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11/22/08 2:01:02 AM#21
Originally posted by Ghist I don't like WAR or WoW, but even I can say this is quite possibly the dumbest post I've ever seen. Especially spelling immersion wrong, and the PvP part.
WoW is a PvE game. Its PvP is a tacked on failure of an afterthought, and WAR beats it day and night with RvR, the most fun and successful RvR system, originated in DAoC by Mytthic and applied to WAR. |
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11/22/08 2:15:15 AM#22
Originally posted by SignusM
lol, spelling police... WAR failed in its PvP / RvR in my opinion because it loses the all important 3rd faction found in DAoC and Mythic went ahead and released a rush job with WAR. I dunno how they can ever turn it around especially with the mass exodus happening... |
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11/22/08 2:27:25 AM#23
Originally posted by tikovoo
lol, spelling police... WAR failed in its PvP / RvR in my opinion because it loses the all important 3rd faction found in DAoC and Mythic went ahead and released a rush job with WAR. I dunno how they can ever turn it around especially with the mass exodus happening... I don't think they did a rush job, and any cut features they announced way ahead of time.
I do think they missed something with third faction RvR, due to the fact that there is no third faction in WAR lore... its not something they can mess with. Also, they made scenarios too easy and important, instead of proper RvR.
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11/22/08 2:27:40 AM#24
Originally posted by tikovoo
Here I actually agree with you. They made a misstake of mixing Chaos and greenskins. The balance and RvR would be a lot more fun if there was 3 sides instead of 2 and the lore about chaos and greenskin as buddies feels kinda weak, they hate eachothers guts. Warcraft is a better game currently, but no MMO are finnished until a year after release, not even wow was that and WAR can become a really good game still. |
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11/22/08 5:27:43 AM#25
Originally posted by Pepsipwnzgod
WoW quests actually have a story behind it, even the level 10 quests near sentinel hill will emerse you moreso then any war quest, Arenas are controlled by druids in maybe 1500-1700 when it's all a game of who runs out of mana first, try being good at pvp before you judge it Even a good rig cant get past an area having more then 30 people in it in War, the lag is rediculous, and a man's game.. seriously?
a MAN's game....... THAT's a joke... and the movie thing is stupid.. i dont mind pressing esc to get past it.. and yea i have played war, and yea it was fun at first up till about 25 then it's just a grind, the same grind, at least wow is a grind with dif things to grind for dif rewards
Dude... Did you acctually even realised that WAR quests ALL of them make part of a story? That's why they call it chapters, in the time you advance more in the game, you will unlock more stories... Wow in the past few years has became more lame, the lore is destroyed, Play War3 And play WOW, see any diferences? I Saw, MANY! that's why i left... Roses are gray |
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11/22/08 5:40:59 AM#26
WAR character customization sucks. you forgot to mention that :) The WoW talent trees are way better than the 3 tree linear Warhammer system WoW will have more new content WAR can have "new content" as much as that's even possible for PvP (very little) and any new PvE will be a joke and a waste of the devs time WoW: over 11 million subscribers WAR: under 1 million subscribers and about 50% of the people that left WoW for WAR are back, myself being one of them. WAR is an overhyped piece of crap MMO |
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11/22/08 8:07:27 AM#27
Originally posted by Ghist Log in screen: It's nice to be able to skip it by clicking once, but who cares really? EULA: Having to do it every time gives Mythic more freedom in what they can do to hackers/botters/abusers/gold spammers. This results in a better overall gaming experience at the cost of two clicks, so easy win for Mythic here. Program: WoW's graphics are utter shit and the game is really showing its age by now, while WAR looks great with high-res textures and large polygon counts. There's still some performance issues with WAR, though these will be weeded out in time. It's a case of WAR, while still in its early stages of the game, isn't perfect, but still a lot better than WoW. Chat Interface: You can do the same with WAR's chats as with WoW's. WoW's chat configuration UI is more nicely done since WotLK, though. Mail system: WoW has the better mail system. The mail system is a very minor part of the game though so it's a minor inconvenience at worst. Lag: Haven't had any lag in WAR, so they seem to be similar at the moment, at least for me. WoW had atrocious lagging for many months after launch though, but it's great now. Combat System: WoW's melee combat system is a disjointed mess where the animations aren't properly connected with actual hits Both for melee and casting there's a big lack of variety in animations, as nearly all attacks use the same few generic animations. WAR isn't perfect either and is suffering from a lack of client-side checks on whether you can use an ability or not, which results in animations playing when you try to use an ability you can't, making it look like you're using it. This is something they'll need to improve. I like WAR's combat better still, however, as it has a more connected feel, and you're constantly active rather than standing there waiting for an opportunity to use an ability. Spellcasting is pretty similar, though feels more responsive in WoW. Class differentiation: Most of WoW's casting classes have the exact same mechanic, leaving little room for variety. WAR has more than double the amount of classes and the mechanics between the various careers vary a lot more. WoW isn't anywhere near the same league as WAR in this category, but wins a couple of laughs for showing up. Emotes: Emotes are as easy to see in WAR as they are in WoW. Instances: There's a few instanced areas, but unless you count battlegorunds, it's used a lot less than in WoW, where every dungeon is instanced. Dungeons: WAR's instances are much more than a string of PQs. In addition, PQs are much better than a string of trash mobs. There's not the same amount of dungeon content as in WoW, though. A dungeon like Mount Gunbad is a breath of fresh air compared to the borefest that is your typical WoW instance. PvP: WoW an extremely low amount of PvP content and is moving it out of the MMO genre by forcing everyone into small-scale arena combat. There is only a single zone for any kind of world PvP. WAR has a couple of scenarios that need to be addressed due to turtling making them boring. WoW on the other hand has the opposite problem with eternity matches in Warsong Gulch for example, which is far worse - in WAR at least the game ends after 15 minutes at most. For PvP, WoW is so pathetic in comparion to WAR that it's hilarious the comparison is even being made in the first place. Reliability: WoW has a more polished and reliable game by now due to having had 4 years to polish it. Win for WoW, although WAR gets an honorable mention for its state and improval rate giving it only released recently. Communications: Mythic is awesome at communication to the players in which direction they're taking the game, and are good at making appearances at fan sites to address issues and help people out. Blizzard has gotten better over the years, but they've still got a lot to learn. Heart: WoW is a confused mess where the developers can't even figure out whether they should take their own world seriously or turn it into a prank. The ambivalence of the development team shines through on every level, be it lore, PvE or PvP. It's as if they lack a common goal and are divided on where the game should be taken, and it really shows. This is what WAR got right, and why I think the game itself feels more serious and a lot less hollow than WoW.
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11/22/08 9:13:19 AM#28
Sadly 4 year old game is still better in all aspects of gameplay than the latest MMOs. Thats worrying. NPC AI in latest MMOs is just very bad atm when it should be heading the other way. Now - with this said... WOTLK is not a great addition to the MMO genre. Its the same old but even more nubed down. Game is trying to balance two diffrent gamestyles on diffrent lvls of players playing. That is allways gonna be a failure cause both sides will suffer for it. And regarding PVP... There will always be loosers in PVP... PPL DONT PAY for beeing loosers. And 50% of loosers = 50 % less subs.... So.... games like AOC and WAR can never become big games cause 50% of players will always be loosers and will not pay for it. What makes WOW such a hit ? Simple answer really - PVE where all can be winners. BUt... there is a limit to how nubed down game can be without ppl reaslising that even the biggest loosers are still progressing... But there is alot more that makes WOW so much better compared to for example LOTRO. If PVE is the way to go... why isn't LOTRO not best game ever ? Thats simple - Limited UI - Not traditional magic style - Bad animations - loading screens. All these factors are simply bad in LOTRO so thats why it can not be such a hit as WOW. |
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11/22/08 9:13:21 AM#29
Originally posted by eq2js
Are you serious? You are saying WAR's customization sucks, but you play WoW. To my knowledge (Haven't bothered with WotLK, quit after it was announced) but the choices for WoW faces, beards etc are limited to a small amount as well. BTW the human in WoW is by far the dumber looking then any WAR character. Gnome knights? Makes real sense. Please when you try saying a game has crap for customization, make sure the game your praising actually has some. WoW tree's. Really. Thats funny cause when I played (before the x-pac) there were cdertain builds for a class, or you were a noob. Which makes it pretty linear imo. Once again, if your gonna rant on a game for something make sure yours excels at it. PVE is a joke, this makes no sense. How does killing X mob go here go there in 1 game suck, but its the same in yours. AND, if you actually read quest dialogue and your ToK then you would see a world opening before your eyes. Its deep and interesting if you actually cared (But seeing how you played WoW your probably one who skipped the text to accept the rushed up to lvl - if you even played) PVE content is tank and spank just like WoW. 11 Mil subs. Good number and congrats to Bliz. But when a company has as many diehard fans as WoW and the norm fans over 4 years, yeah of course they will have more. WAR is a great game, has nice features and will be a success. Your post was useless, it really was. All your "points" can be bounced back onto WoW (i.e custom and PVE) so yeah, you shot yourself in the foot on this one. Better Luck next time. P.S how did this not get locked yet lol
Enjoy : ) |
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11/22/08 3:31:17 PM#30
WoW is easily has one of the least character customization. WAR isn't exactly super in this department, but still a lot better than WoW, not that this is difficult to achieve. Check out City of Heroes / Villains for some serious customization options, though. |
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11/22/08 4:15:08 PM#31
Originally posted by SignusM I don't like WAR or WoW, but even I can say this is quite possibly the dumbest post I've ever seen. Especially spelling immersion wrong, and the PvP part.
WoW is a PvE game. Its PvP is a tacked on failure of an afterthought, and WAR beats it day and night with RvR, the most fun and successful RvR system, originated in DAoC by Mytthic and applied to WAR. Except it's not DAoC RvR, is an adaptation of DAoC's RvR that's been extremely dumbed down. |
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11/22/08 4:17:49 PM#32
Originally posted by Ixnatifual Yeah, because in WAR there's even less armor variety then in WoW, which is just sad. |
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11/22/08 4:28:04 PM#33
Incorrect. Each career has tailor-made armour sets, whereas WoW uses the same generic pool of armour design for multiple classes. This is also why each career in WAR always looks strongly themed while WoW classes always look like the result of a freak explosion at the local clown outfit factory. Until end-game where everyone starts looking the same. Granted the the WotLK leveling armour looks a lot less shit than in TBC/vanilla WoW, but it remains drawn from the same generic pool. At end-game, WAR's variety for each career becomes quite good as there's multiple armour sets to obtain. When you think about it it makes you wonder why WoW has so little gear variety given so much of the generic gear pool is recycled across multiple classes. This is also the reason WoW's armour textures look so horrible on non-human body types, as it's the same armour getting horribly stretched over textures that don't match up to the base model, and also accounts for the atrocious clipping issues. The low-res nature of the armour textures in general only serves to magnify the stretching problem, unfortunately. They are going the WAR-route with the Diablo 3 armour designs, though, so possibly they've learned from their mistakes, though they did do similar for Diablo 2, so it could simply be a case of different art departments for WoW vs Diablo. So yeah, at first you might get the impression that there's less variety, but when you put things into perspective you can see there's a actually a lot more, and it's a lot less shitty. Add armour dyes to it and there's not even a contest. Unless of course you're actually playing the class "Clown". |
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11/22/08 4:38:59 PM#34
Originally posted by Ixnatifual The red text above is exactly what I mean. In each tier, players get new armor sets with slightly upgraded graphics than the previous tier, but ALL armor in your tier looks basically the same. Armor dye provides at least something to set you apart from other players playing the same class, but it's not enough. |
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11/22/08 4:43:59 PM#35
Healing. Healing in WAR is just years ahead of healing in WoW. I recently went back to WoW after playing my archmage on WAR. PvP healing is a joke, if you play carefully you'll end up OOM pretty quick because you aren't dying. if you don't play carefully you won't use any mana because you'll be stunlocked/silenced/feared from 100-0.
the exception to this is of course the pally, but even they can only avoid being useless every few min with their cooldowns. walk out of your base in WSG and the entire other team will see that you are a healer, and ignore everything else to kill you. the only way to avoid focus fire from half the enemy team is with a bubble (and hope they don't have a shadow priests there waiting with mass dispell)
Healing in PvP in WAR is wonderful. there is no "OOM" so you never become useless, you just have to take it easy for a few seconds. nothing worse than being stuck in combat with no mana as a healer and just... wanding, or trying to shift to catform in resto gear.
Healing is decently powerful in WAR, and while running headfirst into the fight WILL get you killed similar to how you get killed in WOW, being careful will reward you with big healing numbers at the end of the day.
I'm going to play Wrath, I'm enjoying it right now. But I'm never going to give up WAR because deep down I'm a HEALER, and in WAR I never feel useless.
Lock, Pally, Priest, Druid, Warlock. Archmage. Everything creates huge amounts of negativity on the internet, that's what the internet is for: Negativity, porn and lolcats. |
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11/22/08 4:48:27 PM#36
Originally posted by hauj0bb
You are right, but some of us like that. I always look like an archmage on my archmage. my armor changes here and there, but I look like my class.
In WoW, everyone looks terribly crazy untill level cap, at which point everyone gets wellfare epics and looks exactly the same. every warrior looks like a robot, every lock looks like a crazy horned person, every priest looks pretty darn good, but they all look the same, because EVERYONE gets the same gear in WoW at endgame.
inspect people who are right at 70, they are in full PvP epics (a few raiders around there in PVE epics) slowly replacing them with wrath greens/blues. once they hit 80 they'll be back in welfare epics and they'll all look the same again.
Every deathknight looks the same, exactly, and most tend to hold on to their starting armor till near 70... exactly the same.
So while my archmage will always look like an archmage, and a lot like every other archmage. my priest has always looked like a priest, and looks exactly like every other priest whenever we sit at level cap for awhile. Everything creates huge amounts of negativity on the internet, that's what the internet is for: Negativity, porn and lolcats. |
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11/22/08 6:22:46 PM#37
Originally posted by hauj0bb
Nailed it in one. Even class balance changes put back just show it's all a mess. Isn't Europe down to like 100k players now I read somewhere? WoW is good, WAR can be better they are not there yet, I hope they do get there but from my experience being EA didn't help at all. |
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11/22/08 6:26:26 PM#38
Originally posted by Shooshoo
WoW quests actually have a story behind it, even the level 10 quests near sentinel hill will emerse you moreso then any war quest, Arenas are controlled by druids in maybe 1500-1700 when it's all a game of who runs out of mana first, try being good at pvp before you judge it Even a good rig cant get past an area having more then 30 people in it in War, the lag is rediculous, and a man's game.. seriously?
a MAN's game....... THAT's a joke... and the movie thing is stupid.. i dont mind pressing esc to get past it.. and yea i have played war, and yea it was fun at first up till about 25 then it's just a grind, the same grind, at least wow is a grind with dif things to grind for dif rewards
Dude... Did you acctually even realised that WAR quests ALL of them make part of a story? That's why they call it chapters, in the time you advance more in the game, you will unlock more stories... Wow in the past few years has became more lame, the lore is destroyed, Play War3 And play WOW, see any diferences? I Saw, MANY! that's why i left... what wow did to the WC storyline and lore was horrible. Really ruined the whole franchise for me. Paladins to the horde ??? DK's on the alliance ??? Sad stuff. 
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11/23/08 4:15:45 AM#39
To be honest, this guy has a point in regards to Warcraft being a better game than Warhammer. First off after being in the Warhammer beta from the start and jumping on my brother's account to do RvR and sieges (I haven't activated my account due to BG not being in).
War is not as polished as Warcraft's due to it having time, pulling in a easy audience (let's face it WOW is not a complicated game) and ended up being the right formula that Blizzard needed. Another thing that makes Blizzard and Warcraft very flexible and a lot of you forget this on this forum, Blizzard doe not have to ask anybody if they can put in or take out classes or races because it's their license (unlike Warhammer to EA). I agree with his post not because the game sucks balls in general as so many posters on different forums have thrown around but because they haven't gotten the ingredients correct yet (Blizzard has had over 4 years to refine their formula).
Quite frankly again, the game should have held off on release for another 3-5 months (releases nowadays is everything to people).
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11/23/08 7:09:29 AM#40
PvP in Wow: fluid control and smooth animations with a tight balanced system. Hardest MMORPG ever to get the best PvP gear because of a rated ladder system ensuring only the very best top PvP players can get it. Best players out of 180.000(!) players from 1 Battlegroup says it all. PvP in War: a little bit clunky, unresponsive and out of synch combat system. It makes you fight the system instead of the other player. Autofacing in a "skilled" PvP game ? Easy PvP because it is "group based". The system lets you hide between other players and support mediocre play. NO individual rating system at all. Class design is Wow is superior, having 51 deep talent points and 61 talents setting. You make a druid or paladin this way and your ONE character can be a pure tank,a pure healer or a pure DPS class. Only thing to do is reset talent points. No need to have 3 seperate characters to level. DK'a are even more tank.dps/class and added another 3 option tree. The 5 BG's in Wow are always accessible, bigger and far more varied than in War. PVE the games can't possibly be compared because of the 4 years polishment of Wow. Professions far more and better implemented in Wow. Wow's 3D worlds you can freely fly over on personal mounts are much more open and fully designed. Role Play: dozens of emotes which simply are not implemented in War. Can't even sit on a chair. RvR is not present in Wow, but no one is interested in RvR because it just resets and is rather useless. I play PvP for the fun and character progress in Wow, (as every video game player), so to me the choice is clear... and looking at the www.xfire.com graphics the majority agrees on this. |
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