERYONE -- levels up faster than I do, since I'm "simu-leveling" 4 to 6 classes/characters at once and having fun doing so, spending a few days at a time on any one of them.

The way grouping works in LotRO is (forgive the comparison) like a really good "one-night stand". If the chemistry is right, it can be very nice, and sometimes groups have good chemistry and get on a roll, working through a series of quests or else a variety of quests. "Hey, anybody need to do such and so?" someone will ask. And on it goes. The better groups can go on for some time like that, sometimes with people coming and going. I like the way that works. If the chemistry isn't there, though, or too many people drop out at once, people will just go their separate ways. I'm cool with that. I'm really not looking for "long-term relationships" in LotRO. (I'll do that in real life, thanks all the same.)

If I'm feeling "solitary", off I go on my own. There is plenty to do, always.

I think if you are looking for a more warm and fuzzy social kind of interaction, the right kinship is the way to go. For myself, I really REALLY dislike being in a kinship. It's too much social for my taste. And I usually feel obligated to pay attention to the never-ceasing kinship chat. Kinships also add a certain amount of pressure to go do this or that or go help this person or that. No, thanks.

That said, for my tastes, LotRO hits the social thing just right.

I read so many posts here talking about bad PUG experiences. Wow. Are we playing the same game? My PUG experiences are 95 to 98% positive. And that's the only kind of grouping I ever do.

As for Moria, I cannot speak to that, as my highest toon is a 40 champ. But I am having a blast in this game and think the grouping "ethos" in LotRO is just about right as it is. My only complaint is not in the groups themselves, but, as I mentioned above, in the limitations of the LFF system as it now stands. It's OK, but it could sure be a lot better.

tmr819:   I have some good news for you.   There actually IS a global-lff channel.

Like you can imagine, it is a specific channel whereby players (instead of using the normal /lff channel, which is just region based, can actually post there to find willing members to join a fellowship.)

Now the problem is that I still don't know how to join it.  I know that it is something like; /join Global_LFF, or something similar, but I have not been able to suss out the current way to phrase it.  Which is extremely annoying.

This brings us back to the core of the arguement, that being; why do Turbine seem to make it so tricky for us to form fellowships?  Almost as though they are promoting casual/solo play.  I'm not a conspiratist theory kind of guy, but if I were, it would be so that they do not have to design too many raid-like content.

I mean, why is important stuff like this ommitted from the rulebooks?

Take the nice, glossy rule-book that came with the Mines of Moria expansion pack.  I received it a week before Moria went live, and so was looking forward to reading it and learning about everything that was going to be introduced.

To my disgust, this feeble rulebook was basically a shorter version of the one which came with the original Lord of the Rings Online Boxed Set.  Oh, it did have a couple of paragraphs about the two new classes, but to my astonishment, that was it!

Now, bearing in mind that Moria is aimed at veteran players (all of whom already knew everything that was in this so-called rule book), what was the point?

If they did not want to mention anything about Moria, they could have at least taken the time to answer some of the questions which players have, and also give us the key-presses to certain functions that even vets are unaware off.

For instance:  a lot of players don't know that by pressing both alt + f10 keys, a small light shines over your characters head,   very useful in dark places.

Or that when someone who passes you by when you are fighting a mob, they get a tiny bit of xp, and you get less (this in particular would have saved a lot of in-game arguements, when the player was merely trying to help, not realising).

And of course, the global - looking for fellowship channel.

I am sure that there are many others, and these would have been a lot more welcome than just going over the old rules, as if we were all noobs!

 I know a lot of older people play this game (in their 30s, 40s, and 50s).  I'm one of them.  We have a very low tolerance of annoying people.  In order to minimize this we only group with personal friends in game.  So much so that we will often skip content (ie. 6 man instances and raids) solely because we don't want to deal with random strangers yacking over voice or telling jokes no one cares about.

When I played WoW I was more open about social interaction.  After getting burned and backstabbed too many times to count I washed my hands of it and now only play with my wife and a co-worker...grouping up only on very rare occassions.

Now...get off my lawn!!! 

The global LFF channel, at least on Brandywine, is pretty worthless, imo. It is monopolized by 50+ players and is basically a raid (Rift) recruiting/general OOC chat channel that has ZERO value for lower-level players. I very quickly turned it off.

My more precise suggestion was to offer a variety of LFFs to choose from.

Basically, I wish Turbine would add the ability for players to audit (and AUDIT ONLY) LFF channel(s) in other regions. This would vastly increase the "range" for people looking for other players to fill out groups -- particularly for instances and difficult areas (e.g., Dol Dinen in North Downs). If you *wanted* to hear all the LFF channels everywhere you could do so, but you could also (my preference) just audit the areas you were interested in. Now, those would be some UserChat channels I could really use!

Incomprehensibly, Turbine, like Blizzard in WoW, sets instances such as Great Barrows in locations too low, level-wise for the players needed for the instance. This makes no sense to me. Most players ready for GB are done with the quests in Bree-Land and move on to Lone Lands or North Downs -- and OUT OF LFF RANGE for the GB instance (Bree-Land).

If anything, this problem is even worse in WoW. I have never understood this.

In my experience, LFF systems are seldom set up to meet the needs of the way people actually play. A solution such as I suggested in the LotRO forums would go a long way toward addressing that problem.

---

Originally posted by Thradar
 I know a lot of older people play this game (in their 30s, 40s, and 50s).  I'm one of them.  We have a very low tolerance of annoying people.  In order to minimize this we only group with personal friends in game.  So much so that we will often skip content (ie. 6 man instances and raids) solely because we don't want to deal with random strangers yacking over voice or telling jokes no one cares about.
When I played WoW I was more open about social interaction.  After getting burned and backstabbed too many times to count I washed my hands of it and now only play with my wife and a co-worker...grouping up only on very rare occassions.
Now...get off my lawn!!! 

---

Heh. I read this post with interest. I am in my early 50s, myself, and I ONLY PUG, since I am not in any kin and don't care to join one. I have just one other friend in the game (we chat occasionally but very seldom team up). My experiences have been very good with PUGs, however -- perhaps my tolerance level is greater than yours. :)

half the people that complain about having troubles grouping is cause for one you turn off the LFG chat or whatever and you refuse to group if something happens etc its no wonder grouping is bad if you got it turned off and except someone else to do it for you etc then theres who wont group with anyone no matter what the cause even if it means he has nothing to do all day rather then joining some random grp