Originally posted by singsofdeath

Originally posted by Hhussk

I just want to add to my original post for the sake of making a point.

I'm no Darkfall fanboi. If it comes out, great. If it doesn't come out. Oh well. But I can't remember the number of times people called Darkfall "Vaporware". And I was laughing the other day because people were blasting DF because the video didn't come out early enough.

Look, I don't know if the game is going to actually come out. It appears that "something" is on the horizon. My definition of Vaporware is a game that ultimately does not release. Perhaps they started it and couldn't finish it, or perhaps they never had code at all. Either way, Darkfall could still end up as Vaporware.

But to all you who hate a game you never played....I just don't understand the anger. So, things are moving along, and now you don't want to admit you might be wrong. Instead, I'm watching you all turn from "vaporware" to "crapware". I think you are making the same mistake. Once again, you really don't know anything to make a respectable judgement. It appears that you are just angry with the Darkfall creators.

On a side note, I'm amused how many people are calling it crapware because of graphics (et al). I would like to remind you that Age of Conan had incredible graphics...and its not doing so well. According to my experiences, graphics is only the initial 'draw' to the game. Once you start playing, you don't pay attention to them anymore. Ultimately, all I'm concerned about is a game that has good mechanics and support. Hell, I would enjoy a good MUD if it was well done.

Anyhow, this is my stake, my opinion, on Darkfall. I'm hoping for a well done game. That's all. Same goes for Warhammer.

 

Actually, there's not -so- many people who are -switching- from one opinion to another. I don't have numbers, but as someone who's been repeatedly called a Troll about this, I can tell you that I do think there is a game and have thought so for a long while. Check my history if you want, that's a fact.

 

I have however also always been skeptical about the wealth of features that the Developers promised for the game and rather disappointed by the little we have seen of those in the Video. That is why I will maintain my opinion, namely that the game will come out, but not with all of the promised features and/or with many of them broken, not working properly etc. 

 

Graphics? Sure, not top-notch, but that's no big deal. Effects and animations, yeah, they should work on that, but that#s doable. It's the things I haven#t seen in this video however that are much more interesting. So...until I've played it/tested it (for FREE mind you, since that was another promise of the Dev's), I see no reason to apologize to anyone. Especially not people who seem to think that they alone have the right to decide what comprises a good game.

Best, most reasonable post I have seen in a while on mmorpg. IF and WHEN it releases I'll play it if its any good. Nothing in that video tells me if it will be. Beta will. That is all.

Originally posted by Xris375

Originally posted by Shannia

Originally posted by imbant

Originally posted by butters88

Apoligize because they saw a video? Why don't you just wait until beta starts to see what the reactions are? And then make this thread... if it actually proves to be decent.

 

ill assume you are new to the df forum...because up until yesterday many people were insulting the fans saying we will never see a video and we were all morons being lied to. and how can there be a video when there is no game at all.

so yea, many have apologized, many lack the character to do so...but we get the last laugh...a great game

 

With all due respect, why make such a moronic statement?

The only thing you have going for your argument right now is a video.  NOTHING MORE, NOTHING LESS.  Guess what, Vanguard guard and AoC fans got new videos of "gameplay" all the time during development and AoC had hype running so high, it was insane.  The game launched and 3 months later we all know the rest of the AoC story.  So please, don't go claiming you get the last laugh.  Many companies have given us amazing videos and their games turned out to play like steaming piles of dog waste and a huge waste of money.

 

What was wrong with that statement ? He talks about the video and some people being wrong about it not being released this week as promised. We got the last laugh on that one. So you start a rant about a video doesn't prove anything ?! Of course it doesn't prove anything. It was made for the fans to answer a whole lot of questions and reveal some surprises as well. To turn thing around, does a video prove the game will not release ? Can you provide proof?

 

there was absolutly nothing wrong with my statement...certainly not moronic.

some people just dont have the respect and are so self centered that they dont read other peoples posts and just see what they want to see.

Like you said...all i explained was the before the video released...there were trolls insulting us saying there was 0 CHANCE we will see a video and that some were even spamming the local time in greece throwing it in our face.

We got the last laugh with stickin to our belief (and using common sense because we take the time to view the official forums) and we got not only an amazing video but beta as well.

The quality of the video or what it means had nothing to do with it, just that it came period.  But you cant expect everyone to use common sense, especially the trolls.

Originally posted by golstat2003

Originally posted by singsofdeath

Originally posted by Hhussk

I just want to add to my original post for the sake of making a point.

I'm no Darkfall fanboi. If it comes out, great. If it doesn't come out. Oh well. But I can't remember the number of times people called Darkfall "Vaporware". And I was laughing the other day because people were blasting DF because the video didn't come out early enough.

Look, I don't know if the game is going to actually come out. It appears that "something" is on the horizon. My definition of Vaporware is a game that ultimately does not release. Perhaps they started it and couldn't finish it, or perhaps they never had code at all. Either way, Darkfall could still end up as Vaporware.

But to all you who hate a game you never played....I just don't understand the anger. So, things are moving along, and now you don't want to admit you might be wrong. Instead, I'm watching you all turn from "vaporware" to "crapware". I think you are making the same mistake. Once again, you really don't know anything to make a respectable judgement. It appears that you are just angry with the Darkfall creators.

On a side note, I'm amused how many people are calling it crapware because of graphics (et al). I would like to remind you that Age of Conan had incredible graphics...and its not doing so well. According to my experiences, graphics is only the initial 'draw' to the game. Once you start playing, you don't pay attention to them anymore. Ultimately, all I'm concerned about is a game that has good mechanics and support. Hell, I would enjoy a good MUD if it was well done.

Anyhow, this is my stake, my opinion, on Darkfall. I'm hoping for a well done game. That's all. Same goes for Warhammer.

 

Actually, there's not -so- many people who are -switching- from one opinion to another. I don't have numbers, but as someone who's been repeatedly called a Troll about this, I can tell you that I do think there is a game and have thought so for a long while. Check my history if you want, that's a fact.

 

I have however also always been skeptical about the wealth of features that the Developers promised for the game and rather disappointed by the little we have seen of those in the Video. That is why I will maintain my opinion, namely that the game will come out, but not with all of the promised features and/or with many of them broken, not working properly etc. 

 

Graphics? Sure, not top-notch, but that's no big deal. Effects and animations, yeah, they should work on that, but that#s doable. It's the things I haven#t seen in this video however that are much more interesting. So...until I've played it/tested it (for FREE mind you, since that was another promise of the Dev's), I see no reason to apologize to anyone. Especially not people who seem to think that they alone have the right to decide what comprises a good game.

 

Best, most reasonable post I have seen in a while on mmorpg. IF and WHEN it releases I'll play it if its any good. Nothing in that video tells me if it will be. Beta will. That is all.

All 3 of these posts are very sensible well thought out posts in a sea of extremes. Well done gentlemen, I salute you all. I have said for a while that although Darkfall looks exceptionally good on paper that the only way to truly judge any game is to play it. I will be playing DF when it releases or in Beta if I get the chance and I will reserve my judgement until that time. This has been my take on DF since the day I found out about it over 4 years ago and still is true today. A video proves nothing about the game other than it is real at this point. Whether or not the game is fun and holds true on the promises that have been made about it remains to be seen. I'll admit the Video has raised my excitement level about Darkfall a little but I still remain steadfast that you can't judge a game until you play it for yourself. All of you that have already judged this game, good or bad, need to take a step back and think about it a little more. Judging a game without playing it is severely flawed logic and is just stupid to do.

Bren

Originally posted by imbant

Originally posted by Xris375

Originally posted by Shannia

Originally posted by imbant

Originally posted by butters88

Apoligize because they saw a video? Why don't you just wait until beta starts to see what the reactions are? And then make this thread... if it actually proves to be decent.

 

ill assume you are new to the df forum...because up until yesterday many people were insulting the fans saying we will never see a video and we were all morons being lied to. and how can there be a video when there is no game at all.

so yea, many have apologized, many lack the character to do so...but we get the last laugh...a great game

 

With all due respect, why make such a moronic statement?

The only thing you have going for your argument right now is a video.  NOTHING MORE, NOTHING LESS.  Guess what, Vanguard guard and AoC fans got new videos of "gameplay" all the time during development and AoC had hype running so high, it was insane.  The game launched and 3 months later we all know the rest of the AoC story.  So please, don't go claiming you get the last laugh.  Many companies have given us amazing videos and their games turned out to play like steaming piles of dog waste and a huge waste of money.

 

What was wrong with that statement ? He talks about the video and some people being wrong about it not being released this week as promised. We got the last laugh on that one. So you start a rant about a video doesn't prove anything ?! Of course it doesn't prove anything. It was made for the fans to answer a whole lot of questions and reveal some surprises as well. To turn thing around, does a video prove the game will not release ? Can you provide proof?

 

 

there was absolutly nothing wrong with my statement...certainly not moronic.

some people just dont have the respect and are so self centered that they dont read other peoples posts and just see what they want to see.

Like you said...all i explained was the before the video released...there were trolls insulting us saying there was 0 CHANCE we will see a video and that some were even spamming the local time in greece throwing it in our face.

We got the last laugh with stickin to our belief (and using common sense because we take the time to view the official forums) and we got not only an amazing video but beta as well.

The quality of the video or what it means had nothing to do with it, just that it came period.  But you cant expect everyone to use common sense, especially the trolls.

Yes, there was.  You said you have the last laugh because you have "A GREAT GAME".  That is your words, not mine.  Just because you got a decent video delivered Friday doesn't mean that you got "a great game".  We don't know what we have YET.  Just remember how good all those AoC videos looked with all the boobs, battles, and decapation.  Now look at the game.  I'm tired of all the pro DFO talk when stil, after nearly seven years of development, we don't have beta.  HOPEFULLY, in October we can revisit your claim to how great of a game DFO is.  That is why I said your comment was a bit moronic.

nit

What the video shows is that they seem to have a box. The thing they haven't shown is that there is actually sand in it - which can be done in about 30 minutes. Why they choose not to do the second gives me reservations about the first.

Originally posted by Draconus 

 i know people in the beta that say this game is not anything close to what was promised and they don't even test anymore.

Bullshit. Have you ever considered just how lame your life has become where you feel the need to come to an internet forum and BLATANTLY LIE about a game you've never played? Dude. Get a grip on yourself FFS.

If, and until, the game releases with everything Tasos claims, there is nothing to apologize for.

Originally posted by Zorvan

If, and until, the game releases with everything Tasos claims, there is nothing to apologize for.

Oh come on.  Zorvan you arent even a troll here.  But that statement is wrong.

There is a wide range of naysayers on this forum, and some have already eaten crow with the video releasing because they swore it would never happen.

But if this game releases at all it would put the majority of haters in their place because the majority is the people who claim its vaporware.

Others like yourself think that the game is just in a crap state and will release with bugs/unfinished/etc and will die a quick death.  Even that doesnt need a perfect launch with EVERYTHING Tasos claims.  If they leave out a feature or two here or there...as long is it isnt features like "pvp" or something huge then yes there will be something to apologize for.

If, for example, ship building and navigation are all in, but the cannons see a bug in open beta and cant make it to launch...that is hardly something to get all upset over.

Now another example...if city building doesnt make it in launch...or the dynamic AI of mob camps improving if they go unchecked over time...then yes that would be something major that got left out.

I know you got burned hard by AoC's shady bs...but dont blame DF for their mistakes.  They do not need to release the game with EVERYTHING at 100%, what game hasnt cut something out on release?

This forum is quickly going from "nothing to see here move along" to "it fails unless it releases x, y, and z"  things are looking up =)

Originally posted by imbant

Originally posted by Zorvan

If, and until, the game releases with everything Tasos claims, there is nothing to apologize for.

 

Oh come on.  Zorvan you arent even a troll here.  But that statement is wrong.

There is a wide range of naysayers on this forum, and some have already eaten crow with the video releasing because they swore it would never happen.

But if this game releases at all it would put the majority of haters in their place because the majority is the people who claim its vaporware.

Others like yourself think that the game is just in a crap state and will release with bugs/unfinished/etc and will die a quick death.  Even that doesnt need a perfect launch with EVERYTHING Tasos claims.  If they leave out a feature or two here or there...as long is it isnt features like "pvp" or something huge then yes there will be something to apologize for.

If, for example, ship building and navigation are all in, but the cannons see a bug in open beta and cant make it to launch...that is hardly something to get all upset over.

Now another example...if city building doesnt make it in launch...or the dynamic AI of mob camps improving if they go unchecked over time...then yes that would be something major that got left out.

I know you got burned hard by AoC's shady bs...but dont blame DF for their mistakes.  They do not need to release the game with EVERYTHING at 100%, what game hasnt cut something out on release?

This forum is quickly going from "nothing to see here move along" to "it fails unless it releases x, y, and z"  things are looking up =)

I hold the game to the standards set by Tasos. He is the one who makes the claims of 200+ people all on screen PvPing with no lag on average computers. He is the one who has stated many times that the game is finished and just being "polished". So, if the game is complete, then everything should be in and ready for release.

Therefore, I expect everything to be in the game at release, or it fails. Bugs are one thing, not included is another.

First of all, when did you change your sig?  Im liking the AoC quote.

And I can sort of see where you are comming from, but i guess im just not as hardcore and maybe a little blinded by my boredom with the MMO world right now.  I really want this game to release because it will be something new and exciting.

So to me if it drops a random unnoticable feature here or there, it doesnt take away from the game for me.  But if thats what it does to you thats cool.

But in terms of the whole DF vs Vapor battle...it doesnt need to be 100% perfect on release.

Originally posted by 123123456202

Originally posted by ddev

Originally posted by Draconus

instead of calling it vaporeware we can now call it "Crapware"

the game play and the graphics look like crap in the video and i know people in the beta that say this game is not anything close to what was promised and they don't even test anymore.

For your guys sake I do wish that it is everything you are looking for, because I would never wish that anyones game would fail, but from what I have seen so far this will be nothing but a bunch of guys running in circles in a FFA frag fest with there 8 year old PC becuase they can't play anything good.

best of luck to you all, you will need it

 

Let me expand a bit with your permission of course :p

The game is BOTH Vaporware AND Crapware ... :)

And its also the only candidate of  DINOSAURWARE (10 years in development, 10 year old designs)

let me help you all comprehend this its looks semi good if you download the file but you watched it on youtube and it looked horrible, the graphics them selfs are turned to medium including the shadows and textures, and spell animations, cannonballs, and maybe this ship ons ( not sure bout the ship ones) would turned all the way on low want to know why because the computers have a 6800 nvidia card and they are recording a video in HD and playing the game at the same time bad combo just maybe so yah the game will impress alot more when open beta is started.....also the animations looked choppy because they did a 3:4 ratio on the frame rate instead of 1:1 while they edited it so the video would not be 2 gigs.

Im not criticizing the video itself or the gfx quality, or at least not just these, and yes I have watched the footage in youtube. Im not gonna spend an hour downloading this Dinosaurware.

There is a clear indication from what I have watched that developers tried and copied a lot of other mmorpgs in an attempt to make the super mmorpg that is called DF. If you guys can recall in the course of this development, there were no thoughts of adding ships but somewhere along, 2 years back, PoTBS was out, so they adjusted like Borgs adjust and add them! And what a bad copy it was! Did you really liked that flying piece of junk in a medieval game with swords and arrows ??? 

Am I not gonna see those if I d/l the files of this crapware?

The game is doomed, and a launch within 2008 is impossible. A launch within 2009 will be actually more of an open beta, with questionable results.

10 years in the making... 10 years old Dinosaur

http://vimeo.com/1631260

no need to dl it...here is a slightly better quality version of it....no excuse not to watch.

Come back when the game hits beta IN 2008 and when it releases whenever and see how you feel when there is more information on it out. 

 Better resolution, same bad taste.

In fact, better resolution reveals a lot to criticize. Where is all that polishing? All Tasos was saying with those dev logs of him, was that he polished and he was polishing and he polished even more, and wax was over and then he bought some more for some more polishing. 

No debris from weapons hitting walls, buildings, ships

Ships in particular very poorly designed, bad animations.... bleh its a waste of time. this thing needs some 2-3 years to finish

Originally posted by ddev

 Better resolution, same bad taste.

In fact, better resolution reveals a lot to criticize. Where is all that polishing? All Tasos was saying with those dev logs of him, was that he polished and he was polishing and he polished even more, and wax was over and then he bought some more for some more polishing. 

No debris from weapons hitting walls, buildings, ships

Ships in particular very poorly designed, bad animations.... bleh its a waste of time. this thing needs some 2-3 years to finish

But tell us how you really feel =)

Hey this game isnt for everyone and thats cool.  The majority feel that this game looks amazing and this video has opened a lot of eyes and even openly converted a lot of naysayers.

The Graphics are above what i thought they needed to be to achieve the large scale battles (see AoC failing with its graphics) but everything looks amazing.

Any comments on the timeframe of the video i gave? would love to hear your thoughts on that.

It actually doesnt need 2-3 years to finish since they are planning an 08 beta and release soon after =)

Hopefully rhe servres will be stable on release, if that happens and there arent major features taken out, this will be an amazing game for its target audience and the people who dont enjoy this niche game will hopefully have fun in one that is more to their liking.

Originally posted by Hhussk

For all you people who cried "vaporware", I was wondering if you are preparing to apologize. Feel free to start here in this thread.

could someone please sticky the definition of vaporware, as a lot of people seem to have no concept of what that term means?  thanks.

Vaporware is a somewhat derogatory term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar software/hardware product. The term implies unwarranted optimism, an as yet unannounced abandonment of a project, or sometimes even deception; that is, it may imply that the announcer knows that product development is in too early a stage to support responsible statements about its completion date, feature set, or even feasibility. However, most vaporware would not be considered a hoax since the makers have a genuine intention to create their product, even if it ultimately never materializes. Products with unspecified release dates or long development times that outwardly demonstrate regular, verifiable progress in production are not normally labelled vaporware.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaporware

Originally posted by damian7

Originally posted by Hhussk

For all you people who cried "vaporware", I was wondering if you are preparing to apologize. Feel free to start here in this thread.

 

could someone please sticky the definition of vaporware, as a lot of people seem to have no concept of what that term means?  thanks.

 

 

Vaporware is a somewhat derogatory term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar software/hardware product. The term implies unwarranted optimism, an as yet unannounced abandonment of a project, or sometimes even deception; that is, it may imply that the announcer knows that product development is in too early a stage to support responsible statements about its completion date, feature set, or even feasibility. However, most vaporware would not be considered a hoax since the makers have a genuine intention to create their product, even if it ultimately never materializes. Products with unspecified release dates or long development times that outwardly demonstrate regular, verifiable progress in production are not normally labelled vaporware.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaporware

FOI

I marked the words that in fact do NOT define DF as VW. Thanks for not pointing that out.

Originally posted by Sulinar

I have nothing to apologise for. It's hilarious watching you idiots get excited over that crappy video.

I know im excited about it too!  See you in game!

Originally posted by Xris375

Originally posted by damian7

Originally posted by Hhussk

For all you people who cried "vaporware", I was wondering if you are preparing to apologize. Feel free to start here in this thread.

 

could someone please sticky the definition of vaporware, as a lot of people seem to have no concept of what that term means?  thanks.

 

 

Vaporware is a somewhat derogatory term used to describe a software or hardware product that is announced by a developer well in advance of release, but which then fails to emerge after having well exceeded the period of development time that was initially claimed or would normally be expected for the development cycle of a similar software/hardware product. The term implies unwarranted optimism, an as yet unannounced abandonment of a project, or sometimes even deception; that is, it may imply that the announcer knows that product development is in too early a stage to support responsible statements about its completion date, feature set, or even feasibility. However, most vaporware would not be considered a hoax since the makers have a genuine intention to create their product, even if it ultimately never materializes. Products with unspecified release dates or long development times that outwardly demonstrate regular, verifiable progress in production are not normally labelled vaporware.

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vaporware

 

FOI

I marked the words that in fact do NOT define DF as VW. Thanks for not pointing that out.

Wow...Damian...looks like you should read before you post definitions blindy.  Apology accepted =)

Originally posted by Sulinar

I have nothing to apologise for. It's hilarious watching you idiots get excited over that crappy video.

You got me interested, which MMO is your favorite at the moment?