Lord of the Rings Online

I think LoTRO has some if not the best quests in the MMORPG world. Considering the limitations of the license they have really done a remarkable job. Their Epics are truly that epic. Second best in my opinion is the level 1 - 20 quest line in AoC. All MMORPGs quests fall into either kill quests or travel quests. the only difference is how well they are written and how they mesh with the overall feel of the game world.

Third place would be WoW. Although I don't play WoW myself some of my friends do and they crack me up with some of their quest lines :) A couple of WoW that  I remember reading about were some bombing run thing in the last expansion and one where you had to follow some dog that had ate some gems(?) and get items them his poop. Funny stuff there, gotta give Bliz credit on that one.

Anyway here is game design 101- all quests have to be designed around a game mechanic that the player character can perform. Which basically fall into 2 different categories.

1) kill quests

   (a) kill ten foozles

   (b) kill ten foozles and bring their beak to me

   (c) kill ten foozles and take their beaks to another NPC

   (d) find ten foozle beaks, butt flowers, dead butterflies, iron ore etc laying on the ground  and take them to  designated   NPC

2) fedex

    (a) take item A and deliver it to NPC Dimwit in another part of the player world

    (b) take item A and deliver it to NPC DImwith then go where ever from there

    (c) find locations x, y, z etc in the player world

     (d) go to NPC Dimwith and get item A and bring it back to me

   3) escort quests. Escort NPC from point a to point b and keep their sorry butts alive. My personal least favorite quest type

What I am saying is that all quests are either  traveling to a point known or unknown, gathering items or interacting with a static or dynamic entity. Static being a resource node, flower on the ground etc dynamic being either NPC or mob that gives damage in return.

ok discuss and see if you can come up with any quest from any other MMORPG which would not fall into 1 of those categories

I think this is a major concern for MMO's, and unless more scripting gets involved, we will be doomed to always deal with these.

That is why my preference is for Guild Wars style of MMO gaming. The instancing helps matters quite a bit.

For example

"Rilohn Refuge"

• Protect Dehjah until she opens the entrance to the Mahnkelon Waterworks.
•  Make your way to the central reservoir.
•  Weaken the Drought by shutting off the water pumps.
• Bonus Defeat the Drought without shutting down water pumps.

Notice the clear objectives as you progress throigh the quest..or

"Tihark Orchard"

Convince the three Princes of Vabbi to join the fight against Varesh.

• Recruit Prince Mehtu the Wise for your war against Varesh.
• Persuade Prince Bokka the Magnificent to join the Sunspears in the struggle against Warmarshal Varesh.
• Coerce Prince Ahmtur the Mighty to ally against Warmarshal Varesh.
• Prince Ahmtur the Mighty wishes to speak with you again. Find out what he has to say.

Then you find out the only way to recruit the princes is to enter various events or participate in certain items within this festival.

Dance with children, which impresses one Price as it happens to be his daughter

Get as drunk as possible within a time limit before another famous alcoholic completes getting his drunk on

Mimic various /emotes of a mime in a certain time limit

Notice how all of these are like mini-games within the main quest, and I do not have to kill anything (right away...that is until the Princes party is broken up by an attack)

Do not get me wrong, no game will be without killing or having to run somewhere or get something. I just wish for more creativity, like in LOTRO and the Hobbit beginning quests (which are the first 15 or so levels, then you move to the multitude of kill 10x quests style) Or look at DDO with the many quests which involve disabling traps, etc. These seem to be better ways to involve the player in the world without the need to be repititious.

This overall shows something of the problems inherint in todays MMO's. Games can keep the good stuff going for only 15 -20 levels (LOTRO has some great beginning quests up to level 15, AoC has an amazing game, until level 20, Guild Wars...only has 20 levels). ..otherwise, they must resort to elongated killing sprees and fetch quests to keep you paying a monthly fee.

Now, a lot of peoples pleasure in these games may stem from the friendships they form instead of the actual game. But, overall it just seems creativity in questing is gone (look at WAR, which finds a great way to alleviate the tedium of the Kill 10x by making sure that groups are up front, easy to make, and using the Public Quest system, this allows you to hop in and out of specifc parts of a quest and still get rewarded)

Until developers find a way to remove the tedium of killing the same mobs over and over, or running from point a to get something from point b to bring back to point a...

We will have to live in this WoW clone world until Developers can find a way to move beyond the monthly fee conundrum which causes the need to make content, and no other way to do it beyond the MMO standards.

Originally posted by Jackdog

What I am saying is that all quests are either  traveling to a point known or unknown, gathering items or interacting with a static or dynamic entity. Static being a resource node, flower on the ground etc dynamic being either NPC or mob that gives damage in return.

ok discuss and see if you can come up with any quest from any other MMORPG which would not fall into 1 of those categories

 

 

Well I have played most MMOs out there, but mainly EQ2 has been my focus until recently. EQ2 being the King of quests available for any MMO out there, I thought I would come up with a few.....but nope, they all do seem to fall into that category. or with slight variance, Kill X mob X time of day..

I am cuerrenty playing LOTRO and again all the quests seem to be along the same lines.

Apart from some deeds - Use X skill 100 tmes - and you get a upgraded trait for it. I would like to see this in mroe MMO's (may already be)

Also you can get titles for example - not dying in your first 10 or so levels.

So many people moan about how everything copies everything else. It looks like it has too.

I would also like to see some posts about quests that don't fall into Jackdogs list :)

Openedge, the reason I made this thread was you made the blanket statement in another thread that you gave the old LOTRO has kill ten x quests as a slam. 

All of the quests t you quoted fall into one of the categories I mentioned in my first post. That is a good questr series I grant you that but it canot compare with some of the LoTRO quest lines such as the one I link at the end of this post.

I don't know how many quest Lotro has but I am leveling a alt now and he is in his mid 30's and has only grouped one or two since I am just concentrating on getting to 50 before MoM releases. So far he has never lacked for solo quests. On the other hand my main has did all of the epics and darn near every major story line. My other alt which is also a 50 did a pretty good mix of solo and group quests also but still has a lot of holes in his epic line. You will not ever lack for quests in LoTRO, that I can promise.

lotro.mmodb.com/quests/

Everything form kill ten boars to find the right items and use them to repair the Trestlebridge to sneak into this Library and find me my father notes.

Professor that is because all quests have to be written around something your toon can do and all it can do is travel to point X  and interact with whatever programmed feature is at point X. Wheterh that programmed feature is static or dynamic makes no difference. It is how well written that make for good quests and there will always be a lot more "kill me ten boars and bring me their hides" than epics such as this series

lotro.mmodb.com/quests/chapter-1:-the-long-road-south-2644.php

which is a truly magnificent series BTW.

I agree. Instead of the method required for someone to complete a quest, I think the actual writing and structure of the quests are very important. I also think that the main storyline needs to be accessible to ALL the players... this is one thing that really pisses me off in certain MMOs. LoTRO is no different. The EPIC quest line requires groups to progress and that equals awful design imo... I mean, it's the MAIN storyline... not some side quest bullshit. If you are purely a solo player or duo (think husband & wife) AND want to experience the story, you'll need to find another game. For something that a lot of people would call a casual game, that's a poor design. (is a casual game a game where you spend hours looking for group to complete a quest? I wouldn't say so...)

Originally posted by Jackdog

Openedge, the reason I made this thread was you made the blanket statement in another thread that you gave the old LOTRO has kill ten x quests as a slam. 

All of the quests t you quoted fall into one of the categories I mentioned in my first post. That is a good questr series I grant you that but it canot compare with some of the LoTRO quest lines such as the one I link at the end of this post.

here pick one.

lotro.mmodb.com/quests/

Everything form kill ten boars to find the right items and use them to repair the Trestlebridge to sneak into this Library and find me my father notes.

Professor that is because all quests have to be written around something your toon can do and all it can do is travel to point X  and interact with whatever programmed feature is at point X. Wheterh that programmed feature is static or dynamic makes no difference. It is how well written that make for good quests and there will always be a lot more "kill me ten boars and bring me their hides" than epics such as this series

lotro.mmodb.com/quests/chapter-1:-the-long-road-south-2644.php

which is a truly magnificent series BTW.

 

I do not disagree. LOTRO does have some good quests. I never disagreed with that. The fact remains that it still is the "focus" of the game, that a majority will be some form of kill this, gather that. I spent level 20 to level 30 killing boars and bears more than doing something "creative" like mentioned above.

Yet, the examples I gave fall more within the lines of attempting to complete objectives. Quests which entail, like DDO, to do something a certain way, like a puzzle. For example the first mission based quest. I must protect this person who also is fighting (different than killing or taking something to them, they actually get involved). I must shut off the water pumps. Again, another mini game in itself.

You made the blanket statement that all games must resort to the "kill 10 x" mechanics or take item A to item B, or escort (which semantics could be argued that protecting the person as they attempt to do something is close to an escort). The quests I gave do NOT require me to get something off a creatures body, or bring something I find to another spot. And then you blatantly over looked the Princes mission which basically is 95% interactive with people in the game, and not killing (until the end, which is a story prop)

More of these types of quests that you must figure out..not just kill, kill is my point.

When I keep seeing quests like these so much in todays MMOs

Restoring the balance

Collect lynx pelts

or

Stocking the larder

Collect aurochs-meat

Now compare that to DDO

Search for the Rare Scroll

• Recover the Gilded Scroll Case
• Smash crates and barrels untill you find the Silver Key
• Solve the puzzle to drop the barrier
• (Optional) Slay the Progenitor Slime: 36XP

In so many words...objective based.

LOTRO has these, but are all group forced on you to finish the EPIC quest lines (while in Guild Wars, if I cannot find a group, I can solo it for more of a challenge, or with DDO which will be adding a henchmen addon). And of course, I can do the SAME things in Guild Wars that I can do in LOTRO...but free.

Makes a big difference.

There is no doubt that LOTRO has some good quests, but your argument is LOTRO has the "best" quests, and based on the "killing" ones I showed, I would argue it has the "same" quests.

I love the quests that involve a riddle, like the riddle quest line from Bilbo or the Loremaster quests, also there is a riddle quest in Evendim that you have to found a treasury.

I remember a quest in goblin town that you have to write in a paper (that Bilbo gave you) the description of some locations in goblin town, he needed this info to remember this place and to continue writing his story.

And the epic quests are truly epic!