I don't really like to use the word nerf when referring to a beta, but it seems to fit.

Last preview weekend, I mostly played Archmage and Runepriest, but this time around, they both seems to be more squishy, have weaker heals, less action/power/mana, and even less damage than before.

Is this all in my mind?

Hmm i didint notice anything , they even added a spell fro runepriest , reduce damage by 50% and reduce AP use by 35% , save my butt alot .

Originally posted by darwa

Is this all in my mind?

No.

I even made a thread about the overall DPS nerf earlier tonight: http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/199416

This close to release, I think it is safe to call this a nerf. I will just play a DPS class and hope this problem is taken care of before I get to attached to the substitute.
 

Quick question, and this is not to insite rage, why would you want the Archmage and Rune Priest to do more DPS and have great heals?

I been playing a Sguig herder (Big shootin mastery line) where they healed right through all my hard hitting ranged attacks until they got within melee and then beat the hell out of me while applying their mega Order kill Squig dots.

I don't think it is a viable idea for them to be able to take out a Ranged DPS class by doing what they were doing (the change was needed).

Another question I forgot to ask, have you guys actually got your DoT specials yet?

I'm asking this because that's where Archmages damaging power comes in for them not overall spell burst damage (that is Bright Wizard's department).

I have played healers in the WAR beta for the past year and this was a much needed change. Now melee characters can do their job, rather than getting cut down on the way to the fight. They didn't reduce healing too much, I can still keep people alive for quite awhile, just not indefinately, and not when its 4 on 1 like previously. I wouldn't say this was a nerf, it was BALANCING.

Cheers!

Originally posted by Tonev

Quick question, and this is not to insite rage, why would you want the Archmage and Rune Priest to do more DPS and have great heals?

Who said that?

I was merely enquiring based on my observations.

Ummm fellas in a game like this a healer SHOULD keep you alive and an entire party alive against opposing damage.

this is not wow or fury,,,, which are mmo first person shooters. this is a TACTICAL mmorpg.

if you are endlessly pounding on an ironbreaker and want to cry nerf.... why dont you ignore the ironbreaker and kill the healer?

in every rpg ever created since the dawn of time the oldest line is "rush the mage"and in every pvp game i have ever played the healer class has been like the most pivotal to any battle. why would this game be any different?

yes I noticed a healing nerf. sorta. they made the smallest heal insta cast... but making the spell instant cast you have to greatly lower its effectiveness. they also lowered the effectiveness of the big long slow heal but in my opinion lowered it a bit too much. 

now the 3 sec long heal restores as much hp as the britewizards 3 sec long fireball deals...... thats a huge problem. healing cant crit for 100% damage and heal you OVER your hp total... like the bw damage can.

to me healing should always have longer range, 50% more points per damage spell 50% more efficent than damage mana wise  to make any game balanced.

Originally posted by Gazenthia

Originally posted by darwa

Is this all in my mind?

 

No.

I even made a thread about the overall DPS nerf earlier tonight: http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/199416

This close to release, I think it is safe to call this a nerf. I will just play a DPS class and hope this problem is taken care of before I get to attached to the substitute.
 

Wrong.  You don't get 'nerfs' in Beta, they are adjustments and balances .

Originally posted by Tonev

Quick question, and this is not to insite rage, why would you want the Archmage and Rune Priest to do more DPS and have great heals?

Right now let us lower our expectations to just getting players past the first 5 minutes of playing an archmage, okay? That would be the DPS problem.

Originally posted by Spaceweed10

Originally posted by Gazenthia

Originally posted by darwa

Is this all in my mind?

 

No.

I even made a thread about the overall DPS nerf earlier tonight: http://www.mmorpg.com/discussion2.cfm/thread/199416

This close to release, I think it is safe to call this a nerf. I will just play a DPS class and hope this problem is taken care of before I get to attached to the substitute.
 

 

Wrong.  You don't get 'nerfs' in Beta, they are adjustments and balances .

I hate when people start off with "wrong" its so defencive and unnecessary.  anyway i do agree with you; betas are for reasolving issues like bugs, glitches, exploits and balancing classes.  im not even saying that the kids at WAR got this issue right but atleast there addressing it and if they see that there wrong maybe theyll change it back before beta is over.

how can u have nerfs when its still beta?...

try take the game as it  is when it goes full live, ..

anything after that is a nerf.

But from what ive seen i dont think there will be anything like the massive nerfs that happened in DaoC - post release.

Anything that happens before a character wipe is not a nerf.

We were told of some of the changes in this patch as much as a month ago so hard to call this a nerf. There are still some changes they mentioned on the beta boards that havent' happened yet so I assume we see more later.

I played a Rune Priest in the beta stage of testing this patch and am playing an Archmage now and both of them are doing just fine so not really seeing a problem. Both of them feel very powerful though the AM is a bit too squishy for the first 9 ranks or so.

Originally posted by Ender4

We were told of some of the changes in this patch as much as a month ago so hard to call this a nerf. There are still some changes they mentioned on the beta boards that havent' happened yet so I assume we see more later.

I played a Rune Priest in the beta stage of testing this patch and am playing an Archmage now and both of them are doing just fine so not really seeing a problem. Both of them feel very powerful though the AM is a bit too squishy for the first 9 ranks or so.

1) Where were "we" told about these changes?

2) How does having prior knowledge negate the problems?

3) The first 9 levels happen to be the most important, so that only compounds the problem.

To the others in this thread making posts about how technically this isn't a nerf because its beta... cut it out. We don't need 5 pages of you guys being spammy butt-holes over a technicality. One post was enough.

If you have access to the beta forums go back and look at the 3.3 feedback threads, some of the changes in this patch were mentioned by devs in those. My point is you can't call this a nerf, these are design changes that have been in the works before the game ever came out of closed beta. Calling it a nerf at this point is completely absurd.

I still place in the top 10 easily on my AM while still doing well on the healing lists in a scenario. My RP doesn't do much dmg but he is the 'pure healer' class so I guess I didn't really expect his dmg to be great.

Originally posted by Gazenthia

Originally posted by Ender4

We were told of some of the changes in this patch as much as a month ago so hard to call this a nerf. There are still some changes they mentioned on the beta boards that havent' happened yet so I assume we see more later.

I played a Rune Priest in the beta stage of testing this patch and am playing an Archmage now and both of them are doing just fine so not really seeing a problem. Both of them feel very powerful though the AM is a bit too squishy for the first 9 ranks or so.

 

1) Where were "we" told about these changes?

2) How does having prior knowledge negate the problems?

3) The first 9 levels happen to be the most important, so that only compounds the problem.

To the others in this thread making posts about how technically this isn't a nerf because its beta... cut it out. We don't need 5 pages of you guys being spammy butt-holes over a technicality. One post was enough.

1.   who cares?

2.  whats the problem, thats what betas are for, testing

3.  why are the first 9 anymore importaint then any others and agian what problem?

spammy butt-holes?  everyone else made 1 each post to correct you and others who complained about a nerfing in beta youve made 3; grow up dude

I saw runepriests heal tank six opponents at a time preview weekend. They needed nerfing.

Originally posted by Gazenthia

Originally posted by Ender4

We were told of some of the changes in this patch as much as a month ago so hard to call this a nerf. There are still some changes they mentioned on the beta boards that havent' happened yet so I assume we see more later.

I played a Rune Priest in the beta stage of testing this patch and am playing an Archmage now and both of them are doing just fine so not really seeing a problem. Both of them feel very powerful though the AM is a bit too squishy for the first 9 ranks or so.

 

1) Where were "we" told about these changes?

2) How does having prior knowledge negate the problems?

3) The first 9 levels happen to be the most important, so that only compounds the problem.

To the others in this thread making posts about how technically this isn't a nerf because its beta... cut it out. We don't need 5 pages of you guys being spammy butt-holes over a technicality. One post was enough.

Just don't play the game if you don't like it.

Beta = Balancing.. there is no nerf...

We= Beta Players

First 9 level most important???

{ Mod Edit }

To the person talking about the beta boards- only a fraction of the current testers can get to those boards. I'm not one of them, and therefor I had no warning even if it meant something.

To the person asking who cares if it was in the patch notes- Apparently the person who originally brought it up. If you read my post, you would see that I didn't know why it mattered either.

What we see in beta this close to launch, as I have noted before, is something to worry about as it is going to be close to what we see in the release of the game. Chanting that it is beta will not invoke a disguise for the short-coming, let alone fix it.

I'm hearing way to much of that chanting as opposed to suggestions on how they might better balance, at the least, the healer DPS. My experience of the Archmage was far to tedius, the leveling and progress taking way to long even without other choices. The first levels are the most important for both the specific class, and the game, as that is when players are testing things.

I tried the archmage again earlier tonight, got bored, and noticed that there were maybe one or two other archmages around. This is going to be very bad for the High Elf players conjointly. People aren't going to want to stick around and play like that when there are so many other options available to them. The solution to this seems simple: Upgrade the damage of Radiant Lance for the first couple of levels so that players won't pull their hair out after the first quest.
 

There are a ton of spells and abilities for them to toy with to balance out issues- later on in the higher levels. I can't figure out what was such a deadly threat at level 1 that they had to have archmages spend a minute and a half on a lvl 1 imp.


Off-topic:

Whether this is called a nerf or a beta balance is both IRRELEVANT and a purely semantic argument. It was made and completed on the first post, which was naturally a one liner. Everything past that is spam. Now get back to the topic, folks.


 

Such anger over a simple question. lol