Originally posted by jedijef

Originally posted by Tzimiscechi

 

If you liked the NGE, you'll love TOR.

-rejected Bioware sales pitch....

 

 

 

 

Bwahahahaha.  Gets my vote for post of the year.

I highly doubt that the new game will be like the NGE, other than having common features that both have with many MMO's (levels, instances, etc). 

LEC clearly doesn't understand MMORPG games, or their customer base.

That aside, assume for a minute that they DID more or less clone the NGE, made the classes simple, stupid, the combat system spastic and stupid indeed, an exact clone.

It would fail. Indeed it'd be the failure that would overtake the NGE as the greatest failure in MMO history.  $75 million dollars spent on beer would return more on the investment in recycled cans than this thing will.  It would end the argument that the NGE failed because of "poor communication", or "poor implementation" instead of it's own merit.

Smed absolutely proved his incompetence by saying that the current game is the one he wished they'd launched with.  Had the NGE game been the launch game, the main difference is that it never would have attracted hundreds of thousands of players and there wouldn't be anyone today lamenting the demise of any form of it as we do Pre-CU and even CU.  It'd have closed years ago.

I'm not sure that it would fail, provided Bioware lived up to their reputation and delivered a game that was relatively stable and bug-free (something Sony/LA was unable to do in either Pre-CU or NGE).

As much as everyone around here hates the NGE (myself included, don't think I'm defending it), it is precisely the type of game that is being played by millions of MMORPG players, most of them in WoW, a few in EQ2 and LotRo.  The NGE clearly set out to emulate that style of game, and the fact that it has low subscription numbers indicates to me that the implementation was poor, not the concept.  The concept has unequivocally been proven successful by Blizzard (financially successful that is), and Bioware will most likely follow that model and do a better job of delivering and communicating.

Will it compete with WoW like they're hoping? I highly doubt it, but it will turn a profit.

Originally posted by jedijef

I'm not sure that it would fail, provided Bioware lived up to their reputation and delivered a game that was relatively stable and bug-free (something Sony/LA was unable to do in either Pre-CU or NGE).

As much as everyone around here hates the NGE (myself included, don't think I'm defending it), it is precisely the type of game that is being played by millions of MMORPG players, most of them in WoW, a few in EQ2 and LotRo.  The NGE clearly set out to emulate that style of game, and the fact that it has low subscription numbers indicates to me that the implementation was poor, not the concept.  The concept has unequivocally been proven successful by Blizzard (financially successful that is), and Bioware will most likely follow that model and do a better job of delivering and communicating.

Will it compete with WoW like they're hoping? I highly doubt it, but it will turn a profit.

Saddly I have to agree with you, the worste part of it all is that Bioware has a good shot at doing this pretty well and making a pretty penny. If and when they do, you are pretty much garunteed never to see another SW Sandbox. It will be themeparks from then on out. I am keeping my fingers crossed that Earthrise and the other Sandbox's comming out do well even the ones I have no intention of playing. Would be nice to get that style of MMO a bit more attention.

I agree. I'm cautiously optimistic about Darkfall and mildly interested in Earthrise (though there really is little info available on it yet from what I can tell).

I'd be willing to pay higher sub rates for a true sandbox; one of these days developers might tap that market.

Originally posted by ArcAngel3

So we've read some LA press releases about the upcoming Bioware, StarWars MMO.  Bioware has a fantastic reputation, but LA is not helping with their current marketting approach.  The strategy focuses on lessons they claim to have learned from SWG.

LA may be right that some people didn't like logging into StarWars Galaxies with a pistol, a melon and a desert full of womprats to shoot.  They also may be right that people didn't enjoy the whole process of killiing a trillion bols, wookies, etc. to try to unlock a jedi.

If, however, these are the only clear examples of what they've learned from StarWars Galaxies, this is going to leave people with a bad feeling.

Did they not learn that releasing a game with broken professions and quests is a bad idea?

Did they not learn that revamping the game (twice) after it went live was a bad idea?

Did they not learn that people strongly dislike having all of their ingame progress and professions deleted?

Did they not learn that surprising people with a complete revamp the day after an expansion release is a bad idea?

If they're going to talk about "lessons learned from SWG," I think they had better start including these in their list.  If they don't, people are going to assume LA didn't learn these lessons; and potential players may avoid the new StarWars MMO because LucasArts, the IP holder, it still out to lunch and capable of ruining yet another StarWars online experience.

uh, bioware has 0 rep as far as mmorpgs....and lucas arts kinda sucks. they have both made cool offline games, but that doesnt really mean much. why bother speculating? they arent making a game for YOU, they are making a game to make $ (read:for the masses) off of a pop IP.

you people make me sick, 15$/mo does not make you a decision maker.. it makes you 1 of the flock. when was the last time anyone cared if the sheep were happy? as long as they get fleeced its mission accomplished. though this does give me insight as to what sheep must be talking about standing around in a field all day.

Originally posted by megafluxmega

Originally posted by ArcAngel3

So we've read some LA press releases about the upcoming Bioware, StarWars MMO.  Bioware has a fantastic reputation, but LA is not helping with their current marketting approach.  The strategy focuses on lessons they claim to have learned from SWG.

LA may be right that some people didn't like logging into StarWars Galaxies with a pistol, a melon and a desert full of womprats to shoot.  They also may be right that people didn't enjoy the whole process of killiing a trillion bols, wookies, etc. to try to unlock a jedi.

If, however, these are the only clear examples of what they've learned from StarWars Galaxies, this is going to leave people with a bad feeling.

Did they not learn that releasing a game with broken professions and quests is a bad idea?

Did they not learn that revamping the game (twice) after it went live was a bad idea?

Did they not learn that people strongly dislike having all of their ingame progress and professions deleted?

Did they not learn that surprising people with a complete revamp the day after an expansion release is a bad idea?

If they're going to talk about "lessons learned from SWG," I think they had better start including these in their list.  If they don't, people are going to assume LA didn't learn these lessons; and potential players may avoid the new StarWars MMO because LucasArts, the IP holder, it still out to lunch and capable of ruining yet another StarWars online experience.

 

uh, bioware has 0 rep as far as mmorpgs....and lucas arts kinda sucks. they have both made cool offline games, but that doesnt really mean much. why bother speculating? they arent making a game for YOU, they are making a game to make $ (read:for the masses) off of a pop IP.

you people make me sick, 15$/mo does not make you a decision maker.. it makes you 1 of the flock. when was the last time anyone cared if the sheep were happy? as long as they get fleeced its mission accomplished. though this does give me insight as to what sheep must be talking about standing around in a field all day.

Blizzard had ZERO reputation as an MMO developer before they released WoW.

Anything can happen in the MMO business.

As far as how companies handle their customers, some think like you mentioned.  But some do care on what their customers think.

In general, it is my personal belief, that big companies tend to disregard what their customers think or care about regarding their products.  They have this mentality that it doesn't matter if they piss off one customer; he/she is easily replaced.  In MMO terms, we can easily use SOE & SWG, Blizzard & WoW.

Smaller companies don't have that luxury.  They have to make sure what customers they DO have are happy, or suffer the consequences.  In MMO terms, we can use Funcom & Age of Conan.

Oh, and paying a subscription on an MMO does give you a say in what happens in an MMO.

1) You devote alot of time in playing and advancing your character.  Some invest an insane amount of time.

2) You are attached to your character(s).  They're your representation in the MMO.

3) You pay this subscription month in and month out.  A big deal if you've been loyal to an MMO for a long time.

Originally posted by megafluxmega

Originally posted by ArcAngel3

So we've read some LA press releases about the upcoming Bioware, StarWars MMO.  Bioware has a fantastic reputation, but LA is not helping with their current marketting approach.  The strategy focuses on lessons they claim to have learned from SWG.

LA may be right that some people didn't like logging into StarWars Galaxies with a pistol, a melon and a desert full of womprats to shoot.  They also may be right that people didn't enjoy the whole process of killiing a trillion bols, wookies, etc. to try to unlock a jedi.

If, however, these are the only clear examples of what they've learned from StarWars Galaxies, this is going to leave people with a bad feeling.

Did they not learn that releasing a game with broken professions and quests is a bad idea?

Did they not learn that revamping the game (twice) after it went live was a bad idea?

Did they not learn that people strongly dislike having all of their ingame progress and professions deleted?

Did they not learn that surprising people with a complete revamp the day after an expansion release is a bad idea?

If they're going to talk about "lessons learned from SWG," I think they had better start including these in their list.  If they don't, people are going to assume LA didn't learn these lessons; and potential players may avoid the new StarWars MMO because LucasArts, the IP holder, it still out to lunch and capable of ruining yet another StarWars online experience.

 

uh, bioware has 0 rep as far as mmorpgs....and lucas arts kinda sucks. they have both made cool offline games, but that doesnt really mean much. why bother speculating? they arent making a game for YOU, they are making a game to make $ (read:for the masses) off of a pop IP.

you people make me sick, 15$/mo does not make you a decision maker.. it makes you 1 of the flock. when was the last time anyone cared if the sheep were happy? as long as they get fleeced its mission accomplished. though this does give me insight as to what sheep must be talking about standing around in a field all day.

Heh, for 15 bucks a month I never wanted to be a decision maker.  I wanted to get the product that was advertised to me, and I wanted it to function...period.  I got none of the above in SWG.
 

As for customers wanting these things making you sick, I'm sure Smed feels the same way--doesn't seem to be working for him.  He and his company are despised, and his games don't come close to the success of his competitors.