General Discussion

This is just a weird idea that came to mind right now.  Every society has a rather elaborate set of norms for everything.  Communication, leadership, love, sex, work, gender roles, and just about everything else.  Culture influences everything.

Then I thought about something I was seeing here on these forums.

So many people just argue needlessly here, myself among them.  It's not even real discourse.  Sure, there is information, but the exchange is often pointless.  It so easily decays into childishness from both sides.  The kicker is that these people are not necessarily children.  In fact, it seems to be the people well into adulthood who argue the most violently.  Most people don't care when they see it.  It's basically live and let live.

But most people also eventually get over the need to do stupid things like argue bullshit topics.  When you look at the people who have hung around these forums for the longest time, many have gotten over the need to argue violently.  It's the newcomers who are the most combative.  It's not that the vets never have themselves.  It's that they have already and have gotten it out of their system.  It has truly sunk in for them that nothing good comes out of it.  It's like they grew out of it.

I sometimes wonder if that's what the internet lacks.  Because groups of people on the internet assemble and disperse at such a rapid rate (a decade is considered incredibly old), you don't really have time for cultural norms to develop, aside from a few spastic subcultural rules.  There's no greater set of rules which make for fluid communication.  Instead, most attempts at communication when the parties aren't already in agreement are sudden bursts of conflicting information followed by periods of humdrum garbage.

Do you think this will change, eventually?  Do you think there will eventually be an actual culture behind the internet, and with it, a set way to discuss things which allows for actual communication?

Or am I making something out of nothing?  Do discussions here decay more because of content (politics, religion, etc.) than a need for unspoken rules on what should and shouldn't be done?

Originally posted by Kurush

This is just a weird idea that came to mind right now.  Every society has a rather elaborate set of norms for everything.  Communication, leadership, love, sex, work, gender roles, and just about everything else.  Culture influences everything.

Then I thought about something I was seeing here on these forums.

So many people just argue needlessly here, myself among them.  It's not even real discourse.  Sure, there is information, but the exchange is often pointless.  It so easily decays into childishness from both sides.  The kicker is that these people are not necessarily children.  In fact, it seems to be the people well into adulthood who argue the most violently.  Most people don't care when they see it.  It's basically live and let live.

But most people also eventually get over the need to do stupid things like argue bullshit topics.  When you look at the people who have hung around these forums for the longest time, many have gotten over the need to argue violently.  It's the newcomers who are the most combative.  It's not that the vets never have themselves.  It's that they have already and have gotten it out of their system.  It has truly sunk in for them that nothing good comes out of it.  It's like they grew out of it.

I sometimes wonder if that's what the internet lacks.  Because groups of people on the internet assemble and disperse at such a rapid rate (a decade is considered incredibly old), you don't really have time for cultural norms to develop, aside from a few spastic subcultural rules.  There's no greater set of rules which make for fluid communication.  Instead, most attempts at communication when the parties aren't already in agreement are sudden bursts of conflicting information followed by periods of humdrum garbage.

Do you think this will change, eventually?  Do you think there will eventually be an actual culture behind the internet, and with it, a set way to discuss things which allows for actual communication?

Or am I making something out of nothing?  Do discussions here decay more because of content (politics, religion, etc.) than a need for unspoken rules on what should and shouldn't be done?

I would say there are two main reasons this happens: anonymity and the difficulty of expressing tone on the internet.

Anonymity allows certain individuals who have deep mean streaks to attack others in ways they could never get away with in real life. The reasons veterans are less guilty of this is because their track records with one another makes them less anonymous -- they have developed a persona and pretty much stick with it.

Also, people often read the tone they want to on forums. If they come for an argument, they read what they want to read, and make an argument about it. The reason veterans are less guilt of this is because they have gotten used to one another's writing styles and can begin to get the tone.

At least that's how I interpret what I've seen on these and other forums.

You know in Spartan life part of growing up was to sneak out of the goverment run military housing all young men lived in and strangle a slave.  Not so much for the murder,  but to be crafty enough to not get caught.

Our societies number 1 rule is the freedom to bitch.  You can bitch about whatever you feel like to your hearts desire.

Couple that up with the number 2 rule of the society and you have some angry,  bitchy,  and armed people telling those in charge [public Servents, servers,  head butlers even] how it's going to be.  At least in theory anyways.

Originally posted by Pyrich

You know in Spartan life part of growing up was to sneak out of the goverment run military housing all young men lived in and strangle a slave.  Not so much for the murder,  but to be crafty enough to not get caught.

 

Our societies number 1 rule is the freedom to bitch.  You can bitch about whatever you feel like to your hearts desire.

Couple that up with the number 2 rule of the society and you have some angry,  bitchy,  and armed people telling those in charge [public Servents, servers,  head butlers even] how it's going to be.  At least in theory anyways.

Forgive me if I'm missing the implicit here, but what's the number 2 rule of our society?

"I am always right"?

Originally posted by Kurush

 

Forgive me if I'm missing the implicit here, but what's the number 2 rule of our society?

"I am always right"?

Just look them up in the US rule book.  They gave the 10 of them their own catagory and call them the Bill Of Rights.

Freemdom of religon, speech, press, asembly,  and petition number one at the top.

Immediently following the worst case secenario right of States in keeping and maintaining militias and the right of individuals to possess firearms.
 

You know, people rarely troll in real life conversation.

How funny would it be if Obama and Clinton were debating their health care policies and Edwards just butted in with "oh yea Hillary, well I heard your husband has herpes".

I find that my mood and the events of the day may change my approach a great deal. I tend to be very calculating, with a level temperament, but a certain event can add a degree of emphasis to any given topic, making my expression take more of a personal tone.

Take racism for example. Since I have black friends that deal with it daily, I do take it personally, and my posts generally reflect the emotional investment I have in those situations.

The opposite is true with the Palin attacks. I disagree with anyone attacking her religious views. However, since I don't share her views, I don't take it personally when they are attacked. I simply disagree with the act itself. If I were a christian, I might show more emotion when I post comments concerning those attacks.

I suppose on the issues people feel very strongly about, it's almost like an insult when anyone else attempts to slight their views or assert that they are illogical. I think the reason why the more mature posters argue most fervently is because of the life experiences that have molded their opinions. When you think about racism or religious persecution, it makes a world of difference whether you can recall actual events or your opinion is based on something you read in a book.

I guess your comment was basically that we make no progress by arguing these topics on a message board. To which I'd have to agree. It doesn't mean that we can't find arguing them entertaining though

Originally posted by DailyBuzz

You know, people rarely troll in real life conversation.

How funny would it be if Obama and Clinton were debating their health care policies and Edwards just butted in with "oh yea Hillary, well I heard your husband has herpes".

 

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I find that my mood and the events of the day may change my approach a great deal. I tend to be very calculating, with a level temperament, but a certain event can add a degree of emphasis to any given topic, making my expression take more of a personal tone.

Take racism for example. Since I have black friends that deal with it daily, I do take it personally, and my posts generally reflect the emotional investment I have in those situations.

The opposite is true with the Palin attacks. I disagree with anyone attacking her religious views. However, since I don't share her views, I don't take it personally when they are attacked. I simply disagree with the act itself. If I were a christian, I might show more emotion when I post comments concerning those attacks.

I suppose on the issues people feel very strongly about, it's almost like an insult when anyone else attempts to slight their views or assert that they are illogical. I think the reason why the more mature posters argue most fervently is because of the life experiences that have molded their opinions. When you think about racism or religious persecution, it makes a world of difference whether you can recall actual events or your opinion is based on something you read in a book.

I guess your comment was basically that we make no progress by arguing these topics on a message board. To which I'd have to agree. It doesn't mean that we can't find arguing them entertaining though

Sums it up pretty well.

No, YOu!

I think people in general aruge he