Originally posted by ZDPhoenix

Originally posted by Galaturc

WALL OF TEXT

Aventurine, the developers of Darkfall have officially announced a release date for the "first time" in 7 years of their game development (7 years can easily be considered common when compared to other MMORPG games)

 

I mean nothing personal by this, but I've noticed a herd of Darkfall fans on this forum who  will not get their facts straight about development time with games. So OP, I'd like to show you these games that took far less time.  Proving that 7 years is nowhere near considered common when compared to other MMORPG games developed.

WoW Development time: 4 years. (not counting two expansions also being released in less than 7 years time from original development)

EQ2 Development time:  Less than or equal to WoW's dev time. (not counting several free updates, and even more expansions in less time)

Dungeons & Dragons Online: Stormreach: Approximately 2 years of development.

WAR: The Warhammer Online license was acquired by Mythic on May 18, 2005 and was lost by Climax Online in late 2004. It's being released Sept. 2008. Companies do not normally make development time for a game they don't own yet. And no serious development till a distribution method is guaranteed.

Dark Age of Camelot: Mythic started Dark Age of Camelot development in late 1999 and released in 2001. That's less than half of Darkfall's development time.

I'm not saying Darkfall will be a failure, but I am tired of seeing fans of the game act like they know this industry because the Darkfall boards/team said "well everyone else is wrong".  And I am indeed looking forward to seeing what 7 years of development can create.

You're absolutely right, it's my mistake and I apologize. I just thought that there were a few other MMORPGs which also took 7 years. I've checked Wikipedia, and saw that the maximum was 5 years.

However,  it all comes down to the success of the game after release, and if Aventurine will keep their promises or not.

I'm not sure what you meant by "well everyone else is wrong"; that certainly had not been Aventurine's excuse for their delays if that's what you meant.

Originally posted by Galaturc

Originally posted by ZDPhoenix

Originally posted by Galaturc

WALL OF TEXT

Aventurine, the developers of Darkfall have officially announced a release date for the "first time" in 7 years of their game development (7 years can easily be considered common when compared to other MMORPG games)

 

I mean nothing personal by this, but I've noticed a herd of Darkfall fans on this forum who  will not get their facts straight about development time with games. So OP, I'd like to show you these games that took far less time.  Proving that 7 years is nowhere near considered common when compared to other MMORPG games developed.

WoW Development time: 4 years. (not counting two expansions also being released in less than 7 years time from original development)

EQ2 Development time:  Less than or equal to WoW's dev time. (not counting several free updates, and even more expansions in less time)

Dungeons & Dragons Online: Stormreach: Approximately 2 years of development.

WAR: The Warhammer Online license was acquired by Mythic on May 18, 2005 and was lost by Climax Online in late 2004. It's being released Sept. 2008. Companies do not normally make development time for a game they don't own yet. And no serious development till a distribution method is guaranteed.

Dark Age of Camelot: Mythic started Dark Age of Camelot development in late 1999 and released in 2001. That's less than half of Darkfall's development time.

I'm not saying Darkfall will be a failure, but I am tired of seeing fans of the game act like they know this industry because the Darkfall boards/team said "well everyone else is wrong".  And I am indeed looking forward to seeing what 7 years of development can create.

 

You're absolutely right, it's my mistake and I apologize. I just thought that there were a few other MMORPGs which also took 7 years. I've checked Wikipedia, and saw that the maximum was 5 years.

However,  it all comes down to the success of the game after release, and if Aventurine will keep their promises or not.

I'm not sure what you meant by "well everyone else is wrong"; that certainly had not been Aventurine's excuse for their delays if that's what you meant.

I think LoTRO took a long time too, depending on what you count.

I somehow doubt that DF has been in 7 years of 100 percent full on development.

Originally posted by Galaturc

Two main issues that I'll try to answer briefly in this post;

1- Skill system being another type of grind,

2- Darkfall community seeking victims to gank/grief rather than more players.

1- I agree that UO was a skill grind with respect to level/item grind of our current main-stream games. I remember doing hours of 8x8 tiling trick to gain those .1s to ding 100, I've grand-mastered 32 different skills during the 10 years I've played - I know a little about how repetitive it can get.

However, you should all know that Darkfall developers are also ex-UO players and "they've been there, done that". They have several quotes on how they are committed to minimize both item and skill grinding. We've already discussed how they will minimize the item grinding; by giving full access to crafters, and taking soulbound items out of the game - in addition, every item in game will decay in time.

They've claimed that maxing out a character to desired skill caps to be able to fight in battlegrounds and be effective on PvP will take significantly less effort than any current MMORPG, and definitely much less than what we (and they) have been accustomed to in UO. Furthermore, since the game is planned to be one character per server, they are focusing on extensive character flexibility, meaning that you will be able to switch your warrior to a mage by dropping some skills (like heavy armor wearing / swordsmanship / parrying, etc.), and training your self in others (focusing / greater fire / necromancy) - this process of transition won't happen instantly but it will take relatively less time to get to desired skill set; in other words, you won't have to re-roll (since many skills like running / jumping etc.) serve both types equally.

2- It is funny how some of you've listed this as the main reason why you won't play the game, honestly it sounds a little inferior and inconfident. The fact that the game is free-for-all full loot does not mean that everyone else will be ganking you, you will have access to their loots and be able to fight back. It doesn't mean he/she will have any extra skills since he has been watching Darkfall for a year more than you do. What happened to your PvP experience you've gained over the vast numbers of MMORPGs you've played all this time? Trust me, that the guy in Forumfall rubbing his hands for "noobs" - you so much like to quote here at every occasion - are probably not much better at PvP than you are. It's mroe about player skills, and we all are most likely be at the same player skills when the game is first released.

You know why so many people like the full loot idea? It's that hand-sweating adrenaline-pump that you feel when you play such a game like Darkfall - to know that if you loose the next duel, your favorite item will be on your opponents hand. It won't match loosing an epic/purple item, you will buy it the next day from your favorite vendor, or craft it on your own; perhaps you already have another spare on your bank for bad surprises. However, you know that if you're not careful, you will be penalized - lightly. You watch your back when you hunt solo in your favorite dungeon, in a flight-or-fight stance. Any pre-AoS UO player knows that feeling very well. It's addictive, and makes you crave for that excitement. We've been craving for that excitement for so many years my friends.  There is finally a hope that another game will provide us some of that, and much more.

I play a game where I fear losing my favorite item......its called Halo 3.

Support the OP.

Enough of these EQ/wow clones, bring on the modernised UO. The very first time I get to punch a d...head in the face, even tho he's the same race as me will be a very, very sweet day. I'm not overly fussed if it doesn't pull the same numbers as WOW, Eve Online already shows us that there exists enough players interested in a quality sandbox game to support multiple 10k+ servers.

Originally posted by rikilii

I somehow doubt that DF has been in 7 years of 100 percent full on development.

The difference is that DF has only been developed by a team of 25-30 people for those 7 years, not a team of 100s like WAR, WOW, AoC etc.

Originally posted by Blodpls

I fully agree with the op.  Unfortunately the majority of gamers these days do not.

They like their grinds.

They like their epic lootz.

They like being herded.

They don't want risk.

They don't want to think.

They don't want actual skill to be the deciding factor in pvp.

Sad but true :(

 

 

 

That is true. It's even creeping upon the FPS genre.

Edit: I'm not waiting for Darkfall, though. I just gave up on MMORPGs for the time being.

 You guys havent even seen a real pvp video with UI and a full actual fight and you hype it soo much and asked others to do the same ... fanatical followers ? ..

Originally posted by airstrike

 You guys havent even seen a real pvp video with UI and a full actual fight and you hype it soo much and asked others to do the same ... fanatical followers ? ..

try watching the latest video, there are plenty of fights and the UI has been shown in numerous videos and screenshots now... the UI is minimal (to heighten immersion) and it's easy to miss.

good luck with it.

Originally posted by javac

Originally posted by airstrike

 You guys havent even seen a real pvp video with UI and a full actual fight and you hype it soo much and asked others to do the same ... fanatical followers ? ..

 

try watching the latest video, there are plenty of fights and the UI has been shown in numerous videos and screenshots now... the UI is minimal (to heighten immersion) and it's easy to miss.

 

good luck with it.

Yea problem is that latest video is Scripted.

Originally posted by airstrike

 You guys havent even seen a real pvp video with UI and a full actual fight and you hype it soo much and asked others to do the same ... fanatical followers ? ..

You will not find your generic MMORPG UI in Darkfall. No name tags (except for your current opponent's health box), no level/class/skill level signifiers, no arrows/spots on your radar, no scrolling damage points, no auto targeting. You will only have a small quickbar which you can also set and assign shortcut keys to skills/spells and for your items such as potions.

Fanatical followers? We're just trying to introduce the game to the MMORPG members who were unaware of Darkfall, and long term followers who quit following. My aim is to try to change the bad impressions many other posters (both Darkfall fans and vaporware trolls) have created about Darkfall previously.

Apparently, you're not aware of the latest Darkfall video or not fully informed about it. Why not ask and learn? If you're not comfortable with Darkfall Forums and their members, you can post it here, and I'm sure me or someone else will gladly help you out.

Originally posted by HYPERI0N

Originally posted by javac

Originally posted by airstrike

 You guys havent even seen a real pvp video with UI and a full actual fight and you hype it soo much and asked others to do the same ... fanatical followers ? ..

 

try watching the latest video, there are plenty of fights and the UI has been shown in numerous videos and screenshots now... the UI is minimal (to heighten immersion) and it's easy to miss.

 

good luck with it.

 

Yea problem is that latest video is Scripted.

Elaborate please?

If what you meant was, it looked as if they seemed to create a scenario for their gameplay video, I don't see why it's a problem. Instead of showing some horde of players aimlessly hitting and killing, they tried to demonstrate some specific situations that you will often see in a game.

The first scene was a castle intrusion where small groups (5 vs 5) having a local PvP is demonstrated.

The video shows how magic and combat goes hand in hand in PvP if you choose so, huge naval battles, several battle ships that come in different sizes, piracy, cannons and attacking a fortress from a coast.

They also have tried to demonstrate the cities, trading, player versus player interaction, crafting, banking system, and user UI to an extent.

Later in the video, you can see a 100 vs 100 battleground where Mirdain Elves, Humans and Dwarves are taking on Orks and Mahirims, how cavalry will be useful in battles, how a city siege will work out, some special siege vehicles, and how a city is destroyed (literally).

However, you should understand that this game is still in closed beta at the moment. They were able to prepare a simple animation for each probable occasion players will face in the given situations of the video. Therefore, it's very likely that current feel of the game from the video will be critically improved and there will be many more animations (such as more varieties of running, jumping, falling to the ground, death, bow shooting, melee swing animations, etc), explosion and magical effects added to the game prior to the release. I'm hopeful that much more sound effects will also be recorded by professionals and implemented prior to the release.

You can see at least one type of each of these animations/effects that demostrates the most important features of the game during the video.

Originally posted by HYPERI0N

Originally posted by javac

Originally posted by airstrike

 You guys havent even seen a real pvp video with UI and a full actual fight and you hype it soo much and asked others to do the same ... fanatical followers ? ..

 

try watching the latest video, there are plenty of fights and the UI has been shown in numerous videos and screenshots now... the UI is minimal (to heighten immersion) and it's easy to miss.

 

good luck with it.

 

Yea problem is that latest video is Scripted.

sure makes a lot of sense to script the whole 17 minute video when they could have just played the game with fraps running, right? and i suppose they were lying about the "100% in-game footage" as well?

some people are truly clueless.

An interesting poll that has recently been posted on Darkfall forums demonstrates how balanced the PvP will be between PKs, Anti-PKs and neutrals.

Contrary to what some speculators suggested in this thread about how Darkfall will turn out to be a gankfast to scare away non-PvP types, te polls clearly shows how most players will actually play it to enjoy the freedom and immersions (similar to UO and SWG) made available for casual players.

Please read on and feel free to join the discussion here:

http://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?t=70860

Originally posted by Ohforfsake

Wall of text is long, but yes I agree. There has been a severe shortage of Darkfall-type games over the past few years.

The op just put waaay too much into that post but I hope Df does deliver and even if not I hope they can atleast convince other companies to try to offer such open play.

Originally posted by Galaturc

An interesting poll that has recently been posted on Darkfall forums demonstrates how balanced the PvP will be between PKs, Anti-PKs and neutrals.

Contrary to what some speculators suggested in this thread about how Darkfall will turn out to be a gankfast to scare away non-PvP types, te polls clearly shows how most players will actually play it to enjoy the freedom and immersions (similar to UO and SWG) made available for casual players.

Please read on and feel free to join the discussion here:

http://forums.darkfallonline.com/showthread.php?t=70860

Agreed I played SWG during some of it's "open world pvp" and of course I got ganked but I didn't die to players any more so than I did to pve mobs so I personally don't worry too much about people crying gank fest. Believe it or not some people who enjoy pvp enjoy it for the challenge of playing against a player every pvp player is not some ganker just looking to make others lives miserable from my own experience I'd say most pvpers fall in the latter category I hope when the game comes out I enjoy it enough to stay on but I'm fairly certain I won't be "pushed" out of the game by pvp gankers.

Darkfall Beta began today. I guess we will find about the game very soon. Cheers to all vaportrolls!