Wow if you guys get this worked up over a game (even though I should know after going to a few football games) then I would really hate to see how you will respond when something really bad happens. I used to think Europeans in general were more laid back than this. Have a pint!

Cheers!

Originally posted by haltea

B U L L S H I T

Your comment is, yes

All I read was:

Mark Jacobs: "Yes, we should have listened to the DAoC Europe players and gone with a different company to host WAR, my bad"

Originally posted by haltea  

 

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Originally posted by haltea

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You are not getting it. They screwed thousand of paying consumers and whats his solution? Complain about the foul language of some of them? That only is a lousy attempt to hide incompetence.

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What paying customers? Putting money down on a pre-order doesn't make you a paying customer. Until you've purchased the box and started paying monthly fees, you aren't a paying customer.

That also isn't his solution. He is venting at the idiocy shown on the Internet today. That wordpress site is his...personal...blog. What is hard to understand about that? If it wasn't linked here, would you have ever seen that post?

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Oh come on, he knew exactly who would be reading it. If he wanted to vent his opinions somewhere noone, or only his friends, would read it he could have posted on a private forum or scribbled on a piece of paper and thrown it in the bin.

He was addressing the community directly or trying to defer blame.

People are acting crazy here in the EU - or as a fellow swede on another forum said:

"as long as GOA don't screw up Head Start there's no reason to soil your pants. maybe a wee wee is in order but please, keep the brown to yourself"
 

Alot of people - including some posts in this thread - should take some medication if their posts are in any way true expressions of their personas.

Originally posted by altairzq

Originally posted by haltea

B U L L S H I T

 

Totally agree. This guy is the most arrogant person I have seen in charge of a company. Arrogant and rude. And they hire AGAIN the company that have been giving a crappy service along the years. And now he comes here whining about.. insults in a forum I guess? God... what is he THINKING???

I am going to THIRD this sentiment.

Not only that but this is the second time I have seen him attack the customers, although this round is slightly indirect. But just like last time it is complaining about the customers complaining.

He was going after the customers complaining, becoming self-righteous, in the hopes of attracting our attention onto this total non-issue and maybe getting some sympathy. If there were serious threats made on the lives of employees, which I haven't seen nor heard of, than they can call the police and get them involved.

Yeah, totally disgusting. People are upset because they were promised a chance to get into open beta, that was part of the 80-110 bucks that they paid for. They didn't get it. They may not get into headstart by the looks of things either, wouldn't bet a bag of dirt on it.

But somebody got insulted

Man Ive played mmorgs for obviously too long,everywhere I look on the internet now its nothing but haters and assholes Im selling my comp and going back to consoles.

Originally posted by tuzalov

Man Ive played mmorgs for obviously too long,everywhere I look on the internet now its nothing but haters and assholes Im selling my comp and going back to consoles.

 

 

Well i think the thing is with this situation is that mythic would have learned to not do business with these people again after they messed op on DAoC, so as much as he hates how everyone is reacting to this he just has to deal with it and move on.  Perhaps when they make another mmo down the road they will understand to never do business with GOA.

First, he did not insult the community. He pointed out some people crossed a line and commented in a manner he did not expect.

Second, you missed only one day of open beta so far. There will be a server wipe before the headstart so what did you actually lost? Shit happens, you will get over it.

Third, if you really wanted to play so badly you should have tried harder. I was able to register a new account and my key so could you. Unfortunately it took like 10 hours and hundreds of timeouts but in the end it worked.

Oh and fourth, I think you crybabies fail at life and played too much WoW instead of going to school and stuff.

That is an insult.

So..... have any of you managed to learn this time, that MMO companies are all but incapable of learning from their mistakes ?

Oh well, another 40 or 50 of the same screwups by dev teams might eventually teach you just how incompetent they are.

It might.......

Originally posted by Scalebane

Well i think the thing is with this situation is that mythic would have learned to not do business with these people again after they messed op on DAoC, so as much as he hates how everyone is reacting to this he just has to deal with it and move on.  Perhaps when they make another mmo down the road they will understand to never do business with GOA.

Yes and between that how much Mark must have actually (now and then) read VN posts about DAoC.. nothing anyone might have posted should have been a suprise in any way.

The only positive for DAoC was there were no euro servers at launch so it was never region locked.. I never bothered to check to see if DAoC is... I know at least half the people I played with in DAoC were Euro's.. as I play different hours than most "americans".

I think it must be hard to find a decent host company in Europe as Sony had major complaints with their EQ2 Euro servers.

I know many of my friends in UO back when I played that seemed happy with their Euro servers.. wonder who they used.

To bad I cut the post out from the guy you responded to.. in a way I agree with them.  In fact I was talking to a friend about it earlier today.

When I first started MMO's sure there were asshats and such.. but not that bad.  Was in general good communities and people you wanted to group with.

Now its just like see how big a ahole you can be to everyone.  Obviously there are still decent people who play but they get lost in the screaming frenzy of the idiots... which is pretty much why I solo so much now in MMO's... I've never liked consoles but even *i* have gotten close to just moving to one... since PC's don't seem to get enough single player type games for my tastes any more.

Of course if a MMO developer was to actually create some community guide lines and enforce them with the nice ban stick... perhaps some of this crap would get cleaned up.

/end rantle

Oh and to close.. I'm not exactly the biggest WAR or Mythic fan around.. ya I played daoc for a long time.. but I honestly feel sorry for people that work at Mythic.. when they read some of the stuff people (including myself) type on forums... I mean even if for me the game sucked... somebody put a lot of hours into making it.. and is probably proud of what they did and hoping people enjoy it.  Hard to keep that perspective at times tho.

Any professional in the gaming world that lets what is said on the internet bother them then they might as well retire.   As for Mark Jacobs any time there is a hint of criticism directed his way he crumbles like a house of cards.

As for the GOA issues I feel for the European gamers and sadly I do not see the situation improving.

Funny. When I screw up at work, and it cost people time and/or money I am treated that way, Mark. It baffles me that he hasn't learned that considering the total screwup that was ToA and NF. Sometimes you just have to swallow your pride and apologize(and take the heat) for screwing up. I still am in disbelief that they choose GOA after they proved to be incompetent with DAoC.

I'm pretty sure that by the end of next week all this crap regarding registration, etc will be mostly forgotten - this doesn't really bother me - a screw up - yes, the end of the world - no,

However, what does bother me, is that GOA appear to have again shown that they don't have what it takes to manage the processes and communication to run a major MMO game and I therefore fear for the future of the EU version of WAR.

Originally posted by Gazenthia

Originally posted by altairzq

Originally posted by haltea

B U L L S H I T

 

Totally agree. This guy is the most arrogant person I have seen in charge of a company. Arrogant and rude. And they hire AGAIN the company that have been giving a crappy service along the years. And now he comes here whining about.. insults in a forum I guess? God... what is he THINKING???

I am going to THIRD this sentiment.

Not only that but this is the second time I have seen him attack the customers, although this round is slightly indirect. But just like last time it is complaining about the customers complaining.

He was going after the customers complaining, becoming self-righteous, in the hopes of attracting our attention onto this total non-issue and maybe getting some sympathy. If there were serious threats made on the lives of employees, which I haven't seen nor heard of, than they can call the police and get them involved.

Yeah, totally disgusting. People are upset because they were promised a chance to get into open beta, that was part of the 80-110 bucks that they paid for. They didn't get it. They may not get into headstart by the looks of things either, wouldn't bet a bag of dirt on it.

But somebody got insulted

Mark Jacobs was not attacking the entire WAR Community.  There was vile insults, racial slurs, things which is not proper manner of expressing your disgust of what happen with the EU site.

In his blog and his posts on WHA, he said people should be mad, should complain about the service.  But NO ONE should post some of the vile things people have posted about what happened over on the EU side.

This is why they do not have official Forums.

After playing the Beta for 2 hours yesterday morning I cant believe anyone would be upset about NOT playing it. I was about to get abusive for them actually having me waste my time with the beta down load...

WAR = Bore Fest so far, so no reason to get your panties in a bunch.

 Any bloke with a kid or can remember their own childhood shouldnt have any difficulty understanding why they took some serious flak.

Are we to believe that they dont understand any of the issues surrounding abuse/racism and over exuberant play, cyber bullying etc.

Come on please this really stretches the bounds of credibility.   

You knwo full well why you got so much flak - you wound up a load of people 9a lot of teenagers amoungst them) took their limited cash and promised them the xmas present that never arrived because you chose a bum to play Santa.

Originally posted by Adythiel

Originally posted by holonist

This could only come from a US player ... for the 1000000 time , UNDER EUROPEAN LAW EVERY SINGLE GIFT INCLUDED ON THE PACKAGE ITS PART OF THE PRODUCT AND PAID BY THE PRICE ASKED .

So yes , everyone who preorerdered a CE or a SE from a premium actually paid for OB access . Just let it rest , we are tired of beating this dead horse .

 

This is what is called a "legal loophole". The price of a Warhammer Online boxed game is the same price as a Warhammer Online boxed game with the goodies included. Due to local laws, the bonuses are labeled as being included in the purchase price of the game; which coincidentally as was earlier mentioned is the same price as the game without the bonuses.

This is the exact same thing as Canadians being asked a question whenever they win a contest. It is a loophole that allows companies to give away products and still be in compliance with local laws. This is nothing more than a legal loophole. While it appears to European authorities that you did in fact pay for said bonuses to be in compliance, you really did get them for free. A box without said goodies costs the same amount of money.

I did not get them for free.. I payed for them. Please stop.

the same comments I left on the blog site:

Nonsense!

There, I’ve got your attention I’d like to address two of the falsehoods that seem to be so prevalent.

1) “It’s beta, its not the product itself, just be happy to be given the chance.”

Beta crossed over a threshold once you start to sell it. Its no longer “spend your time to help the programmer’s make a better game” when you start to sell access to the beta. Tens of thousands of players have made decisions about which of the WAR products to buy, and what vendors to use, based on the understanding that they were buying the additional service of Beta access. Even worse, the forums are full of people buying boxed ‘beta-access’ packages which do not include the rights to play the game at all. Beta is now a product, and as such a company must supply reasonably expected service for money, or provide refunds.

I’m expecting GOA to announce 2 weeks additional play time for everyone with a beta key who endured the frustration of their absurdly amateurish attempts (which were so obvious even the public forums were full of warnings) at providing a service.

2) “People are unreasonably angry and abusive on the internet when things go wrong.”

Complete poppycock again. Imagine for a minute that you scheduled a concert for thousands of LIVE people who pay money, change their plans, and then show up with tickets to a concert venue they can’t get into and they wait for hours with NO WORD OR APOLOGY from the organizers. I’ll laugh in your face if you tell me you wouldn’t hear some ‘hateful’ language while walking through that crowd.

Mark may consider himself ‘cynical’, and Mythic and GOA can attempt to obfuscate the real issues by pretending to be shocked. I say that they should all thank the blessed stars they deal in internet events and products and not live ones.

If, for example, something goes horribly wrong at a fanfest and they are faced with tens of thousands of intensely frustrated live people, I’m guessing there would be a whole lot more in the way of information dissemination and apologies, and a whole lot less of “guys, look at how badly you are behaving.”

While we are talking about good behaviour, do you think a simple public apology from GOA to their customers might be in order?

Originally posted by tuzalov

Man Ive played mmorgs for obviously too long,everywhere I look on the internet now its nothing but haters and assholes Im selling my comp and going back to consoles.

 

 

Don't let the door hit you on your way out!

...someone had to say it

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Originally posted by Mattissimo

 

First, he did not insult the community. He pointed out some people crossed a line and commented in a manner he did not expect.

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He insulted the community again just by doing what he did: making a big deal over NOTHING in an blatant attempt to draw away and degrade the focus over what happened. Believe me you, I think he was complaining about everyone who had an issue with what happened in much the same way he called everyone who worried about the game collectively as "trolls". Yeah there is even a history of the BS.

I have no patience for people that cant do their job properly, wont admit when they need help and consistently lie to people.

If GOA were fire fighters defending a burning building then everyone in the city would be dead by now. Dont like my example? Some programmers write military systems to guide missiles, health systems to book appointments, robots that perform operations etc. Programming is not a profession where incompetence should be applauded.

I think Mark J and Mythic are doing a excellent job, the games very very good and will be a long term game 3-5years. Total praise for all envolved in making the game.

Mark shouldnt really have to defend Goa thats upto themselves to be more envolved with playerbase.

Only bad bad move was GOA, we did give them the benifit of the doubt to pull things of smoothly this time around because PR said over and over again this past year that they learnt their lesson from running Daoc and things would change.

If their were official properly mod forums ran by joint Goa/Mythic all the damage could of been controlled so much better.

Flash website, nobody in EU wants this what we want is a clone of US website and US herald. End off..

Goa have drawn a line and completly said NO NO NO this isnt up for discussion.

Listen to the majority of the fanbase and get Website/Forums sorted. Community spead everwhere isnt good.

I read alot of forums on sunday and cant honestly say I didnt see death threats anywhere.

Comments from Goa like quote IainC are pretty hurtfull. All the newsletters past years, all the buildup and excitement yea people sure were pissed.

"If having delayed access to a beta test really drives you to such depths of anger and fury then - and there is no polite way to put this - there is something wrong with you.
"

Brilliant game.

this waiting made me inpulse buy a new DJ rigg.  GG

Originally posted by adfoam 

There was vile insults, racial slurs, things which is not proper manner of expressing your disgust of what happen with the EU site.

Where? I never saw any nor did I hear reports of any before Mark Jacobs made that blog post.

He's lying to try and cover up GOA's ineptitude.