Im asking this because it just seems that some people want to be at the end game in a matter of a week. I look at the adventure and leveling as something that you slowely grow which takes longer. You need to feel that you accomplished something.

MMOs were not soposed to have a max lvl at all, it's a waste of potential.

You need years to get a high lvl playing a serious pen'n'paper RPG, why it's so easy to get playing a MMO?

I don't understand it, and I guess nobody has a good reason to.

I think that impose any kind of  end on a game that must pay it's server forever is a paradox, people will just get bored and quiting at the end. lol

Ya I guess when I ment Rank I mean like the level cap, not so much "finishing" as per say. The reason I bring it up is that I been playing War since the pre-order release and it seems like everyone is in this huge rush to get to 40. After the first week people were 40 and others complain that they cant get to 40 that fast. Maybe because I came from Vanguard and other MMO's where you level and enjoy the leveling.

Grinding out mobs and quests and whatever else for a solid week to get 1 level does not instill a sense of accomplishment it engenders frustration. Players will get more of a sense of accomplishment from their adventuring if they are doing and seeing new things on a constant basis.

After a while the grind becomes unbearable and you feel like that no matter what you do you are going no where. This is when people quit otherwise good MMOs.

Also, that "its a journey not a destination" is just a bunch of crap. MMOs now offer a lot of stuff to do at max level that is not faction grind, raiding or PvP.

MMO developers are beginning to understand that months and months of grind is not the way to lure potential subscribers.

I understand where your coming from and i dont mean that it should take weeks to get 1 level, but it should be a journey to get somewhere. If you level to fast you dont understand lore, game play, etc. Good example is what bliz did to WOW.

i dont really care if it takes years. what matter is the content inbetween.

Screw the journey; I'm all about the end level :D

LOL

WHY PEOPLE CAN DO PVP FOREVER AND CAN'T DO GRIND FOREVER + PVP FOREVER??

When you reach max lvl you just have 1 less thing to do. The problem is that on todays MMOs, +1 lvl means everything, if lvl wasn't a determinant factor on a fight, people wouldn't care about lvling forever, they will get some lvls and see the difference it makes.

In a game that a lvl 200+ can't 1 hit kill a lvl 100 and a lvl 100 can enter every place on the world, the 100's players wouldn't mind about grinding, they will just have fun doing a lot of different things they can do, even in party with 200+ players. If they get bored they will grind a few lvls to distract.

But if a WoW player (just for exemple) get bored ofthe non-sense PvP, the boring long raids and the "kill 10 boar" quest, what can he do? He will probably search for other games...

What used to be here is now the first part of my blog:

Thanks.

Why does a game need levels?

Did you know in Eve and Ryzom noone has ever gotten to the highest skill level.

I believe Ryzom has 30,000+ skill levels

I think leveling should be very slow to max level or maybe never reach max level.Seems like everyone doesnt want to "grind" anymore ,reach max in a couple weeks then whine because they are bored now.if you take the time to level your chracter most people would find out they would enjoy the game more as well as more pride in the devolpment of their characters. I blame this quick gratifacation  and the people who want it this way as why we cant get a good sandbox game anymore like Ac 1,EQ 1 or SWG.

I think leveling is one of the most pointless wastes of time in it's current implementation. Why am I forced to run around as a gimp, running endless amounts of quests until I am brain dead just so I can one day hope to do something that is fun, challenging, and matters? I am all for character progression, but the current systems are FUBAR.

I think that systems need to be put in place in new games where it only takes a couple of days to start doing stuff you want to do, but character progression lasts much longer than that. No imaginary boundries that say I can't go here because some stupid level hovering over my head isn't high enough.

I think a game designed where everyone can level in a short time is terrible.Proof is in the pudding so to speak.Everyone hits max level in a few weeks and the reward for the people who played long hours is gone ,everyone with almost the same skills ,atrtibutes and/or abilties.Of course I am probably one of the minority of people on this forum who spent 3 + years playing the same  character in a game like Ac leveling,exploring and yes ,grinding.I guess to each his own but as long as people like me are in the minority  I guess the current game mechanics will stay the same.

I don't care how much time you grind for the max level. The only challenge here is how to make the players stay without them minding too much about how many levels they gain. And the one thing that makes the players too conscious about their levels is that the quests themselves sometimes have level requirements. I think what they should do when a quest is done then move to the other. Many MMOs dont have that, sadly.

Originally posted by Scubiedude

I think a game designed where everyone can level in a short time is terrible.Proof is in the pudding so to speak.Everyone hits max level in a few weeks and the reward for the people who played long hours is gone ,everyone with almost the same skills ,atrtibutes and/or abilties.Of course I am probably one of the minority of people on this forum who spent 3 + years playing the same  character in a game like Ac leveling,exploring and yes ,grinding.I guess to each his own but as long as people like me are in the minority  I guess the current game mechanics will stay the same.

I agree. What leveling is right now may not change for a very very long time.

 Levels  are stupid. Most games start at top level (that is also stupid). I don't want to wait 1 year to play the game. I say 7 days. Or zero days.  WAR is a zero days game, you can start killing peopel at level 1.

The people that are voting 7 days are missing the point. The game shouldn't start at max level, the journey IS the game. The reason people powerlevel is that the journey just isn't fun anymore.

The main problem I see is the mentality that the fun doesn't start until you are max level. For games like WoW this may be true, but at the same time max level is relatively easy to accomplish.  Thank God for games like Warhammer Online that let you experience the "fun" of a game starting at level 1 so that it doesn't have to be a race to max level every time you roll a character.

Originally posted by Xiaoki

 

Also, that "its a journey not a destination" is just a bunch of crap. MMOs now offer a lot of stuff to do at max level that is not faction grind, raiding or PvP.

Like what?

i don't really see the need at all for levels, there are other and better ways to solve character development.

Levels should be there. There has to be something in which the player sees how strong he is in numerical form. Though average max level time shud be round 1-2 mos but i guess the game shud be interesting enuf to hold u that far

some ppl race to endgame cause of raiding/pvp.. actually i quite enjoy grinding games cause they are hard if u keep out of the item mall (nice challenge :D) and i just mostly enjoy trying to make money to get that expensive item u want sooo bad :>

I don't ever want to max out my character and want to keep on evolving him in his skills like with the systems EVe and SWG placed, only not time or grind based.

I don't care for the hard set upper limit of games. Why should there only be 40 or 60 or 80 levels? Why shouldn't I be able to improve my character and strive for something for as long as I care to play a game? As it is in a game like, say, Warhammer, you hit level 40. You hit your max renown level. Maybe your guild level. You've gone through the quests. So you reroll once or twice to experience slightly different classes and characters . . . and now you're ready to move on to a new game.

As it is with MMORPGs (except EVE-Online) - once you hit the max level, there's not much point to continuing. It's like playing pac-man without any ghosts in the maze.

And I don't mind getting rid of levels entirely. How about having stats and abilities that you can obtain and improve and leave it at that? EVE-Online doesn't have levels. I like that. I'd like to see a traditional MMORPG go without them, too. I don't care if I'm Level umpteen hundred. What I care about is how powerful my tanking ability is. Or my healing. Or my capability for resurrecting people. Or my speed. Or my total knowledge. If you want to formulate some sort of tally of all those things combined that gives some general reference to my "age" or "level" without calling it a level (or simply saying I'm 27 or something), then that's good too. Perhaps just say "I have 8 million skill points"?

That's a big hurdle I have with MMORPGs. The more I play, the closer I see myself getting to the end of the experience. And unless you have OCD, there's not much point in doing it over and over and over. Or staying on the same character that is already maxed out. And I don't really care about your RvR or battlegrounds or whatever the hell you want to call them in a game. In the long run, they have little effect on anything. They always get reset or balanced out so everyone gets a little control now and then... and since they usually only impact some abilities by percentages, then all that work only goes to serve the lower level players who are running about doing the rest of the game.

One thing is clear from this thread.  A lot of people are just posting their opinion without any intention of changing their own belief. 

For myself I find that leveling isn't always fun, but I find that the so called "endgame" is mind numbingly boring in comparison.  I'm amazed that people will say WoWs leveling content is boring, but find that it is fun PvPing or raiding over and over with no or little progression in the same exact areas.  Yeah thats a lot more fun then doing quests and moving around to a lot of different areas.  To me "endgame" has always been a joke.  It's a gimik to keep people playing the game when the content runs out.  In truth the "endgame" is just that.  It's the end of the game.  Stop playing and find something new to play or reroll.