Originally posted by Meeshak

Whats funny is the op said not fun to everything that the defines the mmo genre.  To me you shouldn't be playing mmo cause every mmo has those same basic elements in some form you said not fun too.

 

Please allow me to correct you; 

as you stated _Whats funny is the op said not fun to everything that the defines the mmo genre_ So everything that defines _COOKIE-CUT MMO CLONES_ other MMO companys that dare stand outside the box are what i would call _INNOVATIVE_ unlike WAR which is another carbon copy clone wanna be, hence why i said _Not Fun_

just curious what mmos do you play?

All MMOs will have a grind be it grinding to gain levels or grinding to get skill points.

Originally posted by Theocritus

      LOL thread number 974263537849 abotu slow leveling.....The game has been out what a whopping 10 days?? There are already people max level (at least the 40)......I'd hate to make an MMO anymore....Players bitch constantly if they arent max level in 10 minutes......Why even bother with levels anymore?? So many players are so spoiled that they should just give them max level, best gear, tons of gold, etc etc etc (and they would still complain).........Cant people work for anything anymore?? Do you really want easier games than War/Wow/Lotro/ etc??

maybe a lilttle innovation from an mmo company and leveling could become a thing of the past

a level grind that takes 2 weeks to reach where the game begins is just a waste of 2 weeks to  use the

excuse that i need to level to learn to play my chatacter is old and worn out  character development

and grinding levels are 2 different things

Stop moaning and play the game or don't play the game.

{ Mod Edit }

Originally posted by Meeshak

just curious what mmos do you play?

 

Well lets see;

Eve-Online - Only because these guys really made something new and no other company has been that bold.

The Saga of Ryzom - I loved their concept and ideas, but slowly became a skill based grind.

Project Entropia - I really enjoy their core game system, but their lack of content turns me off abit.

Guild Wars - I love the fact that i can simply choose a level 20 character to PvP without the hasle of _grinding_ 

Sword of the New World - I Love their pet system

Minions of Mirth - I love their multiclass and skill system

EQ2 - I love their RTM Server Bazaar

and a few others like The 4th Coming, but i highly doubt you would even know what that is.

Originally posted by greydor 

maybe a lilttle innovation from an mmo company and leveling could become a thing of the past

a level grind that takes 2 weeks to reach where the game begins is just a waste of 2 weeks to  use the

excuse that i need to level to learn to play my chatacter is old and worn out  character development

and grinding levels are 2 different things

 

I actually agree 110% with this post, i like it!

Just in case an innocent bystander comes by this thread and thinks the OP knows what he's talking about...he is clueless. About his points....

1. re: levels... while you level you can PvP within your tier (a 10 level range) people at the top-end of the tier, all else being equal, will average better performance than those at the lower... did someone expect otherwise? lol.... anyway, this is temporary since we'll all be at 40 within the month.

2. Empty T3 scenarios... I ran Tor Anroc 7 times in one hour just before bed last night... Some scenarios at each tier are more popular than others...fly around...ask people...TA is the most popular T3 scenario, in case you need it spelled out for you. Btw... at 24, I hold my own just fine (you get buffed up to 28 if you're lower) against 29's...

re: Leveling curve is huge and slow.... this is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. Anyone who has ever played any other MMO will immediately notice just how easy it is to level in WAR. If you want to complain about leveling you should be whining about the opposite....it may just be too easy.

Clue: Scenarios = much, much, much....did I say much? faster leveling than doing quests where you need to find things in caves and such....OBVIOUSLY. An example"? A quest in the T3 area that may take you 20 minutes to do will usually give you 4,000 XP.... a Scenario which is usually over in 6-10 minutes? 10,000+ XP...you do the math. Not to mention that scenarios also give you renown.

Playing on my spare time....after work... watching tons of NFL, CFL, MLB and hockey prea-season.... level 24 Archmage with level 17 renown...and that's because I do enjoy exploring and questing.

It is possible to have complaints about WAR--it's not perfect--but this one is useless and ignorant.

Originally posted by Iselin

Just in case an innocent bystander comes by this thread and thinks the OP knows what he's talking about...he is clueless. About his points....

1. re: levels... while you level you can PvP within your tier (a 10 level range) people at the top-end of the tier, all else being equal, will average better performance than those at the lower... did someone expect otherwise? lol.... anyway, this is temporary since we'll all be at 40 within the month.

2. Empty T3 scenarios... I ran Tor Anroc 7 times in one hour just before bed last night... Some scenarios at each tier are more popular than others...fly around...ask people...TA is the most popular T3 scenario, in case you need it spelled out for you. Btw... at 24, I hold my own just fine (you get buffed up to 28 if you're lower) against 29's...

re: Leveling curve is huge and slow.... this is the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard. Anyone who has ever played any other MMO will immediately notice just how easy it is to level in WAR. If you want to complain about leveling you should be whining about the opposite....it may just be too easy.

Clue: Scenarios = much, much, much....did I say much? faster leveling than doing quests where you need to find things in caves and such....OBVIOUSLY. An example"? A quest in the T3 area that may take you 20 minutes to do will usually give you 4,000 XP.... a Scenario which is usually over in 6-10 minutes? 10,000+ XP...you do the math. Not to mention that scenarios also give you renown.

Playing on my spare time....after work... watching tons of NFL, CFL, MLB and hockey prea-season.... level 24 Archmage with level 17 renown...and that's because I do enjoy exploring and questing.

 

It is possible to have complaints about WAR--it's not perfect--but this one is useless and ignorant.

And one time at band camp ..... /goes back to sleep

Rank 25 now, I have to say I'm not enjoying the sudden grind. I have been running back and forth between every tier 3 zone to try and complete every quest avaiable for chapters 12 and 13 except a couple of the RVR ones, I'm now running out of quests and only halfway to 26.. scenarios are taking ages. I don't like grinding PQs but, I guess I have no choice right now before moving on to the next chapters. Wish there were either a few more quests or better XP rates for them..

Oh, and I'm not a powergamer. I've been exploring every zone and have been taking my time to enjoy it, I just agree that there is a slowdown here..

I agree with ISELIN. A game which is not even one month old and people already complaining about slow leveling. What's the rush anways? thats why i despise so called hardcore gamers. they ruin it for everyone else who doesnt spend 24 hours in front of PC.

Odd, I just dinged 40 on Volkmar as a White Lion.

In my guild alone, I am the ninth Rank 40 player since launch, the leveling "curve" is a joke, and if anything needs to be slowed down - not sped up to cater to a minority that seeks instant gratification for as little effort as is humanly possible.

Seems like an obvious troll to me, and judging by the other threads the OP has created, anyone who isn't a mouthbreathing window-licker should be able to see it pretty clearly.

Originally posted by Narshe

Rank 25 now, I have to say I'm not enjoying the sudden grind. I have been running back and forth between every tier 3 zone to try and complete every quest avaiable for chapters 12 and 13 except a couple of the RVR ones, I'm now running out of quests and only halfway to 26.. scenarios are taking ages. I don't like grinding PQs but, I guess I have no choice right now before moving on to the next chapters. Wish there were either a few more quests or better XP rates for them..

Oh, and I'm not a powergamer. I've been exploring every zone and have been taking my time to enjoy it, I just agree that there is a slowdown here..

Yep. Most people complaining about the grind you start hitting in the late 20s are complaining not just because of "xp gain speed" but because you play the other races' content on one character and sometimes resort to grinding, killing the PvE replay value for alts.

Clue: Scenarios = much, much, much....did I say much? faster leveling than doing quests where you need to find things in caves and such....OBVIOUSLY. An example"? A quest in the T3 area that may take you 20 minutes to do will usually give you 4,000 XP.... a Scenario which is usually over in 6-10 minutes? 10,000+ XP...you do the math. Not to mention that scenarios also give you renown.

quoted from Iselin

to me that is the problem most have with this game we didn't come for instanced pvp we came for world rvr i don't do the scenarios as i goburned out on instanced pvp(wow bg's anyone) years ago yet the best xp and renown reward for pvp is in instanced pvp which is lame

This is a ridiculously easy question to answer. Everything in WAR works better with a group...Scenarios, pq's rvr...

The people sitting in tier three right now are bored (not boared you idiot...a boar is a pig.) because the majority of the population is still in tier 2 tearing it up. It will be another week or two before the majority of the gaming population is in tier three.

RvR: Of course you are going to get owned if you run rvr with a pug group against veteran guilds with higher level toons. How could you expect anything else?

Of course there wont' be that many scenario's popping in tier three..most of the population is in tier 2..and running a pug in a scenario vs. veteran guilds means you lose. Any game that involves competition will be the same.

PQ's are what they are. They are not meant to be the main content of the game.

Perhaps you should open the door and go outside once in awhile. I heard there is this thing they call the "Sun" You should go see it some time.

These threads are so funny.

A developer states that they are making a game that doent require you to dedacate your life in order to RvR.  They end up making a game that is advertised as "jump right in RvR action".  Theres never any rumors or any talk of the game requiring huge amounts of effort in order to have fun.  The game is released and they keep their promises, you can play casually and have tons of fun.

So in walks the "hardcore" gamer, with a chip on his shoulder, hes played the good mmo's...the real mmo's.  He doesnt like what he sees...the average joe being able to RvR effectivly, without requireing a huge grind, or the best gears, or any real time sinks.  He gets mad, he thinks this is easy mode and he cant have fun playing it for 14 hours a day.

What did you expect from a game that promised to appeal to the casual gamer?

I thought you guys would be a bit smarter and be able to forsee that this game wasnt going to appeal to you if the type of game your looking for is a very hard mmo with huge time sinks.

I also laugh about the complaints that nothing innovative has been introduced.  Id like to know other games that offer a multiple leveling path structure.  I dont know any games that i can pve if i choose, or do some public quests, or hop in a scenario, or wander over to open field rvr.  I guess thats just not innovatve enough...perhaps if they intouced a way to make virtual reality pop out of your monitor....either way i feel sorry for those searching for the holy grail of mmo's...im sure the next mmo released will fufill your unreslisticly high standards.

I would also like to point out that, eventually, once the general playerbase starts to employ some strategy in their RvR, there is no form of pve ai that is more intelligent and more difficult to deal with, than a well organized, group of human players working together to steamroll you an your buddies.

So good luck finding that holy grail of mmo's...the hardcore gamers messiah or w/e.  This game allows those of us with lives to hop in for some intense fun, without having to grind our lives away to get to the good stuff.  Honestly i dont even care if the game requires me to do more rvr or pve "grind" to get to endgame....i see no need to rush it since im having fun getting there.

Originally posted by greydor

Clue: Scenarios = much, much, much....did I say much? faster leveling than doing quests where you need to find things in caves and such....OBVIOUSLY. An example"? A quest in the T3 area that may take you 20 minutes to do will usually give you 4,000 XP.... a Scenario which is usually over in 6-10 minutes? 10,000+ XP...you do the math. Not to mention that scenarios also give you renown.

quoted from Iselin

 

to me that is the problem most have with this game we didn't come for instanced pvp we came for world rvr i don't do the scenarios as i goburned out on instanced pvp(wow bg's anyone) years ago yet the best xp and renown reward for pvp is in instanced pvp which is lame

To be fair... I came in to WAR with the same attitude as you. I avoided scenarios like the plague at T1 because I also prefer open RvR and have bad memories of scenarios in other games. A guildmate convinced me to start doing the T2 scenario in the Dwarf area (something Monastery... I forget) and much to my surprise I found myself enjoying them. 

Maybe it's because it's my first experience with scenarios that have been designed as an alternate way to level and you get very good XP and some renown. No question though, T2 raiding in a guild WB and taking keeps was much more fun. We'll be hitting all the T3 areas this Friday looking for trouble.

Anyone who played DAoC at launch though will remember that we had nothing but open RvR there and after a few weeks it was tough for anyone to RvR unless you were at or near the cap... their instanced practice RvR areas came much later. But the point is, as in DAoC, all of this pre-T4 RvR is just practice...the real game begins at T4.

I Personally didnt find any grinding until after lv 31 in which only 5% of the people at my server are at right now so basically that means no keep raids or BOs or scenarios. This may only be me of course but on Azazel i believe it's a hugely populated server because we got realm war going on everywhere. Last Night our guild formed a 20 man t3 warband and conquered every keep. Which sparked some destruction resistance with them coming in and taking em back. Keep Wars are fuckin awesome

I'm a lv 38 White Lion now.

Originally posted by wartywarlock

i just got 25k for a t3 scenario. how is that the same exp as at t2? where you get max 10k? do some research, present some FACTS, not random BS. if you are getting liek 2k then you are basically AFKing

Actually I've got as high as 19676 in Tier 2, and have seen one of my teammates get as high as 27000 in tier 2.    Just started tier 3 but I'm sure it's possible to get even higher there as you say.

I'm baffled how anyone can say leveling is slow in this game.  I suspect they are the ones who want to limit their PvP and grind PvE.   This game is intended to be a mix of both.   Short one and you'll short your character.  

Also to previous posters  - Yes, it sucks when you are at the lower levels in a bracket.    I'm level 23 and RR22, me and some friends milked Tier 2 as long as we could (as it's fun being at the top), we couldn't stop leveling even though we tried to slow down.   If people don't like the extra difficulty of being at the low end, grab a few levels and then focus on Scenarios again once you are middle/top of the bracket to milk renown at that point.    Or try a bit of teamwork, and even at the lower ends you can hold your own in many games.....i.e. combine healing, and high DPSers/couple tanks to protect your healers.....and have some fun.

Sometimes I seriously wonder if some people are playing the same game as me.   Either their server is terrible or they are, it has to be one of the two.

 Are you chums fricking kidding me or what? Why are you blaming the lack of quests? It's the presence of them that sucks ass. The OP states how NOT FUN quests are. I would give 64.000 dollars NOT to have to do damn errands, run like a moron delivering packages of bears' testicles to some stupid guy. That's the most obvious copy of WoW... and don't go tell me that there are quests in every RPG cause first of all they work in an entirely different way, and second of all when you play the same game (wow) for 2 years, and then clones (EQ2, TR, even damn Auto Assault), doing the same kind of kill collecting/ package delivering quests, you just don't wanna see that scheme ever again, it feels like playing the same game over and over.

And also don't tell me that you can grind XP in other ways. The game offers quests, i do quests. I don't buy a game and not play 50% of it.

Originally posted by Gylfi

 Are you chums fricking kidding me or what? Why are you blaming the lack of quests? It's the presence of them that sucks ass. The OP states how NOT FUN quests are. I would give 64.000 dollars NOT to have to do damn errands, run like a moron delivering packages of bears' testicles to some stupid guy. That's the most obvious copy of WoW... and don't go tell me that there are quests in every RPG cause first of all they work in an entirely different way, and second of all when you play the same game (wow) for 2 years, and then clones (EQ2, TR, even damn Auto Assault), doing the same kind of kill collecting/ package delivering quests, you just don't wanna see that scheme ever again, it feels like playing the same game over and over.

What are you smoking?   Quests are a piece of cake in this game.   Rarely have I run into a tedious one, and many of them tie into other objectives.

Example:  I just reached the Badlands.   One of the first quest is to kill ONLY 6 of a certain mob, which is 50 feet from the camp, and ALSO ties into the public quest for the chapter so you get double-bang for your buck.   That helps you not only earn reward from your quest, but helps you earn influence towards the overall renown rewards from that chapter.

Another example of a cool quest - some guildies found a mirror to click on in Altdorf, and BOOM a hidden Public Quest starts.   Exploration is highly rewarded in this game - we are already keeping track of cool stuff to come back and do later (such as the level 40 Hero mob I found by doing a bit of rockhopping this week).  

You sir, fail.

Originally posted by sabutai22

So a few thing Mythic has lied about;

 

1. RvR / PvP is ruled by Level (over) Gear (over) skill. No matter how good a player(s) is/are they CAN NOT compete against a group that out level(s) them by any means.

So for Mythic having said 60% Skill and 40% Gear is incorrect and false, its more like 80% Level, 19% Gear and 1% Skill (And Skill is debatable since the game will auto turn you if someone tried to stay out of your LoS, not much skill in that!)

Gear also plays a huge role, Anyone that goes into Tier 2 Scenarios with their T1 Gear will not have enough DPS compared to those that are in Tier 2 (with the _LEVEL_ requirement) and their Tier 2 Weapons/Armor.

2. Empty Tier 3 Scenarios taking hours to que up, making anyone thats level 22 having to run PQ and Quests, this is a _HUGE_ boaring grind;

PQ - Kills X number of mobs for X number of times (Not Fun)

Quests - Goto location Z find item Y and then Kill X Number of mobs for X number of times (Not Fun)

RvR (keep seige) - Vastly depends on server and sides, however this once again is ruled mainly by _ZERG_ size followed by number of higher _LEVEL_ players in said _ZERG_ and finally by the active guilds that cordinate said keep seiges.

 

I truely hope Mythic plans something or has something in store for everyone, as it stands now post _LEVEL_ 22 is boaring, slow and very repetative and starting an ALT is even worse since you have to do the entire _SAME_ path all over again! Its bad enough the _LEVEL_ curve is huge and slow!

 

While I can agree with you on some of the first thing, how can you think it's slow levling to be more than halfway to max level this soon after release? Off course it's slower to make a level than in a game with 70 or 80 levels, usually they let you reach max in about the same time whatever the game you are playing, the number of levels really doesnt matter, 20 or 80.

Maybe Mythic did the first 20 to easy instead and should have made them a little harder and eased up a bit later but still. Almost all MMOs I played require quite a lot grind to hit max level, only exception I know is Guildwars where the main campaign takes you to max without forcing you to do a sidequest if you don't want to.

Originally posted by Steelguru 

What are you smoking?   Quests are a piece of cake in this game.   Rarely have I run into a tedious one, and many of them tie into other objectives.

Example:  I just reached the Badlands.   One of the first quest is to kill ONLY 6 of a certain mob, which is 50 feet from the camp, and ALSO ties into the public quest for the chapter so you get double-bang for your buck.   That helps you not only earn reward from your quest, but helps you earn influence towards the overall renown rewards from that chapter.

Another example of a cool quest - some guildies found a mirror to click on in Altdorf, and BOOM a hidden Public Quest starts.   Exploration is highly rewarded in this game - we are already keeping track of cool stuff to come back and do later (such as the level 40 Hero mob I found by doing a bit of rockhopping this week).  

You sir, fail.

Jesus and his many trousers. The ONE quest you tell of doesn't make up for the dozens of 'em where i have to run fricking places to kill 10 beasts or marauders of some kind and then run back with their intestines to get the reward and then another one follows to go even farther and then to proceed to the damn new map.

It's JUST like WoW and it got boring after 5 damn years, do you not see it?

---

Originally posted by Steelguru

---

Originally posted by Gylfi

 Are you chums fricking kidding me or what? Why are you blaming the lack of quests? It's the presence of them that sucks ass. The OP states how NOT FUN quests are. I would give 64.000 dollars NOT to have to do damn errands, run like a moron delivering packages of bears' testicles to some stupid guy. That's the most obvious copy of WoW... and don't go tell me that there are quests in every RPG cause first of all they work in an entirely different way, and second of all when you play the same game (wow) for 2 years, and then clones (EQ2, TR, even damn Auto Assault), doing the same kind of kill collecting/ package delivering quests, you just don't wanna see that scheme ever again, it feels like playing the same game over and over.

---

 
What are you smoking?   Quests are a piece of cake in this game.   Rarely have I run into a tedious one, and many of them tie into other objectives.
Example:  I just reached the Badlands.   One of the first quest is to kill ONLY 6 of a certain mob, which is 50 feet from the camp, and ALSO ties into the public quest for the chapter so you get double-bang for your buck.   That helps you not only earn reward from your quest, but helps you earn influence towards the overall renown rewards from that chapter.
Another example of a cool quest - some guildies found a mirror to click on in Altdorf, and BOOM a hidden Public Quest starts.   Exploration is highly rewarded in this game - we are already keeping track of cool stuff to come back and do later (such as the level 40 Hero mob I found by doing a bit of rockhopping this week).  
You sir, fail.

---

Indeed. Some quests are intended to get you involved in a PQ while doing them. Some of them require some travel, and some of them require a party to accomplish, but what do people expect, everything just sitting there? Hell, you don't need to do quests at all, you could just run scenarios all day and get both Career Xp and Reknown Xp, then just buy gear from the reknown vender. I like this game. If you don't, don't play it.

And for those complaining about Destruction kicking Order's ass every time, come play on Phoenix Throne, the sides are usually pretty even and there's always a battle going on.

Originally posted by Gylfi

Originally posted by Steelguru 

What are you smoking?   Quests are a piece of cake in this game.   Rarely have I run into a tedious one, and many of them tie into other objectives.

Example:  I just reached the Badlands.   One of the first quest is to kill ONLY 6 of a certain mob, which is 50 feet from the camp, and ALSO ties into the public quest for the chapter so you get double-bang for your buck.   That helps you not only earn reward from your quest, but helps you earn influence towards the overall renown rewards from that chapter.

Another example of a cool quest - some guildies found a mirror to click on in Altdorf, and BOOM a hidden Public Quest starts.   Exploration is highly rewarded in this game - we are already keeping track of cool stuff to come back and do later (such as the level 40 Hero mob I found by doing a bit of rockhopping this week).  

You sir, fail.

Jesus and his many trousers. The ONE quest you tell of doesn't make up for the dozens of 'em where i have to run fricking places to kill 10 beasts or marauders of some kind and then run back with their intestines to get the reward and then another one follows to go even farther and then to proceed to the damn new map.

It's JUST like WoW and it got boring after 5 damn years, do you not see it?

Actually I gave you 3 examples of cool PvE things.   I won't list every quest in the game for you, sorry.   The thing you don't realize compared to WoW - is that you would have had to grind 30 of those intestines in WoW, and the mob would have had a 10% drop rate, so you would have had to spend 2 hours finishing that one quest.   Here - as you know if you actually play the game - the mobs ALWAYS drop what you need from what I've seen.   So need 10 intestines, kill 10 mobs.   If that is too much for you......then what can anyone say?

That is nothing like the boring grind called WoW........."after 5 damn years, do you not see it"?

EDIT:  P.S. I want to do a server plug too lol......great people on Order-side Ulthuan, we are outnumbered just enough to get fast Scenario queues (long wait on Dest side I hear - so don't roll Dest here), yet have enough good players to win half or more of the games I'm in.   And hold multiple keeps for hours so far, at times.  Winning and owning Destruction DOES go a long way towards gaining XP and renown, I do have to admit that :)